The Mystery, Crime, and Thriller Group discussion

This will be the thread for discussing The Alienist by Caleb Carr. This is the second time it has been selected as a group read, the last time was 4 years ago. I look forward to seeing the comments from a new group of readers mixed with those who may have read and discussed before. Chris is the moderator for this discussion. Congrats and enjoy.

Looking forward to the discussion! I think it was my senior year of high school that I read this which would have been 96/97. I've wanted to read it again for awhile now. Hope everyone enjoys it.

This has been on my wish list for a good couple of years so what better reason to pick it up than for a group read?!

I'll be reading "The Drop" first in the other group read but it's only a short one so don't see it taking me too long to start this one. Looking forward to people's thoughts and opinions.

Starting this tonight, looking forward to it. Has anyone else begun?

Richard wrote: "Starting this tonight, looking forward to it. Has anyone else begun?"

Starting tonight myself (11/19). My pace will likely be slower than most though as I count myself fortunate if I can steal an hour or so a day.

I read this book when it was first published and I enjoyed it very much. I can't remember a lot of it now, but I can remember feeling it was a 'higher class' of dark mystery, literary with more depth than typical of American mysteries. I was happy with it and I have kept it on my shelves.

aPriL does feral sometimes wrote: "I read this book when it was first published and I enjoyed it very much. I can't remember a lot of it now, but I can remember feeling it was a 'higher class' of dark mystery, literary with more dep..."

Yes definitely. I'm only on Chapter 8 right now but the language and story telling is already of a different caliber. I'm enjoying it again this time though it's a bit different then I remember; that's what 18 years will do...

I got the book from the library and will be starting it.

Look forward to hearing what you think Barbara.

I read this one last year and really enjoyed it. I thought it was well-written and loved all the historical aspects, as well as the characters. Definitely on the gruesome side though.

I have just read this after having it on my TPR pile for quite a while.
It was interesting but a slow read and not as thrilling as I would have liked.

Esther wrote: "I have just read this after having it on my TPR pile for quite a while.
It was interesting but a slow read and not as thrilling as I would have liked."

Yeah it's not quite as fast paced as most that get categorized as a thriller. One thing I'm appreciating more this time around is the psychological profiling.

Lindsey wrote: I read this one last year and really enjoyed it. I thought it was well-written and loved all the historical aspects, as well as the characters. Definitely on the gruesome side though.

It definitely is. But after reading Pretty Girls a few weeks ago I've come to realize I would rather deal with a gruesome crime scene than the actual violence of the crime, if that makes sense.

I have it on my bookshelf in the house for years now. Time to re-read it!

From what I remember the crime scenes are gruesome and not for the faint of heart.

I read it in 2000 and loved it. The scenes of New York are wonderful. Time to dust it off, I think.

I read it years ago. Thought it was great. I can't re-read it because I didn't hold on to it.

I'm about half finished. Caleb Carr makes old New York really come alive with his descriptions. It's also interesting to see early versions of behavioral analysis being used in criminal investigation.

Great book. I love the atmosphere and the characters are likable.

I'm about 3/4th's done. Been traveling a bit and haven't been able to keep as quick a pace as I'd like but should have it done in the next week or so.

I agree that the atmosphere in this book is incredible. I am guilty of romanticizing this time period but Mr. Carr sure corrects what are sure to be some poor ideas and presumptions on my part.

I finally finished the book (lot of pages with a lot of small printing). Caleb Carr does a superb job depicting old New York. I grew up in NYC and am really happy it's not quite the seedy, crowded, smelly, corrupt, criminal infested place - full of whorehouses and such - that he describes. (Not as much anyway).

I thought the psychological profiling the team did was interesting, but I didn't buy into that completely. Some of their leaps of intuition (for want of a better phrase) were too convenient to be believable.

POSSIBLE SPOILER AHEAD

(view spoiler)[ The parts where various people and institutions tried to prevent the team from solving the crimes were shocking to me. How could anyone not want a vicious child murderer to be caught? Especially the church leaders!! All for profit and money... it's deplorable. (hide spoiler)]

I thought there was a good build up of suspense as they closed in on the killer and the ending was appropriately dramatic.

Did anyone read the author's postscript at the end...where he describes how he fooled his agent and publisher into letting him write a fiction book. It's priceless!

Maha wrote: "Ok this will be my first time reading The Alienist. I don't know anything about it, literally zero info. Some friends recommended it to me so ...
And I really love teasers, so if anyone likes to ke..."

Hi Maha - Stick with it through the first 100 pages or so. It has a bit of a slow start for some reason even though I hesitate to call it 'slow' since it isn't really. But it does take some time to get into. It's worth it though!

Barbara wrote: "Did anyone read the author's postscript at the end...where he describes how he fooled his agent and publisher into letting him write a fiction book. It's priceless! "

Caleb Carr is a character. I've seen a talk of his on YouTube and it really is funny to see him gripe about things :)

I don't believe there are any spoilers in this video. The talk is supposed to be about his book 'The Legend of Broken' but ends up being more about Mr. Carr's thoughts on our current culture, publishing, the Internet and popular reading habits. It's a fun listen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-hqo...

Alright I have to apologize that it has taken me so long to get back to this thread. I should know better than to nominate a book and moderate a discussion in the midst of Christmas season. I didn't even finish the book until a few days ago.

All that said I still thoroughly enjoyed the story although my thoughts on it have definitely changed from what they were when I read this some 18 or so years ago. Of course, that would make sense being that I was still in high school at the time. We all grow and mature; our interests change as do our views on things.

I don't want to give a side by side comparison between what I thought of the book then versus now but I do have some thoughts that I wanted to put out there.

The first time I read this I remember it took several attempts to get started. There is something about the first 80-100 pages or so that kept it from being gripping enough to get lost in the story. The same was true this time although I didn't have near the frustration I remember having before. I just plowed through it and soon enough, it seems around the time they are getting their headquarters set up at Number 808, it sucks you in.

But this isn't the kind of book that has you on the edge of your seat. It really isn't until the final 30-40 pages or so where (at least for me) you are thirsting to know how it ended. You aren't dealing with twists and turns and red herrings like many other thrillers. Carr admits as much in his afterward to the newer edition. He was going for the analysis of the mind and what makes us do the things we do. In this case you have two guys who have similar backgrounds but end up living life in completely different directions.

With that I have to agree with Barbara on some of the psychological profiling that happens in the book. At times it seems far-fetched. I don't agree with Lazlo's presuppositions in how we come to be who we are to the degree that he proposes. It's a bit too simple.

Probably one of the more fascinating and bizarre dialogue's I've read is the encounter with Jesse Pomeroy. I don't recall this part from my previous reading so it clearly didn't have an impact on me then but I actually stopped and put the book down for a few minutes and then went back and read through it again. This, to me, was one of the shining moments in the book.

I think those are the major points I've had. I do hope everyone who read it enjoyed it and if you didn't get to finish it, don't be deterred; I think it's worth the effort.