Nature Literature discussion

Please add your comments about The Devil's Cormorant - our May 2016 Book of the Month - here.

Hi Everyone:
I just received my copy two days ago. I'm really looking forward to reading and discussing this book. Anybody else planning on joining me?


Sher

I am. My copy of the book arrived a couple of days ago, so I'm ready. I'm new to the group and haven't done a lot of nature/environmental reading, but I'm very interested in it and am looking forward to reading and learning with everyone.

Sharon wrote: "I am. My copy of the book arrived a couple of days ago, so I'm ready. I'm new to the group and haven't done a lot of nature/environmental reading, but I'm very interested in it and am looking forwa..."

Hi Sharon- That's great. This genre is pretty new to me also though I am quite the reader, but mostly I have read in the humanities and not nature. So glad you will be joining us.

Sher wrote: "Sharon wrote: "I am. My copy of the book arrived a couple of days ago, so I'm ready. I'm new to the group and haven't done a lot of nature/environmental reading, but I'm very interested in it and a..."

Thanks Sher!

Hello Everyone- I will be leading the discussion this month, since I nominated the book, and I wanted to start off by asking if you have any memories of or experience with cormorants?


For me- when I lived in SE Alaska we saw them perched on buoys and flying by just over the the water in the Inside Passage at breakneck speed. Black arrows.

In the Columbia River Basin where I live now, I can only see them if I go down to the river. Sometimes in groups sometimes perched alone in a tree along the banks of the Columbia River. Something primitive about them like turkey vultures; I guess with that feeling of ancient-ness comes a sense of mystery.

I get the idea from the introduction in our book that this a bird of "contrasts." Admired, reviled, used, and destroyed. Reminds me of the common rock dove.

The first chapter is about cormorants being used by fishermen to help them catch fish.

Here is a clip from a documentary made about a man in China.
https://youtu.be/N7l6Pe0CKsg

And a 6 min. clip from Japan
https://youtu.be/dkomj5q-bsg

I don't recall ever seeing a cormorant before, probably because I live inland in the Midwest. But I started the book yesterday, and they seem fascinating!

Disclaimer: I haven't started the book yet. I have seen cormorants, though. They are such fascinating and misunderstood birds. They have the most beautiful aquamarine eyes and they sound like dinosaurs. They are very confiding with humans and you can often observe them up close. They spread their wings to the morning sun to warm up, a method I have adapted myself when out birding.

Sharon wrote: "I don't recall ever seeing a cormorant before, probably because I live inland in the Midwest. But I started the book yesterday, and they seem fascinating!"

Hi Sharon- well, it will be fun to find out what you found most interesting... about these birds after you have finished reading this book, and, who knows you might travel some time just to see them. :)

Karen wrote: "Disclaimer: I haven't started the book yet. I have seen cormorants, though. They are such fascinating and misunderstood birds. They have the most beautiful aquamarine eyes and they sound like dinos..."

Thanks for your comments Karen- I did not know about their eyes, and I have never been close to them before, so that was an interesting tidbit about them (at least the birds you have known allowing people close) . Also new to me. I need to look at their eyes.

Good morning! I am curious how you have found Chapter One--for me it seems to demonstrate the tension and complexities of man's relationship with the cormorant.

Yamashita argues the Japanese method of cormorant keeping is more humane or "more equal " than the Chinese method (16 King).

Any thoughts about this?

Anything strike you about using cormorants for fishing?

King also suggested it is like using dogs for hunting. I have a lot of experience with this, and with dogs it is a true partnership. The dogs do find, point, and retrieve the birds, and they don't eat the birds, though that would be their natural instinct. The dog gently gives the bird to the hunter. Later the hunter gives the dog food and shelter.

I had a variety of conflicting impressions and emotions while I read chapter one.

Hi everyone! I am very curious about this book, but I can't read it right now (I'm reading about wolves in this period and this is quite necessary to me). By the way, I will read all your comments and I want to share my cormorant experience:

i live in Rome and there are few cormorants living here on the Tiber (Tevere, our river), even if I am quite disgusted by the quality of its water. I can observe them during the winter, usually they migrate in spring, and I am trying to assess if they have actually left or if they are resident individuals.

I studied something about Cormorants' zoology and ethology (maybe you will find these facts in the book, so I am going to put a spoiler alert):
(view spoiler)[
The peculiarity of this bird is the lack of uropygial gland, the one that produces the oil the bird spreads on his feathers while preening. So cormorants' feathers are not waterproof, even they actually feed underwater. So after their feeding sessions, they have to stay in the sunlight, with wings wide open, in order to dry off. I simply love this behaviour because I feel empathy for an aquatic bird that is not "so" aquatic. :D

The funniest of them all is Galapagos' Cormorant: their wing are very little (they actually don't fly), but they mantain their dry-off behaviour, so after diving they stay in the sun with those moulting and short wings wide open. Impossible not to love them!!
(hide spoiler)]

Sher wrote: "The first chapter is about cormorants being used by fishermen to help them catch fish.

Here is a clip from a documentary made about a man in China.
https://youtu.be/N7l6Pe0CKsg

And a 6 min. clip ..."

Basho wrote a haiku about being on a cormorant boat and being overwhelmed with sadness.

I have not yet received my copy. Looking forward to it.

Ray wrote: "I have not yet received my copy. Looking forward to it." That is great Ray- it will be good to have you join us!

In the intro or first chapter, I can't recall, there is at least one section of Basho haikus. Made me think of our time with Basho a few months back.

I will be very interested to talk with you about some of the tensions within this topic!

Sher

Kikyosan wrote: "Hi everyone! I am very curious about this book, but I can't read it right now (I'm reading about wolves in this period and this is quite necessary to me). By the way, I will read all your comments ..."
Hello Kikyosan:
Thanks for the information; so far I have not come across it in the book. I wondered about the way they spread their wings to dry or warm up. I think turkey vulture have a similar behavior.

Here is a link for the Galapagos Cormorant images in case folks would like to look. Cutie.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Galap...

Hello! and thanks for your appreciation!
I didn't know Basho included cormants in his haikus, this is quite meaningful. I will re-read my collection of haikus to find them, if included. :D

Ray wrote: "I have not yet received my copy. Looking forward to it."

Ray:
I am about 75 pages in at this point, and I'm just getting the idea of why the book is titled the Devil's Cormorant. What is your experience with cormorants? Have you been neutral on these birds all along, or have you had some strong feelings about them in some way?

I've looked back at my impressions. In SE Alaska, as I mentioned, we saw them often on the buoys or flying swiftly and low across the inland channel. I noticed cormorants more than gulls, and I felt they were strange in some way. And, I recall something in the news about fishermen on the Columbia River being angry at these birds, because they felt the cormorants were stealing their fish. Of course fishermen also were having troubles with sea lions at the time too.

Sher

I'm only 60 or so pages in and this book is way more interesting than I thought it would be before beginning it. I have no real experiences with the birds other than seeing them here and there. The anhinga is more common around here and it's hard to distinguish them from afar. The 2 vastly different perspectives on the birds found in chapter 1 and 2 was a great way to start off the book. I was aware of cormorant fishing but do not remember hearing of the incident detailed in the 2nd chapter.

I'm on page 86, and much to my surprise, I read that the Cincinnati Zoo is the only zoo in the world that has a blue-eyed shag. According to the book, they also have a pair of double-crested cormorants. I live close to Cincinnati, so I'm planning to visit the zoo very soon. I'll share pictures (if that can be done here) when I do.

Of course, Sharon - please feel free to add pictures. If you can't for some technical reason, please let me know and I'll see what our options are.

~Becky

Sharon wrote: "I'm on page 86, and much to my surprise, I read that the Cincinnati Zoo is the only zoo in the world that has a blue-eyed shag. According to the book, they also have a pair of double-crested cormor..."

It is fabulous zoo.

Sharon wrote: "I'm on page 86, and much to my surprise, I read that the Cincinnati Zoo is the only zoo in the world that has a blue-eyed shag. According to the book, they also have a pair of double-crested cormor..."

Hi Sharon:
Wow, that's pretty neat. Yes, please do share your experiences and let us know your impressions of the birds when you see them.

John wrote: "I'm only 60 or so pages in and this book is way more interesting than I thought it would be before beginning it. I have no real experiences with the birds other than seeing them here and there. The..."

Hi John:
I'm a bit further along, and I am enjoying being exposed to the the cormorant found in literature, which the author covers in Chapter 3. Will post about this later today.

Hello Everyone:
Checking in to see how far along you are in our May read? I am behind at only 1/3 of the way through. I am enjoying the book, but it's gardening time here, and I am having troubles getting to the book right now. It's good for me to write this as I am sure it will inspire me to get more reading done.

How about you?

Sher

My copy was back ordered, so I have not yet seen the book.

Ray wrote: "My copy was back ordered, so I have not yet seen the book."

That's too bad - Ray. When you do read it, I'll still be happy to discuss the book with you!

I am finding the organizational structure of the book mostly enjoyable though it requires me to really focus, because the author jumps around a lot moving from passages of literature, captain journals, the author's experiences, ornithologist reports, and even scene changes take place within a single chapter.

The chapter Aran Islands discusses how cormorants have been viewed throughout history as "evil and greedy" (King 53). King writes: "We rank animals. We are all guilty" (53).

Did anyone read "The Wounded Cormorant"? It's a short essay about a cormorant that becomes injured. King believes it "matters how the cormorant or any individual species is portrayed in stories over time," because these stories show "our evolving relationship with the natural environment" (53). Think raven -- coyote ---others that you can think of?

Images of the blur-eyed shag of Antarctica covered in the South Georgia chapter.
https://www.google.com/search?q=blue+...

I am ready to begin Chapter 10. I am really enjoying this book! The author presents both pro and con-Cormorant arguments in a fair manner without taking sides. I also love the literature and movie references and will now be adding titles to my reading/movie-watching lists :)

Sher wrote: "Kikyosan wrote: "Hi everyone! I am very curious about this book, but I can't read it right now (I'm reading about wolves in this period and this is quite necessary to me). By the way, I will read a..."

I loved the description he gave of the courtship for the Galapagos cormorants> I had a chance to see this several years ago and it is even more spectacular than his description. It is like watching a complex ballet. The pair suddenly came off the bank and out into the water around our rafts. Over the next five minutes, they swam together often wrapping their necks around each other as the stood, almost, on top of the water. They seemed to totally ignore that we were right there as they swam right up to the edge of the raft and round us. It was one of the most beautiful displays I've ever seen. I took this picture of them dancing together.
http://thomasbancroft.photoshelter.co...

Great and fun book.

Thomas wrote: "Sher wrote: "Kikyosan wrote: "Hi everyone! I am very curious about this book, but I can't read it right now (I'm reading about wolves in this period and this is quite necessary to me). By the way, ..."

Those are fabulous pictures!

I live in Washington state and had to take the ferry across to Lopez Island to meet a friend. Pelagic cormorants, one of the small species, were nesting on the pilings of the ferry dock. The pilings were metal and had a series of shelves between each side and on each shelf seemed to be a nest. The cormorants had brought in seaweed to build a nest. The birds were in full breeding colors too. This species gets a bright red face patch during breeding and white behind the legs seems to be more prominent. The eye also is an intense blue. I really wished I had a camera to photograph them. As I watched, one cormorant surfaced near the posts and had a large clump of seaweed in its bill. A man standing near me, pointed and told his little son, "Look, tthat bird is about to eat something." On the return trip later that day, I saw more cormorants flying in with more seaweed in their bills. I bet there might have been 20 or 30 pairs nesting there.

Thomas wrote: "I live in Washington state and had to take the ferry across to Lopez Island to meet a friend. Pelagic cormorants, one of the small species, were nesting on the pilings of the ferry dock. The piling..."

You are so fortunate to have been able to see them!

I was wondering if people took any bigger message from this book. As I read the last chapter, it seemed to me that the entire book was a metaphor for how people look for an easy explanation for difficult and complex issues. Something or someone to blame when in reality it is more complicated or something else is causing the problem but if people admitted that, they might have to change their ways. Any thoughts?

I enjoyed this book, great choice. I liked how he moved around the world and explored different cormorant species and problems they face. I thought the stories on South Africa and Peruvian cormorants were particularly intriguing, and I had not known there was an extinct cormorant from Alaska. He had done some great research to track the information down and his way of telling it captured my attention.
Thanks for picking it.
tom

Thomas wrote: "I was wondering if people took any bigger message from this book. As I read the last chapter, it seemed to me that the entire book was a metaphor for how people look for an easy explanation for dif..."

Thomas:
Thank you for taking the time to provide your thoughts, questions, and comments on our May read. I'm thinking about what you have written and will respond back. Hopefully others will have some comments too.

I am glad you have enjoyed the book.

Sher

Thomas wrote: "Sher wrote: "Kikyosan wrote: "Hi everyone! I am very curious about this book, but I can't read it right now (I'm reading about wolves in this period and this is quite necessary to me). By the way, ..."

Beautiful photo, Thomas - what brilliant blue eyes!

One of the chapters in our books covers the cormorant colony on East Sand Island. A friend visiting me this weekend was telling me about the news report she heard -- May 16, 2016 that cormorant colony collapsed on East Sand Island. Since I read about the efforts to dissuade the birds from nesting there, it was interesting to learn of 16,000 birds leaving at once, and all the eggs and nestlings being eaten by eagles and gulls.

http://www.kgw.com/news/local/animal/...

http://audubonportland.org/news/Cormo...

Another article on the Oregon cull from Audubon can be found here:
http://www.audubon.org/news/did-orego...

My copy arrived today, but I am going to put off reading it while I re read Crow Planet and focus on that discussion.

Ray wrote: "My copy arrived today, but I am going to put off reading it while I re read Crow Planet and focus on that discussion."

Ray-- sorry your copy took so long to arrive. This book has stirred up a lot of thought and feeling in me! I am almost done and will be posting a final post on The Devil's Cormorant soon.

It has a lovely cover and looks like a very well designed book. Its delay allowed me to finish Arctic Dreams and Braiding Sweetgrass. I have so many projects going right now, finding time to read is difficult.

My favorite chapters by far were the one covering the Bering expedition and the one covering aquaculture in Mississippi. The practices of those catfish farms were particularly interesting to me. I was not thrilled with the one detailing the cormorant in literature. For one, I don't really buy into the premise that these fairly obscure literary works shape people's present day opinions on the birds. Nor could I help but roll my eyes every time he claimed the bird had a reputation in part just because it's black. I do completely agree that it's probably a scapegoat due to its highly visible feeding habits.
On a side note, I recently visited Marathon Key for a school field trip I'm a part of every year and along the old 7 Mile Bridge, their stood a double-breasted cormorant on just about every concrete support brace I rode past in the boat. I was able to watch them fly and dive and kept hoping to see one come up with a large fish but wasn't lucky enough. I've noticed them a lot more around here in Central Florida as well since I began reading the book and no one I've talked to yet has any knowledge of what they even are.

I wouldn't call Paradise Lost and obscure work. It had profound influence in its day and left a mark which remains as an undercurrent in contemporary society. Particularly true here in the Bible Belt.

True. But I don't know one person that's read it these days. Maybe I don't hang around in the right circles

Finished the book and like others I enjoyed the way the author explores the theme by taking us around the world. I found the chapter on cormorants and cat fish farming the most interesting probably because I had no idea the two were related. The other chapter that most interested me was the one covering the "dissuasion" tactics at East Sand Island, which is near where I live. And, then to find out the colony there abandoned the site several weeks ago brought home how successful their program has been.

At the end of the book King states 6 points that sum up his research into the natural history of cormorants. Although I enjoyed how he weaved literature and art into the study of cormorants, I feel more like John; in that, I don't agree literature and art has shaped our view of the bird. I think our view is shaped more by how we relate to the bird in what we need to do to survive and thrive. If the birds bangs up against what we do for recreation, livelihood, or for cultural identity, then the bird is seen as evil. And that is why the bird is shown as evil and greedy in literature (although being able to eat so many dang fish helps). First the impression, then the art work. Though in art it certainly can work the other way around- where the art form influences a generation of viewers, readers, or listeners. I just wasn't convinced that was the case with the cormorant in art forms. ( aside-Enjoyed the many illustrations in the book)

Cormorants (mostly) eat our food and threaten our livelihoods, and so those who suffer, blame and despise the birds. The birds become the funnel for discontent. Although I learned a lot about cormorants, I came away thinking about "man"; humankind uplifts that which serves it and casts down that which competes with it--threatens it. The bird seems caught in the middle of man's wants and needs. Sometimes the bird fares well and is well thought of an protected as in Japan, but often the bird is maligned, harassed, and destroyed.

I really appreciated the short nonfiction interludes sprinkled throughout the book that just described the cormorant being a cormorant-- essays named by month. Because otherwise --in the book--the bird is inextricably linked with humans -- more so than many bird species.

In the end it's the way we treat cormorants that says so much about us.

I'm really glad we read the book. Thanks to all who added their comments and thoughts.

Sher

I got an email from etsy.com to see a needle felted great cormorant an artist has for sale. I have no idea if ETSY knew I was reading about cormorants. :) But, this needle felted bird is extraordinary.

Take a look if you are interested. Some of the gals who do fiberwork will appreciate the amazing detail that goes into this creation.

https://www.etsy.com/listing/24519020...

Thomas wrote: "Sher wrote: "Kikyosan wrote: "Hi everyone! I am very curious about this book, but I can't read it right now (I'm reading about wolves in this period and this is quite necessary to me). By the way, ..."

Extraordinary photos-- Thomas-- thank you for sharing them. I'm glad you identified each species- quite a few I did not know. One of my favorites was the flying waved albatross.