Support for Indie Authors discussion

Here's a trick that I do. I convert it to a PDF and send it to my kindle to read like a regular book from start to finish. This way, I have to read without editing. It gives you a different perspective of flow. If you read it where you're editing, you're stopping your reading to make corrections.

Vincent wrote: "Here's a trick that I do. I convert it to a PDF and send it to my kindle to read like a regular book from start to finish. This way, I have to read without editing. It gives you a different perspec..."

This is a great idea! Thanks for sharing!

By the time I'm at "final editing," The book has had at least one chapter by chapter pass through my writers group, and preferably, a couple of beta reads.
I've already done a consistency edit, (paying particular attention to hyphenated words, characters, events and objects that appear a few or several times in the ms ), a plot hole edit, and a redundancy edit. I go back over the ms several times to make sure that the things my characters decided for me along the way have meshed with everything else. I use Hemingway during the rewrite/editing process to simplify where I feel it's necessary and to cut adverbs. My style is more complex than the Hemingway app likes--it's my style, though. It stays, unless I think a sentence is overly complicated. And I use Natural Reader.
For the final edit, I do one more computer-based spell and grammar check (and I ignore many of Word's grammar suggestions as I find them incorrect). I should add here that I was a professional editor. Then I use Natural Reader one more time to go through the book. I am amazed at how much I find.
Then, when I think I'm done and there's not a typo left alive, I get a hard copy proof and mark it up.
I don't use a professional editor, because I have been one. But I am aware that I will be biased as to style. That's why I rely on my writers' group and beta readers early and often in the writing/rewriting/editing process.

Here's what I do.

I write a lot of crap.

I read it and take the crappiest of the crap out.

I add some more crap.

I read it and take the crappiest of the crap out.

I repeat until I feel the story isn't super embarrassing.

Like several mentioned, there is a content editing pass (or checking for consistency and plot holes). This should come first (so that grammar fixes don't get unfixed while I'm fixing the fact that my villain entered the scene twice).
Oh, and I set aside the book for a while (maybe a month or two) so that I can look at it with fresh eyes.
I print several proof copies to beg friends to read for me (still content level editing).
Finally, I take a line editing pass. I like the Hemingwayapp, but I like prowritingaid better.

It's hard to say how many times I edit a book. I'm sure I went through my first novel about a hundred times. Almost no word is still the same.

Dwayne wrote: "Here's what I do. I write a lot of crap. I read it and take the crappiest of the crap out. I add some more crap. I read it and take the crappiest of the crap out. I repeat until I feel the story isn't super embarrassing."

That sounds about right to me. I refuse to obsess over a single word choice, or edit ten times (let alone a hundred, like Denae). Because (having read so much in this group) I doubt that more than ten people will even read my book (and likely none of them will pay for it), I have simply decided there will be a reasonable limit to the tediousness of unlimited editing. My goals are to get the story right, eliminate obvious problems, eliminate less obvious problems, eliminate spelling and grammar and factual errors. That's four edits to Beta. That seems about right to me.

If only perfect will do, you will never publish your book. Obsessive editing can become a variant of writer's block. At some point, you decide "that's good enough." Where that point lies is always an individual decision.

Charles wrote: "If only perfect will do, you will never publish your book. Obsessive editing can become a variant of writer's block..."

Agreed. When I was much younger with only dreams of being published, I would obsess over editing to the point that I'd end up editing out everything that made the story edgy, special, rough, raw... and would end up with some bland thing that was nothing like the original idea. I could not attempt to publish it any longer as there was no longer anything special about it. And when I tried putting the special stuff back in, it felt forced. Once the magic is gone, it's gone.

One of the most crucial parts of editing is to know when you've done enough.

Dwayne wrote: "Charles wrote: "If only perfect will do, you will never publish your book. Obsessive editing can become a variant of writer's block..."

Agreed. When I was much younger with only dreams of being pu..."

Amen

I'm editing my first novel and expect to publish soon, this summer.

I edit and correct as I write so it takes time, but by the end it is a complete first version, then let it set, then go back and edit as needed and take physical notes. I don't read aloud or listen to auto-read, also don't use Scrivener or spreadsheet. Some chapters were written out long hand and incorporated.

Before the novel, I wrote short stories so I'm used to editing my own work.

Scouting now for a cover! :)

I send off for proofs and do a hard copy edit (also to check if my covers aligned correctly. 3d space isn't absolute ). I check along my ecopy and make my final adjustments. it's a tad tedious but it saves me money lolz

I keep a list of things to be changed or checked, add new items as I think of them and delete them when they are done.

I both peer minutely at sentences and speed-read for flow.

I change the font several times. It's amazing how you can see what you expect to see until a tiny visual change forces the brain to read it again.

I edit until I reach the "plateau". This is the point where the Ms is no longer going uphill in quality but is going around in circles at one level. I know this has happened when I come back to an edit and want to change something back to the previous version.

Vincent wrote: "Here's a trick that I do. I convert it to a PDF and send it to my kindle to read like a regular book from start to finish. This way, I have to read without editing. It gives you a different perspec..."

Good one!

While I use my spellcheck, I also try to weed out redundant words by entering certain words to see how many times they appear in my document. When I start a new chapter, I always go back to reread what lies before my new writing session to check flow, content, grammar, etc. It is an ongoing process. Then, when the entire document is finished, as in the case of the novel I recently submitted for publication--I read it in its entirety several more times before I was satisfied.

How does everyone choose Beta readers? I've been relying on friends and family, but I have a series of six books and I'm wondering if I should step outside my circle and get a fresh opinion. Since I interact with them all the time, I realize I am filling in storyline or character information that an unknown reader won't have access to. My beta readers do catch a few mistakes, but I do all of the other edits myself. Great tips on resources, I'm looking forward to using them.

Suzy wrote: "How does everyone choose Beta readers?"

I am looking for a few Beta readers, so I will be very interested in this!

It depends:

For literary editing, I check for common writing mistakes such as Mary-Sue, discussing the story instead of telling it and overall realism.

For linguistic editing, I prefer someone with a degree in linguistics do it.

Speaking as an editor.

As an author, I first write a draft just to get the story out there. then on the second draft, I go over it and fix whatever grammar errors I can find while expanding the plot. Then I give it to a friend and do a third draft. Last, I submit it to a professional editor, then a linguistic one.

Amit wrote: "It depends:

For literary editing, I check for common writing mistakes such as Mary-Sue..."

The Mary-Sue problem is one thing I'm thankful that I don't have to worry about. I've even been complimented on my ability to come up with off-the-wall but pronounceable names, and I usually do it on the fly, without waiting for inspiration later. When I'm writing I pounce on every opportunity for a new name. Do I ever use bland names? Sure, when it fits the character--like Dr. Paul Werner for a pompous psyche-reader--but I love the crazy ones.