The Mystery, Crime, and Thriller Group discussion

This will be the group read thread for The Last Detective by Peter Lovesey. This is the first book in the Peter Diamond mystery series, a new series for me. Suzy will be your moderator. Enjoy the book and the discussions.

I plan to read this.

Hello everyone - I'm excited that my nomination was chosen for Jan/Feb group read. I suggested this book because a very good mystery-loving friend said it was one of her top reads in 2015. I have not read any of the 15 Peter Diamond books and am looking forward to reading and discussing this one.

In looking at Peter Lovesey's author page it says: His best-known series characters are Sergeant Cribb, a Victorian-era police detective based in London, and Peter Diamond, a modern-day police detective in Bath. Lovesey's novels and stories mainly fall into the category of entertaining puzzlers in the "Golden Age" tradition of mystery writing.

I'm glad to be starting with the first in a series. For discussion purposes, I'd like to suggest using a spoiler alert if your comment might spoil things for those who have not yet finished. And since I imagine many might have read more Peter Diamond books, I think it would be great to make comments about the series being careful to not give any crucial points away. Read on!!

Is this discussion for after the book has been read or are you doing it by chapters, ex. Chapter 1-10 discussion?

Denise wrote: "Is this discussion for after the book has been read or are you doing it by chapters, ex. Chapter 1-10 discussion?"

Here's my thinking, but Bill, can you weigh in on this also? I think we can make comments as we read although we typically don't do chapter discussions in this group. I will occasionally pose questions as well, as I read the book.

I'm trying to remember the protocol from last time I moderated. Bill?

There isn't any set format, Suzy, but I don't think we need to do chapter discussions, especially since I think those that choose to read the story will tend to start at different times. It's more just an opportunity to provide your thoughts as you get into the book and any other discussions on themes, the author, etc. I hope that helps. And to reiterate what Suzy said earlier, please try to remember to use spoilers if you are discussing specific events. If you're not sure how to do spoilers, check just above the comment box, right side where it says (some html is ok)... that shows how to do spoilers.. Enjoy!

I've read this and several others in this wonderful series and have a few more on the bookshelves.

I read this book and it hooked me on the series. I've read a number in the series, not necessarily in order. And I have more on my shelf yet to read.

Lovesey also was the creator of the television show Rosemary and Thyme - Netflix.

Jan and Donna - we would love to hear your thoughts about this book as the discussion proceeds.

@Jan - I did not know this about Rosemary and Thyme. I have watched that on PBS over the years as well as Netflix.

Yes, I had to look up what TV series he worked on and it was Rosemary and Thyme. Also, the BBC did some TV shows of his Det. Cribb series. I looked on my shelf for my copy of The Last Detective and I must have given it on to someone but I have 2 more in the series I haven't read so I started Cop to Corpse this afternoon.

I don't have this book anymore. I will try to get back to reading Cop To Corpse on my Kindle.

One of my favorites so far is Bloodhounds, this is an homage to John Dickson Carr's The Three Coffins (The Hollow Men).

Bloodhounds was good. It has a local book group involved in solving the crime and I read it with my in person book group. We had a lot of fun with that.

Bill wrote: "This will be the group read thread for The Last Detective by Peter Lovesey. This is the first book in the Peter Diamond myster..."

I just ordered the book! Very excited for a new (to me) author

I was just sitting here typing a question to the group . . . "Is anyone listening to this?" or "Has anyone listened?". I am listening starting today - just got the book from Overdrive. (I have at least one fellow, listener, Sherry!)

I look forward to discussing with first time readers of Peter Diamond mysteries, like myself, as well as those who already know and like the series.

For those that have read these books, what are the things you like best about the series? (without giving anything away, of course.)

Sherry wrote: "Hi Suzy! This will be my 3rd overdrive audio book. I really enjoy them."

I also enjoy audiobooks and am so happy my library subscribes to Overdrive. Indeed, I'm an audiobook maniac! Since I am such a slow reader, I can experience many more books than I otherwise might by listening. (Welcome to Goodreads, Sherry.)

I'm about a third of the way through and am enjoying this book. I can see a long line of Peter Lovesey's Peter Diamond books in my future.

I like how he reveals early on why Diamond is "The Last Detective," the way he introduces the crime, how he explains who works on the crime and what they do before the lead detective shows up. I found it interesting what he did with Part 2 - which I am sure will be a discussion topic so I won't say yet!

I'm at approximately the same spot. Also found the change at part 2 very interesting.

I'm very early in the book, having listened to only about 5% but I must say I'm immediately drawn in. Like Denise I liked finding out why the book is called The Last Detective. I especially like the challenge of a murder with few to no clues; the repartee between Diamond and Jack Merlin, the medical examiner, who sees this as an interesting challenge that could make their careers; the dynamics of old-school index-card-loving Diamond and the younger set who are, as he sees it, in love with their computers - ah, I remember those days.

As a listener, I am also drawn in by Simon Prebble whom I'm not sure I've heard before. He has many of the qualities I appreciate in a narrator.

I agree Suzi. It's a very nice narration. I like the old fashioned approach too. I'm not very far either.

I plan to read this, which will be my first in a group discussion

Karl wrote: "I plan to read this, which will be my first in a group discussion"

Look forward to being part of your inaugural group discussion and to hearing your thoughts, Karl!

I'm really enjoying this book. The POV changes make things interesting and the switch is smooth. There's a nice little bonus. There are fun facts about Jane Austen that I never knew.

I think I have to finish the book to decide if the interesting POV changes were a benefit or a negative. So far the changes in POV seem beneficial but there may be more - I'm not done! I'll probably finish the book today (looking at the 2 feet of snow outside). There was also a bit of time I didn't like Diamond thinking he was arrogant and pompous but then there was a change-up and I like him again.

I like the change in POV and was wondering what Lovesey's intent was in structuring the book in this way.I am only about 30% through the book, starting part 3 where Diamond and his sidekick are questioning the "chief witness". It makes me curious if we will get another POV inserted. (view spoiler)[I like that hearing the husband's POV sowed seeds of doubt about the murdered wife. Was she victim or perpetrator? It makes me wonder if they will find a diary of the wife's where we hear her POV ala Gone Girl. (hide spoiler)]

Anyone else finding it interesting that this was written in the era before heavy use of technology? No cell phones, budding use of computers and DNA, etc. I still like the tension created between old-school Diamond and, seemingly, the rest of the force although I agree that Diamond can come off as arrogant about the traditional approaches. But maybe we all know situations/people like this from our own lives.

I also like the Jane Austen theme in the backdrop.

Denise wrote: "I think I have to finish the book to decide if the interesting POV changes were a benefit or a negative. So far the changes in POV seem beneficial but there may be more - I'm not done! I'll probabl..."

A great day to snug in if you're on the east coast! Stay warm and safe, Denise.

Donna wrote: "Bloodhounds was good. It has a local book group involved in solving the crime and I read it with my in person book group. We had a lot of fun with that."

That sounds fun! I already like this first book enough to know I will go further in the series. You're whetting my appetite for more, Donna!

Suzy wrote: "Anyone else finding it interesting that this was written in the era before heavy use of technology? No cell phones, budding use of computers and DNA, etc. I still like the tension created between old-school Diamond and, seemingly, the rest of the force although I agree that Diamond can come off as arrogant about the traditional approaches. But maybe we all know situations/people like this from our own lives."
The arrogance I was referring to was not about the technology but about the other detectives and interrogation methods. But, yes I've read other books where the emerging technology puts the more senior detectives on a somewhat defensive posture and their mingled uncertainly, perhaps fear of not being techno savvy, causes all sorts of conflicts. I'm thinking of Ian Rankin's Inspector Rebus series and Peter Robinson's Inspector Banks series.

This happens with Diamond too and does make him arrogant at times - but this kind of arrogance didn't bother me because I figured it was from uncertainly and fear of looking foolish.

One scene is such a classic -and its general so doesn't require a spoiler alert - when Diamond asks for reports on door-to-door interviewing and refers to the fact the computers should be spitting out the reports someone points out to him they have to be typed into the computer. No one has had time to make their notes into a computer report but he has a written report to use for their meeting. I remember this kind of thing happening in real life. Sometimes computers were not the fastest way to communicate, though that is now changing with each generation of technology.

I enjoy Sue Grafton's Kinsey Milhone series because she is purposely keeping it in the 1980s era and computers are just emerging and are very basic. It seems so low key and slow. I've kept my mobile phone from the 80s in the small museum of my life and its the size of about 12 cell phones, laid out and piled up.

Suzy wrote: A great day to snug in if you're on the east coast! Stay warm and safe, Denise. "

Thank you Suzy!

Denise wrote: "Suzy wrote: "Anyone else finding it interesting that this was written in the era before heavy use of technology? No cell phones, budding use of computers and DNA, etc. I still like the tension crea..."

I agree about Diamond's arrogance toward the other detectives as well as witnesses/suspects and his strong-arm interrogation techniques. Looks like he is from the school of deciding who is the criminal early on then forcing it to be true. But seems to be backfiring on him as far as I can tell now that I'm 50% through the book.

I'm starting the novel today! It is completely a new series for me.

aPriL does feral sometimes wrote: "I'm starting the novel today! It is completely a new series for me."

Look forward to your comments, April. Looks like several of us are enjoying this so far . . . also a first time series for many of us.

Ah, another change in POV but not the one I was expecting!

Suzy wrote: "Ah, another change in POV but not the one I was expecting!"

Yes, I have finished the book and wonder why some POVs were written while at least one, to me, important one was not. No spoilers but hope to discuss later.

I remember y2k. That's when I learned the depth of our dependence on computers. They're a blessing and a curse. Kids are talking in acronyms. I hope they can still spell. Computers advance us and dumb us down at the same time.

Sherry wrote: "I remember y2k. That's when I learned the depth of our dependence on computers. They're a blessing and a curse. Kids are talking in acronyms. I hope they can still spell. Computers advance us and d..."

I also remember y2k and what it taught us about computers, but also about human nature. And as is portrayed in this story, technology has its benefits, but doesn't cancel out human ingenuity.

Denise wrote: "Suzy wrote: "Ah, another change in POV but not the one I was expecting!"

Yes, I have finished the book and wonder why some POVs were written while at least one, to me, important one was not. No sp..."

I am on the 2nd change of POV and have been wondering if there are more. I have concluded that each of these first person narratives are in service of telling their story to the police . . . and to us. I like the way these sections offer clues (red herrings, perhaps) and can sow the seeds of doubt in the reader about the reliability of their story. So far I like the alternating of 3rd and 1st person narratives as a way to build interest and tension.

I have finished the novel and for the most part, it was very entertaining. For some reason, I was reminded of an older style of English mysteries made famous by Agatha Christie while reading this, although I feel Lovesey has his tongue firmly in his cheek, knowingly.

The ending was an interesting twist, but I thought it was handled very oddly. (view spoiler)[Peter Diamond treated Matthew as if he were simply a misguided high-spirited boy who has lost his way despite the fact he smothered a women. Diamond also speaks to Matthew feeling kindly towards him, after Matthew had kicked him in his genitals, after he catches Matthew smoking in his hospital bed after he had purposely lied about being injured which led to Diamond quitting.

I can see how early in the plot Diamond sees Matthew as high-spirited likeable hellion, since he muses Matthew is a bit like Diamond was at his age, but I cannot agree with the author or Diamond, by the time it is revealed Matthew is the killer that he is a victim of his teenage confusion! Even in 1991 people know a teenage killer is bad news and certain to kill a lot more times if given the chance. Instead, Diamond wants to let him go off to America without telling anyone, although he hopes Matthew will confess and do 'the right thing'. This ending was just wrong! (hide spoiler)]

However, even though I thought the ending peculiar I intend to give this four stars when I write a review.

I just finished Cop To Corpse which is much later in the series and Diamond is still struggling with technology!

Donna wrote: "I just finished Cop To Corpse which is much later in the series and Diamond is still struggling with technology!"

Haha he even has issues with microwave ovens!

Donna wrote: "I just finished Cop To Corpse which is much later in the series and Diamond is still struggling with technology!"

This does not surprise me! Must be one of the ongoing themes that make Diamond who he is.

However, it does show that not everything can be solved by technology.

What I most liked about the book was the “golden age” English mystery resemblance, Diamond in the first part of the book, the point of view changes, and the things I mentioned in earlier posts. I thought one more point of view would have enhanced the story – that of the victim.

I didn’t like (view spoiler)[ that Diamond seemed like a completely different person at the end of the book. While its true a Santa Claus and a bartender can’t compare to the behavior of a detective, I just didn’t buy the transition as portrayed. Also, what he thought about the murderer seemed out of sync with his character. Why think the Matthew should go somewhere where he can’t be extradited? That doesn’t fit with the type he was portrayed as in the beginning of the book. I didn’t like the ending because of all the loose ends. I don’t need a happily ever after ending but I like to know what major things happen – does Diamond get back on the force? What happens to Matthew? These aren’t minor threads and I would have enjoyed it much more had they been answered. (hide spoiler)]

I would have given 3 1/2 stars had I been able to, but I gave it 4 stars as I am interested and entertained enough to continue with the series.

Donna wrote: "However, it does show that not everything can be solved by technology."

True. Person to person will always prevail in all areas of life in my own humble opinion.

Finished reading "The Last Detective"!
I discovered this book through the Mystery group challenge, and I was really impressed. I virtually fell in love with detective Diamond, as he reminds me of others like Maigret, Frost, and even Poirot. Both are from the "Old School", not totally trusting modern forensics means, but using their brain too.
They don't jump on a conclusion without deeply investigating every single other possibility. Red hearings and new evidences bring several developments throughout the book, so that the reader can't wait for next chapter. And I can't wait for next book in this serie! Thanks to the Mystery group!

I just finished the audio version of this and really liked it, with some reservations. I will likely give it 3 1/2 stars.
- I liked how Lovesey draws out different aspects of Diamond's character over the course of the book. I first thought I didn't like him because of his seeming strong-arm approach and arrogance, but he was more multi-dimensional than initially portrayed.
- I liked that twice in the book Lovesey changed from 3rd person to 1st giving the main suspects a chance to tell their story. As Denise mentioned, I would have liked to hear the victim's story (maybe through a diary?).
- The setting in Bath and the Jane Austen exhibit added interest. It tickled me when the defending attorney used Sense & Sensibility and Pride & Prejudice to make some points. :)
- In many mysteries I read, there are heart-pounding/harrowing situations where the detective is in peril. I sort of decided this wasn't one of those types of books, but then Lovesey pops one of these situations on us late in the book adding some energy to the story.

On the other hand, like others, I wasn't quite satisfied with the ending. I liked how the things discovered toward the end made the overall story more interesting, but it seemed to come at us in a rush.
(view spoiler)[ - I feel like Denise, that the transformation of Diamond seemed too dramatic and unrealistic. Although it does make me want to read the next book to see how he evolves and whether he goes back to the police force!
- I guessed who the murderer was about 60% of the way through the book, but then doubted myself with the whole Andy/drug dealer plot. I guess there are pluses and minuses to that. Lovesey kept me guessing right up to the end even though I had decided it was Matthew who had killed our victim.
- I didn't particularly like how Diamond in heroic fashion figured this all out after he left the police force and became Santa/bartender. Made his former colleagues look inept. I wondered if it could have been better developed if he had stayed.
- I agree with others, his casual attitude about Matthew at the end didn't seem in sync with who Diamond is. For some reason, though,I think Matthew will confess to the police. (hide spoiler)]

Oh, and I want to give a shout out to Simon Prebble, the audio narrator. He really brought this to life for me. I already have the audio of the next Diamond book on order from my library!

Suzy wrote: "I just finished the audio version of this and really liked it, with some reservations. I will likely give it 3 1/2 stars.
- I liked how Lovesey draws out different aspects of Diamond's character o..."

I think that's what I loved most about this book, too! The setting and the Austen theme throughout. I really should pick up the next book in the series. I've been binging on Midsomer Murders and Lovejoy, and that's what this book reminded me of a little.

Eve wrote: "Suzy wrote: "I just finished the audio version of this and really liked it, with some reservations. I will likely give it 3 1/2 stars.
- I liked how Lovesey draws out different aspects of Diamond'..."

Oh, you're right about this being like Midsomer Murders! Also maybe a little like Inspector Lewis. I'm not familiar with Lovejoy, so I will have to look it up. If you didn't see it, someone commented very early in this thread that Lovesey wrote the Rosemary and Thyme mysteries.

I Just finished the audiobook and I enjoyed it immensely. It hard to believe that I missed this series of books and I will definitely read more.
Simon Prebble's narration was "spot on" especially with the changes in POV.

I really liked the narrator too. I was really into this book until the end. I can't make the spoiler symbols work on my tblet for some reason. I can't say why the ending disappointed me which is frustrating.

aPriL does feral sometimes wrote: "I have finished the novel and for the most part, it was very entertaining. For some reason, I was reminded of an older style of English mysteries made famous by Agatha Christie while reading this, ..."

I agree about the ending. This would have
been a 4 star for me but I have other issues with the ending plus what you said. I gave it 3.