Homeland discussion

Drizzt is a great character, however, R.A. Salvatore always leaves me hanging. It turns out that in all of the books Drizzt is never the real hero of the battle and almost always escapes by the skin of his teeth. Just once I'd like for him to turn the character into a killing machine and just unleash everything he is capable of doing.

Seriously though, I think that many of the books with Drizzt as the main character (I have read them all except the transition series) have been written just to take advantage of his popularity. Not much substance to them after a while.

Now the stories that branch of... the promise of the witch king and the road of the partriarch show once again that R.A. Salvatore is a quality writer I just think that he pigeon-holed Drizzt early on and from a writers stand point is stuck in a rut.

I have read a great deal of fantasy and I am still working on a large list of fantasy books. But so far, of all the fantasies that I have ever read, R.A. Salvatore is probably the most talented author of fantasy I have ever read. His detail brings in plenty of perspective for you to feel every detail come to life. Drizzts very principles of his life can be so easily understood. I eagerly await the next book of R.A Salvatores greatest work.

To me all the books seemed mostly like hack and slash adventures. They lacked the kind of story and character development you can find from books written from authors like Martin, Sanderson, and Rothfuss. I thinks the stories are nice for light reads but shouldn't be put up on a pedestal because they are for the most part very average.

I think, like all your comments and mine we all differ in opinion or point of view....just as the authors do in their writing, if they were all the same what would be the point? but to call R.A. Salvtore average.....come on! He's a great fantasy writer and the Drizzt character is awesome. I agree it may have lacked some character development as the series progressed but R.A. wrote pages throughout the series as Drizzt writing in a diary, so we were able to not just read about the character's life but also see Drizzt's thoughts and feelings which allowed us to see him as more of a person, which I think was defintely Drizzt's goal.

Evan, I agree...there is mostly slash and blood. This is the only book I have read by him. I won't read another. No character development, a totally 'black' society (no gray). If I am going to be kept hanging, I want more of a plot.

Deale wrote: "Evan, I agree...there is mostly slash and blood. This is the only book I have read by him. I won't read another. No character development, a totally 'black' society (no gray). If I am going to ..."

Actually, I think that Homeland and its sequels are the most interesting Salvatore gets in terms of character development and worldbuilding. And yes, they don't get very far. But the original Icewind Dale trilogy is more-or-less stock-footage d&d, and the subsequent Legacy of the Drow is just hack work - not only in the sense of hack and slash, but in the sense of 'people like this character i guess i'd better keep writing about him so that people give me money'.

The Entreri novel I remember being mildly interesting again, because it seemed as though Salvatore was actually interested in the character - the sigh when he had to go back to the drizzt chapters shoehorned into it for financial reasons was almost audible.

And indeed, this is by some margin the most popular Drizzt book, according to Goodreads. Take that fact, and then bear in mind the lensing effect of long series: as people drop out at each book, fewer people review the next, and those few are self-selected as those who are likely to like the books (because they've liked all the previous ones enough to continue onto the next). You'd expect scores to go up through a series as the "it's not for me but i'll give it a go" crowd fall out - instead, scores for Drizzt continually decline. Only two Drizzt books score higher than this one, and one of those hasn't been published yet. To illustrate the point: the other book that beats Homeland is Volume 20 - and that's only got 893 ratings, compared to the 9,627 ratings that Homeland got. In other words, you've got to narrow the surveyed audience to the most fanatical 10% of Salvatore readers to find people who vote a recent book just slightly better than Homeland.

So yeah, you're right to give up. Personally, since they're short books, I'd finish the trilogy and then make a judgement - but broadly, this is as good as it gets.

Drizzt is an immediately appealing character - he's a cool, kick-ass paragon of virtue. The problem is, he has no complexity, or depth, or ambiguity, or any interesting aspect whatsoever. It's 20 novels about Boba Fett, because wow, that mysterious ensemble character from Icewind Dale looked cool and mysterious.

The above commenter got it completely right: "easily understood". Do you want to read 20 books about somebody you easily understood within the first few pages?

It's hack and slash adventure. There are some entertaining moments of coolness, but there's very little character development, the world-building is not particularly interesting, the prose is bland and unpolished, the dialogue is sometimes painful, and the plots are predictable, repetitive, and don't always entirely make sense.

Nothing wrong with that per se, of course. If you've got time on your hands and want the written equivalent of cheesy popcorn action films, there's nothing wrong with enjoying these. But when people hold this up as writing by "the most talented author of fantasy" or "a great writer", I fear that they're seriously missing out on genuinely good fiction.

[For the record: I've read 11 of them and don't mind admitting it.]

Idk 'bout ya'll, but when I read the books, it was a new experience for me, since it was pretty much completely different from anything I'd ever read before. Mix the diaries of Drizzt with the bloody gore of battles and you get a large scope of writing styles already, but then he shoots it from other character's point of view(Like Jarlaxle Beanre and Artemis Entreri) and you get a whole new prospect of writing. The grey shades aren't shown because to each character, they have their own emotions and feelings about certain things. While I'm not expert and probably haven't read nearly as many books as ya'll, considering I'm a teenager and what not, I can honestly say that Drizzt is my favorite character of all time and that I've read his books(I own twenty of them that I bought) three times each. I'm not sure what ya'll were looking for out of the books, but I got what I wanted, and that was to escape our reality and go to another world of magic and battle, and who writes these things better than Salvatore?

I love every one of the books they are all interesting to me. There is alot of hacking and slashing but there good. I think the first three are the best but none of the other books never disapoint.

I enjoy them all, and own them all. Some I've read multiple times, others I purchased because I know I'll re-read them.

Because of the diary entries I found Drizzt to be a bit of a complex character. His ideologies vs his environment during his youth conflict sharply, and he is constantly learning about the surface world.

Wastrel is right: Salvatore DID write more books on Drizzt due to pressure. He got burned out on that character, and it shows when he did. That's probably the part of the series I haven't re-read. (Paths of Darkness?) Anyway, Salvatore switched to another publisher and wrote the Demon Wars Saga, completely different than the dnd style world he built through our Icewind Dale characters.

I've read the whole series, from The Dark Elf Trilogy to Gauntlygrim four times. :)

I have read every Drizzt book.

Drizzt is a very complex, principled character. Since he survived from the Underdark he has had a split personnality ( The Hunter ) and he had had a battle of Wills with it that he usually wins. But when he goes to the surface he is treated as a monster and has to prove he is unlike his kin. He is a great character and if you haven't read this series you should.

Deale wrote: "Evan, I agree...there is mostly slash and blood. This is the only book I have read by him. I won't read another. No character development, a totally 'black' society (no gray). If I am going to ..."

R.A. Salvator develops Drizzt way more than any other author develops their characters. And you won't be "kept hanging" it is an extremely interesting book with extremely interesting characters.

Speaking of the main character, Drizzt, I see him as Twilight's Edward, only instead of 12 year old girls, he is here to sparkle the imagination of 12 year old boys.

(12 here stands for any age before discovery of sex life)

Both Edward and Drizzt are heroes without a flaw, strong, brave, smart, talented, charismatic, boring, boring, boring Mary Sue characters that make my brain bleed. Those unfamiliar with term "Mary Sue character", check here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Sue

Plus, both Edward and Drizzt come from "evil background", one is a sparkling vampire, the other is BDSM femdom dark elf, but they overcome their legacy to be jolly good fellas.

And even sparkle is a common trait. Edward sparkles, and Drizzt has a sword named "sparkle". Horrible.

Zoran wrote: "Speaking of the main character, Drizzt, I see him as Twilight's Edward, only instead of 12 year old girls, he is here to sparkle the imagination of 12 year old boys.

(12 here stands for any age be..."

Your 12 year old boy comment hits the spot. Of course we know why his Mom was REALLY going on a tirade all of the time. Drizzt's room always smelled of sweaty gym socks.

I think some posters are being a little hard on the Drizzt series. It is in the action section of fantasy. The fans read the Drizzt series for the fight scenes. RA Salvatore delivers on that score.

There are many sub genres in the fantasy category. To like one does not mean you must hate the others in the family. Robert Jordan, George RR Martin, Daniel Abraham, and Terry Goodkind can get a bit heavy at times. Sometimes reading the Fanchise series of Star Trek or WOTC can be just the ticket. They are the equivalent of Mystery's cozy reads.

The Drizzt readership? Many of them may not post or frequent Goodreads.

is a light hearted look at evil species with a good guy.

I get the sense from the series that Salvatore had very little choice but to keep churning out Drizzt stories. How many of his characters had he tried to kill throughout? It's like he was trying to send a message saying, "I'm done," but whoever held the final say said, "you're not." I enjoyed the series greatly until the Angsty bad boy Wulfgar returned from hell plane, and the overuse of Entreri. Out of my reverence for how much I liked the earlier work, I lasted until Cattie-Brie's identity crisis that culminated in her far to convenient, and pointless death.

Dale wrote: "Drizzt is a great character, however, R.A. Salvatore always leaves me hanging. It turns out that in all of the books Drizzt is never the real hero of the battle and almost always escapes by the ski..."

I see what your saying and I am only 3/4ths the way through book three. I think of the books (I've read excerpts of the later books) the 2nd and third book are the ones where he really kinda shines.

Dale wrote: "Drizzt is a great character, however, R.A. Salvatore always leaves me hanging. It turns out that in all of the books Drizzt is never the real hero of the battle and almost always escapes by the ski..."

I believe I once read that Salvatore was surprised by Drizzt's popularity. Like has been stated, he didn't win a battle on his own. It's always teamwork, every character deadly in his own way.

I loved the Drizzt/Forgotten Realms books as a teenager, but they just don't hold up when you get older. That type of fantasy can be fun, but it's like comparing spam to filet mignon; both will fill you up but sometimes you just want something more refined.

I don't really get why someone would say that Drizzt is a perfect character when he often lets his morals get in the way of the 'right' thing to do at certain times. The 12 year old boy's comment was moderately accurate but I know many adults who enjoy the books even more so than I do (I am 16, btw). Besides, Drizzt isn't the only drow who rejects the evil way of the drow. He might be the only one that sustains said rejection (considering that certain characters in The War Of The Spiderqueen move in the opposite direction for a short time) but either way, no one reads about a character who doesn't do anything. Drizzt is popular because he not only seeks adventure in his books but also gets involved with things that show his character.
The fact that some people believe he is a simple and perfect character is a little bit unusual to me but I can see where you get that. But being someone who is often surrounded by people who don't exactly make the best choices, it is a little bit easier, I think, for me to relate to Drizzt's reactions. While some of my friends do drugs, an 'evil' act in certain people's minds, Drizzt's family kills a ton of people... not the best comparison but I think that we'd all be great writers if we could make said best comparisons. Eitherway, I agree that Drizzt was, for a while, in a rut of the exact same thing over and over again, but he seems to be out of it by Neverwinter.

It is not just that Drizzt is great but he surrounds himself with great friends.
And why is there no mention of the Underdark archeticure,his brother or the 6-legged lizards that were used as mounts?

I love all of Salvatore's books with the exception of Yneis Aielle. I actually like the Demonwars books a little better than Drizzt. I identify more with Elbryan Wyndon more.

But I like the Highwayman alot. I'm disabled so always good to see a strong disabled character.

I've not read all the Drizzt books, but the few I have read have held my attention and stirred my emotions enough to want more. I'm not as young as most on this site but I read for entertainment and escape, not intellectual stimulus, so I have found that series books, especially those with so many books envolved are better when not read one after the other, so I read 3 or 4 and then take a break. Works for me.

Lorinda wrote: "I've not read all the Drizzt books, but the few I have read have held my attention and stirred my emotions enough to want more. I'm not as young as most on this site but I read for entertainment an..."

Heh heh, I'm 51, Lorinda. I believe there is a wide representation of ages on this site.

I love all the Icewind Dale characters, and have enjoyed to some degree all the books involving Drizzt. There's 2 trilogies I have yet to catch up on, one to re-read and the other as a first time through.

It's just that, somehow, as I've gotten older and one kid has flown the coop I find myself incredibly busy. So much so that I finally put my foot down on myself and vowed to read at least 15 minutes a day... harder to stick with than one might think

Brenda wrote: "Lorinda wrote: "I've not read all the Drizzt books, but the few I have read have held my attention and stirred my emotions enough to want more. I'm not as young as most on this site but I read for ..."
Brenda, I like the way you think! I've sent you a friend request

I'm almost 47 and have been reading the Drizzt books since Streams of Silver hit the shelves in the mid-80's. Still enjoying Drizzt and wishing Salvatore could step it up. That would probably hurt the quality of stories tho.

Evan wrote: "To me all the books seemed mostly like hack and slash adventures. They lacked the kind of story and character development you can find from books written from authors like Martin, Sanderson, and Ro..."

When i look for a Fantasy book i look for RA !

The SpearWeilder's Tale (3 books).

The Demonwars!!

The Crimson Shadow(3 books)

Saga of the First King. With that, all Salvatore series have been listed. Stone of Tymora was written for a much younger audience so didn't hold my interest well.

I had the same problem with Stone of Tymora,however the you are right about Saga of the First King,it was a pretty great series.

I see a lot of narrow limited views. Maybe you need to re read the Drizzt series. True there is some hack and slash, but there is much more to his novels, many layers in fact. And usually a lesson to be learned, or a good message that is shared.
Personally I hate any and all romance in a fantasy adventure novel, or just about any other novel to be honest, but, I found myself pulling for Drizzt and Cat, and actually had a moment of "kiss her already". There is much loyalty and life lesson, to be learned from the master of fantasy adventure. you just have to open your eyes

I skim over the romance; my wife skims over the combat. :)

Lol

I like the Drizzt series and just about all of R.A.Salvatore's work.As well as most fantasy,my wife likes mystery and vampires and witchs and hunters/slayers.

most of the drizzt novels have me on the edge of my seat, especially since he seems to have no issue in killing off main characters.
I managed a bookstore for years, and worked with several schools in helping them find things to get their kids reading. Where my employees failed with different books and authors that to someone who loves to read were really good. When I recommended Salvatore, and the Drizzt series I hit a home run. not only did the schools come back for more in the series and ask for other recommendations specifically from me, but the kids and their parents were coming in looking anxiously for the next book.
Salvatore is a great story teller, and the speed in which you read his books because they draw you in with their fast paced story lines, makes him a great author not only for the long time reader, but for the new reader that really has never had an interest in reading. to call them simple or cookie cutter, only shows your limited lvl of reading comprehension.

Yes,there is in no way I would call the Drizzt series simple,the diary he keeps alone tells you we're dealing with a complex character.

I for one am almost finished with the 2nd book in the Drizzt series and am intrigued. the character Drizzt is fighting an inner battle of finding his true being and the adventures during his travels. the story line flows and keeps anticipation building!

Salvatore spends quality time on the landscape,but not so much to bore the reader.

Chris wrote: "most of the drizzt novels have me on the edge of my seat, especially since he seems to have no issue in killing off main characters.
I managed a bookstore for years, and worked with several schools..."

I truly enjoyed reading that post. I'm just curious as to which books in particular you showed them(starting with the Dark Elf Trilogy or the Icewind Dale Trilogy?) because I am trying to get some of my friends to join in on reading and don't really know which is the best to start on.

To Roderick,Icewind Dale Trilogy is truly great and will catch interest quick if there is a spark.
The Dark Elf Trilogy,in my eyes is as good but others may find it slow.Alot of it is the development of Drizzt.

Charlton wrote: "To Roderick,Icewind Dale Trilogy is truly great and will catch interest quick if there is a spark.
The Dark Elf Trilogy,in my eyes is as good but others may find it slow.Alot of it is the developme..."

Alright, thank you very much. I own all of the books so I can give them out whenever I like, so I'll show them that one and see how it goes!

I'm a middle aged suburban homemaker who discovered this series only a couple years ago. I loved the worldbuilding and characters of the original trilogy. I stopped after that because of the battle shaded anatomy lessons (this is the liver-splat! This is the brain stem-thok!) got to me. I agree that this is lighter fare, but it was well written, at least, early on.
I suspect that many authors who have to keep milking their characters get worn down after awhile. Agatha Christie did that, and so did Doyle on some levels with Sherlock Holmes.
I love the comment that Drizzt is the D&D version of a mystery cozy. Great comparison!

Spoiler alert for lots of things.

Even though Drizzt is the hero, I have began to dislike him. It upsets me how he looks at Entreri as a monster when he is not. sometimes I want to scream in Drizzt's face. I like how in the part of the series I am on, Entreri is becoming a more caring person rather than a rock. Drizzt too much of a flip flop. He makes himself a bunch of promises even though he knows something will get in his way of keeping them. (like in the entire "Legend of the Drow" collector's edition, When he breakes his vow not to spill drow blood, then he gets all upset about it. He should hav known that he wouldn't live up to that.