Between the Lines discussion

To Start out Austen Autumn we will begin by reading Sense & Sensibility! yeah!

I love Jane Austen, and have not had a chance to read this book yet. I can't wait to get started!

I'm doing an Austen challenge on my blog so I'm in on this. Any thing I can do to have an excuse to read Austen works for me!

Lisa wrote: "I'm doing an Austen challenge on my blog so I'm in on this. Any thing I can do to have an excuse to read Austen works for me!"

The Everything Austen Challenge? I'm doing it also!!

I haven't read Sense and Sensibility in about 10 years, so I am looking forward to this.

I have a hard time with Austen, the language is just so heavy, but I'm going to try this one. Maybe it will help with others reading it at the same time.

For Jane Austen fall, will Persuasion be on the list? I would really love to read it.

Once you get into Austen, you find the language isn't really that heavy, well compared to Dickens or Thackery. But it flows beautifully.

Lindsay wrote: "Once you get into Austen, you find the language isn't really that heavy, well compared to Dickens or Thackery. But it flows beautifully. "

I agree, it took a bit of getting used to for me as well but once I really started getting into it, it's quite wonderful (to the point that I started wishing we still spoke and wrote the way they did! LOL) =D

Emily wrote: "I have a hard time with Austen, the language is just so heavy, but I'm going to try this one. Maybe it will help with others reading it at the same time. "

I agree. The story line dragged and I felt like I was reading in circles because of the old sentence structure. I tried to make myself finish it, but it kept putting me to sleep.

Stephanie wrote: " I tried to make myself finish it, but it kept putting me to sleep."

What a shame! To be fair, I think S&S may not be good as a first Austen read. The first one I read was Emma, and I was delighted to discover that Jane Austen is funny!

I read this last year and absolutely loved it. I won't give anything away until next month!

Emily wrote: "I have a hard time with Austen, the language is just so heavy, but I'm going to try this one. Maybe it will help with others reading it at the same time. "

Maybe view one of the films or tv series first, they are all on DVD, then when you can see how the slowness is actually nuance, you might enjoy them more. All the Pride and Prejudices are good because Mr. Darcy is always played by totally hot guys.

Veronica wrote: "Stephanie wrote: " I tried to make myself finish it, but it kept putting me to sleep."

What a shame! To be fair, I think S&S may not be good as a first Austen read. The first one I read was Emma..."

I watched the movie Emma and I liked that one. It was still slow, but I liked the ending.

I've tried reading this book about 3 times and had a hard time with the language as well. Hopefully the support from all of you will help me get through it. I have wanted to read it for a long time, but kinda just get reading but not actually pay attention to what I was reading. I'm excited to try again though!

Hi sense and sensibility makes awonderful reading---- As far as language is concerned Austen's works are not that easy yet you can slowly finish reading without giving a gap(i mean read everyday) do not leave in between to restart. Happy reading---im sure u will enjoy it.

I'm going to try to read this book as an ebook on my computer. I've downloaded it in a file that shows both the page numbers and chapters, so it ought to be possible to keep track of where I am.

I'm pretty sure I've read this before, but don't remember it all that well. It is going to be interesting.

ooh, I want to do this.

I started the book and it is the first time I read anything from Austen. I like the language. I read the sample in Kindle and the story didn't grabbed me, but it being only 99 cents I bought it. It is actually the language, which I find beautiful, that keeps me reading it. Hopefully the story will become more interesting.

I've been trying to listen to the audio book of this, and cannot seem to pay attention! Has anyone else tried this?

I just started reading Sense and Sensiblility, and though I haven't gotton very far yet, it has caught my interest, and I look forward to the discussion. I am thus far enjoying the books. I like Austen's ironic sense of humur.

Christy wrote: "I've been trying to listen to the audio book of this, and cannot seem to pay attention! Has anyone else tried this?"

You might find watching a film first will help you get into Austen. Unlike some films, none of the Austen ones spoil the books at all because they are far far more than just story.

Hey Petra, thanks for the suggestion!! I actually ended up putting S&S on my Ipod, and was able to pay attention as long as it was plugged into my ears. I also followed along with the book, whiched helped. LOVED the story! Have the movie on my Netflix cut for this week. :)

So far I really enjoy the humor in this book. I find the descriptions of the characters to be most particularly amusing.

I will be starting tomorrow. This will be my first Austen book though I own three or four of them. Can you believe I have yet to read hers???

One thing about reading Jane Austen is that it can make you feel ancient. Haha I found it quite amusing, Marianne's conversation about how absurd it was that a woman of 27 could seek happiness in marriage, and a man of 35, should completely resign from life. Though of course that is how it was then, and I think Austen herself, particularly as a woman who never married saw the absurdity in such a way of thinking and intentionally points out the humor in a girl of 17 looking upon late 20's to 30's as being archaic.

When I was a little girl, old age started at 40. When I was 40 that was when middle age started. I'm 68 now, and for my daughter's generation that will be middle age.

I'm not saying that I saw 40 as old when I was 10 or 12. I'm saying that the world saw it that way. There was a column in the newspaper called "Life Begins at 40" where they were trying to convince people that age that they were not yet old, and they weren't succeeding too well.

Though Frued did not come into the picture until after Austen, I find that the three sisters seem to refelct the 3 different personality types of the id, ego and supergo.

Marianne is like the id, young and impuslive, full of passion, but thinking of little beyond her imediate pleasure and acting only upon her first whims without thinking of consequence. She lives within the moment, and for whatever gratifiers her imediate pleasures.

Elinor is the super-ego, much more reserved and conservitive, reasonable, who thinks of things which are more practical and sensiable who tried to get her sister to see reason in her own judgements.

And though we do not yet see much of Margaret's personality, she seems to sit quietly between the two sisters, and thus far she has not emerged as strongly and overbearing as either of them.

Silver, I like your analagy. I've just started to reread the book. I'd forgotten how much humour Jane puts in her descriptions of the characters.

In case anyone is interested, the texts of her books can be found online at
www.pemberley.com

Yes, I am particuarly struck by the humur within this book

I managed to read the first 3.5 chapters and I also read the last one. I'm notorious for reading spoilers and ALWAYS read the last chapter early.

I was reading on my computer. That might be one of the reasons I'm having a hard time with the book. I might also be having a hard time with it just because I'm not in the mood for a "period piece". I know I've read the book before and enjoyed it, but I used to read a lot of classic stuff. So the fact that I'm not enjoying it this time around probably has more to do with me than with the author.

One of the things I notice in Austen's works, at least the ones I have currently read, is that the mother always seems to be rather ineffectual and perhaps in some cases even a burden to her children, often proving incompetent in her duties as a mother.

In Sense and Sensibility the mother is likened to Marianne the most irresponsible of the daughters. They are said to have the same impulsive and unstable emotions, and the mother doesn't seem to be much involved in what is going on in the lives of her daughters, nor does she try to guide or direct them in anyway.

Elinor seems to have to take the most responsibility where her sister is concerned in trying to look after her, and protect her interests.

Even with the little I read, I think you are right. However she is also a widow in a period when women were not trained to take care of themselves. In that time her step-son had business to take care of her and his half sisters.

Yes that is true, but then again there are other female characters who display much more competence and capability than Mrs. Dashwood does. As we say in the relationship between the step-son and his wife, Mrs. John Dashwood was able to overrule all of her husband's decision by convincing him that his reasoning was faulty, and she clearly had control in their relationship. She was a very shrewd woman who knew how to rule the roost.

Not a good choice since the woman is evil! One would hope that you don't need to be evil to be effective.

That was not my point, meerly the fact that I think the case of the mother in the work was more than just a reflection of women of the time period, since other women, and one could equally use Elinor for an example, prove to be perfectly compotent and able to look after themselves and others.

Oh yeah, Silver, you do have a point. And in each of the books there is at least one daughter who is quite competent and there are mothers who, no matter if they are widowed or married, deal very well with life, and mothers who do not.

I truly do prefer Elinor as the example of a woman who is dealing well with life to her sister-in-law, just because Elinor is a good person.

Hehe yes, I was just pointing out the sister-in-law as a prime example of women portrayed a bit unconventionally for Austen's time period, though devious, she has gained a role of dominance within her marriage in a world where such would be unheard, it was very forward thinking for Austen to even think of such a thing as the wife's manipulation of her husband's decisions I think.

That does not excuse the way she treats her family, but I did find it quite interesting.

I have not yet finnished the book, so things could change, but as of now, I am currious as to what purpose or role does Margaret play within the story? It seems currious to me that Austen created three sisters, and yet Margaret seems to be all but non-existint within the story. She is only mentioned a couple of times so far, and than only in breif passing, she has no real voice within the story, and half the time it is easy to forget she is even there.

It seems thus far that the story could carry on just the same if there were only Elinor and Maianne. Is it simply that it would be rather rare and unlikely to only have two kids at the period of time? Or will Margaret acutally come to play a larger role in the story later on in the book?

It just bugs me sometimes when writers create characters and then don't seem to do anything with them, or themselves seem to forget they have even created them.

I think it is a Jane Austen thing. She did the same thing with P&P, Kitty and Mary were sisters in the back ground, but provided a little colour, and also with Persuasion with Mrs Clay. I think Margaret does the same thing, I like her a lot. Dickens loved doing the same thing, he would bring characters in to mark a tone, say a joke or just stand in. Just think of it as a 19th Century way of adding flavour to a novel :)

Yes I recalled that she did something similar with P&P that she had created a couple of "extra" sisters that were just kind of background noise so to speak. Though at least in P&P (especially in the case of Mary), they had a distinct personality to help set a certain tone, and add some variety and comparison to the other sisters, but in the case of Sense and Sensibility it seems Margaret is nothing more than a name, I don't recall anything definite being said about her.

I have to say the character of Edward is starting to grow upon me. During his visit to the cottage, I find his debates and interactions with Maianne to be charming in thier own way.

I am about half way through with S&S. I hadn't read it since college and am really enjoying it again. One of the things that struck me was Edwards visit to the cottage. I have seen Emma Thompson's film version several times since I had read the book, and had forgotten he came to visit them as that is left out of the film.

I have found myself chuckling a few times, I did not remember this book as being this funny. I remember Emma is being very humorous, though. I am enjoying it.

I find it amusing and interesting that within this book there seems to be a lot of men "running" away.

Brandon first suddenly takes off under what seems to be somewhat curious circumstances to say the least of it.

And then of course Willoghby takes off quite unexpectedly with a bit of mystery wrapped around his departure leaving one to speculate just what is really going on.

Edward also seems to make something of an abrupt departure from the cottage.

I also find the mis-matched couples in the book to be amusing. Sir John and his wife seem to be quite the opposite of each other, and then there is the rather energetic and cheerful Charlotte with her seemingly dull and dower husband.

I quite enjoyed the scenes where he buried himself within the paper and just ignored everything else going on around him.

This is my second Austen. I've read P & P and also watched the Colin Firth movie and I loved both. But this one ... I don't really care for it. I don't find it as ironic or sarcastic as P & P was in parts (I love the father in that book!), Marianne seems to be a bit of a drama queen to an extent that I don't really care for her, the men are rather bland - I have trouble keeping some of them straight - and the entire book just leaves me rather uncaring.
I still have about 100 pages to go so I'm hoping something will improve my impression of this book. It's a bit sad because I was so looking forward to reading more Austen and now I'm just a bit bored...

And now I've finished it. Still didn't care particular about it or it's characters. Not sure what went wrong since I really liked P & P.

Willoughby, who for most of the book is a villain, gets excused in the end - both by his own attempt at explaining but also by Elinor's/Austen's attempt to describe why he is that way: "Her thoughts were silently fixed on the irreparable injury which too early an independence and its consequent habits of idleness, dissipation, and luxury, had made in the mind, the character, the happiness, of a man who, to every advantage of person and talents, united a disposition naturally open and honest, and a feeling, affectionate temper." (p. 324 in my edition and it goes on...). So it really wasn't his fault that he treated Marianne that way ... I do realise that Austen use this as a critique of society and that Elinor later on sees less kind on him - but still. It kind of bugged me that because he had become independent early one, he wasn't to blame, not really.

And I didn't like the way the book was tied up. Both marriages seemed rather sudden and weird to me. Edward had in some ways behaved just as badly as Willoughby and yet, he was instantly forgiven. And it seemed that Marianne only married Colonel Brandon because her family wanted her too - and because it was a reward to him after a hard life...

I agree with Silver that Margaret was not necessarily. In P & P she used the extra sisters - she didn't really here. Margaret is used so little that I at times forgot there even was a third sister...

Though personally I am quite enjoying S&S and it may in fact thus far be one of my favorites of hers next to P&P, I felt the same way about Persuasion as you feel about S&S. Though I heard others rave about that book, there was just something about it that did not do it for me.

I have to say though Marianne can be seen as quite immature, and a bit flighty as well as perhaps to a degree self-involved (though she does express genuine care for Elinor) one thing I appreciate about her, is her simple frankness though she is chastised for being rude, I rather agree with her speaking what she truly feels and thinks.

While I can more relate to Elinor's reservedness, and I would be more inclined to keep myself in solitude than make such a public display of my feelings as Marianne does, in some ways Elinor does come off was a bit too much of a goody-two shoes for my own personal preference, in her always having to speak well over everybody no matter her personal thoughts or if they deserve it or not.

It is a bit of an irony, Elinor being the heroine of the story and seen as the morally right one, the "good" one, though her little lies are justified, while Marianne's honesty is looked down upon.

I love anything Austen - after the modern stuff I often read, her dense sentences are like eating cheesecake... The difference betweeen cheap candy and cheesecake. Yum!

I found it a bit interesting an amusing how when Elinor and Marianne end up in much the same position, Elinor looks upon Marianne's position with a very different eye than she looks upon her own.

Upon discovering of Willoughby's engagement to another woman Elinor find's him to be the most cruel and evil of men, and think it a good thing to now see his true character and puts the full blame of the situation between Willoughby and Marianne upon him and sees him as having a black heart.

While on the other hand, in spite of discovering Edward's being engaged to another woman, she still holds Edward in her high esteem and remains convinced that Edward must still have some feelings for her, and there is some mistake in his engagement to this other woman.

While Elinor seems to just humor Marianne's own belief that Willoughby himself cannot be at fault, but she must have been wronged someway by some outside force. Elinor looks upon this sort of conspiracy idea of Marianne's disfavorably.

Yet, she herself believes that someone other than Edward must be at fault for his own engagement.

And I have to say, I think at that moment Elinor should have broken her reserve and told her sister the truth of her own disappointments with Edward.