The YA Dystopian Book Club discussion

Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "But it's SO HORRENDOUS!!!!!! SHE FALLS IN LOVE WITH A RAPIST?!!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!??!?!?!?!??!?!"

uh, no. She doesn't fall in love with him. But that's semanti..."

Hey, I get limits and preferences. And it is a hard topic to tackle for both writer and reader. And different people take away different things from the book. I agree that it is definitely not a middle grade book though. Maybe like late 8th grade if anything.

I see what repelled you from the series but keep in mind that even Teagan forgave Stalker in the second book because this was discussed quite a bit.

Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "But it's SO HORRENDOUS!!!!!! SHE FALLS IN LOVE WITH A RAPIST?!!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!??!?!?!?!??!?!"

uh, no. She doesn't fall in love with him. But t..."

Yeah- maybe mature 8th graders, but I think it's just so unexpected and not at all evident in the rest of the book, that it's really just a shock. I haven't really continued the series, but as I hated the first book, I didn't really plan on it. I bet it was super interesting to read about this topic in the second book as it is quite controversial, but rape just makes me so angry. Like I can't even handle the thought of it, so I can totally understand liking the series- it just isn't for me!

Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Sorry guys (and I respect your opinion if you like the series!) but I just hate this book. I can't get over the whole Stalker being a love interest thing. And at one point ..."

You're right, she does. But that's coming from who Deuce is. SHE'D rather die so she was overlapping her own special brand of crazy on Tegan. I think it was very real as far as writing goes since not all of our thoughts are always PC or appropriate and since we were in her head, we got 100% full panoramic view of her flaws and inappropriateness.

Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "But it's SO HORRENDOUS!!!!!! SHE FALLS IN LOVE WITH A RAPIST?!!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!??!?!?!?!??!?!"

uh, no. She doesn't fall in love wit..."

fair enough. Everyone has their favorites. Thank goodness there's so much out there to read right?! :)

Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Sorry guys (and I respect your opinion if you like the series!) but I just hate this book. I can't get over the whole Stalker being a love interest thing. And ..."

And you just helped me realize one of my biggest problems with the book- Deuce! So thanks Ela!!! :P Anyways, yeah- I realize that that's one of my problems: seeing everything from Deuce's perspective. Give me it from Fade's or even Stalker's or something, but I just can't handle Deuce's I guess. I'm all for flaws, but there are some flaws that mean more to you than others- and I guess Deuce's were just the worst kind for me? At least it was obvious that nothing was sugarcoated or anything!

Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "But it's SO HORRENDOUS!!!!!! SHE FALLS IN LOVE WITH A RAPIST?!!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!??!?!?!?!??!?!"

uh, no. She doesn't fal..."

Haha- thank goodness for sure!!! Everyone's bound to find something :)

Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Ela wrote: "Riya wrote: "Sorry guys (and I respect your opinion if you like the series!) but I just hate this book. I can't get over the whole Stalker being a love interest..."

glad I could help! :)

LOL Just catching up on this conversation...unfortunately, I wasn't a fan of this book either, and I enjoyed the novella at the end even less, so I decided not to continue with the series. I just didn't find anything that unique or exciting about the plot, and I was quite disgusted by the "romance" too. But many people loved it, including most of the people I buddy read it with, so I can understand both sides :)

Haha- looks like we're pretty much on the same page David!

Yes we are!

POSSIBLE SPOILERS BELOW- PLEASE FORGIVE MY RANTING

HUGE hype for this book.
My librarian recommended it to me, my friend said it was the best book she's read this year, and the premise seemed interesting.

This was a bit of a mess for me. There wasn't one thing Aguirre did particularly well. First of all, the characters weren't great. Fade seemed very adultlike and distant at the beginning, and while he did warm up to Deuce slightly, I didn't find myself caring much for him. Deuce had promise as a kick-butt heroine, but there was a glaring hole in her character. When she and Stalker started geting all cuddly, I was mad. First of all, it was clear she loved Fade. And yet she let Stalker, who has taken part in gang rape for all his life and shrugs it off like it was nothing, kiss her, even though Deuce didn't feel anything for him. This is weakness that I couldn't overcome. Tegan was supposed to evoke some kind of sympathy and emotion from the reader, but I didn't care for her as well. As well, the world building was subpar. The enclave was boring, and I kept imagining it as a small, dusty, dark, and dingy place. The freaks were not scary at all to me, and this made for a lack of intensity, which is what I love to feel. Finally, the plot was a disaster. It was constantly slow and boring. The only action was the fighting with the freaks, whih wasn't all that thrilling for the reasons stated above. As well, THE ENDING! How horrible was that? I have never seen a more anti-climactic, facepalm-inducing ending in my life. And the deus-ex-machina thing was so unrealistic, random, and odd. Bleh.

Tried the sequel. It was a DNF.

I literally agree with EVERYTHING Daniel just said

FINALLY, someone who understands me.

I know right!! I don't get how anyone could EVER like this book!??!?!

The english stickler in me wants to point out that that is a direct contradiction from what you said at the top of the page. lol just messing around with you.

I personally found that nothing that Aguirre did made the series worthwhile, and I found the characters lacking in multiple ways. But beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If we didn't have different tastes and different beliefs, the world would not only be more boring, but we wouldn't be where we are today. I've come to accept that not everyone will like what you like, and not everyone will hate what you hate. It's a fact of life.

But Enclave? Come on. lol

Haha and wow- I can't even imagine continuing the series. The characters were very flat I found and din't develop much. They also all got on my nerves. Wow that's a great point.

But yeah definitely :P Don't understand how people could like this one!

Sorry this is long!

I scanned the comments and it seems like their is a lot of hate in it. I personally read the entire series and loved it. (I'm cringing at the judging that is happening right now) Few things I want to say about the series as a whole to maybe make you rethink not reading the next 2 books.

My ratting for Enclave was a 3 (low for me) and I saw it as so-so. It was a library book. Outpost I rated a 4 star and Horde a 5 star.


I feel like the character development, plot, and writing overall improves throughout the series. So I would encourage you to give the next book a chance.

So in the second book Duece goes to Salvation an very "amish" like town. Duce up to now is really naive and is learning that her "elders" in the enclave might not have known that much. The theme throughout the books is about how in the world there is a lot of different ways to live/think. Also how as a child being raised in a certain way you never think to question why things are done the way they are and you are at the mercy of your caretakers to teach you what is right, wrong. and what your worldview should be. Duece and the others (Stalker especially) learn and come to terms with their upbringings and their wrongs. They become adult-like and learn about the world and make their own choices. They take ownership of their decissions and come to know what life is about for them.

I hope that helps. I think in some ways these books are deep.

Now the Stalker issue. Yes he is a rapist. Maybe I'm not as sensitive as others, or maybe because of the above attitude of people growing and changing for the better? --it didn't upset me a ton. I mean I am not his biggest fan for sure! I didn't want him as a love interest for Duce. But Ann Aguirre said she based the evaculation of New York on New Orleans during Katrina. All the weathy got out and less fortunate people were left. We know of the atracuities that happened in New Orleans with the raping and crime during Katrina. That is what I think Stalker is a representation of and how he got into that position. Now I think that situation gets resolved by the end of the book. Here is a spolier about how it is resolved: (view spoiler)[ Stalker comes to realize that the way he was brought up was wrong, but he doesn't use it as an excuse. He wants to make amends to Teagen--who is all class in the fact that she doesn't take on a helpless attitude. She takes her life back and moves forward. Stalker adventually sacrafices himself/dies saving Teagen from a freak attack as a final way to make amends. (hide spoiler)] oh and Duce NEVER has romantic feelings for Stalker....so she never feel in love with a rapist. And I guess its similar to how people were raised in the south during slavery. They were taught growing up that it was acceptable and never knew anything different.

The other thing is that Aguirre introduces PTSD in the second book for one of the characters so I feel like the book is really relevant and has real life situations for a dystopian fiction book.

ok I said my peace, you can choose to read the next ones or not but I've done my duty! :)

Hi Dee,

The book simply wasn't for me.
You said some good comments about how the teenagers are taught by adults how to live, and how the characters eventually learn that life isn't what they think it is. However, I suppose you could say that about nearly every single dystopian series, so having that alone doesn't make a book, especially in this genre, stand out.

Regarding the things you said about stalker, I fully recognize that Deuce is in love with Fade. It was apparent from the beginning of the book, and there are no shortages of reminders. However, what confused me was why Deuce let Stalker get close to her. It was obvious she did not feel for him what she felt for Fade, so the fact that she let stalker kiss him was annoying. This was probably caused by jealousy (the whole Fade and Tegan thing), which was irritating. For a character who seems quite strong, this was a flaw and an emotional weakness that didn't fit with her character, and one I could not overlook.

One of my friends also tell me that the plot and character development (which were horrible in the first book) improve later on in the series, but the first half of the second book was much of the same, so unfortunately, the series became a DNF.

I'm happy you liked it, but I for one can't make myself read on.

Duce was naive and didn't get that she was leading stalker on and all these emotions that she was never taught as a huntress. And fade/Tegan never happened. It was just Duce's perspective. But whatever, is what it is.

I liked that we had this girl Duce who is bad-a learning to become emotional and care. Most dystopias in YA are about this weak, soft girl becoming bad-a.

Most dystopian books you only see about 2-3 ways to live, not 6-8 like we do in the last book. I don't know, this series just grew on me a lot at the end of Outpost and through out Horde.

Anyways, I respect people's decisions and feelings on books. There a a few that a lot of people like that I think are horrible. I.e. Pure

Oh yes, I know Fade/Tegan never happened. Fade clearly liked Deuce, and Deuce was foolish to even think that was possible. The jealousy and what she did because of that just annoyed me, I guess. I respect your opinion, it's just not my own. lol

I really liked this series. And I think this is a huge part of why:

Dee wrote: "I liked that we had this girl Duce who is bad-a learning to become emotional and care. Most dystopias in YA are about this weak, soft girl becoming bad-a."

And I tend to like heroines who are a little emotionally cold since I often get hit with that label as well... :)

Stalker and the rape stuff did bother me a LOT and I cringed whenever it was brought up. I just kind of wish that wasn't even a part of the book at all - I think it would have been a better series without it.