Catching up on Classics (and lots more!) discussion

Tytti- yes. I have loved all the Rhett-Scarlett interactions thus far. I have never seen movie so they are new characters to me. Scarlett-Ashley-Melanie triangle is for a lack of a better word pathetic. He married someone else, get over it. Despite the war, there are still many others fighting for a chance at your hand, especially Rhett (speculation only). I'd read more now but I'm falling asleep. Hope to finish part 3 tomorrow.

I'd like to comment but I can't because I know what will happen... But nevermind, it's 1864 and Sherman is close. When I was reading this we hadn't yet studied the US Civil War (IIRC it came later in the same school year, I was in 6th grade), so I didn't quite know which general was fighting for which side, or what Scarlett really meant when she said that she would dance with Abe Lincoln himself. (I'm not even sure I knew which side won when I first saw the movie. I was 12, after all!)

And I kind of like Scarlett, she is trying to do the right thing but her thoughts show that she isn't perfect. I really dislike characters who are always perfect, and I can understand why she wants Ashley. One has to remember that "Wilkes's have always married their cousins", so she can easily believe that Ashley would have married her if it hadn't been for that custom. and Ashley hasn't really helped to dispel that fantasy. People tend to trust behaviour more than words.

Tytti- I'm from Illinois, the land of Lincoln. I grew up lead to believe that the North was right, and not getting a chance to hear the South's POV at all. This is the South's POV obviously and as a former history student I am captivated.
All Wilkes married their cousins so their personalities are dull. That is the description I have of Melanie this far- she is dim witted and only sees the good in people, not the bad. Would Ashley had married Scarlett if he did not have to marry his cousin, that is speculation only. I like Rhett better anyway so far. He is older, worldly, cynical, and has more of a dark side than the other characters who grew up in a sheltered life.
My eyes were bothering me this morning. I probably stayed up too late reading. Time to catch up now. Melanie about to have baby.

I guess it's easy for me to understand that there are usually two sides to everything because we were on the "wrong side" in WWII (didn't really have a choice because the USSR was on the "right side"). And of course slavery is wrong but then again, Lincoln freed only the slaves in the Confederate States in 1863 but not the ones in slave states that had stayed in the Union. And I'm not sure the people in the North were any less racist than people in the South... But it's the victor who writes the history, it took almost 50 years from the Soviet Union to admit that they had started the Winter War, so I grew up knowing that things are not always as they are said to be.

But what I meant that Scarlett thought so, and she might have a reason to believe it. After all she was only 16 when the war started and everything changed, I think Ashley was somewhat older and should have known better.

Ashley had been north and in Europe and had been exposed to the greater world. Scarlett only knew Tara and Southern life. 600 pages to go.

I finished the book yesterday. Over 12 hours to finish! I couldn't put it down. I cried and raged. There were so many things going on in the book. Margaret Mitchell really depicted everything so vividly in this book. There were so many parts that were cringe worthy to me and so much senseless heartbreak, deaths. I have a headache this morning from all of the crying yesterday!

I also ordered the blu ray from Amazon that will be here Tuesday. I have never watched it either. I just never thought it would be a book or movie I was interested in! How wrong I was and how great to be on goodreads to broaden my horizons!

I am not nearly as far along as I was hoping to be at this point, but so far I am amazed. my only experience has been with the movie, and boy what a difference! These characters are so richly drawn. I understand for the movie that things have to be cut out, and simplified, but I am loving the new aspects I am getting to learn about these characters, especially the backstory of Ellen and Gerald! I was seriously tempted to call in to work so I could stay home and read :)

Melissa wrote: "There were so many things going on in the book."

I have always wondered how many books this ruined for me because I read it so young. I kept comparing other books to it and they all fell short, so I haven't really read historical fiction since. Also I think Mitchell succeeded in making Scarlett a believable character, even though she is too modern for her time. So it both appeals to the modern reader but the people and relationships don't feel like they were just transported from this time.

Scarlett is definitely not a 'lady' according both to Rhett and to the mores of the time. Mitchell wrote this to take place in the 1860s, 70 years later. She most likely had to have made Scarlett into a more modern character in order to get people to read it. I understand Tytti how you can no longer read historical fiction. For that reason I am reading two other short books at the same time so I don't fall into a rut.

Well I read this way too many years ago, it mainly affected me then. I do read some historical fiction but I just feel that many books are not satisfactory enough. I don't know if it's because I am so far removed from the 1930's as well that it feels more real but many newer historical fiction novels seem to concentrate more on romance and sex (sometimes it's very unbelievable) than the actual story set in history. That's why I probably pick books written by men more easily as they don't really write that much romance.

Tytti wrote: "Melissa wrote: "There were so many things going on in the book."

I have always wondered how many books this ruined for me because I read it so young. I kept comparing other books to it and they al..."

I don't read a lot of historical fiction but I can definitely see what your saying. This book is just amazing.

Have you read Scarlett or the other one I think is about Rhett? Someone told me I should read those on my review of this book but they weren't written by Mitchell so I don't know if I want to read those. It said on the one book I looked at that Mitchell's estate okay'd the book, but I'm still not sure

Have you heard of Sharon Penman? I've read her The Sunne in Splendour, charting the life of Richard III, and it is very good. She has a pretty good reputation :O)

Haven't started yet (hiding in shame) but real life has been particularly problematic. I'm still going to see if I can join you all.

Melissa wrote: "Have you read Scarlett or the other one I think is about Rhett?"

I tried reading Scarlett, I got it as a present soon after I had read GWTW but couldn't finish. It just didn't feel real right and I didn't recognize the characters. I think the story was finished already, the book didn't bring anything new to it, especially because a lot of the story was set in the UK. You can always watch the miniseries, I don't think you'll miss much.

(Also I have a problem with historical fiction authors who don't follow the history, so...)

I had someone recommend Scarlett to me so I checked and read the reviews. No three stars. A lot of one star reviews from people saying that Alexandra Ripley didn't stay true to Margaret Mitchell and a few five stars from people who were happy that she continued the story, tying it up neatly at the end. One reviewer also read the book about Rhett and found it interesting to know his side of the story. I think Mitchell develops him plenty that why would I need to know his backstory. Maybe some day if I have nothing to read- hahaha- I will try either of these but most likely not.

Well I guess Scarlett isn't necessarily a bad book, I have read worse, but it should have had original characters. And IMO it was more historical romance and I would say that the appeal of GWTW for me was something else than romance, though I did like the little it had. So it depends on what people are looking for in the book. As I have probably mentioned somewhere, I saw parallels between the South and Finland after WWII. Strong and stubborn women and men (many traumatised by war) rebuilding the country after about 5 years of total war. So for me it's a survival story and I can understand Scarlett maybe a bit better because of that. Sometimes you just do what you have to do because no one is going to help you.

The past two days I have read 2 pages. I had these days circled as slow reading days because I have gone to three baseball games in less than 48 hours. Hopefully tomorrow will be "back to normal" although our air conditioner is broken so it is tough to concentrate. I can pretend I'm at Tara ;). I'd like to get back in my groove and finish in time for the 4th of July.

Just curious, what are everyone's opinions of Scarlett? Do you love her, or hate her? I think I'm somewhere in the middle.

I also think Scarlett is somewhere in the middle. Today she would be considered selfish but that is the times she lived in- not having to lift a finger to do anything. Yet on her return to stars she has risen to the occasion and is attempting to get her home up and running again.

I don't really love or hate characters, I just think they are either well or poorly written. Scarlett might be selfish to a degree but at her time girls were not really expected to do much but they also couldn't even if they wanted. And after they were married they had children and had a household to run.

I finished the book 2 days ago, on the 28th, and I didn't really care for Scarlett as a person, but I loved her as a character. Also, by the end, I feel like I understood her and why she did the things she did. I could even relate to her in bits and pieces. The book ended up being a solid 5 stars for me, and I'd like to think I will read it again in my lifetime. Now I'm just trying to decide if I want to tackle 'Scarlett', the sort-of sequel, despite the fact that it's not by the original author. I have it, so I should read it, and seems to make sense to do so now, despite that it is also a long book. We'll see...lol.

Wow Michelle good for you. I started reading this book the week I had baseball tickets for three games in a row so I'm still on page 415. Today is unwinding day and tomorrow I get my a/c fixed, so I hope to catch up soon. I have read mixed reviews about Scarlett- lots of 1s and 4/5s but almost no 3s. People who adore GWTW say it's an insult to Margaret Mitchell whereas people interested in what happens next love it. I have seen better reviews about Rhett Butler's People and also a prequel Ruth, which is Mammy's story as to how she came to work for Ellen Robillard.

From Country Living magazine: Olivia Havilland who played Melanie Wilkes in the movie turns 100 tomorrow. She is the only living cast member.

Ummm... That's Olivia de Havilland. :)

Yes. But the de must have been missing from the article my friend sent me.

Brina wrote: "Yes. But the de must have been missing from the article my friend sent me."

Ah, huh...

I have to catch up with my reading.

Today Gone With the Wind turns 80 years old.

Tytti wrote: "Melissa wrote: "Have you read Scarlett or the other one I think is about Rhett?"

I tried reading Scarlett, I got it as a present soon after I had read GWTW but couldn't finish. It just didn't feel..."

I'm not going to read it then.

Michelle wrote: "I finished the book 2 days ago, on the 28th, and I didn't really care for Scarlett as a person, but I loved her as a character. Also, by the end, I feel like I understood her and why she did the th..."

I'm so glad you loved it too :-)

That is crazy that Olivia turns 100! Wow! I mean wow!

Happy almost 4th of July. Less than 100 pages to read here and I hope to finish tonight/tomorrow. So glad we got this group together or I would have never been motivated to read it.

That's great Brina :-).

I have to wait for my kids to go to bed, the suspense is making me nuts!

I can only imagine :-)

Wow! You devoured this book, Brina! Congrats, and I hope the ending is satisfying! I just hit the 50% mark today, so I will still be a while.

Once I get into any book I can't put it down. Reached page 900. Ciera it gets better from where you are. That's probably why I've read 500 pages in a weekend. Enjoy.

I read the book in two days. It just about killed me but I just couldn't stop. I never would have thought I would like this book and without GR and friends on here I never would have read it. I can say, I sure would have missed out on a wonderful book!

Finished!!! An absolute gem. I hope I don't get into a reading rut but that's never been an issue as long as I have a book in my hands. I can't cut and paste using my phone but feel free to see my review on my profile.

I'm going to start this book today and hopefully get around a hundred pages read this weekend. Since it is so huge, GwtW doesn't seem fit for commute, so it will be my companion for the next several weekends instead.
I'm sorry I'm so late - is anyone else behind? (I don't want to read the thread and be spoiled accidentally)

I started this late, but am hoping to finish before the month is over. I lived in Charleston for 25 years (and still live within spitting distance), so it is rather surprising that I have not previously read this. The length is rather intimidating and that is the biggest reason I kept putting it off. I am about half-way through and am thoroughly enjoying it. Witnessing Scarlet's maturation is at times a heart-wrenching experience. Some may say this is about the US Civil War, however I would argue that the book is about Scarlet O'Hara, with the war going on in the background.
I saw this movie in the '70's at a movie theater. I don't remember anything about it though. I was on a date and it seems I was more interested in her than the film. The one thing I do remember is it was very long and has been the only movie I have ever seen that had an intermission.
I was looking through my college's alumni magazine and, perfect timing, found an article about Alicia Rhett. I never realized the scope of the movie and how popular it really was. It was a major event in the US. By the way, Alicia Rhett was from Charleston and had a role in the film.
Here is the link if anyone is interested in reading about her.

http://magazine.cofc.edu/2016/06/20/a...

It seemed so very strange to see this at the very time I started reading the book. Strange in a good way!

Niles wrote: "I started this late, but am hoping to finish before the month is over. I lived in Charleston for 25 years (and still live within spitting distance), so it is rather surprising that I have not previ..."

What an interesting article about Alicia Rhett. It's nice to see that she had such a wonderful career even though she chose not to capitalize on her brief Hollywood success. Thank you for sharing, Niles.

Niles wrote: "I started this late, but am hoping to finish before the month is over. I lived in Charleston for 25 years (and still live within spitting distance), so it is rather surprising that I have not previ..."

Wow! What a great article! Thanks for posting Niles! :)

That was a really interesting article Niles!

Thank you for the link!

just finished today! What a great read.

Thank you, Niles. I'm just coming back online now and will have to read the article. Holly glad you finished. I still haven't seen movie. It will have to wait until the kids go back to school.

Tytti wrote: "I guess it's easy for me to understand that there are usually two sides to everything because we were on the "wrong side" in WWII (didn't really have a choice because the USSR was on the "right side").... But it's the victor who writes the history, it took almost 50 years from the Soviet Union to admit that they had started the Winter War, so I grew up knowing that things are not always as they are said to be."

Tytti, this is a bit of an off-topic question, but what were people in your country taught about WWII? Here in the U.S., our studies usually concentrate on the time after the U.S. gets involved and that is a half year after the U.S.S.R. switched sides (or was made to switch sides because its former ally invaded them).

Well in my time and IIRC, we were first taught (in 7th grade?) about WWII when we were covering the world history in general (we started in 5th grade from the Stone age). It was just the basic facts starting from the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, Poland, the occupation of the Baltic countries, France etc., and I suppose we also covered the war between China and Japan that had started earlier (and at some point their older history, too), and then Pearl Harbor... until the Yalta conference, Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Nuremberg, ending with the Paris Peace Treaty. Of course before that we had studied about WWI and the Russian revolutions, both of them, the Treaty of Versailles, the Russian Civil War, Stalin's Purges, what had happened in Germany, the Weimar Republic and the rest of that stuff, also the Depression, probably the New Deal, too, etc. as history is a continuum. I don't think there is much that wasn't covered...

Then the next year I think we studied all of the Finnish history and that's when we covered Finland's three wars a bit more closely (because they were all different and we were fighting a total almost from the beginning to the end, though there was an "Interim Peace" between the first and second that didn't really felt like peace, for example the USSR shot down a Finnish passenger plane). We didn't really pay much attention to any separate battles and such (only the important ones), we were mainly just given the big picture, just like with the other major wars. Then those of us who continued to "high school" covered the era again but just more deeply.

Tytti wrote: "Well in my time and IIRC, we were first taught (in 7th grade?) about WWII when we were covering the world history in general (we started in 5th grade from the Stone age). It was just the basic fact..."

It sounds very thorough! What did you mean when you said that you were on the wrong side of WWII? Do you view the victory of the Allies as a loss to your country? Is this a widespread opinion in your country or not? (Sorry to hijack this thread, but I find the opinions of people from the smaller countries of Europe fascinating...)

Mickey wrote: "Do you view the victory of the Allies as a loss to your country?"

ETA: Sorry Kathy, I think I'll answer here: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

Mickey wrote: "...(Sorry to hijack this thread, but I find the opinions of people from the smaller countries of Europe fascinating...) ..."


Maybe move over to the just talking thread, then you will not feel that you are hijacking this one -- about Gone with the Wind