Reading the Chunksters discussion

Drew wrote: "Jen wrote: "I'd be curious if folks have a thought on why so many minor characters and so many nicknames."

My experience is that in general Russians use a variety of nicknames for their nearest an..."

I think the nicknames would be easier to follow if we were Russian but because even their full name is so foreign to use we can't connect the common nicknames for them like we could for a "Richard" or a "Robert" or an "Elizabeth" so following all the secondary names is harder for us. I found the link Diane posted with all the chapters to be super helpful in keeping them straight, I have it as a document on my phone so I can easily go through it.

Greg wrote: "Jen wrote: "I'm still struggling with the characters and the names - there are just a lot of characters (minor ones it seems) with a lot of names. I don't recall this being a huge problem for me wi..."

I had to do that too, but I'm trying to not use it like a crutch. I want to learn the names right? And it's getting easier, but I certainly have to use the list!

Jen wrote: "Greg wrote: "Jen wrote: "I'm still struggling with the characters and the names - there are just a lot of characters (minor ones it seems) with a lot of names. I don't recall this being a huge prob..."
Jen, yes, it is a crutch. And it can delay the flow of reading a book. But we all have our crutches, be it with reading or whatever.

Nice discussion. I've nothing to add. Trying to catch up with y'all. Enjoying the book so far.

A quick tip for Russian nicknames - they will all most likely have the same root, just different suffixes. Russian language is very flexible and forgiving when it comes to people changing words and creating new ones using handy suffixes, which in turn have certain mood/tone to them. Lets take a common name Mikhail - pronounced Mee-ha-eel, - a Slavic form of Michael. His nick names could be:

- Misha - casual, used by anyone closely familiar with him

- Miha - very casual, tough, slang-like, mostly used by men to indicate close friendship

- Mishutka, Mishanya, Mishulya, - all very cutesy and casual nicknames, most likely used on a child by his parents, grandparents, and those who want to show great affection for him

- Mishka - casual, could be playfully affectionate, but also could indicate someone's displeasure with him, depending on the situation.

- Mikhail *insert patronimic* - formal, shows respect or the fact that he is older than the speaker.

As you can see, the root of the name still stays the same, so it's a good indicator who's who.

Maybe it's just me, but reading the Russian edition, I too missed the fact the the train jumper was Yura's father. I only clued in when someone else brought it up in the following chapters. It seems to me that Pasternak doesn't like to directly explain everything to the reader, but subtly confirms suspicions and connects his dots later in his work. Perhaps P&V translation is more true to the original. I can see that these subtleties might be unwanted by publishers, especially when dealing with translation work, so extra information might be added in certain editions to make it easier to understand.

Sorry i am so late posting- im having a hard time trying to find time to read 😣

Anyways, i am getting a little confused with all of the characters who are being introduced- maybe, like some of you have said, its because of the nicknames and crazy long Russian names. Im enjoying the story so far and feel like it is finally all coming together.

I didnt realize that the jumper was Yuras father... guess ill have to re read that section to see what i missed.

I am defintely looking forward to seeing where the rest of the story goes.

@Tanya I'm behind where I should be and Ill also be reading The Sympathizer in June (actually this other group dissects it on a full-time basis :-). So I bet you catch up with me.

I refuse to rush because one of the main things I'm getting out of reading this is just absorbing everything that is going on, chaos and atmosphere included; allowing me to feel that I know something of Russia during this time. The characters serve as facilitators in this rather than in actors in a story.

Candace wrote: "I refuse to rush because one of the main things I'm getting out of reading this is just absorbing everything that is going on, chaos and atmosphere included; allowing me to feel that I know something of Russia during this time. The characters serve as facilitators in this rather than in actors in a story. "

Exactly my thoughts! Watching the characters adapt to their changing circumstances really gives me a feeling for how immense the personal dislocations were.

Yes, even better explained Drew!

Danielle wrote: "Dianne wrote: "Five O'Clock Express - What a heart rending way to open the book! Our poor Yura is orphaned and has no memory of his father, and we subsequently learn in the next chapter that it is ..."
Hi Danielle, my last trip out of the USA was to the Dominican Republic! (Cruise). Isn't it amazing though that all over the world people can read and talk about the same book!

Andrea wrote: "Maybe it's just me, but reading the Russian edition, I too missed the fact the the train jumper was Yura's father. I only clued in when someone else brought it up in the following chapters. It seem..."
Hi Andrea, since you're reading this in Russian: at the end of the first chapter, (last page in my edition), I read: "Nika remembered his early morning misogyny." To me, Nika is too young to use the word "misogyny." When you read this sentence/passage in Russia, does Nika truly seem to be this mature and self-aware?

Greg wrote: "Danielle wrote: "Dianne wrote: "Five O'Clock Express - What a heart rending way to open the book! Our poor Yura is orphaned and has no memory of his father, and we subsequently learn in the next ch..."

Yes it is! It's not really possible for me to have book clubs like this here so being able to be in an o one is awesome, I've gotten so much more from the book because of it.

And if you ever want to make a trip back there are a TON of cool things to do here and you can get amazing deals at the resorts. Last time I went in October I paid $20 a night, all inclusive (2 to a room minimum so $40 a night for a couple).

Greg wrote: "Andrea wrote: "Maybe it's just me, but reading the Russian edition, I too missed the fact the the train jumper was Yura's father. I only clued in when someone else brought it up in the following ch..."

In Russian edition there is not a word about misogyny. I'm surprised the translator used this interpretation of Pasternak's words. The actual sentence says something along Nika remembering his own omnipotence that morning, when he seemingly commanded nature itself by willing it to change at his whim. I think he was earning to feel the same level of control and grandness, so he could wish for him and Nadya to fall into the water again to share an intimate moment, like they just did. Hope that makes sense.

Andrea wrote: "Greg wrote: "Andrea wrote: "Maybe it's just me, but reading the Russian edition, I too missed the fact the the train jumper was Yura's father. I only clued in when someone else brought it up in the..."

The P&V version also used the word "misogyny." It seems totally inappropriate and not just because it was supposed to be a young person's thought. It just doesn't describe what he was feeling especially now that Andrea has shared what the original Russian said. Strange!

Amy wrote: "Nice discussion. I've nothing to add. Trying to catch up with y'all. Enjoying the book so far."

Thanks for posting Amy! Glad you are enjoying it!

Andrea wrote: "A quick tip for Russian nicknames - they will all most likely have the same root, just different suffixes. Russian language is very flexible and forgiving when it comes to people changing words and..."

This is SO helpful Andrea, thanks!!

Candace wrote: "@Tanya I'm behind where I should be and Ill also be reading The Sympathizer in June (actually this other group dissects it on a full-time basis :-). So I bet you catch up with me.

I refuse to rus..."

no rushing! Threads will stay open, so take your time! We just want you to finish at some point :)

Danielle wrote: "Greg wrote: "Danielle wrote: "Dianne wrote: "Five O'Clock Express - What a heart rending way to open the book! Our poor Yura is orphaned and has no memory of his father, and we subsequently learn i..."

I don't know ANYONE where I live who reads like you all do so THANK YOU!!!!! I really appreciate everyone's comments so much. :)

Andrea wrote: "Greg wrote: "Andrea wrote: "Maybe it's just me, but reading the Russian edition, I too missed the fact the the train jumper was Yura's father. I only clued in when someone else brought it up in the..."

wow andrea, so great that you can share insights like these!