Reading the Chunksters discussion

One major strand of OHB is, of course, Philip’s infatuation with Mildred and all that it means for and does to him.

But another strand that came out again this week is his continuing development of a personal philosophy. Early in the book he had a devoted commitment to his Christianity. He lost that as he went through a range of philosophical developments, including his interactions with his Uncle, his time in Germany, and his discussions with Hayward and Lawson.

This week we get yet another turn in his intellectual development with his friendship with Athelny. There is so much to discuss in these episodes. Athenly’s attitude toward religion: he is either agnostic or atheist, but sends his children to Sunday School even if they’re taught things he doesn’t think are true: “If they're beautiful I don't much mind if they're not true.” What happened to “beauty is truth, truth beauty”? And he respects the values which religion teaches the young, even if they abandon the religious elements of those values as they grow up.

Then the pictures of El Greco, and the memory of Clutton’s reverence for him, cast almost a spell over Philip’s thinking. “Philip, silent still, returned to the photograph of Toledo, which seemed to him the most arresting picture of them all. He could not take his eyes off it. He felt strangely that he was on the threshold of some new discovery in life. He was tremulous with a sense of adventure....The painter had painted exactly what he saw but he had seen with the eyes of the spirit.”

“...here he seemed to divine something new. He had been coming to it, all hesitating, for some time, but only now was conscious of the fact; he felt himself on the brink of a discovery. He felt vaguely that here was something better than the realism which he had adored; but certainly it was not the bloodless idealism which stepped aside from life in weakness; it was too strong; it was virile; it accepted life in all its vivacity, ugliness and beauty, squalor and heroism; it was realism still; but it was realism carried to some higher pitch, in which facts were transformed by the more vivid light in which they were seen. He seemed to see things more profoundly through the grave eyes of those dead noblemen of Castile;”

And it is not only intellectual development which he finds in the unconventional Athenly household, but personal development as he experiences for the first time a close encounter with a happy family. (I’m tempted to hope that Maugham is foreshadowing a marriage in a few years between Philip and Sally – the age difference isn’t that much, and she would make an excellent wife for him.) Several posters have commented in the past week on his developing sense of empathy and caring for others, and this certainly carries into his close relationship with the Athelny children.

But ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IY7uS...

We knew we hadn’t heard the last of Mildred, didn’t we?

But things are different now. Philip finds Mildred streetwalking and offers her Cronshaw’s bed in exchange for her taking of the housekeeping duties he has been paying a woman for. She assumes that he is still in love with her and that he really wants a sexual relationship, but Philip “was quite sure that he was not at all in love with Mildred. He was surprised that the old feeling had left him so completely; he discerned in himself a faint physical repulsion from her; and he thought that if he touched her it would give him goose-flesh.”

Where this change came from he doesn’t know: “he could not understand himself.” But whereas a few years before he would have given almost anything just to get Mildred to go to bed with him, now he has no interest in her, and is even willing to pay an extra pound a week he can ill afford not to have to share a room with her. Mildred can’t understand, or deal with, the changed Philip.

Meanwhile, he goes through the operation on his foot. Do people think this will make any significant difference for him? Or will it just be the same Philip only wearing different shoes and maybe with less of a limp?

In Chapter 96 we get, for the first time, some real insight into Mildred’s thinking and personality. Up to this point we have known her mostly by her reactions to Philip. But in Chapter 96 Maugham opens her mind to us. “She had been used to his subservience: he was only too glad to do anything for her in the old days, she was accustomed to see him cast down by a cross word and in ecstasy at a kind one; he was different now...She was the sort of woman who was unable to realise that a man might not have her own obsession with sex; her relations with men had been purely on those lines; and she could not understand that they ever had other interests.”

Chapter 96 culminates in Mildred trying to seduce Philip and failing totally. He rejects her almost cruelly:

“I love you, Philip. I want to make up for all the harm I did you. I can't go on like this, it's not in human nature."
He slipped out of the chair and left her in it.
"I'm very sorry, but it's too late."
She gave a heart-rending sob.
"But why? How can you be so cruel?"
"I suppose it's because I loved you too much. I wore the passion out. The thought of anything of that sort horrifies me.”

She keeps trying, and he keeps rebuffing her, until she explodes in anger.

“She paused and drew in her breath sharply. Then she burst into a furious torrent of abuse. She shouted at the top of her voice. She called him every foul name she could think of. She used language so obscene that Philip was astounded; she was always so anxious to be refined, so shocked by coarseness, that it had never occurred to him that she knew the words she used now. She came up to him and thrust her face in his. It was distorted with passion, and in her tumultuous speech the spittle dribbled over her lips.
"I never cared for you, not once, I was making a fool of you always, you bored me, you bored me stiff, and I hated you, I would never have let you touch me only for the money, and it used to make me sick when I had to let you kiss me. We laughed at you, Griffiths and me, we laughed because you was such a mug. A mug! A mug!"
...
“Then she turned round and hurled at him the injury which she knew was the only one that really touched him. She threw into the word all the malice and all the venom of which she was capable. She flung it at him as though it were a blow.
"Cripple!"

And there we leave it for this week, wondering what can, what will happen next.

Dun dun dun - the return of Mildred. We all knew it was going to happen. I would have put money on it being in the hospital, but this works too. And as much as I am holding my breath that this won't end in disaster for Phillip, I'm very proud of him for holding his own with her thus far. He's taken her in, out of the goodness of his heart and compassion for a person down on her luck and thus far (I still have a chapter left in the section) he's holding his ground that this is a strictly business transaction.

We learned in the last section that Phillip was devastated by Mildred's betrayal, but I didn't ever pick up on the feeling that he would have this kind of reaction to her. It's very business like. I would have thought that even with his devastation at her lack of love that if she had come back to him he would have succumbed to her 'charms' yet again.

The thread regarding his surgery is curious to me. We have passing references to Phillip's foot, but I was not left thinking that this was a huge hindrance to him in his current situation. And then when he comes into some money and goes in for surgery, I wonder if this will change his life in some positive way or whether it will be another devastation. As in maybe the surgery won't work, or the correction won't be as drastic as hoped. A recurring theme here seems to be the dashing of Phillip's hopes, so I'm holding my breath on this.

Jen wrote: " A recurring theme here seems to be the dashing of Phillip's hopes, so I'm holding my breath on this.
"

That certainly has been a theme, but is it perhaps changing? His work at the hospital is certainly going well, and he has apparently gotten over his infatuation with Mildred. Norah is gone, but he might meet another woman who would be suitable.

There is perhaps reason for hope? OTOH, as you say, things seem never to turn out for him, so ...

I normally wait until the weekend to read the next week's chapters so I don't inadvertently slip in spoilers, but I'm not sure I can wait to find out what the outcome of this big fight is!

Everyman wrote: "I normally wait until the weekend to read the next week's chapters so I don't inadvertently slip in spoilers, but I'm not sure I can wait to find out what the outcome of this big fight is!"

Well, after saying I didn't have time for this book I attempted it anyway. And yep, this is about the point where I couldn't stop reading and I sped through to the end. I have not commented since because I don't trust myself not to spoil.

MILDRED!!!!!! She's back!!!

Throughout the book even when I haven't liked Philip I believed there was something good buried in their somewhere. I really enjoyed these chapters.

I loved reading the chapters about his medical training. I'm amazing by the similarities between training then and now. The brutality of a surgery rotation and being on call in the hospital. 3 days???? I shudder to think of it. I thought 30 hours was brutal. I love the respect he shows the night nurse. A sign of a good Dr...I could not do my job without them.

I was so pleased to see him experience a real family with Altheny and clan. It's easy to forget that not only is he an orphan he is also an only child. His relationship with the Altheny children is wonderful and I think for the first time Phillip understands true affection. I too hope there is a Sally/Philip partnership in the future.

That brings us to Mildred and the baby. What a kind soul to allow Mildred into his home. I knew that baby would suck him in somehow. I'm proud of how Philip is keeping his distance from Mildred though I think she still manipulates him for too much money. I do not find Phillip cruel when he tells her he does not love her anymore. Still she takes advantage. And we are given a glimpse of what a truly wretched using woman she is. I wish Philip could escape Mildred but what about baby?

I too am hooked. Can't wait to move on to the next section.....and look at that. I'm caught up

I have to say that Philip has grown in my eyes a lot now. He continues to excel in his work and I'm so happy he doesn't love Mildred so passionately any longer. It might do him some good to actually live with her for a while and see how dull she really is and how dreadful their life together could be. Right now it's her child Philip cares about, not her. And I admire his compassion.

As for Mildred, earlier I thought she was just an average person, but now I see that she's far more egoistic and much more of a villain than I ever suspected. She resents a lot being grateful to Philip and wants at all costs to reestablish their previous relationship. When everything else has failed, she wants to take revenge. The small glimpse we've had into her thoughts in this section shows her true nature, what a leech she is! Personally, I didn't expect her to be this lazy, and didn't think she would become a prostitute rather than stay with Philip. This proves she has a temper, something Philip didn't believe of her (she was anaemic and unable to love passionately according to him).

I enjoyed the descriptions of Toledo, Seville and El Greco's paintings (I agree that when I saw Toledo it resembles the picture and El Greco's paintings are indeed magnificent). What I dislike the most is Athelny's attitude to women. It shows even in his naming all 5 daughters Maria with a different patron saint when the boys were given proper English names. Sally is a very nice girl, that's true, but I'd like to see Philip marry some more sophisticated woman, if he's to marry at all during the story, that is.

Linda wrote: "Well, after saying I didn't have time for this book I attempted it anyway. And yep, this is about the point where I couldn't stop reading and I sped through to the end. I have not commented since because I don't trust myself not to spoil.
"
I think that Everyman sums up each section so nicely that you may remember exactly when it ends and are able not to spoil after you've read his first post... personally I found them useful when commenting on some previous parts.

Stephanie wrote: "I wish Philip could escape Mildred but what about baby?"

That's a great question. Philip does seem to love the baby, even though it's not his, more than Mildred does. What I fear is that she will use his love as a weapon against him. How, I'm not sure -- whether to keep living in his apartment, or to extort more money from him on the grounds that the baby needs it, or what, I fear she will use it and he will succumb.

Stephanie wrote: "I loved reading the chapters about his medical training. I'm amazing by the similarities between training then and now. "

And since Maugham went through medical training in the same hospital at about the same general years, it's presumably quite accurate.

I think there might be something lurking there with the baby as well. Some return to Phillip's childhood - a baby with a mother or father - something like that. I haven't completely sussed out what that thread is, but I sense it's there.

And, one thing that's killing me - why doesn't the baby have a name? I know this is a literary device that authors use sometimes, but it's one that drives me crazy and I can't place it here. Everyone else in the story (including all of Athelny's kids) have names, so why not Mildred's daughter? Is it meant to keep us from getting too attached to the baby so when Mildred up and takes off with her we're not too devastated?

Stephanie wrote: "MILDRED!!!!!! She's back!!!

Throughout the book even when I haven't liked Philip I believed there was something good buried in their somewhere. I really enjoyed these chapters.

I loved readi..."

Yes, Mildred, the proverbial bad penny, has turned up again! Just when everything was going so well, too! I can appreciate Philip's kindness in taking pity on her, and the growth this is reflective of, but--I just wish he could find a better recipient for his charitable impulses! I can only see this ending badly, yet again, for him. Not only is she a bad penny, but trying to be nice to Mildred is like trying to pet a rabid dog. She's not going to appreciate it, even if she seems to at first. It's not in her. At least he's not nuts about her any longer. I fear that will not stop her from doing everything she can to wreck his life.

I think the baby's lack of a name is indicative of Mildred's emotional detachment from the child. As the mother, she would be the one to bestow the name on the baby. I'm sure she did give it a name, but I think the fact that she doesn't use it is just another sign of her general self-absorption. I think the only reason she doesn't abandon the child is that she has this idea of herself as a certain type of person--a person who actually belongs in a higher class than what her circumstances permit. In this fantasy version of herself, this person would not just leave her child on a convenient doorstep.

I, too, can see a Philip/Sally match in the works. If that happened, I think Philip would be lucky to get her. She seems as if she would be another Norah, with all her good qualities.

I agree Cindy. I think baby's lack of name as well as the lack of capitalization of even the word baby shows the lack of connection she has to the child. Baby is a thing, an item, a material possession.....not of person. Really quite interesting.

Stephanie wrote: " Baby is a thing, an item, a material possession.....not of person. Really quite interesting"

Mildred is even jealous of the baby because Philip seems more attached to it than to her. I remember that she punishes the baby for it.

I haven't noticed it myself, but now that I think of it the fact that the baby lacks a name sounds pretty ominous to me.

Ahhh....I hadn't been thinking of it from Mildred's POV, but Cindy and Stephanice I think you're on to something. It's her lack of caring, not Phillip, or the narrator, etc.

And Teanka - I totally agree. I don't like at all the fact that this innocent little child is mixed up the Mildred - Phillip drama. It can't end well for her.

It's been long time since I hated, loathed, and despised a character in literature as much as I do Mildred. I was actually yelling at her by the time I finished this section. She really is horrible and the way she uses her daughter as a pawn in her sick little game is just awful. The baby lacking a name and the fact that they both refer to her as "it" in several places makes me want to cry for that child.

The scenes at Athenly’s were interesting. They have quite the family dynamic going on there. I too wondered if there is something brewing with Sally and a relationship with Philip but I can't quite see that happening. This section flew by for me and after being behind for a couple of weeks I'm excited to be caught up.

Jen wrote: Is it meant to keep us from getting too attached to the baby so when Mildred up and takes off with her we're not too devastated? ."

Considering everything that has happened in this novel I don't think SM is too concerned about protecting us from being upset!

Cindy wrote: "I think the baby's lack of a name is indicative of Mildred's emotional detachment from the child. As the mother, she would be the one to bestow the name on the baby. I'm sure she did give it a name, but I think the fact that she doesn't use it is just another sign of her general self-absorption."

That's a good point.

Along with it, perhaps, is that Mildred views it more as an object than a real person. If its only "the baby" she can treat it more as a plant or something impersonal she has to deal with. If she names it, it becomes something more, with perhaps more right to her attention than she's willing to give, not being a very giving person.

Sometimes a baby will shake a person out of self-absorption into a more healthy empathetic state. Doesn't seem to be the case here.

But in a way, does this echo somewhat Rev. Carey's approach toward Philip???

Nicola wrote: "Considering everything that has happened in this novel I don't think SM is too concerned about protecting us from being upset!
"

LOL!!

Amanda wrote: "It's been long time since I hated, loathed, and despised a character in literature as much as I do Mildred. I was actually yelling at her by the time I finished this section.

The book was, after all, picked as a "emotional powerhouse." I think it's justifying that characterization in spades!

Stephanie wrote: Throughout the book even when I haven't liked Philip I believed there was something good buried in their somewhere. I really enjoyed these chapters. "

I haven't been so confidant but I'm pleased to see Philip developing into a truly compassionate person. Even if he's still a bit of a mug where Mildred is concerned.

Cindy wrote: "I, too, can see a Philip/Sally match in the works. If that happened, I think Philip would be lucky to get her. She seems as if she would be another Norah, with all her good qualities. ..."

I have had this match turning over in my head for a little while now. I can see similarities to Norah but I think she's more like her mother - very maternal. She's also rather introspective which would match up well with Philips more quiet and reflective nature so long as they were compatible in other areas as well.

Everyman wrote: In Chapter 96 we get, for the first time, some real insight into Mildred’s thinking and personality. Up to this point we have known her mostly by her reactions to Philip. But in Chapter 96 Maugham opens her mind to us."

This was the confirmation I've been waiting for. Up until now I've given Mildred as much of the benefit of the doubt as it's been possible to give but this shows the inner workings of what passes for her mind and, oh, what a truly despicable person she is!

Nicola wrote: "Up until now I've given Mildred as much of the benefit of the doubt as it's been possible to give but this shows the inner workings of what passes for her mind and, oh, what a truly despicable person she is! "

Well, yes, but these chapters also actually made me view her a bit more sympathetically. Does she really freely choose to be this way, any more than Philip freely chose to love her even when she disgusted him? I thought the section emphasized the degree to which we are slaves of our inner natures.

It was at the end of this section (and yes, it was really difficult not to read on through to the end) that I realized that Maugham had caught me in his web again. Yes, this story is a soap opera, and yes, Philip sometimes seems like a ridiculous dolt, but the truth is all along I have seen my behavior or the behavior of people I know in everything Philip does or thinks. And I am so thoroughly engaged and invested in this character and his story now, that I can only hope Maugham gives us, and Philip, some hope and happiness at the end.

This is why I love Maugham. He understands the human condition, and he loves his characters... and that's what I think makes Shakespeare so brilliant.

I've also noticed that Philip is having important epiphanies, realizations about himself and his life and the meaning of life. His ability to observe himself honestly may be his saving grace. I hope so.

Janice George (JG) wrote: "I've also noticed that Philip is having important epiphanies, realizations about himself and his life and the meaning of life. His ability to observe himself honestly may be his saving grace."

I think that's what raises this above the soap opera level. It's not just the events that are so morbidly (at times) fascinating, but it's the philosophical passages where we see Philip's thoughts developing, sometimes as a result of interactions with others, sometimes as a result of self-reflection. I see a great deal of my college life in him. I went through many of the same intellectual phases that he does.

How old is Phillip supposed to be at this point? I'm my mind he's crowding 30 but maybe he wasn't in Paris as long as it seemed.

Renee wrote: "How old is Phillip supposed to be at this point? I'm my mind he's crowding 30 but maybe he wasn't in Paris as long as it seemed."

He was in Paris for 2 years I think? I would put him somewhere around 26ish? But I haven't counted each year religiously.

That seems so young to have seen and done as much as he has! As soon as Mildred appeared again, I just rolled my eyes and went "here we go again!" I was pleasantly surprised that he stood his ground and for the most part wasn't letting Mildred take advantage of him. Yes, spending some more money, but not nearly as much as before. And in his defense, it did appear initially like she wanted to do better for herself.

I'm so worried about the daughter! She's just "it" all the time, even to Philip, who does appear to really love and enjoy her. Mildred is so heartless toward her, though! She notices that Philip is bothered if she slaps at the baby? Very disturbing!

As horrible of a person as Mildred is, I found the chapter from her perspective to be out of place. Have we had a single other chapter in the entire book that was from a perspective other than Philip's? Why now? Why Mildred in particular? Did Maugham know someone like this and sought to try to understand her mind and treatment of him by giving her her own chapter, for him to explore her emotions? While it was interesting to see her mind, I just thought it seemed odd.

Regardless, her going off on him and then choosing to throw at him the one thing that she knows hurts him above all? Inexcusable! He's given her every opportunity, asking precious little of her in return, and she deserves whatever is coming to her at this point.

I'm a little concerned about the gambling bit that Philip has started with. He wins a small amount, but I have a feeling it would be better if he'd lost it, then he wouldn't catch the bug. I'm afraid he'll go in big later and it will come back to bite him. Hopefully he won't go too big too fast.

Alana wrote: "As horrible of a person as Mildred is, I found the chapter from her perspective to be out of place. Have we had a single other chapter in the entire book that was from a perspective other than Philip's? Why now? Why Mildred in particular? "

Great questions. I wish I had answers -- maybe somebody else does?

I didn't catch he anomaly of their being only one chapter from another characters POV., I was just fascinated to see what Mildred had been thinking. Great observation! It is weird, now that you mention it. If I let my imagination run away with me I can imagine Maughn trying to understand her motivations himself. She's such an unremittingly selfish spiky thing. Perhaps because he knew someone like her, as you've suggested. Or perhaps because she sprang from his head and he needed to understand

His own creation. Or perhaps his Beta readers felt she was to enigmatic... But it's an unusual choice from stylistic perspective. It definitely breaks the flow of the story.

Lol. Just reread. Must not type while falling asleep and using spell correct. Hope you can make sense of what I said even with all the grammatical mistakes. X-p

I understood just fine :)

I think I lean more toward the idea that he knew someone, or knew OF someone, like her, and needed something to imagine why someone might act the way she (or he?) did. It seemed like a rather introspective chapter, moreso than even some of the rest of Philip's internal musings. I wouldn't think much on it, except for that variation in style, giving her a voice, just this once, and to no one other than Philip (unless he does this again in a later chapter which I haven't gotten to yet). It seems like less of a literary device and more of an individual journaling out his perception of another person. Guess we'll never know!

I would like to hear how the clubfoot surgery turned out. He walked with a cane, OK; how much has his foot and gait improved, did he get a new shoe, how does he feel about it?

Philip does seem to be developing into a better person.

Mildred! She has some nerve after all he has done for her.

Bonnie wrote: "I would like to hear how the clubfoot surgery turned out."

I don't recall that we ever learned much about the results.

Everyman wrote: "Bonnie wrote: "I would like to hear how the clubfoot surgery turned out."

I don't recall that we ever learned much about the results."

That seemed like such a random side event. But maybe the point was that it DIDN'T make a big difference? It's not really part of who he is as a person?

Alana wrote: "That seemed like such a random side event. But maybe the point was that it DIDN'T make a big difference? It's not really part of who he is as a person?
"

That's a great point. And if you're right, it fits right in with Philip's other experiences -- the things he thought he really wanted, like going to Germany, going to art school, once he got them, they turned out not to be the life changing events he thought they would.

Maybe the clubfoot surgery was the same, something he thought would be life changing, but turned out ho-hum.

Spoiler: relates to something in week 10's reading, but since we're finished the book I'll slip it in here with spoiler protection for those who are still reading along.
(view spoiler)[
And maybe this suggests that his marriage will be more of the same? Something he thinks will be life changing will turn out to be anything but? (hide spoiler)]

Reply to the spoiler:

(view spoiler)[Possibly, but I get the impression more that he does't expect marriage to be life-changing in the way that he looked forward to with traveling and adventures; more that it will be different, but quieter, not earth-shattering. But I guess that's left up to our imaginations :) (hide spoiler)]

Mildred, Mildred, Mildred. You certainly haven't read 'How to Win Friends and Influence People'! Simply horrifically bad conduct on your part. 'Cripple.' Really? I don't know what can be said in the light of such abuse ...

I think that perhaps the baby's not being referred to by a name of her own is partly symptomatic of Mildred's desire to have the world revolve around her. The top names 'the baby' and 'it'. (The latter is still used in Ireland by a few who haven't quite travelled to the 21st century. These interesting individuals do not in any way intend the nomenclature 'it' as an insult. For them this endearing term likens the small child to a family pet, I believe. This is then a compliment. I'm not sure what to say about this ...

Yes, Bonnie, I really want to know about Phillip's foot. I see what you mean, Alana. That is very perceptive. I hadn't thought of that. But then i still want to know. I'm nosy!!!