Sci-fi and Heroic Fantasy discussion

I am writing a fantasy novel and I am trying to brainstorm on how my fantasy hero should be. At first, I am thinking of making him charismatic, but I have no idea what makes a person charismatic. I am also planning on initially making a refugee and fugitive for the first part of the story before rising to power. What do you guys think? What makes a good and interesting fantasy hero? Please share your thoughts.

I enjoy stories where the main character has one or more of these qualities:

-- A strong sense of what's right and what's wrong. A code to live by. One that can be adjusted, one that can grow, but not one that can be corrupted.

-- Courage. Sometimes fearless, but other times fearful and conquering that fear. Able to face doing what's right instead of taking an easy way out that doesn't serve what is just.

-- Empathy or sympathy for others. Not as an enabler, but aware of the needs of others versus their wants. Able to elevate themselves as well as others, even at their own expense. A kind of selflessness.

-- A sense of humor, about themselves, others, and situations. Even to the point of being self-deprecating. Sometimes sarcastic, but always with an underlying sense of rightness to it.

-- Someone that is proactive instead of reactive. A hard worker, who strives to build and sustain a community where everyone can exhibit such qualities.

I tried to avoid male/female pronouns above, since I don't think a specific gender is a necessary quality for a "hero" to have.

On a related note, I just ran into this quote:

"You either die a hero, or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain."

Oh man, I just read a book called "Thanks, But This Isn't For Us". It's a book about writing from start to finish by a pro editor. Definitely check it out! (I found it at my local library)

Other than that, I hate, hate, hate cliché characters in cliché settings. But it takes years of bleeding to get a really developed character, I don't envy any author. My favorite character ever is Kvothe from King Killer Chronicles. You see Kvothe broken, hollow, aching. He tells his history, rich, vibrant, the best of the best at absolutely everything (expect following rules and mathematics). The entire time your mind is trying to wrap around what brought this character to this place of brokenness. Normally characters are contrasted with another character, this one is unique because he's contrasted with himself. You become invested in his story, you care because you want to know. You care because you understand what it's like to be broken and hollow. You want to see him become whole again.

Excellent breakdown, Randy. All points I can identify from books where I've aligned with and enjoyed journeying with the main character.

I liked what Randy said.

First of all, nothing like the @broodingYAhero (that Twitter account is hilarious) tweets

Not handsome
Not whiny
Not perfect in everything he tries - I hate Marty Stus
Does not get every girl or guy he wants - or if he gets one then make it an off screen stable relationship

I like perceptive characters with good observation skills.
A bit of dry humour can help too.

Definitely not too whiny/brooding (see Thomas Covenant series by Stephen R. Donaldson if you want to write a character your readers will hate, even as an anti-hero, one shouldn't be downright annoyed with your protagonist)

On the other hand the character must have some flaws. Nothing more boring for the reader if your character is say a novice mage that just when he's about to die manages to do some god-like feat. At that point you know he'll get out of anything you throw at him going forward. That falls under the "special snowflake" category that kills so many YA novels for me. That so-and-so is the "best ever and only one ever like them in the whole existence of the universe". Sometimes it works but often it's just eye-rolling. Brian McClellan tended to do that with several of his characters in his Powder Mage series, but I forgave him because everything else was so good, but at the same time I did notice it and rolled my eyes.

And be consistent. Don't give your characters a power/ability, and just forget about it when its convenient to add suspense/conflict to a scene. Nothing more annoying than the reader going "but he can snap his fingers and teleport...why isn't he doing it now?" Not unless you explain by "he's in a special cell that negates teleportation".

Not sure about the positive traits, I've loved a wide variety of characters. But I know for sure I've hated/been annoyed by ones that had the above traits.

It really depends upon the style. A fantasy about a ridiculous universe isn't going to benefit much from a heroic protagonist. Neither will a heroic epic terribly benefit from a very relatable and very human protagonist.

You also need to consider how much dimension your characters should possess, keeping in mind that fully-fleshed out, three-dimensional characters are not always the best choice. Sometimes archetypes or mere stereotypes may pay off best in the end.

I tend to work from the characters I found compelling in what I've read, occasionally adding the more authentic experiences I've had in my own life. Most of these characters tend to reflect my own hopes and anxieties, and I've found that there's nothing wrong with this. It's not like I can write with authenticity someone else's hopes and anxieties.

I worry I haven't helped. Just a lot of "this or that." Try writing a one scene story with the character you've got in mind. Not more than five thousand words, closer to three thousand. That might help you flesh out your thinking.

My kids read a lot of YA fantasy, and they complain about characters who are "OP" (stands for Over Powered). It's really important to establish some weakness in a character. Compensating by adding a gazillion angry orcs may make the battle more interesting, but it doesn't make the character more interesting.

IW wrote: "My kids read a lot of YA fantasy, and they complain about characters who are "OP" (stands for Over Powered). It's really important to establish some weakness in a character. Compensating by adding ..."

I just wrote a review last month on a paranormal book that had something like that. I mentioned that the action was non-stop, but it was like the Coyote and Roadrunner cartoons -- the hero was like the Coyote, who keeps getting the stuffing knocked out of him, and would keep going on and come back for me. The difference is that the hero eventually was successful. :)

I usually model a character based on characters I've known in life or ones in a book. I think it's important to keep the dialogues of different characters unique, meaning you keep them distinctive throughout. This can be a little tough.

The key thing a protagonist needs is agency - otherwise they tend to be annoying or there is the feeling that the wrong POV has been chosen for the story. Beyond that the more archetypal you go the more yawnsome it will be. The world does not need another detective with a drink/drug/gambling addiction who is good at their job but not relationships or their personal life... Take how Jamie Lannaster subverts the standard typical hero - he has some heroic qualities but many qualities that are far from typically heroic.

I tend to like stories where the narrative is largely character driven rather than stories that are driven by a plot that the character is inserted into.

If you have no idea what makes a person charasmatic dont try to make a character charasmatic - it wont work or ring true.

Likability can be important - if you make a character a ruthless killer with no sense of humor you need to do so in a way which still keeps us interested and potentially routing for her. There is not one thing that is likeable although relatable can be a good start.

Someone starting out as a commoner/fugitive rising to power has been done a lot - no harm in doing it again but other options might be more interesting.

Avoid too much conscience. The Whole "I killed the man who murdered my parents and was ready to kill me and all my friends and was a serial rapist but I'VE taken a life and let me wrestle with this for the next three books." Waste exposition for those not saved or innocent victims of friendly fire.

My favorite heroes struggle with themselves as much as with the world around them, not in a depressive way, but in overcoming whatever their past has thrown at them even as they overcome their current challenges.
You need to be intimately familiar with whatever personality you write, whether it be yours or someone else's, and you must, must, must not forget your own characters and rules. Keep personality profiles of your characters so you don't mess them up. Make them as realistic as possible; no one has ONE flaw, just as no one has only one talent. We all learn and grow as our stories continue. So should our heroes.

As has been said: agency.

Your protagonist has to act, not just react. One way to handle it is to have someone who does the wrong thing for the right reasons; especially at the beginning of the story. It keeps reader identification because they are the good guy, but also steers away from the -Stu problem.

There is a limit to what you can do with character alone. Character and plot lock together, like the fingers of two hands. So -- start work on the plot. Character will develop side by side with it.

Brenda wrote: "There is a limit to what you can do with character alone. Character and plot lock together, like the fingers of two hands. So -- start work on the plot. Character will develop side by side with it."

I would echo this.

Hi Grady,

great question,

start from the ending maybe, what do you want them to become and how will they get there? They'll be likeable if you have them do likeable things.

Mighty thews and handy with a sword.