The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910 discussion

David's journey continues in the eponymous novel, and this week, we are again discussing the next four chapters (IX-XII). Please post your thoughts and impressions below.

Let me start with the general observation. I am really enjoying the style of the novel. It starts with small things like titles; each title reflects and encapsulates the key points. In this novel, the summary ahead of each title is brisk and self-ironic. Reading them instead of this novel might create a spurious impression that David's life is one easy ride, and entertaining journey of pleasant discoveries, of changing scenes, and of interesting and loving people. The same feeling permeates the fabric of the text. This creates a dubious impression. On one hand, we all feel sorry for David due to numerous troubles, sufferings, and uncertainty, but on the other hand, his tone is never morbid or bleak. Even the most miserable life experiences are narrated with the certain feeling of completeness; the narrator expertly conveys the sad and nostalgic feelings of his lost innocence and bliss but also, due to foreshadowing, we are reassured that David will overcome the difficulties.
Now back to chapters. The inevitable happened, and David goes home to his mother's funeral. It signals the arrival of hard times for David. Mr. Murdstone sends his to work in the most miserable place, riddled with rats and David's life is tainted with hunger and deprivation. He also meets one of those favorite Dicken's eccentrics. Mr. Micawber, who opens up a secret of financial stability.

Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen [pounds] nineteen [shillings] and six [pence], result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.

I think Peggotty and her family literally save David from from emotional devastation. He spends a very restorative week with Peggotty, her brother, Emily and Ham, oh, yes, and an ever-whining Mrs. Gummidge. With such character as Emily, Dickens addresses one of his rare topics -emotional and sensual growth. Both Emily and David are of the prepubescent age, and all her confusions, blushes, and jerky behavior indicate her emotional, sensual and physical growth. Peggotty is also that woman who helps to germinate the idea of new changes for David, and the image of a woman who once came to see his mother on the day of his birth becomes the most evocative tales/myths David has ever had in his life, and his journey continues.
By the way, has anyone noticed how important the concept of a road and traveling in the novels by Dickens? If my memory serves me right, in every novel we read, roads were important, not only like the facts of daily life, but as a certain rite of passage, a 'bildung' trick, a way of maturation. Pickwick Papers is completely based on daily outings, Oliver Twist escapes the working house and the mob of Fagin, Nicholas Nickelby goes away from the privation and misery of Dotheboys Hall, Nell travels with her grandfather and finds her death, Barnaby ends in prison partly due to his roaming and meats his father, and Martin Chuzzlewit becomes a new man after his journey to America. In Dombey and Son, the story is slightly different: Walter travels a lot, but when he comes home, he finds a wife who managed to escape form the oubliette of her father's house. Edith, on the other hand, flees to another country to make her independent stand even louder. Virtually in every novel we read, a road is an important symbol used by Dickens. At this point, one can only ask what the emotional repercussions of David's journey will be.

“When you came away from home at the end of the vacation,' said Mrs. Creakle, after a pause, 'were they all well?' After another pause, 'Was your mama well?' ...

'Because,' said she, 'I grieve to tell you that I hear this morning your mama is very ill.' ...

'She is very dangerously ill,' she added. ...
'She is dead.”

Another example of that mixture of hilarious and excruciating exposition. Mrs. Creakle is breaking the news to him gently. From ill to dead in 4 sentences.

Renee wrote: "“Another example of that mixture of hilarious and excruciating exposition."

Spot-on, Renee. An excellent observation.
David as a narrator, due to the temporal detachment from the events of his long-gone childhood, can be lyrical, sad, and humorous simultaneously about his bitter-sweet experience.

One of the things that I am enjoying so far in this novel is that despite its being morose and sorrowful, David narrates it with a rather matter-of-fact tone that keeps an aura of hope alive. I feel that there are actually three voices coming through in the story—Dickens’, the boy David, and the man David. This layered effect is very original, especially for its time, in my opinion, and it offers a new perspective. It is interesting to me to see how David describes himself; he is a “good boy” (honest, compassionate, etc.) who is cast into bad circumstances, and it is sad to read the struggles of a boy who is thrust too soon into manhood. For instance, upon his mother’s death, at Salem House he gains attention: “I am sensible of having felt that a dignity attached to me among the rest of the boys, and that I was important in my affliction” (chapter 9); this reminded me somewhat of Mrs. Gummidge, although David has more nobility in this attitude. His mother’s death naturally coincides with the death of his boyhood and what little remained of a happy childhood, and it is also the birth of his premature manhood: “The mother who lay in the grave, was the mother of my infancy; the little creature in her arms, was myself, as I had once been, hushed for ever on her bosom” (chapter 9).

David’s second encounter with little Em’ly demonstrates his yearning for affection. He is too young to truly love her in the marriage sense, and she plays upon his desire in a coquettish manner; again he is being ushered into adulthood, in spite of his continued innocence. That innocence is part of what makes him a sympathetic character because I don’t want to see his innocence shattered; I don’t want to see him become hardened and rough, like the Murdstones.

Speaking of whom, I will give Mr. Murdstone an ounce of credit for being so seemingly distraught over Clara’s death. Although I hated to see David neglected, I was glad that he was no longer abused, and just wonder that it took so long for him to be sent away again. Enter the characteristic surrogate parents—the Micawbers. I enjoyed the comic relief that they provided in spite of their desperate situation. Now we are left to wonder what will become of David’s pending encounter with his aunt Betsey…

From my Chesterton, I find that Dickens' own father is suggested to have been much like the character of Mr. Micawber in temperament and circumstance. Including the scene of Charles father putting forth a petition among the imprisoned debtors and it's reading among them.

In fact, young Charles was unceremoniously divested of his own boyhood when the Dickens family was put into Debtors Prison. All expect Charles, who went to work in a factory that made stuff to make boots black. According to Chesterton, huge chunks of young David's experiences in these chapters were taken almost verbatim from Dickens' own life. (Except, of course, his mother was alive and he did not have an evil stepdad.)

The Chesterton biography dwells quite poignantly on the emotions Dickens expressed when he recalled this time in his life as being quite painfully like David's description as he "felt my hopes of growing up to be a learned and distinguished man, crushed in my bosom”

Yet, Dickens was able to turn these remembrances into such a humorous and delightful character as Mr. Micawber, who stands out, to this day, as one of the most fondly remembered characters in literature.

Renee wrote: "Yet, Dickens was able to turn these remembrances into such a humorous and delightful character as Mr. Micawber, who stands out, to this day, as one of the most fondly remembered characters in literature. "


Thank you for a very informative post, Renee. Your posts definitely give this discussion a new perspective.

Isn't memory an amazing thing? We tend to recall our childhood selectively and usually embellish it with the sweet tone. I think Dickens with a much more vivid imagination did the same. It is a sad story but knowing the frame of the story we know it all ends well for Davy, and that adds some dulcet melancholy.

Sarah wrote: "David’s second encounter with little Em’ly demonstrates his yearning for affection. He is too young to truly love her in the marriage sense, and she plays upon his desire in a coquettish manner; again he is being ushered into adulthood, in spite of his continued innocence."

I think Em'ly is an image Davy loves. She is not that flesh-and-blood character that could be David's wife or life-long partner. There is something ethereal about her as if she is an a halo, meaning that she is not for him. It would be too good if they ended up together, but there are already many dark foreshadowings about Em'ly ...

Renee, thanks a lot for the information about the parallels between David/ Micawber and Dickens/ Dickens's father. That is very insightful.

After having read the other novels, I have the impression that besides the narrative style also the speed of events is different to the previous novels. Or is this just my impression?
So many things have already happened, and David has already been at many different places and stages, even though we are currently only through approx. 20% of the novel. I am wondering whether this pace will continue.

A good point is the traveling/ road aspect in his novels. It represents somehow a change in life.

I love the Micawbers. They are quite comical, Mrs Micawber who genuinely stays by her husband and will never desert him and Mr Micawber who is such an optimist despite the worst situation. Let's see whether something will turn up for them :-).

David is despite all the occurrences a quite innocent child, who is e.g. not very capable of house-holding his money (though you can probably not expect that from a boy of his age) and still being taken advantage of, even though he is more cautious than before, still he gets robbed of his box and money. That is pretty sad.

Innocent young David is something if a cautionary character in these chapters. What befalls him is awful, funny, bittersweet and terrifying. But all the humor and sweetness comes because we know the tale is told by the person who survived these experiences.

Still it underscores the peril for the "unprotected" in society. At the mercy of those who would prey upon innocence. Upon the weak. Upon women and children. Upon anyone with a lack of stature under the law.

I am always chilled by how much worse it might have been for this orphaned boy. And I marvel at the nature of the author, who must have registered and remembered the sweetness and humor of his experiences, even along with the despair, and fear, and deprivation he must have felt... To have brought all of it to bear in his writing.

Renee wrote: "Still it underscores the peril for the "unprotected" in society. At the mercy of those who would prey upon innocence. Upon the weak. Upon women and children. Upon anyone with a lack of stature under the law. "

This is one of the reasons why many readers still like Dickens. In his novels, he is the advocate for many socially vulnerable people: children, women, the poor, and even the disabled. We often take it for granted an idea of social equality in the developed countries, but then many of his novels with his social stand were quite unprecedented. His novels reflect our social progress as human beings. Some of his ideas are still quite important even nowadays.

Hedi wrote: "After having read the other novels, I have the impression that besides the narrative style also the speed of events is different to the previous novels."

I agree with you - it is quite fast-paced. I think for the first time Dickens is trying to cover a life span and as an author, he moves quite quickly. I would also say even if it is fast-paced, it is also evenly-paced.

Zulfiya wrote: "This is one of the reasons why many readers still like Dickens. In his novels, he is the advocate for many socially vulnerable people: children, women, the poor, and even the disabled. We often take it for granted an idea of social equality in the developed countries, but then many of his novels with his social stand were quite unprecedented. His novels reflect our social progress as human beings. Some of his ideas are still quite important even nowadays.
"

We were talking about this in one of my classes. As bad as things can be today in the west, we have to look at where we have come from. If we could get into a time machine, we probably wouldn't want to stay in many of the places for very long because they were quite brutal. Survival of the fittest before survival of the fittest was a common term. Ancient Greece and Rome, medieval England. I even brought up 19th century England. Yes, there are children in the west who have extreme difficulties even today. But rarely would we see something like what is happening to David. Against the law for him to work, and Child and Family Services would be called in before long if he were neglected as the Murdstones neglected him. Yes, some children are overlooked today, but in the past, no one would have thought to look to begin with.

Change comes slowly, and can be difficult to see unless we look at the long view. But if we look at how children were treated in the past as compared to today, it is night and day.

Renee wrote: "I am always chilled by how much worse it might have been for this orphaned boy. And I marvel at the nature of the author, who must have registered and remembered the sweetness and humor of his experiences, even along with the despair, and fear, and deprivation he must have felt... To have brought all of it to bear in his writing.
"

I'm going to go a bit off topic, but there is a book currently on the bestsellers list called "The Goldfinch" by Donna Tartt. I bought it because they said it was Dickensian. And it is, with a young boy as the narrator. The plot is very modern, so in that sense, it might be hard to see the Dickens' influence, but overall, it does have that influence. That narrator has that same vulnerability that some of Dickens characters have...dealing with greater forces beyond his control, and the feelings of desperation and hopelessness.

I'm only about 130 pages in, but I have to force myself to put it down. (Which is why I am late posting this week!)

Hedi wrote: "David is despite all the occurrences a quite innocent child, who is e.g. not very capable of house-holding his money (though you can probably not expect that from a boy of his age) and still being taken advantage of, even though he is more cautious than before, still he gets robbed of his box and money. That is pretty sad.
"

It was sad. And made me angry as well because it is realistic. We aren't nice to one another. And no one helps David. There he is running and yelling after that boy, and no one steps up.

Lynnm wrote: "I'm going to go a bit off topic, but there is a book currently on the bestsellers list called "The Goldfinch" by Donna Tartt. I bought it because they said it was Dickensian. And it is, with a young boy as the narrator."

I purchased it as an audiobook and hopefully I will read it soon:-) I am looking forward to it.

Near the end of ch. 11 there is a wonderfully autobiographical passage:

"I set down this remembrance here, because it is an instance to myself of the manner in which I fitted my old books to my altered life, and made stories for myself, out of the streets, and out of men and women; and how some main points in the character I shall unconsciously develop, I suppose, in writing my life, were gradually forming all this while." and at the end of the chapter:

"When I tread the old ground, I do not wonder that I seem to see and pity, going on before me, an innocent romantic boy, making his imaginative world out of such strange experiences and sordid things!"


And I do agree with earlier posters that this section really brings home to me how far we have come in providing social supports in our society to mitigate the abject poverty and child mistreatment that were so prevalent as recently as the 19th and early 20th century.

Frances, nice pick of quotations. :-)

About the changes for children, we have improved a lot compared to the 19th century, but we should not forget the many children in this world who , unfortunately, still encounter similar conditions like David. :-(

Frances wrote: ""When I tread the old ground, I do not wonder that I seem to see and pity, going on before me, an innocent romantic boy, making his imaginative world out of such strange experiences and sordid things!""

This novel is indeed very personal, not in the meaning of dirty linen personal, but lyrically personal, authorly personal, creatively personal, but it is also a reflection of many acute and painful issues England had to face at the time David was just a child and an adolescent.