Goodreads Authors/Readers discussion

Hello everyone,
The creator of ‘Lucifer’ (the TV series) stole some of my ideas and plots from my book‘The adventures of Catrine and the devil’. It would be too obvious that he violated my copyrights had he called his series ‘The adventures of Chloe and Lucifer’. I have alerted The Hollywood Reporter about this theft and I seek a good Californian lawyer. Apart from this, I am devastated because I don’t have any agent and it is one of those things which are difficult to prove. I wonder if it happened to other authors. And if yes, how do you cope in cases of materials theft?
Any help is appreciated.
Much obliged
Stephan

I'm told this happens a lot and the BBC unsolicited submission pile was mentioned more than once. Does your book say "copyright" and to whom on it? You will need to be able to prove when you wrote it (publication date, email, hard copy postmark date or a stamped copy dated and held by a public notary). If you have evidence and there are enough points of similarity, e.g. more than nine words in an identical sequence, try approaching them and asking for an out of court settlement. It's trickier to claim ownership of an idea though. If you can prove it or not, it's a good plan to learn from this experience and protect your work next time.

Thank you, Faith.
Im looking for a lawyer in Denmark as well.
This is every author's nightmare. I wish i didn't know they did it. I was warned not to send my books without an agent. I didn't listen. Now i know why many authors choose an agent.

Stephan,

You might not need to go to the expense of hiring a lawyer. Maybe if you just went through your work and listed the points of plagiarism by citing sections, pages, ideas, etc. in your manuscript. And then provide proof as to the date you emailed and/or snail mailed it to them, that might be enough to get them to take you seriously and suggest a settlement.

If that doesn't work, then maybe think of hiring a lawyer who has copyright infringement experience.

Ideas are not copyright-able. Here's a PDF which explains the Supreme (and lower) Court decisions.

It never hurts to look into things Stephan. I'm really sorry that this happened to you. The silver lining is that every author reading your post will take extra care with their publishing.

T.C. wrote: "It never hurts to look into things Stephan. I'm really sorry that this happened to you. The silver lining is that every author reading your post will take extra care with their publishing."

Thanks. In 2013, shortly after publishing the second book i sent several copies to screenwriters. I knew about the risk, but hoped someone will contact me. My fault, but still, i hope other authors will never experience it. It is a devestating realization. Authors without agents are totally powerless.

Tamara wrote: "Stephan,

You might not need to go to the expense of hiring a lawyer. Maybe if you just went through your work and listed the points of plagiarism by citing sections, pages, ideas, etc. in your man..."

Thanks. I've discovered more than a dozen similarities in themes, plot, characters and events. If i didn't send my books to America back then i would have rested on benefit of doubt.

Jay wrote: "Ideas are not copyright-able. Here's a
PDF
which explains the Supreme (and lower) Court decisions."
Thanks. I know, but my advice here is not to trust these vultures, i have no doubt that they know more about the law of copyrights than authors. I just read about the American view. Thanks for posting it. Fascinating arguments. I disagree with deleting the protection of ideas. I thought California was better than New York until 1947

Stephan wrote: "Hello everyone,
The creator of ‘Lucifer’ (the TV series) stole some of my ideas and plots from my book‘The adventures of Catrine and the devil’. It would be too obvious that he violated my copyrigh..."

Stephan,
If I may hove you one advice: Shop around for your attorney.
20+ years ago when I lived in Austria, I won a copyright lawsuit. However, it was a 'relatively' easy case, we had a contract that was violated.
In the US, the biggest problem is that you may have to put down 5 grand before the attorney even gets to work. It's a different climate than in Europe, one that is very "lawyer-friendly."
Try to find a young lawyer, one who wants to make a name for themselves. Eager lawyers may be happy about a case like yours especially if you have good documentation. Everybody "has to get into the game" somehow. In other words, you are offering them "an opportunity."

Gisela wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Hello everyone,
The creator of ‘Lucifer’ (the TV series) stole some of my ideas and plots from my book‘The adventures of Catrine and the devil’. It would be too obvious that he viol..."
Thanks. I heard about lawyers who take fees only if they win the case. My case is very solid after profound examination.

Copyright protection attaches to original works of authorship upon creation. As the author, you should have no trouble establishing that you own the copyright and possess the necessary publishing rights.
While individual ideas are not subject to protection, your work as a whole, as an embodiment of those ideas, will be protected. If there is that much of a similarity between the characters/events in your book and the characters/events within the show, then it's possible that you may have a viable case.
Have you placed them on notice that they have been infringing your rights? You (or an attorney acting on your behalf) need to send all responsible parties an actual notice of infringement, along with a cease and desist letter advising them of your intent to seek injunctive and monetary relief (as with every legal matter, it's important to have a paper trail). Make it clear to them that you fully intend to pursue this matter--and I sincerely hope that you do. It's horrible to think that others have been profiting from your hard work. It won't be easy but it's worth the fight if you truly believe that you've been exploited. I'm sorry for what you're going through and hope that everything will work out to your advantage.

Sorry, Stephan, but it's not likely that an attorney will take your matter on a contingency fee basis. Most likely, they will ask for a retainer fee and you can expect to pay a pretty penny before the matter is concluded. If it were my work, I would pursue it as a matter of principle. I would alert the media and cause such a stir that they wouldn't want the negative attention--especially if they are knowingly doing something wrong. You never know who the guilty party is--it's likely that the majority of people involved in production aren't aware of what's going on.

Angel wrote: "Sorry, Stephan, but it's not likely that an attorney will take your matter on a contingency fee basis. Most likely, they will ask for a retainer fee and you can expect to pay a pretty penny before ..."
Angel, thank you. I could only wish i had you as my lawyer. As things are, people react differently. I contacted the media and in need of lawyers, but my depression is consuming me.

Stephan wrote: "Gisela wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Hello everyone,
The creator of ‘Lucifer’ (the TV series) stole some of my ideas and plots from my book‘The adventures of Catrine and the devil’. It would be too obvio..."

Stephen,
My latest experience with two US copyright attorneys is based on that I wanted to avoid what you are going through. I had an excellent idea which I wanted the copyright attorney submit to the "other party" so it was not going to be an unsolicited submission of my idea.

So, I inquired with two "bigger names" (after all, this was the idea). Both of them cited their fee as $500/hr and wanted a retainer of $5,000.

I had figured that "writing a standard letter" was going to cost me $250-300 but that was not the case hence nothing happened. Obviously, I could not shell out 5 grand not even knowing if anything would materialize.
To be honest, I thought that was stupid. Obviously, if the idea (there were no negative issues) would have materialized that lawyer could have made a lot of money for contracts, continued legal help, etc. Apparently, that's not how U.S. lawyers see these opportunities.

Personally, I agree with @Angel - stir up the media and get your story out.
Goodluck.

Stephan wrote: "Angel, thank you. I could only wish I had..."

I know it must be horribly frustrating but don't let it depress you. Think of it this way: Your writing was so good and your storyline so creative that someone thought it would make a great television series. Let it be a credit to your talent, despite the fact that you're not getting the recognition you deserve. I strongly believe that people don't get away with their wrongdoings; it catches up to them eventually. In the meantime, let the knowledge that you've developed something so amazing inspire you to keep on writing. Don't let this negative experience bring a premature end to what can be a rewarding writing career. The best way to get back at them is through your continued success. Don't give up! All the best to you.

Stephen, write your experiences down and turn them in to a novel. There is nothing like experience to confirm a novel that sells. Plagiarism may have done you a favour :-o)
You have a plot ready made, and in you novel you can be the winner.

Thanks everyone for your support,
At the moment I’m filing a litigation form to begin with a lawsuit. I also took upon contacting mister Tom Kapinos today through email. I hope to settle it outside the courts. If anyone can recommend me a good literary agent and/or a good litigation lawyer, I’ll be much obliged.
Thanks again
Stephan

Stephan wrote: "Hello everyone,
The creator of ‘Lucifer’ (the TV series) stole some of my ideas and plots from my book‘The adventures of Catrine and the devil’. It would be too obvious that he violated my copyrigh..."

Sorry that someone had stolen your work. I wish I can give you a good advice, but I don't know how. I never had anything stolen from me. Hopefully, everything will be ok. How did you notice that show stole your ideas from your book?

Simi wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Hello everyone,
The creator of ‘Lucifer’ (the TV series) stole some of my ideas and plots from my book‘The adventures of Catrine and the devil’. It would be too obvious that he viol..."

Gradually, by watching the tv series. The coincidences were too many, only in the second season it hit me, through the characters og lucy and chloe. There were things that invented by me that were used, when i did the analysis i was shocked. There were also plots, symbols, subplots and other scenes from my book. I did the math, because back in 2013 one screenwriter warned me that it might happened. I was dumb and desperate to send him the books without an agent. Do not trust the film industry. There is obviously no protection for ideas. In my case i establish theft on grunds of chief plot and chief characters. But i also mention the stolen ideas in the litigation form. I hope to settle without trial, but it's up to them now.

Well, I hope things will get settled. That's not right :(

Simi wrote: "Well, I hope things will get settled. That's not right :("

Thanks. It makes me wonder how many unknown authors out there like me had been subjected to exploitation of their intellectual property. I had experienced it back in 2003 in Denmark when an illustrator used punchlines from my books to make commercials. When i contacted him he refused to talk to me. The law in Denmark is not like in USA pertaining copyrights, he knew it, so he got away with it. I understand that in USA it is a matter of federal law. I can only praise USA for it and wish Denmark could learn from USA. Commercial companies like his are always on the hunt of new ideas, but i have learned not to trust people, so i thought. I guess i will never learn that we live in a predatory world. I can only advice other authors to have an agent and a good lawyer before you render books and materials, because even when the copyrights law is on our side in theory, in practice reality is pretty gruesome.

Well, sadly, I don't have an agent. I just self publish my books. Though, I think it might be bad for me, considering that there are people who want to steal my work.

Angel wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Angel, thank you. I could only wish I had..."

I know it must be horribly frustrating but don't let it depress you. Think of it this way: Your writing was so good and your storyline..."

Angel wrote: "Sorry, Stephan, but it's not likely that an attorney will take your matter on a contingency fee basis. Most likely, they will ask for a retainer fee and you can expect to pay a pretty penny before ..."

Angel Hello,

It has come to a dead end. But I refuse to let it go. I have finished the litigation file, and found more than 75 similarities in my analysis; I know they have stolen materials from my books, but the media do not respond and I am still waiting for a reply from a very powerful lawyer. The series are based on the plot of my books with the two heroes as interdependent characters, particularly in the fusion of these characters. I was alerted by it when the devil becomes mortal around Catrine/Chloe. If you wish I can send you the 25 pages litigation form to prove that I have a case. How can they do this to people and get away with it? You know I wish I could inform the actors about this theft, just so that they will know the truth. Do you think they have the power to make a difference? As I said things came to a dead end and I feel devastated by the whole thing. I keep asking myself, ‘how is it possible?’ I really wish to know how the actors of the series will react when they find out the truth that their boss based his series on my books. He never replied my emails

Stephan wrote: "Angel wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Angel, thank you. I could only wish I had..."

I know it must be horribly frustrating but don't let it depress you. Think of it this way: Your writing was so good and ..."

I hope you'll win the case. This sounds serious

Simi wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Angel wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Angel, thank you. I could only wish I had..."

I know it must be horribly frustrating but don't let it depress you. Think of it this way: Your writing ..."

Thanks, i intend to publish the 25 pages litigation form either as a book or as part of a published book called 'Notes from exile'. It is really humiliating for me to be in this position right now. I cannot wait years for trials and raise expenses i don't have, i want people to know the truth now. At least the truth will be out there and the actors will know the real nature of their team of authors. Now i know why J.D Salinger hated the film industry so much. You can't trust them. Note: even the media is part of the elite. I'm surprised no one wants to help me in the media. We, independent authors are marked as unworthy, i reckon. We can only support each other and hope that the establishment, some day, will treat us equally .

I could spread the word, if you want me to

Simi wrote: "I could spread the word, if you want me to"

Thanks, by all means
Cheers

Stephan wrote: "Simi wrote: "I could spread the word, if you want me to"

Thanks, by all means
Cheers"v

You're welcome ^^

Simi wrote: "Stephan wrote: "Simi wrote: "I could spread the word, if you want me to"

Thanks, by all means
Cheers"v

You're welcome ^^"

Is it possible to contact the FBI from abroad?

I think?

Why? You're thinking of dragging them into copyright case?

Simi wrote: "I think?

Why? You're thinking of dragging them into copyright case?"

Yes, it is a federal offence. I might go to the embassy and ask for legal advice. I couldnt Imagine other authors in my situation getting over it. It is theft. I have debts, unemployed, while others are thriving on my works, it is outraging.

I'm sorry to hear that. :( I wish you good luck. Hopefully, everything will be alright

Stephan wrote: "Hello everyone,
The creator of ‘Lucifer’ (the TV series) stole some of my ideas and plots from my book‘The adventures of Catrine and the devil’. It would be too obvious that he violated my copyrigh..."

Unfortunately, this is a difficult situation. When you submit a book or treatment to a production company, many of them ask you to sign off on a waiver stating something like "Since it is possible for writers to come up with similar ideas, you agree not to claim infringement if we later produce material similar...." etc, etc.
You own the copyright to your original material, but there are a few things that cannot be copyrighted, primarily facts and ideas. So, for example, if you have an idea for a novel or teleplay about a girl who falls in love with Satan, and later, a production company - even one to whom you submitted your material - produces a television show about a girl who falls in love with Satan (or Lucifer or Beelzebub), you would probably have a very difficult time proving that their infringed upon your material.
You may want to check out the "ultimate" copyright information website: http://www.benedict.com which has some helpful information about how copyright works, with some very interesting cases. I would also recommend Pierce O'Donnell's book, "Fatal Subtraction" about the Art Buchwald/Coming to America case, one case where an infringement issue was successfully litigated as a "breach of contract" issue.
Also, infringement and plagiarism are not the same - plagiarism is when someone submits or publishes your copyrighted material word-for-word and presents it as theirs.

Fellow authors,
Lawyers demand 500 bucks an hour plus 25 k retainer,
Do yourselves a Big favor, find an agent and protect your copyrights and dont send your books to Hollywood. It is a burrow of vipers...
Peace

Thank you everyone who gave me advice here, I'm indebted to you all. As it is from today the truth is out. I have published a book that reveals the theft of my intellectual property. Feel free to find it on my blog if you're interested.
I wish everyone here success and best of luck
Stephan

It looks like this discussion is pretty much closed, but I wanted to ask if you put a copyright on your book.
If there's no copyright on the book, then technically it's in the Public Domain, even though it's your own intellectual property. If the book doesn't legally belong to your name, then the government can't touch the company for stealing it from you. Yes, it was immoral and wrong, but one hundred percent legal.
Unless you put a copyright on before they released their plagiarized version. In that case, you have nothing to worry about in court. They'll have to pay you a bunch of money when they lose.

A. J.

A. J. Deschene wrote: "It looks like this discussion is pretty much closed, but I wanted to ask if you put a copyright on your book.
If there's no copyright on the book, then technically it's in the Public Domain, even t..."
Yes i did put the copyrights statement, i just hope a good lawyer will read the litigation case in my book and take upon the case, so far money Down the drain and loss of creative energy. It is petty and ugly to steal like that, but i decided to stop the circus of greedy lawyers. I know other authors would have freaked out had it happened to them. Imagine how it feels when someone else profit on your labor. My solace is that the truth is out there. I could only hope the actors would find out some day where their boss Got the inspirations. Just the truth, thats all. Thanks.

One of the reasons you probably aren't getting much traction on a legal case is the character of Lucifer (that the TV series is based on) has been around since 1989. There was also a comic series in the mid-2000s. Well before you wrote your book.

I don't know how closely the show follows the comics, but it might be worth checking them (if you haven't already), just in case.

Sephira wrote: "One of the reasons you probably aren't getting much traction on a legal case is the character of Lucifer (that the TV series is based on) has been around since 1989. There was also a comic series i..."

Sephira, hello

Yes, I have investigated into it after I made the analysis, and it appears that they have used the comics as a pretext.

Here is a quote by a member of Amazon who gave the Lucifer TV series a negative regarding the guise of the comics.

'
I'm disappointed in the series
ByDarrin K. Brownon June 6, 2016
Format: Prime VideoVerified Purchase
I expected to see more of the Neil Gaiman Sandman version of Lucifer. This version is basically a perv with a few powers and a temper problem. He's nowhere near as complex as Gaiman originally wrote him. I'm disappointed in the series. I expected to get a dose of the Sandman universe but it looks like the character has been watered down to the point of being banal... '


Either way, everything matches in timeline and contents ragerding my books and the promotions of them. They did it and got away with it, so far...
All the best