Catholic Thought discussion

Just finished and really enjoyed.

The Ninth Hour by Alice McDermott
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

What does it mean to love, for love to stand before suffering one’s own and another’s suffering, to stand even when love can not end the suffering, to love without counting the cost even though one knows what must be paid, to sacrifice whatever is asked? This is the question I found at the heart of this novel of a young widow raising her daughter under the care of a local convent of nursing sisters. I liked this story with its complicated characters, religious themes, layers of glimpsed questions. I appreciated that McDermott trusted her reader enough to open door after door, letting the reader make her own observations, draw his own conclusions.

I just read a short story that might interest the group. You can find itfree online. The Happy Prince by Oscar Wilde. I loved it.

C. S. Lewis

I decided on "The Four Loves" for my next reading after I finished two rather hard works of his "Reflections on the Psalms", and "Surprised by Joy". The Preface though was the first stumbling block. All I could derive from it is how love can be a “Need-love” or “Gift-love”. Lewis ponders over the difference between the two for most of the four pages. These become however major themes of the whole work. This becomes clear at the very end.

It is difficult to rate this serious writing in terms of the stars. Lewis is an intellectual who makes constant allusions from his lifetime of reading and thinking that are way above the knowledge and capacity of an average reader no matter how enthusiastically disposed towards his writing. It is a difficult task to stop and research all such references such as Lady Juliana, foreign quotes “façon de parler“, or just how he understands Venus and Eros that he refers to throughout. These stumbling blocks make this work a slow reading. It’s not suitable for skimming unless you are anywhere near the intellectual that Lewis was.

It may be worthwhile for this group to include some concluding thoughts Lewis offers on the very last two pages:

Lewis speculates how the afterlife will be like: “We may hope that the resurrection of the body means also the resurrection of what may be called our ‘greater body’; the general fabric of our earthly life with its affections and relationships.” He wonders what will become of his love for his wife or friend. Theologians, he says, sometimes asked whether our earthly relationships continue after life. Would it be like you in adult life meeting a great friend from your preparatory school? He thinks though that the frequent illusion that the goal of Christian life is to be reunited with the beloved dead must be denied. Prolonging of earthly happiness would not be completely satisfying. Where is God in all of this? What comes first? There after all no earthly comfort in the long run.

We were made for God and are in some respect like Him. We will not be asked to turn from our loved ones to a Stranger. “When we see the face of God we shall know that we have always known it. . . In Heaven there will be no anguish and no duty of turning away from our earthly Beloveds . . . from the creatures He made loveable to Love Himself . . . because we shall find them all in Him.” (p. 288)

Lewis concludes by reminding that he included two Graces under Charity: Gift-love and Need-love. “But God can give a third. He can awake in man, towards Himself, a supernatural Appreciative love. This is of all gifts the most to be desired. Here, not in our natural loves, nor even in ethics, lies the true centre of all human and angelic life. With this all things are possible.” (p. 288)

The pages are to the volume The "Inspirational Writings of C. S. Lewis" (1984) where I read these works.

Perfectly Yourself by Matthew Kelly
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

This bit of pop psychology sprinkled with a smattering of God language proposes to tell the reader how they can find happiness by being “perfectly yourself”. If it were not for the examples from work life, parenting and marriage, I would have thought I was reading a seventh grade mini-course text on personal development. The themes addressed, the simplistic tone, the over explanation of the most basic concepts, the unending repetition, the life principles highlighted, gave this an adolescent feel. As an adult reader, it was insulting on numerous levels. The author’s frequent mentions of his large audiences, his international speaking engagements, the thousands of people who sought his advice came across as braggadocious. 1.5 stars

Irene wrote: "Perfectly Yourself by Matthew Kelly
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

This bit of pop psychology sprinkled with a smattering of God language proposes to tell the reader how they can..."

Reading this author is unnerving. Some years ago our parish gave out a copy of his book The Four Signs of a Dynamic Catholic: How Engaging 1% of Catholics Could Change the World. My discomfort grew as I read it—half curious what he was all about. He seems like the closest Catholic version of a TV evangelist. The surprise to me is that his “lecture seminars” are sold out now even a couple of months in advance, or are they really? I read the book and on further investigation decided to donate the book to goodwill.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...

I agree. Thought the 4 Signs of a Dynamic Catholic was better by far than Perfectly Yourself and I was not exactly thrilled with the former. Our parish gave out Rediscover Jesus as a Christmas gift to everyone this year. Did not think it was bad at all, a nice refresher in our basic teachings about Jesus for those who have not done any reading or thinking about the topic since their Confirmation. But, he is, as you say, very popular. The neighboring parish gave out Perfectly Yourself and a copy was passed on to me. That is how I came to read it.

I’ve never read any of Michael Kelly’s books, but I have heard him speak on the radio. I find him to be an engaging dynamic speaker. He’s an evangelist, so you’re comparing apples and oranges if you’re sizing him up against theologians. He is not a theologian. Think of him as a Billy Graham, who just passed away. Graham was a great speaker and evangelist but I never found him to have any depth. But for his objectives he didn’t need any. Some people are at a certain state in their religious journey that they need an evangelist to inspire them. I remember when I was just returning to faith listening and loving Fr. John Corapi on EWTN. I needed that. We Catholics do such a poor job at evangelization. Michael Kelly is a rare bright spot.

And yes I know what happened to Fr. John Corapi. ;)

Manny wrote: "I’ve never read any of Michael Kelly’s books, but I have heard him speak on the radio. I find him to be an engaging dynamic speaker. He’s an evangelist, so you’re comparing apples and oranges if yo..."

Matthew Kelly's background is as a corporate motivational speaker (and I don't know if he still does that), but it does explain his approach and the tone of his books. He and Catholic Dynamic very much focus on re-evangelizing Catholics due to the atrocious non-catechesis that has plagued the Church since the 70s until fairly recently. So their approach is from the perspective of minimal or no knowledge of the Christian faith, let alone Catholicism. The priest of our previous parish is a personal friend of Matthew Kelly, and according to him it does take people like Kelly to fill in the gaps of knowledge that no single priest or parish can fill. The parish also has been a spring-board for Catholic Dynamic parish events before going national and the educational materials they make available to parishes to gain feedback. So while we were there I saw first hand the incredible work they do.

Kerstin wrote: "Manny wrote: "I’ve never read any of Michael Kelly’s books, but I have heard him speak on the radio. I find him to be an engaging dynamic speaker. He’s an evangelist, so you’re comparing apples and..."
One of his books I read last year. It was really inspirational. He gives lot of practical approach for the catholic living. He speaks from his experience so it is quite interesting to read him.

Manny wrote: "I’ve never read any of Michael Kelly’s books, but I have heard him speak on the radio. I find him to be an engaging dynamic speaker. He’s an evangelist, so you’re comparing apples and oranges if yo..."

No, I was not evaluating him as a theologian. I understand that he is an evangelist. Not sure what in my post gave you the impression that I might have been evaluating him as a theologian. Actually, "Perfectly Yourself" the book I reviewed, had only a veneer of anything religious about it.

Irene wrote: "Manny wrote: "I’ve never read any of Michael Kelly’s books, but I have heard him speak on the radio. I find him to be an engaging dynamic speaker. He’s an evangelist, so you’re comparing apples and..."

Ah. My apologies if I misunderstood.

The Humility of God: A Franciscan Perspective by Ilia Delio, O.S.F.
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

A Franciscan theologian, the author uses the life of St. Francis and the writings of St. Bonaventure to argue that humility is the quality of God evident in the inner life of the Trinity, the Incarnation, the processes of the natural world, the suffering of humanity and in the mandate of Christians to divinize all of creation. Delio applies some very traditional Franciscan spiritual language to some contemporary theological notions such as Process Theology and a “Cosmic Christ”. This is a great deal of material to cover in less than 170 pages. My prior familiarity with the Franciscan theological giants made some sections, such as her exploration of the Incarnation, familiar and easy to follow. But, other elements, such as quantum mechanics or the concept of “Cosmic Christ, needed a fuller explanation. At times, it felt as if she was clinging to a handful of sufficiently vague catch phrases and repeating them chapter after chapter. This book is intended for a non-scholarly reader. Maybe I need to look at her more scholarly works in order to find the deeper clarity I desire. 3.5 stars

Just finished The Way of the Cross and posted a review. Here's what I said.

Actually four and a half stars if I could give half stars.

I have seen many a devotional passage from Caryll Houslander, but this is the first book I’ve read by her. This was a perfect Lenten read with some of her characteristic insights and lovely prose. Houselander was a British Catholic artist, mystic, and writer during the first half of the twentieth century. In The Way of the Cross, she walks us through the Stations of the Cross, each chapter being one of the stations. At each station she puts you in the scene of Christ’s suffering, moves to some theological point, connects that station to our lives, and concludes with a prayer poem. In what stands for an introduction, titled Via Crucis, she walks you into a church where a group is praying the Stations.

Three o’clock on a grey afternoon. Outside, a steady drizzle of rain; inside the church, an odd motley of people.

A smartly dressed woman, side by side with one who is shabby and threadbare. A boy and girl who appear to be in love. A very old man, so bowed that he is permanently in an attitude of adoration. A stalwart young soldier whose polished buttons glitter like gems in the candlelight. A couple of students, shabbily but elegantly dressed in corduroys and bright scarves, rubbing shoulders with a gaunt, round-shouldered man who looks like a tramp. A sprinkle of small children. And behind them all, as if he felt himself to be the modern Publican, though there is no reason why he should, a thickset, square-shouldered business man. And a few seconds before the priest, in come a couple of rather flustered little nuns, like birds shaking the rain off their black feathers.

What a diversity of places these people must have come from—luxury flats, tenements, small boardinghouses, institutions, barracks, studios, colleges, doss houses, schools, offices, convents. What sharp contrast there must be between their different lives and circumstances! But they seem to be strangely at one here, gathered round a crude coloured picture on the wall of the church, “The First Station of the Cross,” and it seems to come naturally to them to join together in the same prayer:

“We adore Thee, O Christ, and we bless Thee.”

“Because by Thy holy cross Thou hast redeemed the world.”

The tender rhythmic prayer that has been on the lips of men all through the ages is repeated fourteen times as they move slowly around the church, following the priest from station to station, until they reach the last of all, “Jesus Laid in the Tomb.” (pp. 1-2)...

That should give you a feel for fluid, even poetic writing style. Well worth reading, especially at the Kindle price of $4.99. The only draw back was that at 100 pages it was too short. I wanted more! One should probably save it for during the Lenten season.

Manny wrote: "Just finished The Way of the Cross and posted a review. Here's what I said.

Actually four and a half stars if I could give half stars.

I have seen many a devotional passage from Ca..."
I'm going to have to look for this book. I read The Reed of God a few years ago and was truly touched by the writing. You've reminded me of how much it caused me to think and have inspired me to reread parts of it.

Lisa wrote: "Manny wrote: "Just finished The Way of the Cross and posted a review. Here's what I said.

Actually four and a half stars if I could give half stars.

I have seen many a devotional p..."

If you use Kindle, it's only $4.99. I was just looking through The Reed of God and The Way of the Cross is not as long, so perhaps it's not as deep. But it made for a good Lenten read. The reviews for The Reed of God were out of sight positive. I'm definitely going to pick it up, perhaps for next Advent. Hollander is such a beautiful writer.

I am reading the book A Call to Mercy: Hearts to Love, Hands to Serve. A good book with great thoughts, in fact, this book gives a lot to meditate on this Lenten season. Mother Teresa is a real model for me, her exemplary life will help me in my future ministry.

Stabin wrote: "I am reading the book A Call to Mercy: Hearts to Love, Hands to Serve. A good book with great thoughts, in fact, this book gives a lot to meditate on this Lenten season. Mother Ter..."
Ah a Mother Teresa book. We did one just before you join us John. Or were you already here for that? My memory is showing its age.

Manny wrote: "Stabin wrote: "I am reading the book A Call to Mercy: Hearts to Love, Hands to Serve. A good book with great thoughts, in fact, this book gives a lot to meditate on this Lenten sea..."
No, I was not there to read with you. This is a good read.

I started to read the book The Lord. The introduction by Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI is really wonderful. I hope will enjoy the rest of the book.

Stabin wrote: "I started to read the book The Lord. The introduction by Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI is really wonderful. I hope will enjoy the rest of the book."

I love Romano Guardini! I bought the book, but it will be a while before I get to reading it. I did add it to our booklist a while back, though this would be a long read.

Kerstin wrote: "Stabin wrote: "I started to read the book The Lord. The introduction by Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI is really wonderful. I hope will enjoy the rest of the book."

I love Romano Guardin..."

Yeah it is a good book, of course a long read. I came to know about Guardini from the writings of Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, he is really inspired by him. Both the writings of these two legends have lots of similarity. A worth read and it is a long read.

Earlier this year I read From Islam to Christ: One Woman's Path through the Riddles of God and I finally put together a review. Great read of a Turkish woman born Muslim, became an athesit, converted to Protestant Christianity, and then converted to Roman Catholicism. You can see my review here:
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3...

Manny wrote: "Earlier this year I read From Islam to Christ: One Woman's Path through the Riddles of God and I finally put together a review. Great read of a Turkish woman born Muslim, became an ..."
Oh I need to read it, but may not be now because this book is too costly in India. Here we are really in a tight situation to get a book it costs more especially our Catholic books. I want to see somewhere in Library.

Stabin wrote: "Manny wrote: "Earlier this year I read From Islam to Christ: One Woman's Path through the Riddles of God and I finally put together a review. Great read of a Turkish woman born Musl..."

That's too bad Stabin. You can read a little more than my review on my personal blog. I posted twice on it. I provided some excerpts.

Part 1: http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.c...

Part 2: http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.c...

Manny wrote: "Stabin wrote: "Manny wrote: "Earlier this year I read From Islam to Christ: One Woman's Path through the Riddles of God and I finally put together a review. Great read of a Turkish ..."
Yeah sure, thank you Manny for the review.

I just read Bearing False Witness: Debunking Centuries of Anti-Catholic History. It was not as good as I wanted it to be, but I think it could be a useful resource in certain situations. My review is here.

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

Good review Joseph. Is the author Catholic?

He is not which actually works in the book's favor since he's not writing as an apologist.

Joseph wrote: "He is not which actually works in the book's favor since he's not writing as an apologist."

Got it.

Joseph wrote: "I just read Bearing False Witness: Debunking Centuries of Anti-Catholic History. It was not as good as I wanted it to be, but I think it could be a useful resource in certain situat..."

I read it, and thought it was quite good for the format Rodney Stark had given. What would you change?

I think the biggest drawback is Dr Stark's theory of the Church of Power and the Church of Piety. At best it's over simplistic, at worst it shows a lack of understanding. The other thing that bugged me was his talk about the dating of Christmas and Easter as essentially pagan which is something that's been debunked more times than I can count. It ends up undercutting his good work because he hasn't looked into these side issues and repeats things which he should know are wrong while debunking other stuff.

Joseph wrote: "I think the biggest drawback is Dr Stark's theory of the Church of Power and the Church of Pretty. At best it's over simplistic, at worst it shows a lack of understanding. The other thing that bugg..."

I get that. Stark argues from the position of being a sincere historian, not affinity for the Church. There is a residual Protestantism that's hard to overcome no matter how "open minded" folks think they are. As a convert I get confronted with this all the time.

The Seven Last Words by Michael Crosby OFM Cap
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

In this slim volume, Michael Crosby explores how the words spoken by Christ from the cross might be fulfilled in the lives of contemporary American Christians.

The Seven Last Words by Michael Crosby OFM Cap
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

In this slim volume, Michael Crosby explores how the words spoken by Christ from the cross might be fulfilled in the lives of contemporary American Christians.

I found a book that might be interesting to the group for a group read. We could go with the older, single version, or for the more ambitious, the two volume series.

The Jesuits In North America In The Seventeenth Century FREE on Amazon today in Kindle format!!!!!!!

France and England in North America : Vol. 1 of 2: Pioneers of France in the New World, The Jesuits in North America in the Seventeenth Century, La Salle and the Discovery of the Great West, The Old Regime in Canada

Francis Parkman : France and England in North America : Vol. 2 of 2: Count Frontenac and New France under Louis XIV, A Half-Century of Conflict, Montcalm and Wolfe

Leslie, just part one alone is 1500 pages. And part two is over 1600 pages. It will take us over two years. This might be too long even for along read. But feel free to nominate it.

Thanks for the free book from Kindle. I got it.

I know. LOL. I said, the group might wish to read the first which appears to be a summary, or rather, earlier version. It's under 600 pages which is a length we've done in years past. Just throwing it out there.

I recently read both Jesus and the Jewish Roots of the Eucharist: Unlocking the Secrets of the Last Supper and Jesus the Bridegroom: The Greatest Love Story Ever Told. Fascinating reads.

Lisa wrote: "I recently read both Jesus and the Jewish Roots of the Eucharist: Unlocking the Secrets of the Last Supper and Jesus the Bridegroom: The Greatest Love Story Ever Told..." It is a good selection Lisa. Me, I want to read those two books it is there on my list. I have both books. Brant Pitre's way of explaining the matters very impressive. I read his book, The Case for Jesus: How We Got the Gospels, Who Jesus Said He Was, and Why It Matters.

Lisa wrote: "I recently read both Jesus and the Jewish Roots of the Eucharist: Unlocking the Secrets of the Last Supper and Jesus the Bridegroom: The Greatest Love Story Ever Told..."

Absolutely loved them.

Lisa wrote: "I recently read both Jesus and the Jewish Roots of the Eucharist: Unlocking the Secrets of the Last Supper and Jesus the Bridegroom: The Greatest Love Story Ever Told..."

I have read The Jewish Roots of the Eucharist and thought it was excellent.

Hello! I’m new in the grupo, currently reading “His humble servant”, Pascalina’s Lehnert memoirs on pope Pius XVII. !very interesting!

Welcome to the group Monica!

Mónica wrote: "Hello! I’m new in the grupo, currently reading “His humble servant”, Pascalina’s Lehnert memoirs on pope Pius XVII. !very interesting!"
you are most welcome. Happy to hear about the book His Humble Servant: Sister M. Pascalina Lehnert's Memoirs of Her Years of Service to Eugenio Pacelli, Pope Pius XII I think it is a good book, emphasis on the role of women in the Catholic Church.

Welcome Monica. We're in the middle of a read but perhaps you can join us in the next one.

Jesus of Nazareth: What He Wanted, Who He Was by Gerhard Lohfink
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

This is a scriptural Christology and exegesis of the concept of the Kingdom of God by a highly regarded German theologian. I found it in turns, thought-provoking, challenging and confusing. I plan to return to page 1 and start a re-read immediately, not something I usually do.

I started to reading Pope Francis new Apostolic Exhortation Gaudete et Exsultate--Rejoice and be glad: On the call to holiness in the contemporary world. It is newly released one, I recommend you all to read it if possible. It is available in vatican site, http://w2.vatican.va/content/francesc...

Stabin wrote: "I started to reading Pope Francis new Apostolic Exhortation Gaudete et Exsultate--Rejoice and be glad: On the call to holiness in the contemporary world. It is newly released one, I..."

John, that's great. I was hoping it would become our next read.

Manny wrote: "Stabin wrote: "I started to reading Pope Francis new Apostolic Exhortation Gaudete et Exsultate--Rejoice and be glad: On the call to holiness in the contemporary world. It is newly ..."
Yeah that is good we can learn it deeply.

I just finished reading the new Apostolic Exhortation, Rejoice and Be Glad: Gaudete et Exsultate and I tried to write a review on that, I hope you may like it, thank you.
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...