Rachael Herron (RH Herron)'s Blog, page 6

Just a quickie miniepisode here as Rachael FREAKS OUT about how well A Life in Stitches is doing, along with a chapter from her memoir! Enjoy!

The post Ep. 278: A Life in Stitches is a Bestseller! appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

Rachael’s honored to introduce you to Monna McDiarmid and her new podcast, Ease Lessons. Here’s a snippet from the new show, and Rachael gets really vulnerable about her own writing in it. Enjoy!

Find Ease Lessons here!

The post Ep. 277: Welcome the New Year with Ease Lessons by Monna McDiarmid appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

Jason Craig Poole is a word nerd who wants to play in all of the literary sandboxes — especially poetry, creative nonfiction and fiction. After years of feeling like he was STUCK, he studied how his own mind works and began assembling a writer’s toolbox. Thanks to his tools, he’s not stuck anymore. (But he still doesn’t know how to operate a power saw.)

And today we’re talking about Four Thousand Weeks by Oliver Burkeman!

The post Ep. 276: Jason C. Poole on the Magic of Four Thousand Weeks appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

Rachael Herron shares tips and tricks for when writing is hard to do, as well as what to do when you lose control of a manuscript and wonder if you should just start a new book. 

This show is sponsored by her Patrons at the $5 level! Join Rachael’s mini-coaching tier!

And don’t miss the 15-Day Frolic! – it’s the most fun you’ll have writing this year. 

The post Ep. 275: Bonus Episode – How to Write When it’s Hard to Write appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

Chandra Prasad is the author of the critically acclaimed novels On Borrowed Wings, Death of a Circus, Breathe the Sky, and Damselfly, a female-driven young adult text used both individually in classrooms and in parallel with Lord of the Flies. Prasad is also the editor of—and a contributor to—Mixed, the first-ever anthology of short stories on the multiracial experience. Being half-Asian herself, Prasad has long acknowledged the dearth of significant mixed-race characters in literature, especially for teens and children, and has sought to bring awareness to this issue. For this reason, Prasad chose multiracial protagonists for both her Young Adult novels, Damselfly and Mercury Boys. Prasad’s shorter works have appeared in The Wall Street Journal, The New York Times, The New York Times Magazine, The Week, and Teen Voices. She is also a contributor to New Haven Noir, a short story anthology edited by Amy Bloom, and the author of a how-to guide for young jobseekers. A graduate of Yale, Prasad is currently working on several books and writing projects. She lives in Connecticut with her husband, sons, and assorted pets. Find out more at https://chandraprasad.com/.

The post Ep. 274: Chandra Prasad on How to Get Unstuck appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

We’re in New Zealand! It’s wonderful to be in my mother’s homeland. We’d been planning to move around a lot once we got here until we found a house to rent, moving week to week, with the hopeful destination of Wellington where we’d settle into a rental, but we got locked down eight days after we got out of MIQ (the quarantine hotel where we spent 14 days when we arrived).

Of course, we got locked down in heaven. Just south of Russell, we ended up in a house on the Bay of Islands, and it’s been magical. We’re both working full time, of course, so that’s worked out well, as we haven’t been allowed to do much else as we stay indoors!

View from the kitchenOur house is the 2-story one – that’s Lala in a kayak

While we were at level 4, we took our one walk a day. At level 3, we were allowed to take out the kayaks! Excellent, exciting exercise! We enter level 2 tonight, which means we can get on the road again soon on our way to Wellington! (We’ve found a darling rental that we’re so interested in — it’s lovely and would come with the bonus that the people moving out are leaving the country, and we could buy their furniture from them! Since we have none, how ideal would that be? Please cross your fingers for us – it looks like an ideal place for a writer to be settled.)

I’m not blogging much, but I wanted to make sure that if you want to see lots more pics of our journey, you can go to Instgram or Facebook, where I’m trying to cross-post pics and videos of our adventure at both places.

We’re so lucky, and so grateful, and so excited to be starting our new life here.

Discovering the bush walk up the back of the house!

The post We’ve Moved! appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

In this bonus mini-episode, Rachael Herron talks about what she’s found to be the best platform-building tools for writers. 

Also covered: 

Turning your book into a screenplayWhat if your book just isn’t as strong as you’d like yetHow do you handle not being historically accurate? 

Go HERE to get Rachael to be your mini-coach!

Join Rachael’s Slack channel, Onward Writers!

Transcript:

Rachael Herron: [00:00:00] Welcome to “How do you Write?” I’m your host, Rachael Herron. On this podcast, I talk to authors about how they write, what their process is and how their lives fit together. I’ll keep each episode short so you can get back to writing.

[00:00:16] Well, Hello writers! Welcome to episode #249 of “How do you Write?” I’m Rachael Herron. Thrilled you’re here with me today on this mini bonus episode, which I’m just going to try to do more of. If you are a Patron of mine at the $5 or up level a month, not only do you get all the essays that I write, and right now I’m writing about, moving, and fear, and courage, and how both of those things feel in the body, but you get to have me as your mini coach and you get to ask me any questions. I’m finishing up all the questions right here. Got a couple of questions and then it will have no more. So you mini coaching clients, please send me some and I’ll be doing more of these videos, which I really, really love to do. [00:01:07] So, right now, just a little catch up. I am doing this right after I filmed the last episode. So I’m still in Idaho as we speak. Although when you get this, I will be one day away from leaving the United States of America and moving to New Zealand. We leave tomorrow as this is released. So perhaps when you listening to it on crying on an airplane, somewhere over the Pacific. Anything is possible. I have reached a really deep level of happiness though, and acceptance and excitement about this. Finally, the fear is almost gone. I’m sure there will be more of it in the days to come, but, we’ve done all the things we’ve sold the house, we’ve sold the cars, everything we own is in suitcases. And now all we have to do is live and follow our noses to where they feel like going. And that’s super exciting and I’m just tremendously overwhelmed by this feeling of anticipation and also deep happiness in the moment which is the most important thing. I’m not trying to get anywhere. Yes, we are going to New Zealand, but I don’t have an idea of what that’s going to look like or what it needs to be.[00:02:21] It is just going to be what it should be. And what matters is this moment sitting in this particular co-working space in Idaho and how it’s a little bit hot in here and a little bit muggy, which is impossible in place. I don’t know how that’s happening. But I know that after I record this, when I go home tonight, we’re going to have Mexican food. And at this moment I really am enjoying the width and the height of this desk that I’m sitting at it’s really, really good, fits my body. I’m enjoying the incredible speed of the internet. That’s what’s going on for now. And it’s good. So, just for one second, why don’t you take a moment to think about where you are? How does your body feel? How’s your back feel? How does your brain feel as I’m talking to you? What’s going on in this very minute, what can you see? What can you taste? What is good right now? What is difficult right now, what hurts? Acknowledge that, I’m going deep and really, I meant to just answer questions.[00:03:26] So, but do take a minute to maybe think about what you are glad of in this moment and it doesn’t have to be just good things. You can be glad about hard things too. So, I am glad that I’m with you here in this moment, in a very cool kind of time, travel way and all right, let’s jump into the questions. We can go less metaphysical and into the nitty gritty of writing. [00:03:52] Okay, so this first question, and the second question are from Maggie. How rude my cell phone is still on, I’m turning that off. Okay. All right. She says I’m in the process of drafting my first complete novel, where the romance between the two central characters is both of the theme and the main story I want to tell. I have a solid premise and I know my characters inside and out. Still, I’ve struggled to develop the finer points of my plot in a way that supports my character’s development while also keeping the story moving in an interesting and satisfying way. My concern is that my plot devices will feel forced and inadequate. Do you have any advice on crafting a story driven plot without over complicating the heart of the story? And then it goes on to ask a different question. I want to answer this one first. [00:04:43] So, you’re in the process of drafting your first complete novel of this particular book. And I would just like to reassure you and everyone listening that the finer points of your plot will be awkward and weird and wrong and flat and strange, you want them to move in an interesting and satisfying way. They will not, they will move in a dull, boring and completely unsatisfying way. That’s a first draft’s job. It’s also sometimes even a second draft’s job and the more we get comfortable with allowing our books to really just suck the big one. The closer we get to being able to create books that satisfy us completely, that satisfy every single thing that we want them to do. First, they have to be written wrong. And, that is a truth that is just gonna continue to be a truth for the rest of our lives as writers. So it’s kind of liberating, isn’t it? In a first draft or sometimes even a second draft, what we do in the book is just, it just feels bad. It just feels wrong because said with love, it is it’s not good enough yet, but you can’t make it good enough until the book is written. There’s no way, right, there are a few exceptions to this. I’ve known like I, and I’ve told- I’ve said this before, I have known four or five professional writers with, you know, 30 or 40 books under their belts who go through the book and they make the book good as they go. That is less than 1% of the writers that I know. The rest of us cannot make chapter six. Good. And then go on to chapter seven, we just write chapter six and it’s bad, and it is not interesting and it is clumsy and wrong.[00:06:44] And then we go on to chapter seven and we have to do it that way. Ninety nine point- I’m going to say 99.3% of writers have to do it that way. If you think you’re not that kind of writer, and maybe this is not you, I’m not talking to you because I know you and you’re not this kind of writer, but if you think you are the writer who has to get it right before moving forward, that is only your method if you are regularly completing good books that you are proud of, if you are not, and you think that that is your method. That’s not true. You’re wrong. Your method is to write a crappy first draft and get to the end and then revise it just like everybody else. The only way that you know, that is your method, that perfectionist method of making a chapter good and then moving on to the next one and then making that good and then moving onto the next chapter is if you are regularly completing good books. So that is a really useful test to see if you are in that .7% of people who can do that, are you doing it? Then that’s you, if you’re not doing it, then you’re just like the rest of us.[00:07:44] So going back to Maggie and her question, the next part of that is my novel is loosely inspired by sensitive and important events in history. However, my goal and vision is not to write historical fiction. What are your thoughts on how to be sensitive to historical themes without needing to make sure I’m being historically accurate in my representation of the events? So this is great. I think a lot of writers struggle with this because history is important. It is important, it’s how we got here. History it’s how I got here, it’s how you got where you are, history matters and you mentioned the word sensitive, which means that these are probably historical events that perhaps have two different sides as most historical events do. And what I like to recommend when writing historical events is to hold them with a loose hand, move stuff around. If you want to, there are some writers who really, really, really want to be historical writers and getting the history in the right place. On the right day, at the right time of day with the right weather is going to be very important to them.[00:08:55] And that is perfectly fine. However, you’re currently saying your goal is not to be a historical writer is to tell this story of these characters. So hold it loosely. If you need to move stuff around, allow yourself to do so. And then, before the book is published you just get to put in that magic line at the beginning of the book that, or at the end of the book that says some historical events have been moved or changed in order to suit my story. There. You’re in the clear, the average reader who doesn’t know much about these events will be learning from your events even if you have changed some things, they’re learning deep lessons from what you are showing them and the avid historical reader, who knows every single thing about this particular battle and where it occurred and who died first, who died second, who won, who lost? They will be comforted by the sentence that says, I know the history and I’m choosing to change it, to suit my story. And you get to do that. You are allowed. And in fact, I encourage you to do that because I think that’s really fun. [00:10:01] All right. Next question of all the different methods you have tried newsletter, social media, promotions, podcasting, et cetera, which one has been the best for building your platform/finding your specific readers/fans? What in the early years of your writing career, pre-published, to a few books published, do you wish you had done more of, or less of? Okay, so I have two answers for this because I have two different basis of readers. I have the writer base, people who come to me to hear podcasts like this, to talk about writing, to talk about how to complete books and how to get out of their own damn way and get their work done. So that has a particular niche of people. The best thing that I have done in finding them is podcasting reliably for more than five years now. This is episode 249 and that’s awesome. That’s a lot of freaking podcasts for, I dunno, three or four years. I did the Writer’s Well podcast with J. Thorn that also increased my visibility as a teacher of writing. Probably another thing I did that really got me to know a lot of people was teaching both at Stanford and Berkeley and having that kind of word of mouth. And that’s how writers have found me as a person to listen to and ask questions of. So podcasting is probably my primary purpose for that, but if you, but for my readers, for finding readers of my fiction and of my memoir that I write, this was such a good question.[00:11:44] What I wish I had focused on earlier is the thing. I always encourage everyone to focus on as early in their careers as they can. I wish I had been building my mailing list as early as possible. And I was to a certain extent, I did have a mailing list that readers could join before my first book came out and I was able to do that because I was a regular and reliable blogger. I started blogging in 2002, so almost 20 years now. And I had a quite large readership on the blog. So I was able to move those readers over onto my email newsletter list for the books that I write. And a lot of those people liked the books that I wrote. So they came along with me on that newsletter experience. However, I didn’t do a great job of catching the people who read the first few books and in part that is because those books were traditionally published. And at the end of a traditionally published book, those were from Harper Collins, my first five or so books were Harper Collins. And at the end of the book, they say, please sign up to follow Rachael Herron. And then they give you the Harper Collins website to follow Rachael Herron’s books at Harper Collins. I didn’t get any of those email addresses. It’s hard to do if you’re traditionally published because the publisher wants those email addresses too. They know how valuable they are, but set up a phone and I’ll say it again. The most valuable thing you can do as a writer is to get those email addresses for yourself. Not Facebook, not Twitter, not Instagram, not TikTok, getting followers on that is fine.[00:13:24] If you love doing that, great. But the only thing you own, you really own that is yours are those opt in newsletter subscribers never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever put anyone under newsletter, even if they’re your best friend without asking. That’s just something that I will always, always say, if you and I have been friends forever, don’t put me on your email newsletter without asking me if you ask me, I will say yes, if you don’t ask me suddenly we are not friends anymore. And I will send your email to spam and that’s just not good. I mean, that is just one of those things that everyone hates. So you want opt in newsletter subscribers. People who have said I like you. And I am choosing to ask to continue to hear more about you. That is the number one most important thing to have.[00:14:18] I think number two, most important thing to have is just a place on the internet where you can be found. You own your own website. So that is the most, that’s the safest place to have. If you are a blogger and like blogging, do that. That’s a great way to go because then your voice is out there and people are finding you organically through search engine optimization, talking about the things you’re writing about, and then they have an option to follow you and people do. That’s the weird thing is people sign up for newsletters, but that’s true of me too. When I find something, a voice that I like, the first thing I do is I sign up for their newsletter. Often I unsubscribed after a while because either they aren’t who I wanted them to be or what I thought they were going to be. But I give a lot of newsletters, a try and certain newsletters I just absolutely love and don’t ever want to be off of, and you want to be that person and you want to be find-able. However, I will say about blogging. You do not have to blog at all. Only blog if it is something that you are passionate about doing and know that if you’re starting a blog, it’s going to be probably years before you gain traction and a large readership. So again, only do it if you love doing it. [00:15:30] Otherwise my take on social media. It’s changed a little bit. I’ve always said that you don’t have to build up any kind of social media following before your books come out because publishers would love it if you had a Kim Kardashian following, but they don’t expect you to. However, that’s changed recently to say that I don’t think you have to have a lot of followers, period, but you should be visible on the major platforms. You should be find-able and you should not be an asshole. Publishers are going to check. Agents are going to check. They are going to search for you on Instagram, Facebook, maybe Twitter. And if they find that you’re out there trolling or saying negative things to other people, they will immediately ignore you. They will send your email to delete. They don’t want to work for the person like that. They also want to see you out there interacting kindly with other people, maybe with writers, maybe with readers, maybe with just your friends that you went to high school with. Be visible on at least one platform perhaps.[00:16:32] And you don’t have to do a lot. And again, only do what you like. I hate Facebook. I’m barely there, but I have set up my Instagram. I like Instagram. I have set up my Instagram to send my pictures to Facebook. So it looks like I’m there. It’s a lie. I’m not, I just went in the other day and found comments from someone from February 2020 in my like, messages box. I barely know how to get to my messages box. So, you don’t have to be good at it by any stretch of the imagination, but, be at least one place. It’s what I would recommend and be the place that you like to be. I’m on TikTok now, because I love TikTok. It’s really fun. Am I trying to build up a following? I am not. I am trying to kind of make a record for myself and make videos for myself that have memories, especially about this whole move. You can follow me at TikTok if you want to. I’m really not interesting compared to all the people that I follow, but that’s fun for me so I allow myself to be there.[00:17:28] But overall to answer your question, get the newsletter list going as soon as possible. Have you ever, okay. And then, let’s see. Have you ever tried turning one of your books into a screenplay and having your agent tried to sell the movie rights? If so, what does that process look like? If not, what book of yours would you most like to see as a movie? Okay. This is such a fun question. I have never tried turning a screenplay, writing a screenplay from one of my books. I probably never will. That is a particular skill set that I do not choose to devote my time to, I have written a screenplay in the past. It was really fun. It was a great experience. I did it with a friend who was actually in the film industry. Never went anywhere. It was, but it was a really fun exercise. But what is more frequently done because most screens are never seen, let alone picked up. What happens is that you get a film agent usually through your own agent, and then they try to shop your book around. And if your book gets picked up or often by somebody, then the production company will hire a screenwriter to write your book. And that is the way I would prefer it to happen. I did have a film agent for Stolen Things and she was unable to sell it. Although we had some really, really close calls and close bites to options and that’s generally how it’s done. A film agent will take your project around. It is very hard to get a film agent. They are not like literary agents. Literary agents, you can just look up on agentcrew.com and send them career letters, film agents keep their information offline, and it really is an industry in which you have to know someone to get the information of a film agent. Which is why it usually goes through your own agent to have that happen. [00:19:14] So right now we’re crossing our fingers for Hush Little Baby. There is a film agent interested in it who knows if that one will pick it up. The film agent that I had for my last book did not. I don’t think we gave her the option. I think my agent did not give her the option to pick up Hush Little Baby, because we weren’t really impressed with the job that she did. And my agent is in charge of that. And I give that control to her. She makes those decisions because I don’t want to, but in answer to your question, what would I like to see made into a film? I have two in mind, Pack Up the Moon, which will always be one of my favorite books that I’ve ever written, and also Hush Little Baby, the most recent book, because it’s super, super action-oriented and intense and tense and all of those thrilling aspects that I think it would be good on the big screen. I think it would be a little gory, but that’s fun. So that is what I would love to see as a movie right now.[00:20:12] Okay, thank you, Maggie for those questions and this last one is from Donna. It is a comment, not a question. She didn’t send it to me as a question, but it is something that I just wanted to relay because this worked for her. She said, she is a 90 Days to Done previous student of mine. And she says since 90 days, I’ve lost that love and feeling and was getting down. This week I set up right track again as with an easy target. And my Pomodoro is 30 minutes. It absolutely works when you’re too overwhelmed, anxious, depressed, paralyzed, whatever to write. Thank you. So Write Track is just a free, if you Google Write Track, write, as in writing, is a free writing tracker that I actually really like, and you can set low goals, high goals, whatever they are, you can, I enjoy using it. And I’ve been talking a lot about the Pomodoro method recently because I’ve been needing it myself.[00:21:08] And it does work. You make yourself write for a very short amount of time or not even write, to sit with your butt in the chair and look at your writing and make some notes about what you want to do next for a small amount of time. And guess what, those small amounts of time add up to books, novels, essays, memoirs, poems, almost no one than, I mean almost no one sits down with eight hours and writes beautiful prose for that time.[00:21:41] We all do it in 15, 20, 30, maybe 45 minute bursts of time. And then our brains freeze. And we look at our phones, go to the bathroom, get some more coffee, consider never, ever returning to words again. And then we sit down and we do another 25 minutes and that’s all it takes. So Donna, I just wanted to thank you for saying that the Pomodoros work or whatever way you want to get yourself to the page where a very short amount of time in which you write frustratingly, terrible sentences that eventually add up to something that you can revise. And that adds up to something that you can take out into the world. Give to other people to read. No, you will not give it to, you will sell it to them. So, yes, I think that is all the questions that is all I wanted to say today. By the time you hear this, I’ll be on my way to New Zealand. And thank you for being here.[00:22:29] Thank you for your writing. You’re the only person you can write your book. And I want you to tell me about it and where I can buy it when it is out. And I really mean that. Okay, my darlings, happy writing to you. I’ll see you on the other side of the world. 

Thanks so much for joining me on this episode of “How do you Write?” You can reach me on Twitter, twitter.com/RachaelHerron, or at my website, www.rachaelherron.com, you can also support me on Patreon and get essays on living your creative life for as little as a buck an essay at www.patreon.com/rachael spelled R, A, C, H, A, E, L and do sign up for my free weekly newsletter of encouragement to writers at rachaelherron.com/write/

Now, go to your desk and create your own process and get to writing my friends.

The post Ep. 249: The Best Method for Building Your Writing Platform appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

Patti Callahan is a New York Times bestselling author and is the recipient of the Harper Lee Award for Distinguished Writer of the Year. She is a frequent speaker at luncheons, book clubs, and women’s groups. Surviving Savannah is her most recent novel. 

How Do You Write Podcast: Explore the processes of working writers with bestselling author Rachael Herron. Want tips on how to write the book you long to finish? Here you’ll gain insight from other writers on how to get in the chair, tricks to stay in it, and inspiration to get your own words flowing. 

Join Rachael’s Slack channel, Onward Writers!

Transcript:

Rachael Herron: [00:00:00] Welcome to “How do you Write?” I’m your host, Rachael Herron. On this podcast, I talk to authors about how they write, what their process is and how their lives fit together. I’ll keep each episode short so you can get back to writing.

[00:00:15] Well, Hello writers! Welcome to episode #248 of “How do you Write?” I’m Rachael Herron. Today, I am talking to Patti Callahan. I know you’re going to enjoy the interview. We were talking about how to know what your characters want. And for me, this is always one of the bigger challenges about writing my books. It takes me a while to really, really know what my characters want. I can come up with a great idea, but as I write, things always change. And I always, I always forget that my characters have wants that are different than, you know, Rachael Herron’s on a general day. So, that is something I would have to work on in revising a lot. So it was fun to talk to her about this. I know you’re going to enjoy that. [00:00:59] What is going on around here? Well, I am, if you are watching on the YouTube, I’m in a new spot, I’m in a coworking spot in Idaho. We’re here for one week, seeing my wife’s family. And it has been awesome and challenging. A lot of family in the house. I think we have eight people in the house now, six of us sharing one bathroom. But it is a house full of love and it is really wonderful. Yesterday, Lala and I, there were only three of us who wanted to raft down the Boise River and what that means is actually, just kind of like tubing down the river. It’s a very slow, very cold, very shallow river at this point, I kept swearing myself in the river. But I would whack my knees on the rocks at the boulders at the bottom of the river, because it was so shallow, but I really wanted to cool off. And it was just me and Lala and our 12-year-old nephew who ended up wanting to go and it was so fun. It was a moment of remembering that, when I want to, I get to let go of control. And I am kind of a control freak, you all know that, in so many ways. And so of course, I started out the day. [00:02:20] We want to be in the ideal position in the river. We want to be ahead of those people behind those people. I don’t want to hear them talk. I don’t want to have to have conversation with these strangers on the river. So let’s, you know, fight our way there. And eventually I ended up giving my paddle to the 12-year-old nephew and he became the best river guide. And it didn’t matter when we crashed into trees and the banks of the river, it didn’t matter.  It was just fun. I just got to hang out in the middle of the boat in the 96-degree weather, repeatedly throwing myself into the snow water and then climbing back up onto the boat. There was this one brilliant moment that I will share with you. Every once in a while, the river would speed up. And we would have like these tiny little rapids, which were very fun to scream as we went over. And you know, the eddies would swirl and the water would get a little rougher. And I had put myself in the water and I was, you know, the boat was towing me because it was a little bit deeper there and a little bit faster and it was exciting. And then I realized it was getting shallower, but really, really choppy. And I was getting banged around on the rocks, you know. If I had stood up, it could not have been higher than my thigh, really. But, kind of freaked me out and I wanted in the boat. I couldn’t get in the boat, because now the boat is going really fast and I’m having a very hard time hanging on to it. Everybody in the boat, Lala and Isaac are, they’re busy. They’re busy doing other things, but I needed somebody to help me up and I was really terrified in this delicious adrenaline. This is life or death, must get back on the boat, screaming. Lala was trying to haul me up my knee. My nephew hits me in the head with the paddle which was hilarious. And I managed to get on board gasping and I’m lying in the bottom of the boat, gasping and howling with laughter because the adrenaline pumping my system said that, yeah, you almost just died and, reality said that, had I let go of the boat and stood up and walked to shore, it would have been just fine and they would have pulled the boat over and I would have either walked down over to them or swam if I could, but it was not deep enough really to swim. So it was just this really delicious moment of fear that was laced with a hundred percent knowledge that I was completely fine. And it was just so great.[00:04:39] So we’re having adventures like that. And the reason I’m telling you about that is that, I was writing this morning and I was beating myself up for not doing more writing while we’re here, while the house is full of eight people. And I can only use this coworking space for a little bit of time at a time because it’s expensive. And I was trying, for the last few days, I’ve been trying to get work done in the house. And I am interrupted all the time by people who love me, who want to talk about things. And I just had the major revelation, of course, the realization, that I should have had a few days ago, which is it is okay. I am not going to be the most productive writer for the next nine days. We’re in this country for nine more days. We are going on a big tour of after we leave Idaho going around California, seeing people and saying goodbye to them.[00:05:31] I’m not going to get that much work done on my current projects. I have a couple that are really, really invested in working on, and I’m letting that go. I’m going to call this maybe like a little vacation. And for this workaholic, that is hard to do. There are some things, there, I’m just going to ask myself to keep on top of a few things. My email, which is hard for me to do, but I put on the vacation responder that says, I’m moving to a different country, responses will be delayed, and that helps me feel better. And I’m going to keep on top of the two classes that I’m teaching because that’s easy and fun and I love doing that. And I’m going to try to keep on top of my slack messages and everything else, I’m going to let go. I, yeah. I just thought I probably will not be able to do a podcast next week. I might do a mini podcast, Q&A, because I’ve got a cup full of questions from darling Maggie, which is a song. And I might do that and put that out next week, but I might also miss a week in here in the next few weeks and that’s okay. We have to adjust with life. And I personally, I like to talk to you all a lot, but right now I’m talking to myself. I have to take a moment and chill out and enjoy this exciting moment in our lives. There’s enjoy embarking upon this adventure, which we are already in the middle of. [00:06:55] So that’s what I’m doing. I’m giving myself that permission. What kind of permission do you want to give yourself or do you need to give yourself? Do you need to give yourself the permission to push yourself to write a little bit more than you are doing? Or do you need to give yourself permission to read a little bit less than you are trying to make yourself do? Where are you in your life and in your capacity to get your work done? There are times in our lives where it is easier to get more work done and when it is harder. If you are spending all your time watching Netflix and TikTok, that’s a different conversation.

That is time you could be spending writing. However, if you’re just busy living, moving, grieving, whatever it is, be kind to yourself. You have to be kind to yourself as a writer in order to do this really difficult work. I think that if I have one rallying cry, one mantra, when I am talking to writers, it is that to be kind to yourself and be honest. With my students, I always talk about how I am always two things. I’m always kind, and I’m almost always honest. Those two things go together perfectly, beautifully. We can be kind to others and we can be honest to others. And we really importantly, have to be those things with ourselves. I don’t know about you, but I’m very good at lying to myself. And I lie about all sorts of things to myself. You know, I’m going to get more work done tomorrow, or it’s really important that I get this done today. And those are sometimes just big lies that I get to uncover and say, no, it’s really okay if I take a day off or conversely, no, you’re really slacking Rachael. That is actually slacking that you’re doing. That’s not resting. That’s slacking. So why don’t you do one Pomodoro, get that done. And then of course that usually leads to more, but I’m letting myself off the hook. I’m not doing Pomodoros for at least the next nine days or until tomorrow morning when I panic and forget this resolution and hopefully remember it. 

[00:09:05] Besides, tomorrow morning, I’m going for a swim at the Y with my father-in-law, then I’m going to go get a pedicure with four of my family members. And then, we’re going to go down the river again because the family saw the little TikTok video that I made of my nephew boating us down the river while singing a song. He was making up at the time in his beautiful voice. We had this little gondolier, who learned while we were out there, how to steer a boat. You could see his body shifting and assimilating and understanding what happens when you put the ore that way, what happens when you put it that way? And by the end, he was doing all of it and Lala and I were just relaxing, staring up at the blue sky. So, ask yourself, where in the river you are, what kind of paddling you should be doing. And I hope that, at some point you come back and find me, tell me about it. [00:09:59] I am getting ready to send out a Patreon message pretty soon here. So, if you’re not on my Patreon, you can always check into that. I’ll do a little mid-point read of that in a second. But I would like to thank new patrons, Jenny Grant. Thank you, thank you so much. Appreciate it, Jenny Momsen, that’s a Jenny Day. Thank you. Thank you. Miley, editing her pledge up. Thank you. Thank you, Miley. Irene Scoonwinkle. Hello, Irene, wonderful to have you and Diana Ben Aaron. Same. Wonderful to have you. Claire Lydon edited her pledge up. Thank you. Boy, I love it when you guys do that because not just for the money, the money is fantastic. Thank you. It supports me in doing this work for you. However, when you edit a pledge up, it just is like this added load of confidence that you’ve been around for a while and you’re doing that. So, I don’t know, it just warms my heart. And thank you, Tyler. This, that you’re pledge just came in. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you to everyone at every single level in Patreon. It means the world to me. All right, I’m going to finish up doing some work around here. And then I’m going to take tomorrow off and the next day and the next day. And, I hope you were very kind and very honest with yourself, wherever you are when you are listening to this. All right. Happy writing my friends.[00:11:20] Do you wonder why you’re not getting your creative work done? Do you make a plan to write and then fail to follow through again? Well, my sweet friend, maybe you’d get a lot out of my Patreon. Each month, I write an essay on living your creative life as a creative person, which is way different than living as a person who binges Netflix 20 hours a week and I have lived both of those ways, so I know. You can get each essay and access to the whole back catalog of them for just a dollar a month, which is an amount that really truly helps support me at this here, writing desk. If you pledge at the $3 level, you’ll get motivating texts from me that you can respond to, and if you pledge at the $5 a month level, you get to ask me questions about your creative life that I’ll answer in the mini episodes. So basically, I’m your mini coach. Go to patreon.com/Rachael R-A-C-H-A-E-L, to get these perks and more. And thank you so much!

Rachael Herron: [00:12:19] Well, I could not be more pleased to welcome to the show today, Patti Callahan. Hello, Patti.

Patti Callahan: [00:12:23] Hi! I’m so happy to be here. 

Rachael Herron: [00:12:25] Well, we were just talking, before we got started on era about how our paths had missed crossed and I got sick and you were double booked and it was, so this is perfect timing today.

Patti Callahan: [00:12:35] I believe in the right timing and this is it.

Rachael Herron: [00:12:38] We do. Let me give you a little bit of an introduction here. Patti Callahan is a New York Times bestselling author and is the recipient of the Harper Lee Award for Distinguished Writer of the Year. She is a frequent speaker at luncheons, book clubs, and women’s groups. Surviving Savannah is her most recent novel, which just came out. And she’s got another one coming out called Once Upon a Wardrobe, which comes out in a few months after this, and we’re recording this in April of 2021. So, no matter where you are in time, Patti has a book that has just come out around when you’re listening. So, Patti, obviously, you are prolific, you get your work done. But I can’t wait to talk to you about Surviving Savannah too, because it’s got some really heavy research involved in it too. Before we go into the research world, how and when do you get your writing done? 

Rachael Herron: [00:13:31] I think we broke up just for a little in bit. Okay.

Patti Callahan: [00:13:33] I write in the morning.

Rachael Herron: [00:13:35] Okay, so, you’re a morning writer. 

Patti Callahan: [00:13:38] I’m a morning writer. So, when I first started writing, I, my kids were five, three and one. And so, the only time I could write was the morning, right. Or the middle of the night, and I’m not a middle of the night person. So, I would rise it on. I would write from before dawn, I would write from 4:30-6:30 in the morning. I don’t do that anymore. I think that’s crazy. But it was what I had, and so it began this morning routine, that, that is now what I do. So, I try to keep my mornings blocked off for the writing. 

Rachael Herron: [00:14:13] What is your morning routine look like nowadays? What is included in it? 

Patti Callahan: [00:14:18] Well, my kids are grown. They don’t live at home. Well, they did during the pandemic. That was actually kind of fun. I have one, one married with a baby and then two, one in graduate school and one in college. So, they were home. 

Rachael Herron: [00:14:31] Oh, how fun.

Patti Callahan: [00:14:32] I know, but it, my routine looks like, I rise, I stumble to the coffee pot, I sit down and I immediately start. Sometimes on my better days, I do my morning pages, which is from the artist’s way. I’m a big believer in morning pages. 

Rachael Herron: [00:14:48] I still do those every day, every day that I can. Yeah. 

Patti Callahan: [00:14:51] Yeah. I mean, and I can tell, can’t you tell when you’ve gone too long without doing them? 

Rachael Herron: [00:14:56] Absolutely.

Patti Callahan: [00:14:57] I can tell. I get a little ungrounded, I rush into my work and make mistakes. So, I try to take a little bit of time, even if it’s like not the full three pages, but half a page or, and then I try to dive into my work. I try to ignore the ding of the email and the, you know, the text messages and the to dos. And yet at the same time, the earlier I get up, the better I can do that. And then I look up, and the day is, the rest of the world is going. So, I try my best to do it that way. 

Rachael Herron: [00:15:32] I love that. That is also my perfect way to do it. Although, sometimes it gets, 

Patti Callahan: [00:15:37] Harder and harder

Rachael Herron: [00:15:38] You know, if you glance at an email once, you’re, especially around release, when you’re doing all the things, I’ve got a release in two weeks as we speak.

Patti Callahan: [00:15:47] Which one comes out in two weeks? Hush Little Baby?

Rachael Herron: [00:15:49] Hush Little Baby. Yeah. I just got the poster in the mail today, actually. So,

Patti Callahan: [00:15:53] It looks fantastic. 

Rachael Herron: [00:15:54] Thank you. 

Patti Callahan: [00:15:55] Yes. And during release, I didn’t even try and write. I mean, I’m gentle with myself. If the two weeks before the week during, you know, if I can get to it for a couple minutes and just touch base with it and say, hello, honey. I’m here. I’m not leaving you. Right?

Rachael Herron: [00:16:11] I’ll be back. 

Patti Callahan: [00:16:12] I’ll be back. I promise. Just like I tell my family, but yes, in a non-release world, that is my, the way I like to get it done. 

Rachael Herron: [00:16:24] I really like those words that you just said too. I’m gentle with myself. How did you, I feel like that’s one of the late things we learn as writers. At least for myself. I can say that I’d beat myself up for so long. And, 15 years into the game, I’m only learning how to be gentle with myself as a writer. How did you learn that? Or are you learning that? 

Patti Callahan: [00:16:44] I’m learning it all the time. I think you know that it’s a bit in the artist’s way for sure. 

Rachael Herron: [00:16:48] Yeah, that’s true. 

Patti Callahan: [00:16:50] It is. It’s a bit about remembering that it’s play. It’s our inner child. She says who’s doing the writing? We use our mental faculties in our craft, you know, to hone it. But if we’re whipping ourselves, like get to work, get to work, you haven’t done enough. And self-fragilation and trying to, you know, you don’t get to go out tonight, you know, like we’re the parent. I don’t think that that makes, and it’s not that I don’t do it because I do, but I think it doesn’t make for whimsical, creative, deep dive writing, and that’s the kind I want to do. 

Rachael Herron: [00:17:32] That’s really, really beautiful. What is your biggest challenge when it comes to writing?

Patti Callahan: [00:17:39] Time. Honestly. Even with the pandemic, I think. I love writing. I love it. So, I want to do it. Now, I get frustrated and I think I don’t know where this story’s going and I, you know, want to pull my hair out and give up and start a different story, but I always want to start something like, I want to work on something. I love writing. And so, the blessing of having books in the world, as you know, is that you have to spend time on them. You don’t throw them into the world and then walk away from them. So, it’s just like everybody thought you sent your kids off to college and that meant empty nest and all was well. Are you kidding me? 

Rachael Herron: [00:18:25] It never ends.

Patti Callahan: [00:18:29] But it never works, it’s fiction. So, we have a weekly show and we have a podcast. And so, you have to find, you have to be deliberate. I know you do too or you wouldn’t have a book out in two weeks. You have to be deliberate about the time. And I honestly, that’s my biggest challenge is honoring the time for that and not checking that first email and then it’s over for the morning. 

Rachael Herron: [00:18:56] Yeah. Checking that first dang email. So, I love, I love hearing how much you love writing. What is your biggest joy when it comes to writing? 

Patti Callahan: [00:19:06] Oh, gosh, it’s when it works. I think it’s, it’s like a drug, right?

Rachael Herron: [00:19:10] Yes, it is!

Patti Callahan: [00:19:11] It’s what we come back for. 

Rachael Herron: [00:19:13] Right. 

Patti Callahan: [00:19:14] And it doesn’t work all the time, but once in a while it hits and you see a connection or you find the right word or you boom! That theme of the novel, like explodes and you’re like, that’s what this is all about. And those are the moments, once they happen to you, that you come back for and it might take another year until you have another one of those moments, but they happen or you’re just driving along and you see the connection that was there all along that you didn’t, that you already wrote into the novel, but you didn’t see it yet.

Rachael Herron: [00:19:50] I love that. I wish we could go find that. And I was just struck, you know, cause I’ve had dogs for many years and you know how they teach us about intermittent reward with dogs. You don’t want to treat them every time they do something right and I think our books do that too. And that’s what keeps us coming back. Sometimes, 

Patti Callahan: [00:20:06] Oh that’s so funny

Rachael Herron: [00:20:08] Sometimes we get the dopamine hit and then most of the time we don’t, but every once in a while, we get that big blast.

Patti Callahan: [00:20:11] Oh, I love that! Exactly. You’re exactly right.

Rachael Herron: [00:20:16] Oh, great. Can you share a craft tip of any sort with us? 

Patti Callahan: [00:20:21] Sure. When I get stuck, when I’m frustrated, when I don’t know where I’m going, aside from technical plot issues, like, should I make it, you know, alternating timelines? Or should I go chronological? That’s not what I’m talking about. But, when the story is sledging for me, like we’re in the, you know how it is, you get to the middle, you’ve left the shoreline, you can’t see the other shoreline, you’re in the middle of the storm is coming. Ship metaphors never get old, right? It’s never. 

Rachael Herron: [00:20:55] It’s true. 

Patti Callahan: [00:20:56] And, you know, my book is about a shipwreck. But it is, what does your character want? So elementally, that you can see it for them. I don’t want to know what your character wants vaguely. I don’t want to know that they want a love or that they want. I want to know that they find an example. They imagine themselves standing there while their father brags about them. Right? That’s a lot different than they want respect. 

Rachael Herron: [00:21:28] Right.

Patti Callahan: [00:21:29] So, the more specific you can get with what your character wants, and it can be as simple as in my book, Surviving Savannah, they want to survive the shipwreck, right? That’s what the book is about in the historical parts. Then of course, their wants grow, you know, after survival. But, if you know what they want, then you can, or you’re getting a sludgy middle, if you can touch point back to their deepest desires, I think that that’s my biggest piece of advice.

Rachael Herron: [00:22:12] It’s brilliant. And on a technical level, how do you keep track of what they want? For me, it’s one of those things that I’m always in that middle, where I could have even written the whole book, since I write such terrible first drafts, that I realized I forgot what they wanted. What do they want? Do you keep track of it somewhere? Do you look at it from time to time?

Patti Callahan: [00:22:20] I do. I didn’t use to, but as, that’s why I’m such an evangelist for this writing tip is because it has changed the way I write. So, I do, and I spend a lot of time on it. I write what they want. I write why they want it. And I’m not big on character sketches, like, oh, she has blonde hair and blue eyes and her mom was mean, and that they grew up on 507 Merwin road, like I don’t do that. But I do spend a lot of time on what does she want? Why does she want it? Why can’t she get it? What are the things she believes about herself that are keeping her from getting it? I do. I write those down and then, I sometimes, not all the time, give them a personality profile from either that ENFP or enneagram.

Rachael Herron: [00:23:13] I love using the enneagram. I don’t understand it at all. I’ve never really studied it, but I’ve just recently got into looking at all of the things and assigning characters to them. Oh, it’s so fun.

Patti Callahan: [00:23:36] It’s so fun.

Rachael Herron: [00:23:33] Oh, we’re a little bit frozen here. 

Patti Callahan: [00:23:36] I think we’re unfrozen. 

Rachael Herron: [00:23:37] Okay, good.

Patti Callahan: [00:23:38] Okay. 

Rachael Herron: [00:23:40] Something you said there, super rich and deep. What does the character believe about themselves that is keeping them from getting that goal? That’s really rich and juicy.

Patti Callahan: [00:23:53] Yeah. Like, you know, if their mother told them they were unlovable. They are, deep down, going to believe that even though the one thing they’re wanting is for this one person to love them, right? I mean, that’s a very general statement, but yes.

Rachael Herron: [00:24:08] I love stories about mothers and daughters so much. I’ll just read any story about mother and daughter about any kind of love at all. That’s a fantastic

Patti Callahan: [00:24:15] Maybe all stories are about mothers and daughters. 

Rachael Herron: [00:24:17] I have a theory that they are. I try to write books that aren’t about that and they all come back and,

Patti Callahan: [00:24:21] And they always end up the same thing. 

Rachael Herron: [00:24:23] Exactly, exactly. So, what thing in your life affect your writing in a surprising way? 

Patti Callahan: [00:24:31] I don’t know if surprising but sleep. If I don’t, if I have a terrible night’s sleep, my brain is sludge and that’s really hard for me. And the whole day I’m thinking I’m going to get a really good night’s sleep so I can write tomorrow, you know? So, when you first said that, that’s just like, but bing!

Rachael Herron: [00:24:53] I love that.

Patti Callahan: [00:24:54] In my head, yeah.

Rachael Herron: [00:24:56] Are you normally a good sleeper or is it something you struggle with? 

Patti Callahan: [00:24:58] No, I’m normally a good sleeper, although I need a lot of it. 

Rachael Herron: [00:25:03] And that there’s nothing, there’s nothing to be ashamed of in that. I find I am smartest after nine hours of sleep, but I’m a bad sleeper. So, to get that is really, really hard. 

Patti Callahan: [00:25:11] Yeah. Well, when I have a lot of my mind, just like any normal person. 

Rachael Herron: [00:25:16] Yeah, yeah. Oh, that’s awesome. Okay. So what is the best book you have read recently? And why did you love it?

Patti Callahan: [00:25:22] Oh, wow. So many. I love so many, I don’t even know which one to say. Can I pick up a few?

Rachael Herron: [00:25:28] Yes.

Patti Callahan: [00:25:30] Okay. So, I’m madly love Paula Mclean’s new one, which is called When the Stars Go Dark. Paula is the one who wrote the Paris Wipe and she changed genres and this is a thriller. She’s a really dear friend of mine and it was a brave thing to do and it hit the list this week and it’s really, really good. 

Rachael Herron: [00:25:47] Oh, I can’t wait. 

Patti Callahan: [00:25:49] And, I got to read an advanced copy of Chris Bajalian’s new one, comes out in six days. It’s called Hour of The Witch, set in Massachusetts in the 1600s. 

Rachael Herron: [00:26:03] I am signing myself right up for that one. I’ll read anything by him.

Patti Callahan: [00:26:07] So good. And, I also just finished on audio of The Midnight Library.

Rachael Herron: [00:26:13] I loved that.

Patti Callahan: [00:26:14] Obsessed. 

Rachael Herron: [00:26:15] Yeah.

Patti Callahan: [00:26:16] I was like, what’s she going to do? What’s she going to do? What’s she going to do?

Rachael Herron: [00:26:19] He was on the podcast a while back and I was just like, yeah. He’s so interesting, he’s so kind and friendly, and I just, I’m still obsessed with that book. I can still feel myself kind of living inside the library. 

Patti Callahan: [00:26:34] Ah, so great. And I can tell, and maybe I shouldn’t do this, Rachael, but I could tell from that book that he was a soulful kind person. 

Rachael Herron: [00:26:45] Yes. Yes. Yes.

Patti Callahan: [00:26:47] Because you can’t write with that kind of depth.

Rachael Herron: [00:26:51] Yeah.

Patti Callahan: [00:26:52] Unless you had been through some things and knew, I don’t want to give anything away but, yeah.

Rachael Herron: [00:26:58] Oh, what a wonderful way to put that. I think that’s really true. 

Patti Callahan: [00:27:00] I’m so glad that he, that you say he was like that I’m dying to talk to him. 

Rachael Herron: [00:27:05] He lived up to the hype, lived up to the hype. But, like you are proving, whenever I love a book, I have always had authors live up to their books. I’ve never had, they’ve got, I mean, I’ve been doing this for four or five years now and I’ve never had one person who I hang up and go, oh my God, that was horrible. You know, I’m so disappointed in her and her book now. It’s never happened. So, let’s talk about your wonderful book, Surviving Savannah, and I would love it if you would tell us, tell the audience, because I already know it, but tell the audience a little bit about where you got the idea for this book and what this book is about. Let’s just lay it, lay it on us. 

Patti Callahan: [00:27:37] Okay. So, what this book is about, plot-wise, is the explosion of the steamship Pulaski on June 14th, 1838.

Rachael Herron: [00:27:48] Which I had never heard of.

Patti Callahan: [00:27:50] Crazy and, and listen. Untold story, lost a time story, that is like catnip to an historical fiction writer. It rings every bell, ding, ding, ding, ding, you know. So, when I discovered how untold it was, as they called it the Titanic of the south. And when I discovered that in this area I love so much and where I am, which is in, near Savannah, Georgia, and Bluffton, South Carolina, that, that it had been lost to time. I would write about it. The way I found out about is that a local mariner friend of mine told me about it, but he told me about it three times before I finally decided to look into it, and that’s because I kept saying the world’s stupidest thing. I kept saying, I don’t write about shipwrecks. 

Rachael Herron: [00:28:46] Oh my goodness.

Patti Callahan: [00:27:47] Like I had this preconceived idea. You had to be like Nathaniel Philbrick to write about shipwrecks, right? And so, then I started looking into the families and I was like, well, that’s what I write about. 

Rachael Herron: [00:29:00] Yeah.

Patti Callahan: [00:29:01] And I found this fascinating family, but I was three weeks into writing it, and not even writing it, just researching it. Is this something I want to do? Are there some characters I want to follow? There are 200 passengers, which are the two passengers worth following? When I stumbled on a headline that a shipwreck hunting crew had found the ship. 

Rachael Herron: [00:29:22] Just, just coincidentally, right then at that time.

Patti Callahan: [00:29:26] Three weeks into research. 

Rachael Herron: [00:29:27] Fantastic.

Patti Callahan: [00:29:28] Boom!

Rachael Herron: [00:29:29] Your, I mean, how did that feel?

Patti Callahan: [00:29:32] Chill bumps head, starting in your scalp, down your neck, you know. So, I just dove in deep. It wasn’t very research intensive. It was years. But it is a dual timeline where we follow a modern-day woman who is curating an exhibit for the things they’re finding at the bottom of the ocean. And then we followed two historical characters who are related and they’re related to the family that we follow. And the reason I chose them is because, number one, the main character is based on a very real person and a very real family. And the family was intimately connected to the ship. Her brother was the owner, stockholder and financier for the ship. And he had taken his wife, his six children, his niece and his sister on this journey. So, we follow his sister in the historical part of the story. 

Rachael Herron: [00:30:31] Let’s just point out too, that by choosing them, the stakes, the stakes go up. 

Patti Callahan: [00:30:37] Yes. 

Rachael Herron: [00:30:38] So high because of who they are. They’re not just. 

Patti Callahan: [00:30:41] Right. 

Rachael Herron: [00:30:42] They’re not unrelated to this boat.

Patti Callahan: [00:30:43] They’re tied, they’re intimately tied to the boat and they are intimately tied to the history of Savannah as a city.

Rachael Herron: [00:30:50] Yeah. Yeah, which is so deep and rich to your heart too and it shows, and it shows in the writing. 

Patti Callahan: [00:30:57] Thank you. Thank you.

Rachael Herron: [00:30:58] Yeah. So I would encourage anybody to go out and grab that right now. And can you tell us just like a one line or two about Once Upon a Wardrobe, coming out in October?

Patti Callahan: [00:31:05] I would love to. 

Rachael Herron: [00:31:06] You probably haven’t talked about this one too much recently.

Patti Callahan: [00:31:07] I know. Can you see me looking up into the right? 

Rachael Herron: [00:31:10] What’s that book about again? 

Patti Callahan: [00:31:14] It comes out October 19th and it is set in the year 1950 in Oxford, England, and Worcester England. And it is November, 1950, which is the year that the book, The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe, came out. 

Rachael Herron: [00:31:30] One of my favorites. 

Patti Callahan: [00:31:31] Yes. And so, a little boy named George, is very ill and his sister, Meg, is a student at Oxford University. And George is obsessed with The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe, as most of us are. And none of the other books are out yet. So, there’s not a whole Narnia world. And he asks his sister to find C.S. Lewis because he teaches at her college and ask him where did Narnia come from. And she doesn’t want to, because she’s a math major and a physics major and a genius. She’s a prodigy in mathematics and physics. But she does. She tracks down Lewis and says, where did Narnia come from? My brother needs to know. 

Rachael Herron: [00:32:17] Patti. I am, it’s a good thing I know you’re a publicist because I’m going to start knocking on her door for an arc so that I can review.

Patti Callahan: [00:32:26] I can get you one, don’t you worry about that.

Rachael Herron: [00:32:28] I’m also obsessed with CS Lewis. I had a strange thing about him when I was a kid that even though I was, you know, 10 years old, I was reading mere Christianity because I just loved his language and wanted to be with him. So like all of my spidey senses are tingling. Now I just got to read that next.

Patti Callahan: [00:32:42] Well, you know, I wrote a novel called Becoming Mrs. Lewis. 

Rachael Herron: [00:32:47] No, I don’t know this.

Patti Callahan: [00:32:49] There. 

Rachael Herron: [00:32:50] Oh, I see it. Gorgeous. 

Patti Callahan: [00:32:51] It is, It’s about his wife, it’s about his wife, Joy Davidman. 

Rachael Herron: [00:32:54] So, you are also obsessed. How did this, how did that obsession come to you? Is it from Narnia?

Patti Callahan: [00:32:59] So, I was just laughing because when I give my speech, you know, Joy, the story about his wife, Joy Davidman came out two and a half years ago, came out in 2018.

Rachael Herron: [00:33:09] Grabbing that as soon as we hang up.

Patti Callahan: [00:33:10] And whenever I’m on tour, about her speaking about her, which I do a lot, cause she’s incredibly fascinating. She was an American poet novelist. Is that I was 12 years old when I picked up the Screwtape letters and I don’t recommend that anybody read the Screwtape letters when they’re 12 years old.

Rachael Herron: [00:33:35] I read them all. I’d read it.

Patti Callahan: [00:33:37] I grew up, I’m a preacher’s kid. Yep. Yep. Yeah. So our house was covered in those books. Yeah. You can see them all behind me right there. 

Rachael Herron: [00:33:46] So you just got that voice inside your head early and it, and it stopped.

Patti Callahan: [00:33:50] Yeah. Yeah. 

Rachael Herron: [00:33:51] Oh, that is so exciting. Okay. Patti, I know what I’m doing after we hang up is that one clicking. So, thank you so, so, so, so much for being here, tell us where we can find you on the internet.

Patti Callahan: [00:34:02] Oh, everywhere. Put in my name and you will find me. I have a website, PattiCallahan  P-A-T-T-I Callahan, C-A-L-L-A-H-A-N, and my website has loads of things on it. It has book club kits and photos. And for the ship for Surviving Savannah, I have pictures of the dive and the artifacts, and I have a book club kit that has the timeline of the night and all kinds of interesting things. 

Rachael Herron: [00:34:28] Very cool. 

Patti Callahan: [00:34:29] I’m pretty active on Instagram and Facebook. Not very active on Twitter. I’m not good at the Twitter.

Rachael Herron: [00:34:35] You don’t need to be, it’s a garbage campfire.

Patti Callahan: [00:34:38] I just can’t. I get lost in it. And I don’t know how to say anything in 40 or I don’t know. So, I’m out there. I’m easy to find. 

Rachael Herron: [00:34:48] Patti, thank you so much for such a delightful conversation and for your writing.

Patti Callahan: [00:34:53] You, too. 

Rachael Herron: [00:34:54] It was wonderful talking to you and I wish you happy writing.

Thanks so much for joining me on this episode of “How do you Write?” You can reach me on Twitter, twitter.com/RachaelHerron, or at my website, www.rachaelherron.com, you can also support me on Patreon and get essays on living your creative life for as little as a buck an essay at www.patreon.com/rachael spelled R, A, C, H, A, E, L and do sign up for my free weekly newsletter of encouragement to writers rachaelherron.com/write/

Now, go to your desk and create your own process and get to writing my friends.

The post Ep. 248: Patti Callahan on How to Know What Your Characters Want appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

Amy E. Reichert is an author, wife, mom, Wisconsinite, amateur chef, and cider enthusiast. She earned her MA in English Literature and serves on her library’s board of directors. She’s a member of Tall Poppy Writers. THE KINDRED SPIRITS SUPPER CLUB is her most recent novel. 

How Do You Write Podcast: Explore the processes of working writers with bestselling author Rachael Herron. Want tips on how to write the book you long to finish? Here you’ll gain insight from other writers on how to get in the chair, tricks to stay in it, and inspiration to get your own words flowing. 

Join Rachael’s Slack channel, Onward Writers!

Transcript:

Rachael Herron: [00:00:00] Welcome to “How do you Write?” I’m your host, Rachael Herron. On this podcast, I talk to authors about how they write, what their process is and how their lives fit together. I’ll keep each episode short so you can get back to writing.

[00:00:16] Well, Hello writers! Welcome to episode #247 of “How do you Write?” I’m Rachael Herron. So thrilled you’re here today with me as I’m speaking to Amy Reichert about one of our favorite topics of all time, procrastination. I have this working theory and I bet you subscribed to it too. That writers are better procrastinators than most normal human people. There is something about writing. Well, I know what it is. There’s something about writing that makes us procrastinate because it is painful, because it is never as easy and as fun as say, takin’ a walk to the local ice cream parlor, is it requires thought and effort and an angst and low levels of pain, sometimes high levels of pain.[00:01:08] Of course we become expert procrastinators. There are exceptions. You may be, one of those people who actually gets their work done early every time. I really liked to listen to Adam Grant’s podcast, which forgotten what it’s called but it’s really good. And he is a, he calls himself a pre-crastinator. He loves to get an assignment and start working on it that very day. But the majority of us are not that, we are procrastinators. So, I know you’ll enjoy the episode. Very quickly what it’s going on around here? Well, we’re on the grand adventure. We’re still in the same Airbnb where I was last week. We move this next week out on Sunday, this coming Sunday, we’re going to have our going away party, which I’m kind of sick about. Honestly, I’m so nervous. I don’t like goodbyes at all. I, as a recovering addict, I have made my whole life about avoiding pain, and throwing yourself a goodbye party as you leave the country so that you can say goodbye to the people who are most beloved to you really sucks. [00:02:21] However, I do think a lot about discomfort and living with it and thriving with it. I think we have to, as writers, we have to get comfortable being uncomfortable because writing is discomfort. Writing is resistance, is the discomfort that we feel. And we must be able to sit down with that discomfort and just do the work. So I’m thinking a lot about that as I think about this party coming up, I’m walking toward it with as much of an open-heart as I can. Understanding, and I’m going to cry a lot that day and I hate crying, and I’m getting to better and better at doing it. I’m going to walk forward knowing that it is going to hurt and that, that is part of life. And that I want to see these people and I want to be around them. And I want to tell them that I love them. So, that’s, what’s coming up for me this weekend. I am being saved. My ass is being saved by Pomodoro’s. I mentioned this on Twitter yesterday, but in the busiest times of my life, when everything is all chaos, Pomodoro’s always come to my rescue. I- Pomodoro’s, if you don’t know what they are, it is just a technique of writing in bursts; a traditional Pomodoro is 25 minutes working for 25 minutes and then taking five minutes to do something else.[00:03:46] Usually it is prescribed to do something that does not checking your email or your Twitter or something that has a lot of open loops. You want to do some closed loop stuff on that five-minute break, go get yourself another glass of water. Go to the bathroom, get a snack. Do something that won’t completely hijack you and your brain and for me on a normal and in a normal life, 25 minutes is an irritating time. Amount of time to get stopped in. And I prefer to work in 45 minute chunks or hour chunks, but on these chaotic days where I know that I wouldn’t get any writing done, I have been setting my goal of a bare minimum of two to four Pomodoro’s because you know what? I cannot write today. I will absolutely not write today. There’s no way I’m going to write today. But, could I write for 25 minutes? Okay, fine, fine. Turn on the Pomodoro timer. And for me on Mac, I like to use the Be Focused app, I have the paid version of Be Focused and it works well for me. [00:04:46] So I just turn it on and I do 25 minutes and after 25 minutes, oh suddenly that time is up. It didn’t take that long. Take a little break. I guess I could do another one. So I do another one and that has been saving me. That is the only way I’m getting work done. So I mention it just in case. I know we’ve been talking about it a couple of times on the podcast. Recently here, because I’ve heard from people hello, Eliza, who have heard about it and have tried it and I’ve loved it. So I’m saying it again to reiterate. If you’re not getting your work done, try to get some smaller chunks of work done. One of my students is writing in 12 minute bursts because that is her. And then another one is doing 17 minute bursts because that is the least amount of time that feels like they can actually get a number of words that would make them feel like they have a little bit of success. So they’re doing that. What is your minimum viable product? Have you decided that, have you tried it, have you played with it? I want to know. So come find me. If you’re not on my email newsletter list, you should be, I’m going to ask you to subscribe to it. And I’m going to put it in the little add read in the middle today. Join my email list. That is important. I promise you, I’m going to send one out really soon. Maybe I’ll use a Pomodoro to write one really quickly to get it out because I have not done that in a while. But everything else is going a pace. Very excited. We will be in the air in two and a half weeks. And, I’ll just keep talking to you from New Zealand, tell you how it’s going there. So my friends happy writing to you. Get some work done. Come to find me online and tell me how it’s going. And now please interview this enjoy, how about enjoy this interview with Amy? Happy writing everybody. [00:06:30] Hey, you’re a writer. Did you know that I send out a free weekly email of writing encouragement? Go sign up for it at www.rachaelherron.com/write and you’ll also get my Stop Stalling and Write PDF with helpful tips you can use today to get some of your own writing done. Okay, now onto the interview. 

Rachael Herron: [00:06:30] All right. Well, I could not be more pleased to welcome to the show, Amy E. Reichert. Hello, Amy! 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:06:52] Hello, Rachael. Thank you for having me. 

Rachael Herron: [00:06:54] It is a pleasure to have you, let me give you a little introduction and then we’re going to jump in talking about all things writing. Amy E. Reichert is an author, wife, mom, Wisconsinite, amateur chef, and cider enthusiast. She earned her MA in English Literature and serves on her library’s board of directors. I love that. That’s sexy. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:07:13] Thank you.

Rachael Herron: [00:07:14] It really is. She’s a member of it really is library’s board of directors. Wow. She’s a member of the tall copywriters and THE KINDRED SPIRITS SUPPER CLUB is her most recent novel. So congratulations on that. The covers amazing

Amy E. Reichert: [00:07:27] Thank you! I have it right here. 

Rachael Herron: [00:07:30] It’s, look at that beautiful! That is- Oh my gosh!

Amy E. Reichert: [00:07:32] It looks really good on the screen. 

Rachael Herron: [00:07:35] It looks amazing. I was just actually looking at it a minute ago, thinking like you won a cover lottery for that one. Good job! 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:07:41] Thank you. Well, I had nothing to do with it. I just

Rachael Herron: [00:07:47] I know, but it’s really nice when we do hit that lottery and we’re like, yeah. Thanks. So tell us about your writing process. How do you get your books done with all of this other stuff? You mentioned that the kids are going to be walking in the door any minute. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:07:59] Yes. 

Rachael Herron: [00:08:00] They’re back in school? What does it look like? 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:08:02] They are back- they’ve been in school the whole year. They, it was a hybrid situation where we were so, like if there was a contact tracing situation, they’d be at home for a couple of weeks and then they’d go back.

Rachael Herron: [00:08:15] It sounds smart

Amy E. Reichert: [00:08:17] It was really, really well done. They’ve been wearing masks, they have spacing. They know you have to sit in the exact same spot so that if there is someone who’s, who hasn’t, you know who they were in contact with. So it’s been really, they’ve kept it open. And I think that was a big win for our school district. 

Rachael Herron: [00:08:34] Probably a win for your writing as well. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:08:36] Yeah, I can procrastinate and under the best of circumstances

Rachael Herron: [00:08:42] under any circumstances, if you’re like me. Yeah.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:08:44] Yeah. I’m really, really good at that. That’s my super power. Sadly, most that, like, I can get away with doing that with cleaning. Cause eventually, somehow I can get things off of the list. Someone else will just do it, that doesn’t work with writing. No one else, there aren’t little elves that come in and do the writing for me. So at some point I do have to do it.

Rachael Herron: [00:09:05] So when do you do, how do you do it? How do you, this is a really actually, it’s a really good, big question. How do you deal with your procrastination with our writerly procrastination?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:09:13] I know. It’s, I am constantly looking for the right solutions. First of all, I know with me, the key is to know what I’m writing next. So, having an idea of this is the scene I’m going to be going into, and here are two or three things that are supposed to happen or need to be accomplished in that scene. If I know that, I am super productive and I will get right to it and I will knock it out. If I don’t know that, which is kind of where I am right now, it doesn’t help that I’m pre-launch so I’m easily distracted. But, so I’ve been really having a hard time getting my words in. I actually need to sit down and look at what I need to do next cause I’m like midway through that first draft, I’m like, I don’t know what I have. I don’t know what I need to do. Cause I don’t write chronologically all the time. So I kind of write this, I want to write this scene. I’m gonna write this scene and as ideas come to me, so I kind of end up all over the place without any lines connected, 

Rachael Herron: [00:10:20] Which I’m always telling my students it’s okay. Because we connect those things later. Right. So, where would you put yourself on the plotter versus pantsers spectrum?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:10:31] I am a plotter. I definitely have pantser tendencies. I like to know, I like to, maybe I’m a plotter. Like if I were a sandwich, I’d be- the bread would be the plotting and then the filling is the pantsing. 

Rachael Herron: [00:10:50] I love that.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:10:51] Thanks! I just came up with it. 

Rachael Herron: [00:10:52] That’s where all the flavor is. That’s where all the delicious, that’s where the cheese is. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:10:57] You’ve even made it better! So I was trying to do like horoscope. Like I’m a plotter with pantser rising, but I don’t really understand. I don’t understand horoscope language. So I don’t really know what that means. But I do like to know my big major moments. I have to know that I do write a very like four to five-page detailed synopsis of what’s going to happen. I know how it’s going to end. I do give myself permission to change that if a better idea comes along. But how I get from those big tent pole moments, kind of, I fill in the blank as I go. And I like to give myself that freedom. But at the same time, I hate that I give myself freedom. Cause it results in moments like this, where I don’t know what I want to write next and I need to rethink and get back down to it. My current, like a very specific thing I’m doing right now, is I have created, a handy-dandy or I don’t know if we’re going to see it. 

Rachael Herron: [00:12:01] Oh, yeah I can see it.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:12:03] Kind of. So it’s like a sprint to the finish. Each of those little squares is a 30-minute writing sprint. 

Rachael Herron: [00:12:07] Oh nice!

Amy E. Reichert: [00:12:09] I write down my words, which is really great. Assuming I will sit down and do that again. A writing sprint is only as good. It was only good. If you know what you’re supposed to be writing. 

Rachael Herron: [00:12:22] I saw the number of boxes is that predicted to the end of the book, like to the word count that you’re aiming toward. That’s fantastic. I’ve never seen it exactly like that because you, you know, approximately how many of those little sprints you’re going to take?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:12:34] Yeah. Cause I have about 45 thousand words and in a 30-minute writing sprint, I can get anywhere from like 500 to 700 words. Sometimes, I mean it varies obviously. So yeah, that’ll bump me up to about a 70,000-page draft by the time I’m done, which is what I like for a first draft, I tend to write very bare bones. In fact, I’d be happy with 60 

Rachael Herron: [00:13:02] and then you’re going to put, then you’re going to put the filling in the sandwich.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:13:04] Then I put the filling in the sandwich. Someone, I was talking to someone cause I’m writing a book. My next book is a Christmas book which is really all I’ll say about it. But someone asked if I was watching a lot of Christmas movies and listening to Christmas music and I’m like, no, not really, because I’m trying to do my bread. So

Rachael Herron: [00:13:24] You’re doing the story, that’s what’s important. Yeah. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:13:26] Yeah. So once I get to like all the window dressing, all the flavor in the middle, then I’ll get in Christmas mode but not yet. I like our sandwich analogy, it’s gold! 

Rachael Herron: [00:13:38] It’s working on multiple levels and it’s kind of also making me hungry, which is, which is normal. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:13:42] Yeah. Me too.

Rachael Herron: [00:13:43] What is your biggest challenge when it comes to writing? 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:13:48] Beyond procrastination which is, I think I even wrote something down. Yes. Yeah. Procrastination is consistency. I think that is the other big thing is, when you want just being, getting the butt in the chair every day. And it’s not always a procrastination situation. It’s a life situation with kids, especially moving into baseball season and to the school year and the summer I’d much rather be on our pontoon than writing. 

Rachael Herron: [00:14:16] Hell yes!

Amy E. Reichert: [00:14:18] So I think consistency is something I really strive for. I’ve tried- I have a dear friend, her name is Karma Brown and oh, I don’t have it with me. I lent it to someone. She wrote a book called the 4% Fix she’s, she normally writes fiction, but she wrote a nonfiction, called the 4% Fix. And the idea is that, you carve out an hour of time, every day to accomplish something that you want to accomplish. And she ultimately uses that hour for writing. I actually have started using it for reading, cause I wasn’t reading enough, but then I started doing like an 8% fix where I would read for an hour and then I’d write for an hour. And if I can consistently do that, it’s like, I feel like I can conquer the world. So that is my goal is to be consistent about reading and writing for at least an hour every day, which sounds like not a lot of time, but you’re a writer. You understand how much other 

Rachael Herron: [00:15:11] It’s all the other stuff. There’s this great quote, and I need to figure out who said it. But you can accomplish your life’s the work of your life and half an hour a day, you know, I’ve written a whole books in like 45 minute chunks day after day. Not more than that, so yeah, Absolutely. What is your biggest joy? Oh, sorry, go on. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:15:30] Oh, what does it say? Let’s be honest. We actually are half of it. More than half of it is in your brain when you’re wandering around doing nothing. 

Rachael Herron: [00:15:38] Absolutely 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:15:39] It looks like nothing. 

Rachael Herron: [00:15:41] It’s very profitable. And why don’t our families know that, but 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:15:45] They should! Like, I’ll be playing my candy crush. It’s actually a Harry Potter version of candy crush. And my husband’s like, that’s not working. You bet it is. You just don’t know it. 

Rachael Herron: [00:15:56] Absolutely is, no one trusts us. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:15:59] Yeah. There might be a little bit to that. 

Rachael Herron: [00:16:03] Don’t let them listen to this podcast episode. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:16:06] No I won’t. 

Rachael Herron: [00:16:08] What is your biggest joy when it comes to writing?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:16:10] My biggest joy, there’s, I would say there’s two things that are tied because they count and they’re very different points in the process. One is when something clicks in a story and you’re just like, oh my God, this is the plot point I was trying to get to and didn’t know how I was going to click on that. Oh my God, I’m genius. That doesn’t happen often, 

Rachael Herron: [00:16:35] But when it does, it’s so good. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:16:38] It’s crap. You know, it’s what keeps me going. That and when I have the finished book and people start reading it and people start saying, oh my God, this, this book was just what I needed right now. And because of, I tend to write lighter, happier books. So for a lot of people, what they come to me and say is I had a really bad, things were really bad for me and I read your book and it just added some brightness to my day and that, doesn’t get any better. 

Rachael Herron: [00:17:09] That is like the most honorable thing we could reach for, right?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:17:13] Yes. Yeah. Because that’s why I read, I just want to, not that my life is horrible, but I just want to get out of it. So 

Rachael Herron: [00:17:20] Yeah, and you wanna go somewhere else. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:17:23] To be able to do that for other people? Oh, so good. 

Rachael Herron: [00:17:25] You’re so fun to talk to. All right. Can you share a craft tip with our writers of any kind?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:17:30] I actually wrote this down cause you gave me the questions, in advance, because I didn’t want to forget. So people often say when you are in like the later drafting phases, you should read your work out loud. I hate reading out loud.

Rachael Herron: [00:17:47] Me too. And I don’t do it. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:17:48] I hate it. And so I don’t do it either because to read a book out loud, that’s like 15 hours of time. I don’t want to do that. That’s a lot of talking that I don’t want to do, but I use Scrivener and I think Microsoft word does this too. And it will read it to you. Now it’s super funny, cause it’s kind of a robot voice, but it really, really, it helps me because I can listen to it being read to me and all of a sudden that changes things because I have like, I’m more likely to keep working because the other part is if I’m reading out loud, I hate reading out loud. So then I’m like more to procrastinate and go do something else. But if my computer’s reading to me, then I get a lot more, like it keeps the ball rolling better, and then I’ll pause it and make changes when something sounds funny and then I’ll start it up again. And it just, I discovered it during my, when I was writing Kindred Spirits and I, it was really, really helpful for me as a way to, when you’re working at that sentence level.

Rachael Herron: [00:18:48] Yeah. So you’re playing it and you’re looking at it at the same time and 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:18:52] Correct. 

Rachael Herron: [00:18:53] And you’re actually looking for things like rhythm and words, repetition as well as- I use it for typos, but it sounds like you’re using it for actual helping you with it with the sentence level.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:19:00] Yeah. Cause even like, even if the robot, when the robot voice seems to stumble then you know there’s something wrong or I can’t follow, like that made no sense. And then I’ll double check. Was it the robot voice reading it or no, it really doesn’t make sense. I’ll fix that. I find it really helpful.

Rachael Herron: [00:19:18] One of my biggest problem as a writer is writing those sentences that don’t make sense later. Like they made sense to me. But,

Amy E. Reichert: [00:19:23] They do!

Rachael Herron: [00:19:24] But not when somebody else like a robot reads them out loud. I love that. I love that.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:19:28] Yeah. So Scrivener’s magical. I really, really love Scrivener. I’m always finding new things

Rachael Herron: [00:19:36]. I know you only need that. Speaking of 4%, you only need to know about 4% of Scrivener’s tricks to use it. And I’ve been using it for as long as it’s been out. I think I got it at 13 years ago or something like that. And I’m still finding things. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:19:49] Yeah. And I really do only use 4% of it. 

Rachael Herron: [00:19:51] Did you know it has a name generator? 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:19:53] Oh yeah. I like that one. 

Rachael Herron: [00:19:55] That’s a good one. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:19:57] That is a good one. 

Rachael Herron: [00:19:58] Okay. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:19:59] I need a waiter, what’s the waiter’s name? Harvey!

Rachael Herron: [00:20:02] Exactly. I haven’t, I’ve literally no creativity to spare on wasting on the waiter’s name. It does it for us. That’s fantastic. Okay, so-

Amy E. Reichert: [00:20:09] People are really funny. 

Rachael Herron: [00:20:11] I know. And you could set the like, idiosyncracy, of the name too. If people haven’t found that it’s under writing tools, I think. What thing in your life affects your writing in a surprising way?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:20:24] What thing in my life, I should’ve thought more about that one. I got to like question three and then I got distracted. About what affects my writing in surprising ways. I shouldn’t be thinking about this so long, but I am. I want to, I think part of it is going back to that time crunch and how we get a lot of writing done in short amount of time because I am a mom. I have found my most productive writing times are sometimes sitting in the car, waiting for a kid to come out. And that kind of surprised me. When you know, you always think to write productively, you must be in your space, but in truth, I find being flexible and willing to work everywhere. Actually, the most productive place for me to write is on an airplane because there’s no internet.

Rachael Herron: [00:21:24] I love it. I am not spending $15 on your internet. I will not do it. And it sucks like I’m cheap and lazy. Yeah. Also, I really love, I really love airport. Oh, no. Sorry. I like hotel lobbies there’s so, back when we used to travel. They’re so generic and it’s hard to get on the internet and not in a hotel too. Brilliant! I love that. Okay. So what is the best book you’ve read recently?

Amy E. Reichert: [00:21:49] So I recently read Ayesha at Last by Uzma Jalaluddin. Two seconds 

Rachael Herron: [00:21:57] Yes, get it for us.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:22:01] I will. So this is it. Ayesha at Last, it is a retelling of Pride and Prejudice, which you’re, you know, you’re kind of like, oh, you don’t need another one. You do. It is set in the Toronto and it’s Toronto Muslim Community. So it has- It’s just a different twist. It’s a different twist and it’s beautifully written, so well done. And what I love about it as is it’s taking a very familiar story and familiar romantic tropes, but it’s setting in a community that a lot of us aren’t familiar with and you get to explore the joy in that community and the romance. And what I really found fascinating is because the main love interest is they’re both Muslim. They’re very chaste, but that doesn’t mean there’s not steam. And I kind of loved that. So I’m really excited. I actually have an event coming up with her in a couple of weeks, so I’m very excited. I’m gushing all over her. 

Rachael Herron: [00:23:07] That’s so cool. And that’s flying to the top of my TBR list. I had not heard of it. Oh, thank you very much, Ayesha at Last. Perfect. Now speaking of awesome books, why don’t you tell us a little bit about Kindred Spirits Supper Club? 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:23:19] So the Kindred Spirits, Supper Club is about Sabrina Monroe, who is forced to, for financial reasons, moved back in with her parents in the Wisconsin, Dells, where she grew up, which to her is the worst possible thing that could happen. And then she’s forced to face the figurative and literal ghosts of her past, her family. The women in her family can actually see spirits and to help them, the whole point is they help them move along to whatever come next. It’s not creepy at all. In fact, her best friend growing up was ghost Molly, who is a rom-com loving ghost, who is somebody they could never, they could never quite help. So she’s just become part of the family. And Molly is determined to help Sabrina find her happy ever after, since Molly did not get hers. Enter Ray, who is the new supper club owner in town. And he is intrigued by this sort of awkward and anxious woman and Molly decides this needs to happen and does some stuff. And yeah. So, yeah, it’s just sort of a sweet, romantic well story. 

Rachael Herron: [00:24:31] I cannot wait to read it. Your publicist got you in with me right at the last minute. So I haven’t read it yet, but, it’s on my Kindle and I was just looking at it online and it just looks like everything that I like to read. So thank you.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:24:42] I am just. You’re welcome. I love all my books, but I really do. I really love this book. 

Rachael Herron: [00:24:51] Your face gets mushy. When you talk about it, like you’re, I can see how much you love them. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:24:56] I’m kind of mushy about them. 

Rachael Herron: [00:24:58] That’s awesome. That’s awesome. Okay. And where can we find you online? 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:25:03] Sorry, I had to hydrate. 

Rachael Herron: [00:25:05] Of course, that’s necessary. 

Amy E. Reichert: [00:25:07] You can find me online at my website, www.amyereichert.com, A-M-Y-E-R-E-I-C-H-E-R-T.com. And on there, you can subscribe to my newsletter, which I am about to do a major revamp of, you can also find me on Twitter. You can find the links to me to find me on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook from there. So yeah, I’m at Amy E. Reichert at most places. So yeah, I’m all over the place, right now I feel like I’m flooding the world with stuff.

Rachael Herron: [00:25:38] Thank you so much! Well, I’m always behind in my podcast, like I’ve got a bunch that need to come up before you, so this is going to be one of those later bumps in your release. So that’d be great.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:25:50] I am all for that. Extend it as long as possible. 

Rachael Herron: [00:25:54] Tell your publicist that when she’s like, where did Rachael’s podcasts go. Amy, it has been such a treat to talk to you. I’m so glad to meet you and know you and I can’t wait to read your book.

Amy E. Reichert: [00:26:03] Likewise. Thank you so much for having me on Rachael.

Rachael Herron: [00:26:05] Take care. Happy writing, bye!

Thanks so much for joining me on this episode of “How do you Write?” You can reach me on Twitter, twitter.com/RachaelHerron, or at my website, www.rachaelherron.com, you can also support me on Patreon and get essays on living your creative life for as little as a buck an essay at www.patreon.com/rachael spelled R, A, C, H, A, E, L and do sign up for my free weekly newsletter of encouragement to writers rachaelherron.com/write/

Now, go to your desk and create your own process and get to writing my friends.

The post Ep. 247: Amy E. Reichert on Writers and Procrastination appeared first on R. H. HERRON.

In this bonus miniepisode, Rachael talks about how to get better about being okay writing truly crappy first drafts. Also, she talks about marketing from a trad perspective, as well as marketing memoir when your platform might be a little wobbly! 

Join Rachael’s Slack channel, Onward Writers!

Transcript:

Rachael Herron: [00:00:00] Welcome to “How Do You Write?” I’m your host, Rachael Herron. On this podcast, I talk to authors about how they write, what their process is and how their lives fit together. I’ll keep each episode short so you can get back to writing.

[00:00:16] Hello writers! Welcome to episode #246 of “How Do You Write? And this is a bonus mini episode brought to you by the patrons who support me at $5 a month or up. I get to ask, act as your coach and you get to send me questions. And then I get to feel a little bit guilty when it takes me a long time to do the mini episodes, but I do answer every question eventually. So, here we are, let’s jump into some of these awesome questions and I have to tell you that answering these, just makes me really happy. It makes me really happy to have this honest to God back and forth conversation with you, about the things that really matter to you. So, thank you to every patron at every level, including the ones who are at this level. [00:01:04] So, let’s start. Darren first asks. Let’s see, preamble, when I signed up for your newsletter of encouragement, which I love to pieces, you asked the question that I replied and answered. To paraphrase, what is the thing keeping you from the page? To which I replied, that I am not very good, and I know it. You graciously sent a response, which I did not expect that said, and again, I paraphrase, then write badly on purpose. I’ve tried and failed. My question for the mini coach: How do I put aside my ego that wants to write good words, even if my ability sticks out its tongue at the notion and just write crap on purpose? It feels counterintuitive. I mean, how are you supposed to improve if you’re intentionally writing crap? I heart your podcasts. I heart your spirit. I hope things continue to progress for you in your trek to New Zealand. Stay awesome, because that’s exactly who you are. Thank you for your time. [00:02:05] I think you’re awesome, Darren. Thank you for your patience and me getting back to this. I love this question because I lived in this question for at least 10 years, maybe more. I knew that everybody was telling me to write crap badly on purpose and move forward so that then later I could fix it. But in my heart, head and soul, my true deepest part of my soul, and this is hard to confess, but I’ve confessed it before on the podcast. I’m going to do it again. I really believed, that at some point, I would be a good enough writer that I wouldn’t have to that. I really, truly believed that the great writers that I admired, even their first drafts, were pretty damn good. I truly thought that on a cellular level. I even thought that, okay, well, if everybody else’s first drafts are crap, then I need to be the exception. And I will someday, if I try hard enough and I read all the books and I, and I keep trying to up my craft, even though I wasn’t writing very much. [00:03:21] Someday I’ll be good enough that I won’t have to deal with the pain, the essential pain and agony of putting words on the page that just are not up to standard. And I really believe that I held this belief on a cellular level until about two years ago, maybe. It was when I realized that that’s actually what I was saying to myself deep inside my soul. I was expecting myself someday to get good enough that I wouldn’t have to deal with that. Let’s just, Rachael. Rachael, that was bullshit. Oh my God. Nobody, nobody, nobody sits down and writes well, what they want to write. What happens is we sit down, we write badly, but we think we want to write, and then that changes too. When what we are actually meant to write is something else that we only get to by writing crap and leaving it behind. And so, I really, really understand what you’re saying, Darren. I have 100% been there. Your question is how do I put aside my ego that wants to write good words? For me, let’s talk about this in practical, usable ways. For me, the best thing that ever happened to me was doing NaNoWriMo. Because you write 1,667 words a day, every day for 30 days, or you write more and then less or whatever you need to do. But if you’re writing 16, almost 1700 words a day, sure, the next day you can sit down and try to make them better. You know, try to edit, revise a little bit or edit and revise after you write those words on the first day. But the next day you still have to get those 1700 words. And the third day you got to get those 17 words and the fourth day, and after a while, you’re so tired. You cannot, you don’t have time to write the words and then make them as good as you want them to be. At some point, you have to wave the white flag of surrender and just keep moving forward every day, making those 1700 words and you have to leave them behind because you just don’t have time to fix them.[00:05:29] That is the way I learned how to do it technically is I gave myself a big enough challenge, and for me it was 1700 words a day. Yours may look different, but I gave myself a big enough challenge that the only way I could keep up with this challenge was to write words and then stop writing for the day because my brain was empty. My brain was done and tired by that point. And what that necessarily produced was a whole whack of words that I had to leave behind me on the page to fix later. Your real existential base of your question though is, how the hell am I supposed to get better if I’m just writing badly? How do I get better? 2 answers to that. Number one, it just happens. The more we write, the better we get, the more we write, the better we get, even when we’re writing crap. And number two, you actually get better measurably and you can feel it when you go back to revise that mountain. That trash mountain of a first draft, because you have learned, you have, number one, you’ve learned from the words that you wrote. You’ve learned a little bit about what the book wants to be, what these characters want to be. They’re not what you thought they would be, and they are not as good as you thought you could do on a first draft. They disappoint you, they let you down. And that is part of writing. Our writing will always disappoint us.[00:06:55] Our writing will always let us down. That is part of writing and we just keep showing up every day and we get used to the feeling of being let down by our writing. However, when we go back to revise, we have learned from doing the writing and we learn, literally, we literally learn from reading the words we left behind and we think, well, that just sounds awful. What a stupid sentence. I must be an imbecile to even think I could try this. And then somehow we stay at the page and we fixed that one sentence. We make it a little bit better or we get rid of it entirely. And then we go to the next sentence and it’s just as bad. And we fixed that. And in fixing it, we learned a little something. And then by the time we get to the third sentence and I’m breaking this down very simply, but the building blocks are true and reliable. By the time we get to that third sentence, you are a little bit smarter than you were when you sat down that morning to work on your work. And that third sentence, you’re gonna revise in a different way, in a way that you wouldn’t have been able to. Had you not started revising this and had you not written all this first draft.[00:08:03] So you are constantly learning as you write and as you revise. Susan Sontag said, my writing is smarter than I am because I can revise it. It blows my mind every time I think of that quote; my writing is smarter than I am because I can revise it. Your writing is one level of smart on that first draft, but every time you go back to it, it gets better and you get smarter as a human being, as you learn to be a better writer. And it just feels terrible to leave those words behind. So again, let’s go back to that idea, sorry, creaky chair, of giving yourself a challenge that’s big enough that you just have to leave crappy words behind, and maybe you don’t want to write 50,000 words in a month, like NaNoWriMo has you do. Maybe you just want to write 10,000 words this week. And you know that that is enough to exhaust you. You won’t be able to really get too tied up in thinking about how bad you did yesterday because today you’ve got to write your 2000 words or whatever it is. Then do that, and then go back and play with revising. But what you are feeling, Darren, is 100% normal and, it gets easier. It gets easier and easier. You’ll always write badly. You’ll always let yourself down. But you get a, you learn to have a deep, deep faith that yeah, you know what, that sucks. I’m a terrible writer when it comes to first draft, but boy, do I know how to make things better in a second or third or fourth draft. And that becomes super, super, super exciting, and not only exciting, it becomes, what’s the word, satisfying. You know, that you’re going to have a satisfying experience when you get into revision. And, knowing that that’s coming, is enough of a reward to draw us forward. So, thank you for asking a question that will help everybody. Thanks for that.[00:10:04] Okay. Mariah says, hello, Mariah, now that your new book, Hush Little Baby is out, hooray! I’ve been wondering how promotion is set up for this one. How does the publisher work with you on that one? How far ahead do you and the publisher and the publicist get in touch and plan things? Is your agent involved at all? What moving parts are in the plan? How much do they ask you to do? Are there Facebook ads for this sort of thing or other promotions? Tell me everything. Okay, so fantastic question. So, promotion for Hush Little Baby was set up a little bit later than normal because during this pandemic, we have not been doing, and by we, I’m talking about all the traditional publishing, almost no one has been doing physical advanced reader copies. It used to be that people over in the office at Penguin or Harper Collins or wherever. The publicists would be physically touching the advanced reader copies, putting them in an envelope, sending them to the long lead magazine, sending them out to the bloggers, sending them out to the bookstagrammers. They’re just not doing that now. They’re doing NetGalley advanced reader copies, which is digital. They didn’t even print advanced reader copies of Hush Little Baby at all. There wasn’t one printed, which is the first time in 20 plus books that that’s ever, I’ve ever seen that happen was this pandemic. So, it’s a little bit less lead time. [00:11:29] So we did a little bit more of that coming together and talking about marketing a little bit later than usual. Usually, we started about four months out. I think I met with them two or three months ahead of time. What happens is you and your agent, if you are traditionally published, generally what happens is you and your agent get together with your editor? And whoever’s working with you on publicity and whoever is, and that includes your promo person and your marketing person. Your marketing person is in charge of the stuff that they put money into and your promotion person is in charge of the stuff that’s basically free, social media. If you write essays to get interest in your books and you have this meeting online, and you brainstorm about what you could do to get attraction for this book. [00:12:16] So I will just say that when we were brainstorming this, I realized that in this book, Jillian is a recovering alcoholic. It is not what the book is about and that was my whole point is to show recovering alcoholics just doing their jobs, living their lives, much like I, as a recovering alcoholic. I just do my job and live my life. But it hadn’t occurred to me until after I talked to them or while we were talking that, oh, I really like recovery podcasts.  Let’s reach out to the recovery podcasts that I like best and talk to those hosts and send them digital advanced reader copies or finished copies after the finished copies are printed, so that maybe then they will want to have me on their show to talk about this book. And so that was a brand-new idea that occurred to us then. Something that generally happens nowadays. [00:13:06] It used to be that you would be put on a blog tour. Blog tours for books are a little bit dead. Now it’s all about the bookstagrammers. People on Instagram who read and review books have a lot of power, a lot of clout, and they have a lot of followers. And your publicist at the traditional publishing house has a list of all those people. So, she’s going to reach out to them, offer to send them the book they’re going to say yes or no. Hopefully if they get it, they’re going to feature it. And a little, they’re going to put up a photo of it and they’re going to say to their followers, do you want to read this? Does this book look good? Best case scenario is if the bookstagrammer reads it and then talks about it and recommends it, hopefully they like it. So that is a big part of publicity and promotion right now. Let’s see, your agent is involved in that. She’s just there making sure that stuff gets done. As regards, things that cost money like Facebook ads or Amazon ads, generally in traditionally publishing, from where I have been, which is just a solid mid-list author, they will put a little bit of money into that, not a lot, and it’s usually for the first week or two. In Facebook ads, they’ll generally target other authors like you, their readers, they’ll target them. But money doesn’t go far. Publishers don’t have very much of it. So, they’re not gonna be able to send you on any kind of book tour or pay for your plane flights to go do something, back in the days when we could still do that. There’s less money spent, unless you are a very big name. If you’re getting a seven-figure deal in a, if you’re getting a seven-figure advance, they’re going to put some real money into Facebook ads, into Amazon ads. But if you’re not, then you need to do it on your own. [00:14:53] So anything that I didn’t say on this podcast, about that, is what I’m doing on my own. Basically, the author is in charge of doing the vast majority of all publicity and promotion for their books, which is very hard and is a perennial source of angst and wringing of hands. Do I know how to do it well? I absolutely do not. Could I do a better? Oh, yes! If you look at my Instagram, I should have a lot more pictures of Hush Little Baby instead of the seven or eight that I do. I’m not very good at it. And it is something that we’re all always trying to figure out better ways of doing, searching for the magic bullet, there isn’t one. Books take off and hit the New York Times bestseller list and nobody knows how. They didn’t have any publicity promotion behind them. And perhaps you as a reader, didn’t think they were as good as this other book, which completely tanked. Sales for a book, like I’ve said on the show before, don’t have anything to do with how good a book is. It’s this weird thing. If publishers could make best sellers, they would. If publishers could make best sellers of every one of their books, they would. They don’t know how to do it either. None of us know how to do it. So, it all, I always would like to bring it back to what is inside my control. The only thing that is truly inside my control is my writing, is doing the work, is sitting down, protecting the time, writing the crappy first draft, and then knowing that revision will happen and I will make something out of it. That’s what I control. I control the fact that every book that I write, I want to be better than the one that came before it. Hush Little Baby, as my most recent book, is my best book. It’s the best book I’ve ever written. Is it selling as well as some others? It is absolutely not. It’s a, that’s a strange time in publishing for many different reasons. But I can rest. I can close my eyes at night knowing that that’s the best book I’ve ever written, subjectively, as I rate it on my particular sale. And that’s all I can control. So, I’m just going to write the next book. But, fabulous question. Thank you for asking that. I think I answered all of those questions.[00:17:16] All right. We have two more questions. All right. This one is for Brian, from Brian. Thanks again for your patience, everybody. Brian says, thanks and hello again. I have a question regarding my first revision. First of all, I imagined myself being your least qualified patron. No, that’s not true, Brian. I am a high school dropout and my only qualification for writing is that I lived in a cabin alone in the woods of Sweden for nine months during COVID. I passed my ninth-grade writing competency test and I’ve completed a 100,000 word first draft memoir. So, this might seem like a very simple question, how much passive voice is okay? My normal speaking voice is very passive, slangy and sing-songy. This is my voice however, and I understand that to engage the reader, I must write actively. Do I limit my slangy sing-song passiveness to quotes, or can I slip 5-10% into the overall narration? Thanks for any help. And thanks for being my coach, coach.[00:18:12] I love this question. So, I personally am very, very, very drawn to writers who use their own voice, who could not be anyone else, I’m thinking particularly right now of Samantha Irby. If you have not read her, her last name is IRBY. She writes incredibly funny essays where she is passive voices, sing songs, slang, all of her own words. You can tell that she is writing in the voice she uses to speak in the world and it is hilarious and nobody else could do it. And I would say for her, you’re asking 5-10%. I would say that Samantha has got 30-40% in there. Of course, she has things that we need in our writing. She has action. She has dialogue. She has things happening on the page. She has things that she wants. Things that she has prevented from getting and methods of trying to get around those blocks. Right? That’s what we’re all writing about. We’re writing about wanting something and not being able to get it and how we, how we changed in the pursuit of that goal. That’s really what every story is about. But you get to put in as much as you want. The passive voice in particular. So, let’s, let me try to come up with an example. Oh, it’s going to be just a simple, dumb example, but here we go. When the sun was shining and the birds were chirping on the morning, on Tuesday morning, so the sun was shining. Let’s just say the sun shone and the birds chirped. When we have that to-be verb in there, the were, the sun was shining, the birds were chirping, it is, it puts us at one degree of remove. We’re one, we’re one step away from that actually happening and feeling like it’s happening. So, the sun shone is more direct. I was angry. That’s a passive voice. If we say, I slammed the cup against the wall and the coffee sprayed all over her face, that’s direct. That’s active. That is, that is happening. That is not, I was angry. That is actual action happening. So, you do want that in your book, but if you have that passive voice in there, absolutely. If that’s your voice, include what you want in it. And this will be, at some point, everybody, every single person listening to this podcast, I’d like to remind you, you will have an editor. Please, God, have an editor. You don’t have to. You could write a book, first draft and slap it up online and it will get bad reviews and you’ll be sad. But everybody else, all the rest of you will have an editor.[00:21:12] You will either get an agent and go the traditional publishing route where your agent will sell your book. And then you will have an editor at an, at a publisher who will be assigned to you, who will buy your book and they will work with you on editing your book, or you will use someplace like Reedsy to find a great editor for you and they will be, and you’ll hire them. They will be the one saying, okay, this is too passive right here. I don’t feel close enough to you right here. Can you bring me closer in your work? And here are some suggestions of how to do that well and strongly, and your editor will be helping you with that. So in the meantime, number one, I forgot to say, the most important thing. Congratulations! You did something that most people never do. You finished a book. You completed a first draft. The statistics say that 80% of Americans say, I know you might not be American because I know you were living in Sweden. But 80% of Americans say that they want write a book, 97% of those who start. 97% of those who attempt to write a book, do not finish it. You’re already in the top 3%. Holy crap! Congratulations! And now, start working on that revision or revisions. And then, you’re going to be working with an editor at some point, and they will be able to tell you if you’re using too much slang, if it’s getting in the way. But, you’re so close to it, you will probably not be able to tell that yourself. So onward I say to you, and I’m really proud of you. Thank you for asking that.[00:22:47] All right. Last question is from Ken. Rachael, I’ve finished my memoir letters to my son in prison, and I am in the process of hiring an editor for development and copy. Now I’m turning my attention to marketing and promotion. Up to these point 5 years, I’ve wanted to go traditional, both for credibility and marketing help, but my wife has been pushing, and I don’t think even the best traditional will bring much promotion muscle to the table. As to platform, I have a poultry Instagram presence and to be honest, I don’t see myself having much success on any social platform. What I do have a several decades of friends and business acquaintances who I can market my book to. I’m guessing I can sell a hundred books with my network and maybe get word of mouth working for me. Any thoughts? Advice? And who is the guy you use for marketing you interviewed him a few months ago? He had a book out. [00:23:38] Okay. So, first of all, let’s start off with where I should have started with Brian, which is congratulations. I’m so glad that you have finished your memoir and I’m really proud of you that you are in the process of working with an editor for development. First, we first work with our developmental editors and they help us with the large picture, very important stuff. And then second, the copy editing. That’s the very, very last part. That’s where we get all our commas and our typos out of the way. So, it looks like you’re doing everything exactly right in the right order. I love that you’re thinking about marketing and promotion.[00:24:13] Here’s what I like to say. Social media, it can help. Absolutely. Will any of us or all of us be able to boost our social media numbers up into the dozens of thousands of people following us that we would need to really utilize them and harness them? That’s difficult. The most important thing to be working on using is building a mailing list, if possible. And we could do a whole show on that. And perhaps we won’t right now, but having a mailing list to announce to people when you come out with books is a nice thing to have. If this is the only book you want to write and get out there, then that mailing list is going to be less important. However, for you, I’m guessing, you said you have several decades of friends and business acquaintances who I can market my book to. You might be a person who might do very well on LinkedIn. LinkedIn is one of those often overlooked social media places. You might already have the connections there and you can start, you know, you can basically write little blog posts on LinkedIn to get attention and eyeballs. You can release your book cover, there, when you get the book cover and have all of those business acquaintances and friends, look at it and say, Ooh, I can’t wait to buy that. You could, if you’re going to self-publish this, you can do a preorder at all the vendors and say, my book is now available for pre-order, here it is. Click that link. You can excerpt things on LinkedIn and on all the other social media, you can do this. You can excerpt like, you know, a paragraph or two to wet people’s appetite. That might be something that’s gonna work really well to drum up that interest.[00:25:56] Another thing to think about when we’re talking about this kind of marketing is when the book is out, ask people to leave honest reviews. You cannot incentivize good reviews. It is not allowed and you will get punished for it. And it’s not very good to do morally, let’s just admit that. But you can ask for reviews. You can say to your friends and acquaintances, reviews are very, very important for books. It helps them to be visible in the algorithms. So don’t forget to ask for those, after your book comes out, after you’ve sold those, a hundred or so copies that you feel like you can move with your network. Ask for those reviews, because that’s how other people who are not related to you will be able to find the book. The social credit. That is gained by people, looking at your book and seeing that, oh, people really did like this. This is a verified purchase. They bought this book, they read it, they wrote this review and they liked it. That means I’m going to do the same thing. I’m also going to buy the book. Can be hugely useful. But can overall, I just want to say, like, it sounds like you’re doing everything in the right order. The title is awesome. I can’t wait to see it. Continue forward, onward, onward always.[00:27:12] And thank you for your questions, all four of you. I have more than four people in the mini coaching club. So, let’s, I’m going to erase these questions from my guilt-laden list of questions to answer. And I want new ones. So, if you’re on that list, please send me new ones. Maggie, I feel like you sent me one. Did I forget it on this? But I’m usually pretty good at not forgetting that. So I will go back and check. But to all of you listening who are Patreon supporters or who are not, thank you for being here with me. This really makes my heart sing when I get to talk like this to you extemporaneously, well, I actually always do that, just heart to heart of what you are thinking about. What I am also going to do and what. [00:28:02] Oh, can you ask me who my marketing person was? I don’t have a marketing person, but I do have an assistant. His name is Ed, he’s in episode 200 and his contact info is in there. He doesn’t, he’s an assistant, not marketing. But you can always reach out to him and see if he’s accepting new clients. His information is in that episode, number 200. And what I was going to say is that Ed is bugging me to do another bonus episode. So, I will be putting that up soon of Hush Little Baby’s release party, which is now more than a month old. But if you were not able to attend the launch, it’s a fun conversation that I had. So I’ll be releasing that probably next week. Cause I’m starting to get around to doing things because we are out of the house and I’m just in this Airbnb doing work. So thank you for listening. Thank you for being here. Thank you for being a writer. You’re the only person who can write your book. You’re the only person who can write your books. So please continue to do the crappy first draft work, which will get you closer and closer to those revised words, which will make their way into readers’ hands. And that is an awful, damn good feeling. So, happy writing, my friends.

Thanks so much for joining me on this episode of “How do you Write?” You can reach me on Twitter, twitter.com/RachaelHerron, or at my website, www.rachaelherron.com, you can also support me on Patreon and get essays on living your creative life for as little as a buck an essay at www.patreon.com/rachael spelled R, A, C, H, A, E, L and do sign up for my free weekly newsletter of encouragement to writers rachaelherron.com/write/

Now, go to your desk and create your own process and get to writing my friends.

The post Ep. 246: Why It’s Essential to Be Okay with Writing CRAP! appeared first on R. H. HERRON.