The Pickwick Club discussion
A Christmas Carol
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Reading schedule, general background, resources
I am in. I am already reading other books while on this TOCS ride. I will be glad to switch one out. I am currently rereading barnaby Rudge ( I couldn't help it. All that mention of it. ) and I am trying to get through Adam bede. BORING! Halfway through and bupkis. No one has a spine on this one. Summary promised me a murder. Someone better die soon. That all I can say.
Tristram wrote: "In order for us to read Dickens's CC around Christmas, what do you think of starting it in the week from Nov 25th to Dec 1st, covering "Stave 1", and then giving a week for each additional chapter?..."I'm in too (of course). In fact I vote for reading it two or three times a year. :-}
LOL. ooooo. Let gods gifts to you shine. Girl power! I may have to come see your Michaelmas extravaganza! You are not too far. My first major credit card was out of dauphin deposit bank in 1984. I was 21. Hmmmmm. Although I am 50 now, I am still sexy and hip. Well except for the classic lit part. I am still regarded by my peers as goofy for my passion in this regard. But they are really intimidated by my diversity. From eminem and my new iphone 5s to dickens and Tolstoy. And the credit all worked out well.i'm platinum now.
I'm good to go and read CC. Can't do better than read that book and watch the movie in December.
Peter wrote: "I'm good to go and read CC. Can't do better than read that book and watch the movie in December."A Christmas Carol is the only book that I can think of that I also saw the movie. Well, the classics that is. There have been movies I've seen and not even realized they were books at the time, Shutter Island comes to mind when I think of that. I saw the movie in the theater and a few years later happened to see the book in a bookstore. Still haven't read it though, too new. Anyway, I've seen about five different versions of A Christmas Carol, which one are you planning to watch?
Okay, then I'm going to set CC up in the reading list according to my proposal. Thanks for your feedback!I hereby propose the following reading schedule:
Nov 25th - Dec 1st: Stave I
Dec 2nd - Dec 8th: Stave II
Dec 9th - Dec 15th: Stave III
Dec 16th - Dec 22nd: Stave IV
Dec 23rd - Dec 29th: Stave V
I'm really looking forward to it, friends!
Tristram wrote: "In order for us to read Dickens's CC ..."I am out. Out, out, out. I am sick of CC. If I never read it, see any movie or shows about it, or even hear that old guy's name ever again, it will be too soon for me.
Kim wrote: "Peter wrote: "I'm good to go and read CC. Can't do better than read that book and watch the movie in December."A Christmas Carol is the only book that I can think of that I also saw the movie. ..."
Hi Kim
When its all said and done (and watched) I still love the Alistair Sim version of ACC. It's the only one I will watch, and it being in B & W is fine with me.
Two days until my wife and I start unwrapping the skinny Santa collection.
Peter wrote: "When its all said and done (and watched) I still love the Alistair Sim version of ACC. It's the only one I will watch, and it being in B & W is fine with me."I like that version too and the one with George C. Scott.
Tristram wrote: "Okay, then I'm going to set CC up in the reading list according to my proposal. Thanks for your feedback!I hereby propose the following reading schedule:
Nov 25th - Dec 1st: Stave I
Dec 2nd - De..."
I propose we read it once a day from now until Christmas day. That would be 44 times just in case you don't know. :-}
Kim wrote: "Bah Humbug. If there was a contest for biggest grump, you'd win. Oh I almost forgot, the old guy's name is Ebenezer Scrooge, Ebenezer Scrooge, Ebenezer Scrooge, Ebenezer Scrooge, Ebenezer Scrooge, Ebenezer Scrooge, Ebenez.."It would almost be worth not having the Internet still in order to avoid that.
Actually, we only have it intermittently. Had it early morning, lost it for a few hours, got it back around 1:30 for almost an hour, lost it again until just before dinner, ate a quick dinner and still have it, but for how long who knows.
I think, because there's a very limited bandwidth in this kluged up system, when some of the young'uns get involved in on-line gaming it knocks the rest of us out of the system.
Kim wrote: "Peter wrote: "When its all said and done (and watched) I still love the Alistair Sim version of ACC. It's the only one I will watch, and it being in B & W is fine with me."I like that version too..."
Retro-wise I like the alistair Sim version. It made the intended impression on me as a kid. And my dad loved it. And I love my dad.
But I have to admit that my favorite "version" is SCROOGED. with bill Murray. I am a modern girl and I
Love when my time marries a classic. And it is so f-ing funny. Laughing is my #1 hobby.
Hello Joy,welcome to the Pickwick Club, and it's nice you're joining us in our CC group read. As I said, I'm really looking forward to it - and yes, I'm partial to the Muppets, too, but I also like Alistair Sim. But still my favourite Christmas movie is Capra's It's a Wonderful Life.
Kim wrote: "Tristram wrote: "I also like Alistair Sim. But still my favourite Christmas movie is Capra's It's a Wonderful Life.Almost everyone's favorite CC movie is the Alistair Sim's movie. Doesn't it bot..."<
I don't know what level of movie buff tristram is but I can say that a movie has no obligation to nor is limited to honoring a book. It is a whole new ballgame.The trick is to to have the story both translate to film and appeal to the audience. Most people who see a film haven't read that book and may not even know there is one. Making a film from a book is super hard. Limited viewing time. You can't convey thoughts or background at any length.... Its far easier to describe a look on a face than get a being to have said look AND have the audience " get it" . even if that went right the editing has to be great to seal the deal.
I do ,though, have a great appreciation for a movie that follows a book truly. It is quite a feat.
Christine wrote: "I don't know what level of movie buff tristram is but I can say that a movie has no obligation to nor is limited to honoring a book."@ first part of sentence: A lot of people call themselves movie buffs, but then it turns out that they are smitten with Tarantino and Tarantino-like stuff, which makes them, in my eyes, rather movie buffoons. - To me movies, especially those of Hollywoods Golden Era and the B-Movies of the 50s, are what the Art of Fortification and all sorts of Fortresses are to Uncle Toby. A week without a western throws me into moodiness, a month without a John Ford or Anthony Mann film would send me on my premature deathbed, at least as far as my spirit is concerned. ;-)
@ second part of sentence: I fully agree with you. Regarding film as an art in its own right, I would not say that a good film should try to imitate the book - for the very reasons you name. But I think we had this discussion in another thread already. So if there are changes in a film adaptation with regard to the book, I can live with them if they make sense within the film. As to the Alistair Sim movie, I must say that I like it so much because I like Alistair Sim so much, and you haven't got a chance to see him on German TV all that often. One other major role of his I remember is in Hitchcock's Stage Fright, a film many Hitchock fans underestimate or even detest. Here for once, I sin in hardly any company at all, which must make it good company ;-)
Tristram wrote: "Christine wrote: "I don't know what level of movie buff tristram is but I can say that a movie has no obligation to nor is limited to honoring a book."@ first part of sentence: A lot of people ca..."
Hmmmmmm. With all due respect, in my opinion any movie fan who limits themselves and embraces one genre hardcore is the buffoon. The descriptive word is of no matter, just a fun term. It is the discussion as with these books that reveals the pearls.
I am into all movies. I will let you know AFTER I have seen it ,my detailed opinion.
As far as my credentials.... Let's just say my resume includes on set with peter Jackson. aaaaaaaah! I have never see such a smooth machine. Bummer there were editing disputes and the movie ( the lovely bones) though Oscar nominated ...... Not up to snufff.
So sorry! I love dick. I'd like to hook him up with sally. She would never be the same. I can see them as a couple. OMG my husband is like sally and I am alot like dick ( sans the debts. ). They will be a PERFECT couple then!!!!!
Tristram, just watched FOUR FOR TEXAS. B-)
Kim wrote: "I propose we read it once a day from now until Christmas day. That would be 44 times just in case you don't know. :-} "I think if we followed this noble proposal I would feel about CC as Everyman already does. That would make one grumpy man more as far as CC is concerned.
Christine wrote: "Hmmmmmm. With all due respect, in my opinion any movie fan who limits themselves and embraces one genre hardcore is the buffoon. The descriptive word is of no matter, just a fun term. It is the discussion as with these books that reveals the pearls.I am into all movies. I will let you know AFTER I have seen it ,my detailed opinion. "
Once you get hooked with a certain genre - although I agree that often genre borders are not clear-cut -, you just want to know and see more.
I cannot say I was into all movies. If you have ever seen one of those politically correct German comedies, you wouldn't probably, either, any longer. Or these French arthouse films that drone on and on forever. Or American comedies like Hangover or American Pie or anything with this insipid Ben Stiller in it? So saying "all movies" is very, very brave. Plus I don't have to watch any more movies by this overrated and hyped Tarantino to know that it's a waste of time. And the more movies you know the easier it is for you to notice after a short time watching it if it's worth giving it more time.
Tristram wrote: "Christine wrote: "Hmmmmmm. With all due respect, in my opinion any movie fan who limits themselves and embraces one genre hardcore is the buffoon. The descriptive word is of no matter, just a fun t..."All the above mentioned movies and person are awesome. A few flops for Ben but there is a script and a director etc. A lot can go wrong. But dickens it is today and like the hang over and american pie. He writes over the top funny characters and story lines.
Christine wrote: "I can say that a movie has no obligation to nor is limited to honoring a book. It is a whole new ballgame."If it's not going to honor the book, I say don't claim to be making a movie about the book. Make up your own story, call it whatever you want to, and no argument. But if you claim you're making a movie out of a book someone else wrote, I think you do have an obligation to honor the book, just as when I make a post here saying, for example, "as Kim said" I have an obligation to say what she said rather than make something up that she never said but I think has more audience appeal than what she actually did say.
Or do you think it's fine to misquote people freely and not honor what it is that they were saying when you quote them?
Hmmmm. Well I am not a purist. I get excited about blending and rolling things forward. Each medium ( movies. Music. Books theater. Etc) has it's own abilities and options for conveying a story to an audience. Honor. Parody. Retort. Any angle or inspiration is valid to me. Even if the story is original the idea is not. You could relate almost any story to something in the bible. Humans are taught through imitation. We praise the young for efforts in this regard. We say you did your best. It looks just dad! We are told a story or read a poem. Then in school we are assigned a task of creating our version of... People are reared on foundations that send them out into the world to continue. Not start from scratch.
I appreciate it all. People will say " oh the good old days. Why have they forgotten them? Blah blah.... Then someone says " well, those days were before my time. I can let them know, but i will tell them the story 2013,." Or that story would be cool if it twisted this way or that. A human with vision and inspiration can change the world. Or film a bad version of the great gadsby or Anna kerennina. As of recent. Big deal. So many people who would have never bothered now know the story.
We keep giving children the same basic wooden shapes to play with and what they build with those blocks will be their version. It's all good.
A misquote implies that you intended to be exact. Plain and simple. A version implies there will be changes.
Everyman wrote: "If it's not going to honor the book, I say don't claim to be making a movie about the book. Make up your own story, call it whatever you want to, and no argument. But if you claim you're making a movie out of a book someone else wrote, I think you do have an obligation to honor the book"I so agree with Everyman here that there's little I can add to it besides Amen!
not me. I say spin it and spin good. if former cloths can become a quilt so can a story become the reworked fabric of a new generation. I am no ozymandias.
besides , its not possible to stop a moment in time and preserve it from evolving. even ideas.
And even Ozymandias did not fare too well. That's why I'd side with Christine on this question.I don't think you can compare making a movie on a film to quoting somebody because doing the latter you do not change the medium, since you quote language by using language, whereas a film is a completely different thing from a book. So after all, you simply cannot give a faithful rendition of a book via film.
Secondly, film is an art form in its own right, offering its own chances and suffering from its own drawbacks. The necessity of finding his own ways of expressing a character's thoughts, for instance, will oblige a director to find his own strategies.
And why should not a book be the subject of a movie? After all the stories are around, and also novelists hook on stories and ideas they might have picked up somewhere. ;-)
Kim wrote: "Tristram wrote: "So after all, you simply cannot give a faithful rendition of a book via film.Since you cannot give a faithful rendition of a book via film, then don't try, make up your own story..."
Ozymendias is a poem by Percy Shelley.
Given that Dickens can be attributed as the "man who invented Christmas" I'm looking forward to this being my first read with the group.
Welcome, Mark, to your first group read! Just a few days to go ...
Thanks very much. I can't think of a better start!
Hello mark. Welcome. Have you read dickens?
Thanks Christine. Yes, Dickens has always been one of my favorites. I have to say that the Carol tops the list so I am very much looking forward to reading with the group.
Re: movie versions, you're all wrong! By far the best adaptation is Blackadder's Christmas Carol. You can find it here, with free Chinese subtitles :-)) http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTI0NjQ...
The Blackadder version is a great spoof! Always watch is several times a season.
I am soooo excited! I have never seen this version. I am a fan of the entire cast. LOVE. LOVE. BBC! Available on netflix in US.
PIP, are you on china?
Christine wrote: "I am soooo excited! I have never seen this version. I am a fan of the entire cast. LOVE. LOVE. BBC! Available on netflix in US.
PIP, are you on china?"
No, I'm in Spain :-) I only put the version with the Chinese sub because I hadn't found this one yet: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xzsa... - loading, quality and the rest are better, at least for me. Glad everyone's enjoying it - I've a sneaky feeling Dickens might have had a giggle too!
I agree that dickens would get a laugh out of it too. Spain... How romantic!
Christine wrote: "I agree that dickens would get a laugh out of it too. Spain... How romantic!"
Ha ha! It's currently more Wuthering Heights romantic than Room With A View romantic - I'm up in the north :)
Hi folks,for those of you who are going to take part in a group read in the illustrous Pickwick Club for the first time: Since we started reading the first chapter on Monday and people have different reading speeds and other books and prosaic everyday duties to fulfil, I am going to open the first folder for the Carol in the course of the week, maybe on Thursday - so that those who read at a slower pace will not be put off by spoilers.
Is that okay for you?
Tristram wrote: "Hi folks,for those of you who are going to take part in a group read in the illustrous Pickwick Club for the first time: Since we started reading the first chapter on Monday and people have diffe..."
Fine with me.
You have done more good than you know. I now have written proof of my prosaic life and truly need more fun!! I told my husband" LOOK AT THIS the pick wick club is all the excitement I have!! We need to go out there and LIVE!!" He said. " you look lively to me . did ya pack my lunch? "
But I have proof!!
Schedule good for me.
This is my first group read. As I look back, I realized that I've never read Christmas Carol. Shocker!! I've probably seen every rendition of it via movies, tv, etc. My favorite version is the 1951 movie with Alastair Sim. My second favorite is Black Adder. Talk about two totally different interpretations!
Connie wrote: "This is my first group read. As I look back, I realized that I've never read Christmas Carol. Shocker!! I've probably seen every rendition of it via movies, tv, etc. My favorite version is the ..."Welcome aboard. I'm with you on the Alisair Sim version of ACC!
Lol. My favorite is the Alistair Sim version and 2nd is Scrooged! Welcome.
Mod
I am out. Out, out, out. I am sick of CC. If I never read it, see any movie or shows about it, or even hear that old guy's name ever ..."
I think you are really into it, but you are just impersonating one of the characters. Let me think. Which one? Oh, I forgot, we're not supposed to say his name.
Mod
Or, the internet gods are giving you time to go read about Scrooge.
Mod
I agree with everything except your crack on Ben Stiller. I watch maybe 3-4 movies per year, but he is one of my favorite actors. I find him amusing. Must be a German thing! For you. Not me. Although, I am part German by descent, not birth!
That would mean some parallel reading of CC and TOCS, but the CC chapters are not so long.
What do you think?