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A Deep and Gorgeous Thirst author/reader discussion
I can't wait to read this for National Poetry Month, and have heard that the book is amazing.Either version is fine, but I'd prefer a hard copy. I'm located in Cincinnati, Ohio.
I agree to participate in the group book discussion in February.
A Deep and Gorgeous Thirst
Here's a few book trailers made for the release in October, plus some samples to hopefully kick up a little interest!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEmu2R...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAkE4P...
http://rustytruck.wordpress.com/2012/...
http://outlawpoetry.com/2012/06/05/ho...
http://thiszinewillchangeyourlife.blo...
http://unshodquills.com/2013/03/23/ho...
I look forward to chatting with everyone soon!
Hosho
i'd love to win a copy. i'd drop one at my favorite watering hole but i do have lots of friends who deserve the drunkskull love. i do already have a copy but i aint a rich man. i'd love to join the discussion in Feb too from homebase here in Philly USA. I've read the book straight through and random poems. It's brilliant & influenced by Bukowski, among others, but don't be fooled. AD> is it's own unique beast. The book works all kinds of ways for a million reasons. I've told as many people as possible about the book but getting a copy in people's hands is the way to go.
I'd like to enter to win a copy. I'm not familiar with Hosho McCreesh's work, but after checking out his site and the Amazon blurbs about his books, I think I need to become familiar with it! A Deep and Gorgeous Thirst in particular intrigues me. I live in Denver CO and agree to participate in the group read book discussion. I would prefer a paper copy. Thanks!
Mod
Lori wrote: "Only two more days to throw your name into the hat for A DEEP AND GORGEOUS THIRST. Don't miss out on the opportunity to not only read amazing poetry, but to also interact with the man whose brain spawned it all!!!"And whose guts drank it all!
Mod
I'll be in touch shortly for specifics so I can get you your book.
Thanks for your interest in reading Hosho's poetry and for planning to join us next month as we discuss!!
So, sad I missed this contest. Sounds like some fascinating poetry.
Mod
That's great!! My email is [email protected] and of course is be happy to participate in the discussion.
Mod
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8__w...
Michael wrote: "Loving it so far brother."Hey, thanks man...I appreciate you taking the time to let me know. Hopefully it gets even better!
I just got back to NJ and read Lori's email. I've heard so many good things about this book I can't to get into it. I don't need a copy thanks just wanted express my excitement!
Mod
Who's been reading? What are our initial thoughts?
Here's some audio: a few drunk poems read at the book release party -- enjoy!http://soundcloud.com/hosho-mccreesh/...
I really enjoyed reading this book of poetry. It was like sitting and talking with an old friend, telling stories and reminiscing about the past. Though these poems share the theme of drinking throughout, it's more about the connections made with others that stand out. Some of the poems are laugh out loud funny; others are touching and heartfelt. Did anyone have favorites in particular? If so, what made those resonate with you?
Mod
My kickoff question for you: What's been the biggest challenge for you as a writer in general, and more specifically with publishing this collection?
Hi Hosho! I really liked the 2nd-person point of view. Why did you choose to write from this perspective?
Hey everyone -- thanks for stopping in for a little chinwag, and thanks to Lori for giving me this opportunity to talk with you all. I'm excited!The biggest challenge in writing in general or this collection specifically: This collection was a breeze to write. In fact the only thing that was difficult was how to handle poems without titles. Anyone who knows my earlier work knows titles are important to me -- but I knew I never wanted titles for these poems. I ruminated on it for a few months, and, on a whim, I posted on The American Society of Indexers to see if anyone would be interested in making an unconventional index. On day one I found a great guy, John Barkwell, and his ideas meshed perfectly with how I thought an index of the poems could work. He ran with it, and the problem was solved. His index is a hilarious read on it's own...and I couldn't be happier with it! We've nominated it for an indexing award, in fact...so hopefully he wins!
As for trouble writing specifically: I've been writing seriously for going on 17 years now, and what's hard is never feeling like I have enough time to write. Or paint. Or live life and have fun. The reality of a 9-to-5, and 40 hours gone each week means there's hardly enough gas in the tank to really crank out work. When I am concentrating on a project I work every lunch hour, a couple hours each weekend, and even take days off to write. But writing is a joy -- so it's worth the struggle.
As for Rosanna and the use of 2nd person: The 2nd person perspective is the #1 reason why this collection works exactly as I wanted it to. It's a rare book that can use 2nd person and not lose the reader along the way. Bright Lights, Big City was a book that did it pretty well. The risk is readers simply refusing to "go along" with the narrative...saying "I wouldn't do that" and shutting the book. But to drag everyone through 300 pages of drunken shenanigans, it seems important to me that they weren't simply MY shenanigans...and that the right kind of reader would instantly recognize some of these shenanigan as their own (or close to them) -- and thereby participate in the madness. As you noted earlier, I wanted the book to feel like a shared and living, breathing thing between reader and page -- and active participation, letting the reader be the hero (or occasionally the villain!) was the only approach that made sense. I've never written in 2nd person before...and who knows if I'll ever do it again. But there's no way this collection would've worked without it!
Did you all feel, reading, like it could very much be you and your friends doing some of these things?
I've never been much of a drinker, but that's a big part of the allure of this book. I've been to a decent number of live music shows at bars, but almost always for the music and the socializing. (I've usually been too broke to drink much.) In that respect I do know a number of people who could easily pass for participants in this book.You said that this collection was a breeze to write. These poems generally read like a breeze as well, very stream-of-conscious, flash-fiction-like in many cases. I remember reading (I forget where) that this collection was written in quite a short time-span. In that respect did do you much revising? Or did you feel that given the subject matter it would be more apropos to leave more of the rough edges?
(Are there any "first takes" that made it into this collection?)
I'm keen to see your response to Derek's comments, and I'd like to throw this question into the mix -- can you describe your process for deciding the order of the poems?
I think the 2nd person perspective was key to my experience of the book. I recognized myself instantly in one of the earliest poems and from that moment on I felt like I was inside the poems. Even though I don't relate to every "shenanigan," they all somehow feel like mine.
For Derek: Yes, the first drafts of these poems were all written in about 5 weeks. I have never written that fast, and don't imagine I could again! But once that furious onslaught was finished, I spent about 6 months editing and rewriting just about every single day. I didn't want to edit out the thrust and inertia of each piece, but did spend lots of time on really getting the sentences to work, cutting out all the gristle. But yes -- the material can and should stay a little rough and rambunctious, and I didn't want to make it all too pretty! As for first takes making it in -- I can't say for sure, but I'd doubt it. I really went line by line over the book a couple times.Which leads into Nancy's question: the order of the poems. I worked hard at building the underlying narrative structure. It didn't make sense to arrange poems chronologically -- as the nature of drinking isn't linear. Hell, life isn't linear -- we just perceive it that way! Joan Didion says "we tell ourselves stories in order to live," and we impose a linear narrative on the "shifting phantasmagoria" around us. So I wanted the poems to reflect a kind of spiritual journey -- a spiritual narrative. In many ways all books are about reconciling just two things: love and death. Those are, for me, the two most important human questions. So the examination of each became the book's structure.
And Peg: Yay! I'm glad there was room in the book for you to walk around, and live some of these things! I wrestled with using too many specific details -- as too many specifics might contrast with the readers' experience. I suppose I wanted to use just enough details to excuse the reader from having to own MY drunken mistakes, all while sharing the good times! Because my overall experience with drinking is a joyous, and celebratory one...one that has taught me about myself, and about the people in my life. Of course, the collection would've been complete without the ugly side of drinking. Thankfully, there aren't too many regrets in the book!
I'm delighted with the way you won the wrestling match over specific details -- especially the details about locations. So many times I found myself nodding, yes, I've been there, I recognize that exact spot or at least something like it. Looking at the index now, I find three and a half pages listing locations. That makes my return to favorite poems easy as can be!
Thanks for the kind words, Nancy! All the credit for the index goes to John, and to the publisher for saying yes to it! If anyone needs an index, look up John Barkwell via the ASI website -- I can't recommend him enough.
I love the book. It reminds me of my own youth. It is somewhat shameful for a girl when she recollects her drunken past. Your book gave it an okay, a new life and made it almost cool, by injecting poetry and laughter into it. I haven't laughed like this in a long time. Maybe, Bukowski brought me a similar thrill. Congrats, Hosho!
Thank you, Jocelyne -- that's high praise as Bukowski is on my poetry Mt. Rushmore. And as for shame -- I think there's entirely too much societal pressure to succumb to shame...and not nearly enough effort made toward understanding and compassion. As the book shows, there are drunken mistakes, regrets -- but I'll be damned if the heart wasn't usually in the right place. And, like Bukowski, it's that deeper humanity behind the lines -- the style, the humor, the grace as life was beating him down -- that's nothing short of heroic. In fact, I'd worry about someone who hasn't made any mistakes int heir past (drunken or otherwise) as we always learn more from losing than we do from winning. To screw up takes a kind of courage that the safe and the terrified can never know. And the humility we learn when we do mess up -- that's valuable, and sacred, and profoundly human. I don't want that to sound like advice to go set the world on fire...but I do think we can usually stand to do a little more living, and a lot less worrying. I say wear that "drunken past" like the hard-won redemption it was!
What I meant to say is that it is almost taboo for a woman to tell about it. Yes, it takes courage and a lot of heart to get up and go, with eyelashes stuck to your cheek, after falling asleep on the metro, and missing your stop for the second time. And no, I was not looking for Bukowski in your book, only recognized a certain quality that reminded me of B., the honesty!
LOL... I will be looking forward to your next book.
Read the one about Scotland to someone in Seoul.
and joyous church bells
as you tour the entire country
by mouth, tasting
the earth itself,
the grass, and
the peat, and
the loam, and
the salt off
the North Sea, or
the Atlantic, and .....
the centuries have
been patient,
excellent!
and joyous church bells
as you tour the entire country
by mouth, tasting
the earth itself,
the grass, and
the peat, and
the loam, and
the salt off
the North Sea, or
the Atlantic, and .....
the centuries have
been patient,
excellent!
Fantastic! It's been something of a Worldwide book...sent special editions from Australia to Romania. Then there's this: The Worldwide DrunkSkull Photo Set. Friends with stickers and T-Shirts from Thailand to the UK!https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?s...
I still have stickers, if anyone is interested in one for their hometown! All I'd ask in return is to email me a photo for the album!
I'd love a sticker or two. I will send one to my son in Korea and ask him to take a photo. I'll do the same.
my address is
Jocelyne Desforges
4100 rue Broadway #16
Lachine, Qc.
H8T 1T9 Canada
my address is
Jocelyne Desforges
4100 rue Broadway #16
Lachine, Qc.
H8T 1T9 Canada
I'm about a third of the way through my second reading of A Deep and Gorgeous Thirst, and I woke up this morning with a question: in the crafting of such an open, honest, and autobiographical collection, did you edit or cut any poems to protect friends or relatives who might be hurt or embarrassed by the telling of their roles in your shenanigans?
Well...to be fair, being my friends & family, I think they already know what to expect from me! But to answer your question -- I didn't. Again it came down to specific details -- too many and the reader can't share in the fun; not enough and the scenes aren't fully formed. The solution I arrived at, for better or worse, was a kind of faceless everyman (or every brother, everymom, everycousin, everyfriend) surrogate for the reader, an archetype, almost -- not to exclude (or spare) anyone, so much as to include everyone, if that makes sense.
As with the discussion of shame with Jocelyne, if anyone has anything to be ashamed of in the book, it should be the narrator! I might be wrong, but I see very little in the book to regret! As I say in the introduction, there's probably a few things I'd take back...but not many! And it could be that I just run with maniacs...but I don't suppose anyone who appears in the book would take back their part in it either.
I mean, IF the book was autobiographical, that is...which it may or may not be...(wink, wink!)
Hosh! So happy just to eavesdrop on this conversation, man.I've got two questions for you:
1) How involved were you with the book design? ADP puts out beautiful books, but this design in particular feels like it's kind of an essential part of the book itself, it's such a perfect reflection of the tone of the verse. Is that just down to Ryan Bradley's excellent book design, or did you two collaborate at all on the look of the book?
2) I need to read everything you've ever written, but until I have, I'm struck by how different the language of these poems is from the other book of your poetry I've read, "For All These Wretched, Beautiful, & Insignificant Things So Uselessly & Carelessly Destroyed..." These poems, with their stronger attention to narrative and their beautifully stripped-down, honest prose, feel closer to some of your short fiction than to the beautiful, complex grandiloquence of "For All These Wretched, Beautiful, & Insignificant Things." Which is the anomaly? Or does every collection of poems have its own feel, its own style?
1)I was lucky enough to have some input, but all the credit goes to Ryan. We started with the idea of different booze bottles, each with a different set of antlers -- went back and forth with some early designs -- but nothing really struck. In an email, I told him I thought we needed something "iconic" like the crab on the cover of Henry Miller's TROPIC OF CANCER -- and the glorious DrunkSkull was, I believe, his first shot out of the gate. The moment I saw it I knew we had the design...I instantly loved it. Since then I've slapped it on everything from flasks, to patches and temporary tattoos, to etching it on highball and pint glasses! It's been fantastic. Someday it'll be on my letterhead!2)As I mentioned before, if you know my work from magazines, I'm usually the "title guy" -- as I have poems with titles longer than the poem itself. It became a kind of calling card, I suppose -- which is cool. But the downside is feeling like new work has to fit the mold. So I say to hell with it, to hell with trying to make anything work with earlier stuff. The true strength of the small press is that there aren't lots of focus groups and accountants standing between what is written and what is produced...and the less hands trifling with manuscripts the better for the reader! Whatever rough edges remain far outweigh the bland, watering down of books. Publishers all want to make money...I get that...but in the small press the idea is usually to make enough to keep putting out books, not make enough to buy another beachhouse. So you can still take risks in the small press...in the small press readers get really close to the original, unwieldy vision of the book the author intended. I think that's a great thing -- warts and all.
As to comparisons between WRETCHED and THIRST the only one I can make is chronological. Both made sense to me at the time they were written. THIRST is the logical outcome of the gut-wrenching, angry, and disappointed suffering of WRETCHED. Afterall, we don't struggle just to keep struggling...we struggle to survive and outlast the darkness...to once more find ourselves in the hot yellow joy of sunshine. In my mind, neither is an anomoly...and both are pieces of the puzzle that my entire life's work will eventually be. One day it will include novellas, short story collections, maybe even screenplays, and small films. Like John Sayles, I want to do it all.
P.S. Congrats on HAGRIDDEN, Sam. That's a helluva good title!
Hi Hosho,So I've been through the book twice now. I have to say, it stirred up a lot for me. I'm a recovering alcoholic, and this book brought back memories, good and bad.
I'm keen to know more about your editing process. You said you edited every day. How long after you finished the poems did you start the editing process. Did you give it some time, or did you immediately dive in? How much time did you spend on editing a day (on average.) The book feels very polished. In fact, I'll probably dive in for a third time after a few months have passed.
Joe
Joe,First and foremost, congratulations on your recovery. And don't let anyone tell you different -- it's a heroic thing to take the helm and demand that your life be truly yours. Keep kicking ass.
When it comes to editing: with this book, I dove right in. I think there is value in putting stuff aside before jumping in to editing -- but I just couldn't wait! I shared the ms. with a few early readers, and each went through finding typos, etc. while I went to work on content and the larger themes the book would eventually map. On average, I'd say I put in a couple hours of editing every day -- usually my lunch break, and an hour or so after work. When the feedback from all the early readers was in, and all my changes done I had the ms. copyedited by a professional service. Once all those changes were made, I started in on the structure, the final order of the poems. And that took a while. The powerful drive toward narrative in the book is what helped me figure out how to arrange the poems...as I wanted the book to have a kind of cumulative effect -- with the days and drunken nights slowly adding up to more than the sum of their parts. And I couldn't be happier with it -- truly. All the work was, for me, very rewarding.
Hello Hosho!! I am about a third of the way done with the book and I am loving every single minute of it!! It has brought up a lot o fold memories of when I used to drink. I haven't drank for 4 years now.My question is it sounds like writing is an absolute joy for you. Is there anytime that you get frustruated writing? I used to write poems and songs all the time, but I find myself getting so frustuated with writers block that it isn't fun for me to write.
Also thank you for taking time out of your schedule to answer our questions! ;)
Brittany -- Thanks for the kind words! Glad you like the book so far. And congratulations on your sobriety too -- it's truly a thing to be proud of, living life on your own terms. And sure -- of course there's frustration sometimes. It ain't for the faint of heart -- as you know! I've had long spells where I wrote very little, and was unhappy with whatever pap I did turn out. And when I find myself caught in that, I usually do 3 things. 1) read more -- go back to my favorites, and re-read them for the pure joy of them. 2) Live more -- go out, take a trip, even just a little weekend getaway, or a day-trip to see something beautiful...be it mountains, a museum, an old friend, even a special meal somewhere -- whatever you can swing. Break your routine. And 3) this is the hardest part -- actually try to figure out what it is that is making you unhappy in re: writing. More often than not, for me, it's not the writing at all -- but rather the hustle of writing or publishing or trying to get published. Ambition is a ferocious and hungry ghost of a thing...it cannot be appeased, cannot be bargained with...so be very cautious about indulging it. I used to worry about "making it" until I realized that having to make my living writing meant having to write things they pay people to write...NOT just write what I wanted to write. That's a very important distinction to make. If you want to be paid to write, then write what pays. If you just want to write what you want write...like I do...then be honest with yourself about what that means. Realizing that I didn't want to be forced to write something -- to meet a publisher's deadline, or churn out copy for the sake of thinking of myself as a "working writer" -- it freed my mind to truly enjoy writing, on my own terms. And my work is all the better for it.
Life can punch the stuffing out of you -- the last thing we need to do is further complicate our artistic lives with ugly ambition, and pipedreams of "making it." I know plenty of great writers, with various degrees of success -- from the cover of the New York Times Book Review to talent folks with but one or two collections out. But ask any of them if they've "made it" and invariably they'll say no. Because writing is about the next bloody line, and the line after that...and there's always another line if you love what you do.
Thank you for taking time out of YOUR lives and schedules to listen to me ramble. I appreciate that!
Mod
Hosho, what was the toughest piece of criticism you've had to face, whether it be with this collection or one of your previous books?
And I agree with Samuel. That cover is just amazing.
I couldn't agree more -- I'm jazzed to hear that folks are connecting with it. There's no higher compliment I can think of!As for criticism: The problem is true, constructive criticism is a really valuable thing...but it's also pretty damn hard to find. Here's a handy way to figure out what to take seriously and what to ignore:
http://annfriedman.com/image/49152967734
You can chart criticism by two measures: 1) how well they know you and 2) a sliding scale of ration to irrational. Then ignore everything in the bottom 2 quadrants -- including our own self-doubt!
But seriously...great criticism is immensely valuable. It's tough when you've poured yourself into something and people don't "get it." But if you take your job as a writer seriously, then you instantly realize that it's your job to make sure they get it! I have been criticized, especially in my short fiction, of stories being too subtle. Personally, I hate obviousness -- and would rather risk being misunderstood than to come off that way. So, when in doubt, I just try to remember that, at the end of the day, it's my work -- and I have to write it as I see it...and just trust that serious readers will dig a little deeper when they aren't sure about something.
Hey...I've been drinking since noon, and don't have a cell phone! That's my excuse! Someone get James Lipton on the horn, we need some more questions!
Drunken poetry, anyone???!!! It's really an amazing collection. Don't you dare let this one pass you by!
In order to be considered, you must comment here or on the blog for a shot at winning one and secure a spot in the discussion that kicks off February 16th:
http://thenextbestbookblog.blogspot.c...
This giveaway will run through January 8th.
Winners will be announced here and via email (if you provide one) on January 9th.
Here's how to enter:
1 - Leave a comment here or at TNBBC's blog, stating why you'd like to receive a copy of the book. You MUST be a resident of the US to win a paper copy, so please state your preference and where you reside.
ONLY COMMENT ONCE. MULTIPLE COMMENTS DO NOT GAIN YOU ADDITIONAL CHANCES TO WIN
2 - State that you agree to participate in the group read book discussion that will run from February 16th through February 22nd. Hosho McCreesh has agreed to participate in the discussion and will be available to answer any questions you may have for him.
*If you are chosen as a winner, by accepting the copy you are agreeing to read the book and join the group discussion here (the thread for the discussion will be listed here, or emailed to you before the discussion begins).