UK Amazon Kindle Forum discussion

Interesting article, plus an interesting experiment

https://www.theguardian.com/books/201...

I saw that yesterday! Definitely an interesting read.

As someone struggling to establish initial sales, it's been pretty frustrating seeing that there are somehow already sites hosting pirated copies of my book...

Mind you I've seen sites claiming to host copies of a book of mine that hadn't yet been released! (In that it was still with my proof reader, but I'd started advertising it)
I suppose it could be a fine example of the reach of pre-launch advertising :-)

Oh, I've run across those as well! One seems to pop up for any search term you can imagine, sooner or later.

Going to such sites is a good way to infect your device with malware.

I agree, David. A friend (from another forum) went to see one of his offered on a freebie site. He's an IT specialist and he said his malware alerts were pinging off everywhere. Sometimes you get more than a free book!

It's amazing how many people who'd never steal a paperback, because they're not a thief, have no issue with stealing an ebook.

If people don't want to pay for books, then there are loads offered for free by the authors and/or they can go to the library.

Yes, I've always regarded some of the 'free' sites as basically a form of plishing aiming to get malware onto your computer.
But one problem with the web now is that so much is 'free' that a lot of people pretty well expect everything to be free

Jim wrote: "But one problem with the web now is that so much is 'free' that a lot of people pretty well expect everything to be free ..."

And I can't go that way - I only have the one book, and it's going to be a while before the second is up.

I am still trying to figure out the proper strategy for that one.

I have a short story collection which is free, in the hope that those who enjoy it will go on to buy my other books. I've no idea if they do, or they just go on to look for more free books.

Alicia wrote: "And I can't go that way - I only have the one book, and it's going to be a while before the second is up.

I am still trying to figure out the proper strategy for that one. "

I'm in exactly the same position!

I've also been using Instafreebie to give away sample chapters, but I've not seen many follow-through sales yet.

I don't want the readers who expect free. Not my tribe. And they tend to leave very bad reviews - because they are not in my tribe.

Don't tell me 167K is too long or needs editing unless you're used to Ken Follett and Umberto Eco, because that's the kind of books I'm writing. And it will take two more of them to tell the whole story. Some indies have to aim for that niche - we can't all be fast genre writers.

I write for readers who will eventually try indies who write 'their kind of book.' If you look at the Author Earnings posts, you can see that divide happening in the past, as indies have taken over a lot of the categories traditional publishers used to consider their own. And it takes time (plus personal reasons make me deathly slow).

My debut novel 'Grace's Turmoil' is to be published by Devine Destinies next month. Having taken 3 yuears to write this 96,000 word tombe the last thing I'd do is make it free (even if my publisher would let me). I know a number of authors who make their books free, or mega cheap to build up a following. I think that's a flawed strategy and that most of their readers will jump ship once they start to charge. Although, there may be a few who love the author enough to stay loyal. I wouldn't go the freebie route even if I had 20 years to spare but at the age of 73 that's unlikely.

I have the first book of a trilogy permanently free. So far almost 15,000 copies have been downloaded (an average of ten a day, outside of direct advertising) keeping the book fairly high in the top 100 free fantasy kindle chart. Those downloads, along with Amazon posting also read emails due to the numbers downloaded, attract sales of books 2 & 3, with a conversion rate of around 4%, making them my most consistently selling titles. Hopefully, some of those readers then go on to try other titles. Therein, I'd say free can work, if done in the correct way and with a strategy in mind.

I agree, David - it can work for the right author in the right circumstances. If I had a series I might make the first one free, or very cheap, in the hope of gaining readers for the following books.

My problem there is I need my first book to do well enough to sell the publisher on a series...

The other problem is that people who download the first copy free because it's pirated are probably going to download the second copy from the pirate free as well :-(

Only if they enjoyed the first one, Jim.

Jim wrote: "The other problem is that people who download the first copy free because it's pirated are probably going to download the second copy from the pirate free as well :-("

Indeed. I was looking at it only from the point of genuine giveaways.

David wrote

Indeed. I was looking at it only from the point of genuine giveaways. "

Me too. People who download pirated books will probably always do that rather than buying, if they can find a pirated version.

The big publishers know a thing or two about selling books and they almost never give them away. They may reduce an older book in order to publicise a newer book and will occasionally offer the first book in a series cheaper in order to get readers started, but that's about it.

Of course, Amazon will only let you give stuff away in certain circumstances and when it comes to the making money side of things, they know stuff.

Big publishers have many more options open to them for getting the name of an unknown author out into the public eye, so they don't need to do giveaways. Except they often do, via Netgalley, the cost of which is beyond most of us, and would likely not prove to be fruitful anyway.

I think PG Wodehouse had the best of it. He discusses publishing and promotion in his book Cocktail Time

“It has been well said that an author who expects results from a first novel is in a position similar to that of a man who drops a rose petal down the Grand Canyon of Arizona and listens for the echo.”

and also in Uncle Dynamite

“Too often when a publisher entertains an author at the midday meal a rather sombre note tinges the table talk. The host is apt to sigh a good deal and to choose as the theme of his remarks, the hardness of the times, the stagnant condition of the book trade and the growing price of pulp paper. And when his guest tries to cheer him up by suggesting that these disadvantages may be offset by a spirited policy of publicity, he sighs again and says that eulogies of an author’s work displayed in the press at the publisher’s expense are of little or no value, the only advertising that counts being – how shall he put it –well, what he might perhaps describe as word-of-mouth advertising. “

Wow. Didn't know I've been paraphrasing Wodehouse for years!

Patti (baconater) wrote: "Wow. Didn't know I've been paraphrasing Wodehouse for years!"

I shall merely reply that you are indeed as wise as him

anything else could get me into no end of trouble :-)

You may already be courting disaster.

Jim wrote: "I think PG Wodehouse had the best of it. He discusses publishing and promotion in his book Cocktail Time

“It has been well said that an author who expects results from a first novel is in a positi..."

But it was a HEAVY rose petal!

You can always take comfort from the thoughts that:
1. A person visiting something that represents itself as a source of pirated reading material is more likely to find their device pwned than they are to find what they are looking for, for why else would the site go to the trouble of advertising obscure pirated wares from which they will extract no monetary value?
2. Any person who does succeed in downloading a copy of your book would likely never have bought it, so it isn't a lost sale.

Yes to all the usual arguments, but I don't like being used as bait.

Every penny from my books goes to a charity but I am regularly offered copies (so I presume other people are offered them also) of my own books, from sources who are obviously not going to give money to the charity.

Similarly, I have seen secondhand copies of my print books offered on Amazon for over £100. None of that will go to my charity.

Vic wrote: Similarly, I have seen secondhand copies of my print books offered on Amazon for over £100. None of that will go to my charity.

I doubt that anyone parting with £100 would end up possessing your tome. Offers like that shout 'Scam!' from the roof-tops!

David wrote: "Vic wrote: Similarly, I have seen secondhand copies of my print books offered on Amazon for over £100. None of that will go to my charity.

I doubt that anyone parting with £100 would end up posses..."

Of course - it is clearly worth £500. :-)