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Hugo Nominations
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Nice! Would love to know what new stuff people recommend. :)
I picked up a membership last year to vote and hopefully next year to nominate.
George R.R. Martin has some thoughts on his LiveJournal page.Hugo Thoughts
More Hugo Thoughts
More Hugo Musings
Not sure what the difference is between a "thought" and a "musing" but there you go. ;)
terpkristin wrote: "George R.R. Martin has some thoughts on his LiveJournal page.Hugo Thoughts
More Hugo Thoughts
More Hugo Musings
Not sure what the difference is between a "thought" and a "musing" ..."
I completely agree with him about Outlander. It will absolutely be on my nomination ballot. The time travel aspect is enough to qualify it in the fantasy genre, and it was some of the best produced, acted and designed television I've seen, ever, let alone this year. I strongly suspect that latent cultural snobbery about the "romance" genre (which it also qualifies as ) has prevented it from being taken as seriously as it could have been. Possibly also that romance classification may have scared off many viewers who don't consider romance their "thing", which is a shame because it shares DNA with a variety of genres, including books like Game of Thrones.
The Long Way to a Small, Angry Planet is definitely worth a look. Brilliant characters and while things happen it's not plot driven... but it's so well done that you can see the events and people and aliens she's describing.
terpkristin wrote: "Not sure what the difference is between a "thought" and a "musing" but there you go. ;) "Musings are when you're in your bathrobe. Thoughts are when you're fully dressed.
This is Nebula suggested reading list. It is super long http://www.sfwa.org/forum/index.php?a...
my books I am pushing is The Liar's Key, and Nemesis Games,
Jesus that's a dangerous list to have... (DOWN Visa™! Down I say)... Sorry, the credit card gets out of control around books... Anyone read Archivist Wasp? It's got great reviews...
Rick wrote: "The Long Way to a Small, Angry Planet is definitely worth a look. Brilliant characters and while things happen it's not plot driven... but it's so well done that you can see the eve..."It looks like it was published in 2014, so not eligible. I'll keep it in mind for reading after my nominations are settled though.
Stephen wrote: "This is Nebula suggested reading list. It is super long http://www.sfwa.org/forum/index.php?a...
my books I am pushing is The Liar's Key, and [book:Nemesis Games|228866..."
Do you feel that Liars Key is something I could jump straight into, or is the first novel in the series a prerequisite?
So after considering for a while, I think what I'm going to do is start this process focusing on books from smaller presses, debut authors, self pubs, or other books that might have been overlooked this year. My thinking on this is two-fold. The first reason is I have a soft spot for underdogs, and the second is if I do find good Hugo-worthy novels in these categories any encouragement I can give to other voters to read them is best served by doing so as early as possible.
I do intend to also read and consider the eligible heavy-hitters and big names, but since those well publicized books don't really need any help to have a shot at a nomination, I feel like I can put it off until closer to the deadline.
Here are three I'm considering starting with (all three are small presses as far as I can tell) :
The Girl with Ghost Eyes
If Then
Mort(e)
I'm a big fan of R. Scott Bakker. I think he's a great writer and his novels and stories explore some interesting themes, mainly the death of meaning (or the semantic apocalypse as he calls it) and the myriad ways we deceive ourselves. The author has a background in theory, criticism and philosophy of the mind. His latest short story is called Crash Space and it was published in the recent issue of the academic journal Midwest Studies in Philosophy (a special issue is devoted to philosophy and science fiction). It's a provocative piece that explores ethics and transhumanism.
A draft version of the story has been posted to Bakker's blog.
https://rsbakker.files.wordpress.com/...
Rick wrote: "The Long Way to a Small, Angry Planet is definitely worth a look. Brilliant characters and while things happen it's not plot driven... but it's so well done that you can see the eve..."I really want to read this one but it doesn't come out in the states any time soon. It's all over BookTubers in the UK.
Jenny (Reading Envy) wrote: "I really want to read this one but it doesn't come out in the states any time soon. It's all over BookTubers in the UK. "You sure about that?
Oh, and a warning to everyone -- Vox Day has decided to sic the Rabid Puppies on Goodreads. File 770 reports that at least one person has been harassed over a negative review of last year's Hugo nominees, and they're reportedly getting ready to bomb "SJW" books with negative reviews.
Well then, Sean, we'll see if GR has a backbone. If they allow this to happen it just means they don't. Jenny - it's out in the States. Very fun book.
Sean wrote: "Oh, and a warning to everyone -- Vox Day has decided to sic the Rabid Puppies on Goodreads. File 770 reports that at least one person has been harassed over a negative review of last year's Hugo no..."Just skimmed the related blog posts I didn't see anything talking about that even in the comments where I figured it would be. Vox's post and the comments seem to be about attacking people for posting reviews that are clearly about the politics/views of the author and not about the book which is against GR policy...why comment and start a controversy instead of just reporting and moving on like I do is another story.
Sean wrote: "Jenny (Reading Envy) wrote: "I really want to read this one but it doesn't come out in the states any time soon. It's all over BookTubers in the UK. "You sure about that?"
Well, I wanted it in print.
Rick wrote: "Well then, Sean, we'll see if GR has a backbone. If they allow this to happen it just means they don't."Well I forwarded the news to a GR admin this morning and as of now the group is gone and VD's whining on his blog about how the SJWs here are cowards for banning him.
Good thing I got screenshots.
Jenny - You can order a print copy from Book Depository. They are UK-based but ship worldwide for free. I saw Books and Pieces review and had to order it. It's there.
I'm tentatively assuming that Long Journey to a Small Angry Planet is ineligible due to the 2014 pub date, but it occurred to me that the author might be eligible for the Campell award. Does anyone know how the rules shake down for that?
Isn't there a second eligibility window when published in the US, or is that just translated to English. (I'm to lazy to look it up right now).
The members of WSFS have been concerned that works published in English outside of the USA are not getting sufficient exposure to the voting public (the largest group of whom are Americans even when Worldcon is in another country). Frequently US publishers will pick up on successful British, Canadian or Australian books (amongst others) a year or two after their initial publication. American voters want to nominate them, but by then it is too late because the eligibility year is passed. So effective with the 2015 Hugo Awards, WSFS granted an additional year of eligibility for such works when they are first published in the USA. This extension only applies to works that did not make the final ballot in their initial publication.Well, then maybe it is eligible! It's difficult to tell though. It looks like the original publication might have been self published...so I guess the question is : was the initial run available in US stores?
I have to say between this kind of thing and the confusing length restrictions the Hugo's nomination process isn't really user friendly. I think that's contributing to their small nomination base.
Jenny (Reading Envy) wrote: "Sean wrote: "Jenny (Reading Envy) wrote: "I really want to read this one but it doesn't come out in the states any time soon. It's all over BookTubers in the UK. "You sure about that?"
Well, I wa..."
Can't you just order the UK version from bookdepository or something? I order English language books, both UK and US editions, online all the time.
E.J. Xavier wrote: "Well, then maybe it is eligible! It's difficult to tell though. It looks like the original publication might have been self published...so I guess the question is : was the initial run available in US stores? "
Stores don't really matter, because self published novels are eligible. It was just sold online worldwide, I think. Also the author is American, in case that wasn't clear (even though the UK version of the re-published edition was released before the US one).
Sorry I should clarify that by "stores" I was including online venues. A book appearing on Amazon UK but not the US site would be covered in the extension clause (which does happen). Also the rule description doesn't mention that the nationality of the author matters, but focuses on publication locations. It looks like she was an ex-pat living in the UK and Europe when this launched, which might be why it was launched in the UK first.All that said, it looks like the initial self publication was available in the US in 2014. Which looks like once again we are back to "not eligible".
It's a shame. I would really like to see more self published works get recognized. However the nature of self pub is just that it takes longer for good ones to get recognized in the large ocean of new books. It seems by the time they gain momentum it's too late for awards.
Thalia wrote: "Jenny - You can order a print copy from Book Depository. They are UK-based but ship worldwide for free. I saw Books and Pieces review and had to order it. It's there."
Didn't know that, thanks!
Beyond RedemptionJust finished and I think it's worth considering for nominations. I've placed it in my "possible" pile. Seems to have flown under the radar, and not gotten much of a press push from it's publisher.
It's very dark. Possibly too dark to realistically get nominated for a popular award like the Hugo, I'm not sure. I can see a lot of strong reactions to this. It's definitely a book that gets down in the trenches which a cast of very upsetting characters, and the title should be taken as fair warning. It's not playing around.
Heh, I just read that. Loved it. If people won't nominate it because it's dark then the Hugo voters need to grow up a little.
So. As we close in on the nomination deadline I'm narrowing the field. None of my categories are full up yet, and I'm still reading, but I'm going to share some things that I'm very confident are going to make it onto my ballot, and I hope others who are still reading check them out, because I really quite liked these and feel they deserve consideration.And likewise, if others have things that they think are 100% on their list let me know. Though I will say that at this point, I just don't have time for mid-series books before the deadline. I'm down to only stand alone or first in a series.
Most of my reading so far has been for Novel and Novella. I haven't done enough with the other two short fiction categories to have much of a list yet.
Novel:
"The Fifth Season" - N. K. Jemison
"The Traitor Baru Cormorant" - Seth Dickinson
"Beyond Redemption" - Michael R. Fletcher
Novelette:
"The Sorcerer of the Wildeeps" - Kai Ashante Wilson
"The New Mother" - Eugene Fischer
"Binti" - Nnedi Okorafor
"The Four Thousand, The Eight Hundred" - Greg Egan
Well I just did something I didn't do last year. I submitted a nomination form for the Hugo Awards. Remember everyone who is eligible, you have until the end of the month to submit a form. If you have already nominated, you can also make changes until the end of the month.
John (Nevets) wrote: "Well I just did something I didn't do last year. I submitted a nomination form for the Hugo Awards. Remember everyone who is eligible, you have until the end of the month to submit a form. If you..."
Are you willing to share some of what you nominated? My ballot is getting as close to finished as it's likely to be. But for example the Novelette category is still largely empty. I read the nebula nominations and while I liked many of the nominees in the other short fiction categories, I did not find much in the Novelette list. Currently I only have two slots filled there.
Yea, I didn't have a ton in the shorter fiction categories, as well as some others I don't feel great nominating in (like editors and Fan stuff). I know this could still help those who support the slates (whatever those slates are). But I did at least get my nomination ballot in this year, something I didn't do last year. I meant this as much a reminder to others as anything else. Like I said, I didn't nominate at all last year, and was thus part of the problem with how the slates got a foot hold. I said I wouldn't do that again this year, and I'm glad I followed through on that.
Now that I was done making at least my initial choices, I checked to see what the slates had. And even outside of the dramatic categories I have a couple that line up with there lists. So, that is what it is, but at least it wasn't a slate, it was a nomination here or there, with plenty of room for others to also fill in the rest of the list.
Sorry, that didn't answer your question EJ, but I really don't have much else to add to those categories.
In case anyone's wondering, the Pups are back this year.The Sads to their credit put out a list with more items than voters have nomination slots, so it technically isn't a slate, but they blew any good will they might've engendered by (A) waiting until the middle of March to publish the list, ensuring that no one has time to actually read the nominations, and (B) not only refusing to remove authors who want nothing to do with the Puppy movement, but posting screeds about how anyone who wants off the list is insulting their fans and is being intimidated by evil liberals.
The Rabids are doing pretty much the same, except VD makes no pretense about his list being a slate, and he's going for a scorched earth approach by going out of his way to include anti-Puppy authors, tainting any nomination they receive.
I think it's overstating it to say that no one has time to read from the Sad Puppies recommendations list. The only category this could realistically apply to is Novel. The short fiction lists are easily tackled and I've made use of them, and it takes a very short time investment to look at the artist categories as well. I keep up with GRRMartin's Not a Blog and of all the commentary about the Hugo disruption that I've read his was among the thoughts I most generally agree with. He has stated that you shouldn't vote against a work or a nominee simply because it was endorsed by one of these groups, and I wholeheartedly agree with that.
All that aside, my hope for this thread was to be able to trade suggestions of possible nominees. Which is in my humble opinion the best way to shore up the low numbers of votes, and make the whole process less manipulatable. I don't see any need for secrecy so I'm going to share my updated ballot today. Just need a few minutes to get it together.
Novel:"The Fifth Season" - N. K. Jemison
"The Traitor Baru Cormorant" - Seth Dickinson
"Beyond Redemption" - Michael R. Fletcher
"Uprooted" - Naomi Novik
"The Mechanical" - Ian Tregellis
Novella:
"The Sorcerer of the Wildeeps" - Kai Ashante Wilson
"The New Mother" - Eugene Fischer
"Binti" - Nnedi Okorafor
"The Four Thousand, The Eight Hundred" - Greg Egan
Novelette:
The Ladies' Aquatic Gardening Society - Henry Lien
So Much Cooking - Naomi Kritzer
Botanica Veneris:Thirteen Papercuts - Ian McDonald (Old Venus)
Short Story:
Damage - David D. Levine
Madeleine - Amal el-Mohtar
Please Undo This Hurt- Seth Dickenson
Cat Pictures Please - Naomi Kritzer
Today I am Paul - Martin L Shoemaker
Best Related Work
Lois McMaster Bujold (Modern Masters of Science Fiction) -Edward James
John W. Campbell Award
Becky Chambers - The Long Way to a Small Angry Planet
Scott Hawkins - The Library at Mount Char
Kelly Robson - The Waters of Versailles
Andy Weir - The Martian
Alyssa Wong - Hungry Daughters of Starving Mothers
I have some votes in the other categories, but nothing that is really worth discussing or that might be of much interest for people looking for suggestions to fill out their own ballot at this late of date.
If anyone knows of any promising Novelettes let me know. (don't bother suggesting the Nebula list though I've already read those).
E.J. Xavier wrote: "I think it's overstating it to say that no one has time to read from the Sad Puppies recommendations list. The only category this could realistically apply to is Novel. The short fiction lists are ..."Assuming the novella nominations are on the low end of the spectrum, five titles would add up to about 90,000 words, which is equivalent to a moderate sized novel by itself. The short story and novelette categories combined probably come close. When you combine that with five titles for the novel category, that means the Rabids would have to read seven books worth of material in a single month if they're going to nominate honestly and not just do what VD tells them to. It's not impossible, but it's a real stretch for most people.
The Sads are even more extreme, with ten titles listed in some categories.
All that aside, my hope for this thread was to be able to trade suggestions of possible nominees.
For Best Graphic Story, everyone should check out Duty After School. It's a webcomic about high school students drafted into the military after aliens invade the Earth. The last chapter was published in English in December, so the whole series should be eligible.
Sean wrote: "E.J. Xavier wrote: "I think it's overstating it to say that no one has time to read from the Sad Puppies recommendations list. The only category this could realistically apply to is Novel. The shor..."The Sad Puppy list is a recommended reading list in which literally anyone could add to, and was created openly in comment threads. Anyone could go there for months now and look at the recommendations, and in many ways it's no different than the Hugo Wiki, or the Hugo Spreadsheet. (Both endeavors I contributed to BTW). Their biggest problem was frankly that they didn't take the Wiki approach, and instead relied on one person to collate it all, making it less accessible until that work was done.
I don't agree with the politics of the group or what they did last year, but I see absolutely nothing wrong with them creating a recommendation list or going about it the way they did this time.
I'm frankly concerned that so many anti-puppies seem to be so dedicated to the fight that they haven't taken the time to think about what winning actually looks like. Way more ink spilled discussing what the puppies are up to and very little in favor of promoting voting in the Hugos and recommending award worthy works.
E.J - Are the removing people who ask to be removed? I can certainly see an author not wanting to be associated with the group at all and the honorable thing to do is to remove someone if they ask to be removed. As for anti-puppy sentiment... they created that themselves by being assholes the last 3 years, esp. last year. You reap what you sow and if people distrust them and dislike them at this point because of their past behavior that's on the Puppies.
Rick wrote: "E.J - Are the removing people who ask to be removed? I can certainly see an author not wanting to be associated with the group at all and the honorable thing to do is to remove someone if they ask ..."There is nothing wrong with disliking the Sad Puppies or wanting to distance yourself from them. What I object to is this unhealthy obsession with them. If you don't want the puppies to dominate the Hugos then for F***s sake the way to undermine them is to get more people voting in the Hugos. Not to obsess about every fart and belch that emanates from that website.
And an even worse tactic is to paint even their innocuous actions as evil, even when what they are doing is no different than a half dozen other non-politicized groups. All you're doing is creating a climate where no one wants to put together a recommendation list for fear of getting dragged into this mess. It's counter productive. Even more frustrating is the awful and unfair position you put all the artists in if one of their works actually makes it onto one of those lists. No one should feel they have to turn down a nomination because two people recommended them in a freaking comment thread on Sad Puppies. That's seriously messed up and I sincerely hope that doesn't happen this year.
Now that said, I am politely asking that if you all want to discuss any flavor of puppies that you make a new thread. I would really really like this one to stay on topic, and it's meant to be about what we are reading for the Hugos.
There is nothing wrong with disliking the Sad Puppies or wanting to distance yourself from them. What I object to is this unhealthy obsession with them. If you don't want the puppies to dominate the Hugos then for F***s sake the way to undermine them is to get more people voting in the Hugos. Not to obsess about every fart and belch that emanates from that website. Totally agree. I could comment further, but you're right, it's de-raily.
On topic - have you all seen http://www.rocketstackrank.com/search...? Seems to be a way to try to surface short works for consideration. Might be useful.
I have been using Rocketstackrank and It's been helpful. Though the rankings are hit or miss for me. It's probably unavoidable that these things tend to be overwhelming since there always seem to be far more than I have time to read. One thing I noticed late in the game is on the main ranking list, whenever the title of the story is a link, it means there is a free version of the story on the other end. And the vast majority at this point are free. The site is well worthwhile for that aspect alone.
http://www.rocketstackrank.com/p/2016...
You know it occurred to me while contemplating the "Best Fanzine" category last night, that "Rocket Stack Rank" qualifies. What could be more fannish than that? Perhaps a touch "meta" to give a Hugo to the website that is dedicated to helping you nominate Hugos.... but what the hell. Certainly it's been more helpful to me than most of the usual fan sites have been, and they have definitely helped me reinvigorate my interest in short fiction.I think other nominators should give it serious consideration.
Well it's no more meta then a few years ago a Hugo winners speech was nominated the following year in short Drama.
The Sword and Laser
Books mentioned in this topic
Beyond Redemption (other topics)The Long Way to a Small, Angry Planet (other topics)
Prince of Fools (other topics)
The Liar's Key (other topics)
The Long Way to a Small, Angry Planet (other topics)
More...
Authors mentioned in this topic
R. Scott Bakker (other topics)George R.R. Martin (other topics)
George R.R. Martin (other topics)
Based on the information I can find it looks like nominations are typically due early March. That gives me a solid 2.5 months to start reading up on what's out there, and I'm planning on slanting my reading during this time pretty heavily towards eligible works.
I'm not really interested in lists of eligible works, there are plenty of those already available, and I'll never be able to read everything. Much more interested in earnest recommendations of things people think should be considered and why they think so. If there are other people who are intending on voting I really think it would be fun to have a discussion about what they are considering as well.