World, Writing, Wealth discussion

To continue the conspiracy series -:), each banknote whether it's Franklin, the Queen or Euro has a serial number on it.
When you run a stash of cash on a counting machine you can have a list mentioning those numbers.
Each time the banknote passes through a bank or change booth, it might register.
Can the Fed or each relevant issuer trace their banknotes around the world and, if yes, do you think this feature is used?

It may be technically possible to do, but the amount of electronic data to analyze would be truly massive. Why bother?

Of course, no need to analyze all the data, although Big Data and how to work with it is one of the leading fields in high tech at the moment.
But for example - if you want to establish the length of some clandestine or illegal chain - you give a few banknotes to the front man and see how high up it goes or where the banknote is tried to be laundered.
Or to trace where really big sums sit and where they came from.

Sure they can trace anything, this is why I don't trust the Cloud, no matter how safe they say it is.

Big Brother is truly here. They've been following all my life, since the Cold War. You'd think they would understand that somethings are nonsense, and drop their spying. But once on the list, always on the list. What can I say, they're caught in a rut, and programmed not to leave it.

Can someone know where all the dollars/euros/other currencies bills are?

Faith wrote: "The majority of currency is not in physical form. A FIAT bank "issues" new money as an electronic number transferred to another account, usually a clearing bank. This is often done so a government ..."

Excellent angle. Makes it impossible to finish the game by concentrating all the banknotes in one hands -:)

I suspect we are on the negative system already. Many of us in reality, others - hypothetically

You're right Nik, it is a negative system and I don't like the sound of that - it is psychologically negative to have a 'debt system'. I'm dead against abolishing cash, it's the only thing standing in the way of negative interest rates - that would mean that banks would charge you for holding cash in their bank, and I bet they would still charge a fortune for having an overdraft.

I use cash as much as possible in my small personal protest against cashless. They tell you that going cashless will eliminate money laundering but that's nonsense, they assume that people think that it's all done as seen in Breaking Bad, but the truth is that criminal money is mainly laundered electronically nowadays.

"Money will always be paper, but gold will always be GOLD!"
-- Darwin Mayflower, "Hudson Hawk"

J.N. wrote: ""Money will always be paper, but gold will always be GOLD!"
-- Darwin Mayflower, "Hudson Hawk""

Gold is long gone out of the money, now they even want to take the paper out -:)

Fiat money works fine as long as everyone has sufficient faith in it to continue using it. Faith mentions nobody wants to pop the bubble, but I suspect it is not that simple. You can't actually call it in because it is not there. You can't make everybody pay up at the same time because of contracts. So as long as the system works, everyone is more or less happy. The whole point is that as long as the ledgers redeem value on demand, all is well. What I find interesting is a lot of this fiat money is being diverted to cryptocurrencies. If these collapse, maybe the whole bunch of negatives will disappear as well, and after the blood bath, all will be well again.

Are you saying that when one spends cash that it is being traced/tracked?

You have to track your spending or the tax man gets annoyed with you. If everyone is playing by the rules, it all gets tracked. banks have to track everything. Cryptocurrencies are apparently not tracked, which of course also leads them open to criminal use, and once hackers get there, massive losses.

I'm asking if the government or any other entity can track cash.

For most transactions, provided they can get a warrant, they can track electronic transactions. Tracking cash is far more difficult, and the best they can do is ask questions like, "How come you have a salary of $40,000 a year and you buy a $5 mil house?" They can't track bank notes, which is why cash is handy to drug dealers, and why money laundering (essentially, giving you the excuse for those big expenses) is such a big deal.

People like that wouldn't own assets in their own name, they buy them through shell companies with a labyrinthine structure so that it is nigh on impossible to work out who owns what. Criminal Capital: How the Finance Industry Facilitates Crime is an excellent guide to how that works.

Even if cash is abolished it would do nothing to stop criminality, even on a street level. They would set up shell companies for payments. I understand that this happens already, though for higher class illegal activity such as exclusive brothels. I have no first hand knowledge of this, I hasten to add. :)

The major use of shell companies is for tax avoidance. Trillions are involved.

Ian wrote: "The major use of shell companies is for tax avoidance. Trillions are involved."

Indeed - what I didn't realise until I read Criminal Capital is that they are also used for money laundering. The ingenuity of the crooks is scary and the banks and police can't keep up with them.

Each banknote has a serial number, which registers most times when the banknote passes through a bank, so theoretically it's possible to see where the banknote travels.
With ever renewed banknotes (supposedly to make it harder for counterfeiting), I wouldn't be surprised if at some stage they are able to implant nano-trackers or mikes into them...

The serial number would only register entry or egress from a bank. The person depositing them would be more easily tracked simply by the amount. Even if a banknote had a serial number from a robbery six months ago, most of the time it would have been given as change by someone else. Tracking the hundred dollar bills might be easier though, I suppose. However, has anyone taken bills into a bank and deposited them recently? I usually spend them, and income usually comes to the bank in electronic form.

Ian wrote: "However, has anyone taken bills into a bank and deposited them recently?..."

I do occasionally. Ukraine for example is largely a 'cash' country and people don't trust banks to keep their money. Moreover, part of population don't even have bank accounts. Clients from there would usually prefer paying cash, however with restrictions on cash settlements, this option becomes less applicable

"I wouldn't be surprised if at some stage they are able to implant nano-trackers or mikes into them... " Come on, Nik. I'm paranoid enough as it is.

I keep a fair amount of cash on hand, just in case. I've always liked the idea that it can't be traced. Early on, I read Fahrenheit 451 and 1984. I don't like the idea of censorship, and I hate the idea of giving up my privacy. You don't have to be doing anything illegal to feel this way. It's the principle of the thing.

In recall once in South America being told that, because of the rather odd banking system at the time, and maybe other reasons, it was common to buy a house by bringing up a suitcase full of $100 bills. The Franklins have widespread influence!

Are there agencies tracing global banknote circulation? What do you think?

While they have identifying numbers, I think they get too mixed up. If they were traceable, the trade in white powders would disappear.

Google "HSBC fined" then tell me if they care.