A Song of Ice and Fire - A Chapter a day discussion
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09/19/15 - Chapter 63: Catelyn X
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Your point 2: It makes me wonder if Ned was ever aware that his wife was pregnant during the time he was away? Did he only find out about Robb when he came back for her, or did he somehow get a raven while he was at war, telling him that she's pregnant? Your point 3: I think it's briefly mentioned that Brynden Tully and his men closely studied Jaime Lannister's movements in and around Riverrun, so he got a good notion that Jaime cannot stand hiding behind the walls of Riverrun when there are raiders to attack, so he knows his weakness from observation. I think he's a very clever man to lure Jaime like he did.
I have to admit, the first time I read this chapter I didn't clearly understand what was going on. It was a lot easier the second time around. I also don't know that much about war tactics, so I thought Robb and all his men were well away from Cat, getting their battle on, and she was waiting to see who would come back for her. As it turns out, Cat was hiding with them in the woods as they wait patiently to ambush Jaime, who's pursuing the Blackfish for raiding a nearby village.
Your point 12: Haha! I also like how Jaime seems to mislay everything. He has a sense of humor that even though I still hate him at this point in the books he still manages to make me laugh. And you are right, I hadn't noticed how cool and calm he is at being captured. I sort of saw it as that's just how Jaime is; he doesn't take anything seriously and maybe he is overconfident that they would not dare harm him because he is so important to the queen.
Good stuff!
1. I think it's interesting this chapter starts with: "The woods were full of whispers." Right away it reminds me of the northern gods. Even though Cat doesn't believe in the old gods she still hears whispers through the trees. (And perhaps it is only because there are thousands of men hiding everywhere in the woods, but I got a spiritual feel from it.)
2. So Catelyn is waiting in the forest for Robb's first battle, no doubt very nervous for him. I like that Robb wanted fifty guards to protect her should anything go wrong and she wanted only ten, so they settled at thirty, "neither happy with it." :) You can tell they care a lot about each other, each caring less for their own safety and more for the other. I can really feel the tension.
3. A lot of men in her life made her wait, so she's learned to be patient.
4. Ned and Catelyn got married in a sept, okay. For some reason I thought they got married in the godswood. I feel for Cat when she was younger, looking forward to marrying handsome Brandon Stark and getting Ned instead. I'm glad they learned to love each other! But can you imagine how awkward it must have been to be all excited about marrying this one man for most of your life and then you end up with his brother instead? And then she had to watch Ned leave, never knowing when or if he would ever come back...that must have been extremely difficult for her, and pregnant too. The life of a lady sounds so stressful! You wouldn't think it at first glance.
5. So now she's waiting for Robb Stark to come back to her, her first son, the one she was carrying while she was waiting for Ned. No wonder she's having flashbacks -- it's set in the riverlands, too, close to home.
6. Apparently Jaime had never learned to wait for anything. The drawback of being born into the wealthiest family in Westeros. This could be his downfall today.
7. They rely heavily on Ser Brynden Tully's knowledge of where Jaime and all of his men will be, from scouting. There are so many things that could go wrong if he's not right about Jaime being unaware. But the Blackfish is smart and experienced.
8. Jaime's holding Riverrun and has 3 to 1 soldiers compared to what they have, but the Blackfish is sure they'll win because Jaime is impatient.
9. I like that Ned says a lord should be seen by his men before going into battle. Gives them courage. Maybe Robb can give them a rousing speech, like Braveheart, lol.
10. Robb is known as the Young Wolf, and all the lord bannermen's sons want the honor to protect him. :) You can tell Robb is a beloved leader, and he hasn't even fought a battle yet! I really like that one of his protectors is Dacey Mormont, a girl, though it's said she'd been given a morningstar at the age where most girls get dolls, lol. That's really cool that Robb allows it. I think that makes her Jorah's cousin.
11. Forgot about the snow shrikes. In the dictionary, they are also called butcherbirds. Apparently they are northern birds. They only show up in the riverlands in the winter, presumably for migration, and right now it's still summer. I wonder what this could mean.
12. They've basically led them into a trap, waiting for Jaime and his men to take the bait. Jaime goes after raiders in an effort to have something to do (because it must get pretty boring waiting around inside the walls of Riverrun), so he goes after the Blackfish for raiding and gets himself ambushed. Cat almost feels sorry for him. She can't see the battle, but she can hear it.
13. Robb comes back to her with blood on his hand but he says it's not his'. He seems shaken. They've kidnapped Jaime, woot!
14. Of course Theon would want his head cut off; he likes kicking heads. But Robb keeps him as a hostage instead, a very valuable one, too!
15. Robb is upset that some of his protectors died saving him, awe. He feels guilty that he allowed men would die in his place. You can tell that he really cares about his men, because of this. I like that Cat tells him to mourn them, but not right now. They still have to retake Riverrun.
16. Lol Theon...he likens this battle as as great as the Field of Fire, which was the only time Aegon the Conquerer unleashed all three dragons in the battle for Westeros. He had a ratio of 1 in 10 soldiers, but he won because he had dragons. A lot of people died from the flames. I wouldn't go that far, Theon...
17. I like that Cat chastises Theon, saying unless they've taken Tywin Lannister himself, the war is far from over. Robb agrees. (No doubt capturing Jaime will inflict Tywin and Cersei's wrath!)
18. This chapter was short but full of tension!
I don't really know, maybe he got a letter with the news about Catelyn, but I can't say I am sure.And now that you said it, I remember reading about Brynden studying Jaime, thank you!
I didn't remember Catelyn was staying so close to the battle. Like you I don't know anything about war, but it sounded really risky. She was just there for Jaime and his men to kill her if things didn't go the way they did.
Of course, the first time I read the book I hated Jaime and he didn't make me laugh. But this time I did. I really like his personality. And I now I do think he's acting calm because that's just the way he is. It is mention often he doesn't really care about a lot of things.
About your point 4, it must have been a terrible thing to her. I can't even imagine what she felt when Ned showed to marry her. But now I have a doubt, was Ned the only brother who got married to the woman his brother was supposed to get marry? Or is this a commmon thing? I don't think it is. And I don't see how honor gets in the way, his brother died and it was sad, but why did he feel he had to marry Catelyn? I just thought about it, lol. I also really like they loved each other. And how awful to marry someone you don't love, and hope to love them someday.
Lol at your point 9. Does anybody ever gives a speech in these books? Before a battle I mean, I remember there are a few in A Feast for Crows.
1-Catelyn is waiting, guarded by Hallis Mollen and thirty more men. They are waiting for Robb, who went to Riverrun and is fighting against Jaime. I really like the way this chapter is written, and I think it's one of my favourites. I don't know why.
2-She is used to wait, since her men always made her wait. She thinks about his father, when he went to war. He called her little cat, and I think it's really cute. They seem to have a really nice relationship. Brandon Stark made her wait as well, but never came back. Later Ned kept her waiting. I forgot he wasn't there when Robb was born.
3-Her uncle told her Jaime Lannister didn't wait at all. I wonder how he knows that, did he hear it or know it first hand? And I liked the comparison, Catelyn is used to waiting and Jaime isn't.
4-It was really sad to read her prayer again. She is a really good mother.
5-The situation wasn't the best for Robb, Jaime's army was in Riverrun, and had them 3 to 1. Which is a lot, and I know anything can happen in war, but it was a gloomy situation for Robb. Of course I don't know anything about war, but I liked (and I think it's correct) when Brynden told Robb to have patience. It must be really difficult, but in this case it was a good choice.
6-I like Robb is now called "Young Wolf". Cool name. Also, I think his bannermen know at this point how he is, and it makes me think they really want to protect them, and some offer themselves to be his guard.
7-Catelyn sees Jaime, and the way it's written it makes you think he won, and he is coming for her. I really like that. I also think that's what I thought the first time I read it.
8-I loved all the things that were associated with the word "here". It was really beautiful, and I forgot about it, so I'm glad I catched it this time.
9-I also liked when she thought "this is what death sounds like" when she heard Grey Wind howl. I can't even imagine how that sound was, to make her think that.
10-This chapter is full of beautiful descriptions. This one: "Yet when she looked across the valley to the far ridge, she saw the Greatjon’s riders emerge from the darkness beneath the trees. They were in a long line, an endless line, and as they burst from the wood there was an instant, the smallest part of a heartbeat, when all Catelyn saw was the moonlight on the points of their lances, as if a thousand willowisps were coming down the ridge, wreathed in silver flame.Then she blinked, and they were only men, rushing down to kill or die." That one is gorgeous! One of my favourites.
11-It seems to me Robb was pretty shock, and it's understandable. He was covered in blood, not his, but he's not sure who it belongs to. He got it put together though.
12-The conversation between Catelyn and Jaime. Interesting the word mislaid it was used so often. *SPOILERS FOR A STORM OF SWORDS* (view spoiler)[It remind me of how he "mislaid" his hand. (hide spoiler)]. I have to say as well, I thought Jaime sounded like he didn't care that much about what might happen to him. What I am trying to say is he didn't beg, or was shocked when it was suggested he should be killed.
13-As if Jaime didn't have enough people behind who wanted to kill him, now he has Lord Karstark, he killed his two sons. I forgot he was screaming Robb's name while he fought.
14-Catelyn knows what this mean. Her son won a battle, not the war. Maybe she said that too coldly, but she is right. She knows if they don't have Tywin, the war will go on. Like I mentioned in her chapters, she is really, really smart, and more perceptive than a lot of the men there.