Support for Indie Authors discussion

Has this happened to (anyone/everyone) else?
In spite of overall positive reviews (which are admittedly rare anyhow), I have not sold a single copy since July. I've shown myself to be prolific. I've released 4 books within a year. I blog regularly, work with a variety of online groups, at this point, I have no budget for advertising. I know we can't all have our day in the sun, but after 21 years of solid effort, I was expecting... something. I know there's a thread about this. I have studied it, commented a few times, but it seems like I'm getting nowhere. When do you reach that point where you just say enough is enough?

Unfortunately shorter works don't seem to sell as well (unless they are erotica). Out of my 5 short works, I maybe sell 1 or 2 copies a month overall. All I can say is keep on writing, and worry about everything else when you can.

One or two copies a month? I envy you. ;) Don't complain.

If you haven't sold a copy for half a year, I guess that pretty much answers your question. I don't think it will really rocket up unless some miracle happens, so now it's all down to your motivation. Are you happy getting just 5-10 copies per months sold (because I estimate that was the amount you got before July)? Then keep doing what you do. Otherwise, after putting 20 years of work into something and getting a complete void back, I would probably say that this is "enough is enough" point.

I mean, it can happen. Some of my books haven't sold for the first month or two (or if they did, it was some ridiculous number, low two-digit) despite proper marketing. You usually get ups and downs. But six months... nope, never really happened to me.

People have always said that it happens that way - a well-written book with nothing wrong in the cover/blurb department just doesn't take off. And that could be the case with yours. (It might also be the case with mine, which is yet to take off, but I am waiting until book 3 is out to put real effort into the advertising.)

If you've really tried everything possible, maybe it's time to try a new genre. Or take a break from publishing altogether. No sense letting it get you down.

But on the other hand, marketing is hard. Especially for those of us who don't have huge budgets to blow on trying things that might not work. Have you put a lot of time and effort into it? Do you know your covers, blurbs and keywords are all in order? Have you experimented with strategies like free or giveaways or any other marketing you can do on a budget? The thing with self-publishing is you only really fail when you stop trying.

Here's An example of a writer who gave up:

After 3 yrs of trying to become a professional writer, Andy weir gave up in 2002 & wrote as a hobby only: then in 2009, he serialized for free on his website what was to become The Martian.

Giving up professionally does not have to mean giving up writing.

As others on this thread have mentioned maybe a genre switch is in order. I've heard that romance & erotica have voracious readers. Those genres could support your other writing. Scifi, Unfortunately for me, is a hard row to hoe. Fantasy however is a little better.

you need to add more people in your instagram and facebook ccount. when you have enough poeple, you can post your adds to those poeple. I guess it's the only way if you don't have money to advertise.

I have no idea why my books are popular and continue to sell. I never expected to sell any beyond friends and family.

I have seen two things that seem to sell books. That can actually map to bumps in sales numbers.

1) I have a college buddy that is now famous. When he tweeted "Hey my buddy Published a scifi novel! Check it out!" People did.

2) On my blog I do a silly weekly comic about me writing and my cat saying stuff. If it gets lots of hits, my sales go up. But is it cause or effect here?

So just keep writing and beg Oprah to recommend your Book!

You may want to rework the blurb for the 1st in the series. It seems a bit vague. For instance, what does paradise mean to Jendra? And why is she seeking it? Did something bad happen to her? Does she live in hell?

Also, I couldn't tell what age group the book was meant for, but both the cover and blurb indicated a middle grade audience to me. If that's not your intent, then that could be a problem too.

A stronger blurb may draw more people to your 1st book. Once they're hooked on the story, it could also encourage sales for the rest of the series.

You have good books Iffix, I know that isn't the problem. Perhaps a break is in order. I took a break from writing for a month, and it really helped me focus and put my wants into perspective.
Perseverance is key, if you give up no one is going to find you. My advice is to take a step back, and decide from there. A little time, and some space will lead to a clearer head and a decision that doesn't leave you wondering, "What if?"

Comment above deleted for violation of group code of conduct. Offering to assist is fine. Speculating that someone's strategy 'sucks' is not.

It all depends on whether or not you love to write, or have the need to write. If your love for writing depends on success, then at this early stage you may be writing for the wrong reason. If you have other aspects of your life that are more interesting, or need more attention, make those the main part of your life and relegate writing to a hobby. But continue to write. If you stop, success at it becomes impossible. If you do it at least sporadically, when you want to, you run the dire risk of becoming successful somewhere down the line. Without perseverance, there is no success.

Susan wrote: "You may want to rework the blurb for the 1st in the series. It seems a bit vague. For instance, what does paradise mean to Jendra? And why is she seeking it? Did something bad happen to her? Does s..."

E.J. wrote: I do agree that your blurb for Impulse is vague. Everybody wants paradise. It needs something more specific and emotional, and an obstacle that promises conflict."

that is so nice for you two to give specific feedback w/o even a real request.

i love this group.

I'm sorry you feel that way :( Marketing is tricky and what works for one author may not work for another so it's difficult to give specific advice. Have you tried free book days or perhaps having book 1 on perma-free? That has worked for a lot of authors who write series'.

Iffix wrote: "When do you reach that point where you just say enough is enough? "

That is an individual choice. We all define what success means to us, and what we are will to do to try to achieve it. But here's what I have observed: selling books is "hard" only in the sense that winning a lottery is "hard". If our expectation of success are tied to the amount of effort we expend, the chance we will be disappointed is high. So I believe it is not effort that counts (beyond the effort of writing) so much as staying in the game.

Your reviews show that your writing has touched people and made them happy. That is no small accomplishment.

Thanks, Owen. That's why I wanted to try this to begin with. I also appreciate E.J.'s comment. I thought about it. Even if I didn't publish, I would still write. I have a strong desire to know what happens to these characters, even if no one else expresses much desire. It's what I love. I simply wish I could find an audience who loved the stories as much I do, so I could do more of it. :D

Thanks for the other comments. To answer some of these:

No, I will not write erotica EVER. (To avoid giving offense to those who do, I will not state my reasons at length. Suffice it to say, I write what I have a passion for, and I have no desire to write erotica.)

I have done free days, but there has not been any residual result. I haven't even received reviews due to free days, as far as I know. I find free days largely disappointing. (Somehow, I get excited the day they happen, just to see my rankings on Amazon. But afterward, I wonder why I gave away my books to someone who, ye know, probably should have had the courtesy to spend a few bucks?)

I am considering a Good Reads Giveaway, though I would like to know the results of this sort of thing. Does it really help get the word out? And, strange question I suppose, but is it too late to do this for a book that came out eight months ago?

I am willing to consider rewriting my initial blurb. I was under the impression, originally, that giving too much information could actually turn off readers. I'm learning to be more realistic with this, and having done it a few times now, I may have a better angle.

I am considering releasing the first three books in a single volume to appeal to those who read longer fiction. It's true that those who read sci-fi/fantasy find a larger book more appealing. (Of course, my works are primarily YA, so I'm not certain how that will fit in.) I originally released the books in a shorter format to cut some cost, so that those who wanted to see what sort of author I was could do so without a heavy expense, but in reality, this could be hurting my sales because of shipping costs and the failure of KDP to be flexible in pricing.

As far as I have seen, KDP doesn't allow me to give my first book away on perma-free, though I would be willing to consider it, if someone can tell me how.

As stated, I don't really have much of a budget for advertising, so I have been using my personal website with a blog. I have used Twitter, though I haven't seen any beneficial results.

I'm willing to try some additional marketing tricks. I know I broke a number of rules, for example designing my cover artwork myself (with the help of skilled artists, but alone in other ways).

Also, someone up above recommended trying Fantasy. The lines between Sci-Fi and Fantasy have always been blurred in my fiction. I don't write Hard Sci-Fi. I don't think I could, to be entirely honest. I consider my books Intergalactic Fantasy, in that I spend more time with characters and plot and less time with science. I do, however, approach Sci-Fi from much the same way that my mentor Brandon Sanderson does, in that I believe that the fantastical ought to have restrictions, if only to make the plot slightly more realistic.

Finally, @Wisteria, not sure if I read sarcasm in your comment, but I LOVE THIS GROUP too.

I read your first book's description and I couldn't get a sense of 'threat'... I'm not sure if you know what I mean, but there's no feeling of suspense or conflict. I think the description needs some work. Perhaps that would help!

No sarcasm intended.

I self-published my first ebook in late 2013, and most of the downloads were during my free runs, which I expected. I have only one star rating (which is 4 stars, but still) on Goodreads for it, and no written reviews, mainly because the people I know that have read it aren't on Goodreads. I can only assume the rest that downloaded it haven't read it.

To your main point- after about a year I was pretty discouraged. But I shrugged it off- I can't expect anyone to take a chance on me when they could take that money elsewhere and buy an author they know and love. So instead of letting my disappointment get me down, I've been working on other projects. Recently, I've updated the cover of my first story (I too broke the BIG RULE of making my own covers, mainly because I can't afford to pay for it right now. Eventually I'll get there).

I've also started my blog back up, and I've been doing bookish things on Instagram, and I've even posted a story still in the early stages on Wattpad to encourage readers to give me a shot.

I'm hesitant to give you any advice specific to your books since I haven't read them, and clearly I'm in a similar boat, but I can say that I've noticed more interaction from people when I post about what I'm reading, or talk to someone else about what they're reading. I think maybe people seeing what I read helps them better judge how or what I write. But that's my guess; it could be another reason.

I hope you don't give up, though. If you're passionate about your characters, there has to be other people that are, too.

Thanks Rebecca.
And Danielle, I appreciate the feedback. I will take a look at it.

Your books sound interesting, but less from the blurb or cover and more from your website's gallery (gawflings look cool!). I plan to read it later this week.

Awesome, Denae. Thanks for your support. If, after you've done so, you have any suggestions for me, I make it my goal to really listen to my readers.

Its tough and I need to remind myself I didn't do this for the money. Its disheartening when very close friends and family have yet to purchase a copy...or purchase 1 copy to share amongst multiple households! Or ask for a free copy 'you must have a bunch of those don't you?' 'Ummm, no- I have 5 and 4 I sent to reviewers or donated to the local library'.



Oh well....just venting here.

John

Iffix wrote: "Has this happened to (anyone/everyone) else?
In spite of overall positive reviews (which are admittedly rare anyhow), I have not sold a single copy since July. I've shown myself to be prolific. I'v..."

Iffix,
What about other outlets? I'm sure your local paper(s) would love to do a story about a local writer no? That could be good for a sales 'pop'? Maybe donating your book to your local libraries and ask they put you in the 'local' writer section? Donate to book clubs?

John

I just edited it. My point was to say I thought I had sold a ton and I barely made $200 bucks...that's all. Still disheartening

John wrote: "Iffix wrote: "Has this happened to (anyone/everyone) else?
In spite of overall positive reviews (which are admittedly rare anyhow), I have not sold a single copy since July. I've shown myself to be..."

I have done all of this. The newspaper essentially wrote me off. (As it goes being an Independent Author.) I have given a book to the public library, though that didn't help with sales. I am considering donating to the school library, since the series is aimed at middle-graders and young adults, though I'm not certain how the schools will react.

Iffix,

Keep plugging away. I have sent about 300 emails for 2 responses. And 1 writer completely disappeared after I sent him my work. Its just throwing stuff against the wall and seeing what sticks. I can't believe a local Minnesota paper can't find room to promote a local, talented author.

JD

They're interesting that way.

Iffix, hang in there. You are already successful - you wrote 4 books! Not an easy task. I'm still promoting my one book that was self-published two years ago. I'm finally seeing better results, but it has taken a long time. Don't give up, have patience. And keep writing, it's clear that you love it. :)

I am a new author, so I am probably not that knowledgeable. But I am working with twitter and hashtags. I am also looking for bookfairs to attend as an author.

K. wrote: "Iffix, hang in there. You are already successful - you wrote 4 books! Not an easy task. I'm still promoting my one book that was self-published two years ago. I'm finally seeing better results, but..."

got a pretty good and relevant link today on twitter:

https://t.co/NsOjIJlneq

140-char answer:build up ur backlist & don't quit ur day job & it might as well be a decent-paying 1 so go 2 college

Sometimes it's easy to want to give up and throw the towel in, but if you do that, you lose. Just keep in mind that the work you have published should generate residual income for you for the rest of your life, and keep writing. Compound it. I know what it feels like when you try to add nothing to nothing, but that is an insurmountable way to look at it. Change your mind, change your life.

I imagine children are a hard sell. If its not published then its not in book stores which is where the majority of them get their books from. The good news is that people are getting lazier as the years go on but that still doesn't change the fact that the parents are buying the books for them. Adults have the freedom of looking at their kindle and buying with one click. Would you give a child a kindle? You'd look at the bill and realize they had spent hundreds of dollars clicking away, teens are more trust worthy. Kids are always into the latest fad. If its popular at school chances are they need it. Like Goosebumps, absolutely zero marketing but everyone was reading it at school and it caught on. So I imagine if the child would want to read on a kindle or any other platform the parent would show them their options and then buy it for them while shopping online.

Your books look fine on amazon, good covers and the price is fair, the writing looks good. So what's the problem? What you have is a major targeting issue. Lets just say that that age range isn't on social media, 13 years old is the minimum age to get on these kind of sites (not like kids listen, but lets imagine no kids under 13 are on social media.) That already makes it a tough sell. And second, mommy or daddy has to buy it for them. Third of all they aren't consumable types of books (like a 8 page picture book) i'm guessing its in the 8-13 age range which is too old to be read to before they go to bed and too young for them to buy books on their own, online that is. And fourth, its not in bookstores. So what are you left with?

You should be looking for "parents who want to get their children to read more" or "children struggling with reading", "books for 8-13 year olds." Seek those types of groups and target them, as many groups as you can find like that, Facebook groups, online forums, etc. And if you have money, find readers of a similar type of book to yours and target those readers with FB ads. So for example if you wrote a story about a dinosaur theme park. You'd target to Jurassic Park or Michael Crichton readers. Maybe try taking the first book off of KDP and making it free. Its readers you're after right now not money.

Hope this helped. Good luck.

Nothing too extreme happens to be too frustrated about. There are lots of us here, myself included, who sell very little. 0 sales or few sales doesn't make that much of a difference. It's not that it costs you money, as you don't do paid ads.
If you invest terribly lot of efforts in something specific that you don't enjoy, you might as well reconsider that specific activity. Other than that, if you enjoy hanging out in the groups and stuff like that, why should you quit any of these?
I hope you don't mean 21 years spent specifically in promoting the books, right?
I say, you and anyone should align expectation with the reality. Your cumulative effort may pay off one day or not, but if you invest only a reasonable amount of effort in something that you enjoy, then no harm's done really

Thanks for the comments.
I really have to find a way to target the school system. And the only practical way I can see is to take the whole works off the market and target main-stream publishers, though that's a beast in itself.
Considering I have sold less than 40 copies (freebie or otherwise) of any book I've written, I could even suggest I had it beta read with favorable results. (Not sure the publishers will buy that, though.)
I wish I could find an in. I'm not writing erotica, here. A parent could feasibly consider getting this story for their children. A school could feasibly consider buying a copy for their library. I just have to find a way to jump those hoops. (Which, essentially, means I have to take y'all with me! So let's write some killer INDIE FICTION!)

I'm not sure it works this way. I might be wrong, but I think publishers take previously unpublished work, or if you have a proven track record of few K sales, as indie.
If you have overall positive reviews from objective readers plus few fellow writers here, who took a look, say they like your style and concept, content wise you might have no problem at all to go back to beta.
Maybe teenage bloggers, contests aimed at that segment, parental groups and reviewers can add some visibility to your work.
You sound more optimistic now and that's what important-:)
If you find a magic formula though, don't forget to share with us -:)

Wow; 21 years?? Well done you.

These days it's all about your 'online presence'.
Make sure you post on fb and Twitter, about your everyday life as well so it's not just plugging your books.

You can try blogging to help drive traffic to your website too?

Romance is a really tough genre actually; it's flooded with people. I'm struggling myself to get a foothold in the great sea of smut. So unless you want to write about it then don't. It's really not an 'easy win'.

Publishers these days like to see you have a social media presence, and have at least 2k followers on Twitter. :-/

You could try getting onto a fb book launch as an author takeover? Find authors in your genre. They will have a book launch and you can piggy back for 30mins/1hr to have your tuppence worth.

Or for very little money you can create a Twitter ad?
Wise use of #s is a bonus.

Join groups who do non-reciprocal reviews?

I have to spend an awful lot of time online trying to make contacts, get 'my name out there'. Slowly but surely it helps.

Write because you love it. No other reason.
If you no longer love it take a break.

Love & light to you.
xx

"Write because you love it. "
Yes. Write because you cannot imagine not writing. Everything else is inconsequential.