Goodreads Authors/Readers discussion

My thriller novel, “The True Virus”, takes place during the last Gaza/Israeli war. This recent outbreak of hostilities between Israel and the Hamas terrorists in Gaza brings back memories of what I found during my research about the tensions between these two countries. The last conflict ended in January of 2009 with a cease fire. Therefore, I knew that an incident like the kidnapping and killing of the three Israeli teens and subsequent killing of a Palestinian youth in retaliation would spark another skirmish between both sides. My only hope is that this doesn’t end being a major war between not just Gaza and Israel but also the rest of the Palestinians could get involved.
When I wrote my novel, I tried to present through the use of subplots and characters from both sides the reasoning and feelings of the Israelis and Palestinians. It was hard and next to impossible to be neutral. I don’t know if there will ever be peace over there.
What are your thoughts on these recent hostilities between these two countries?

It took an almighty war to bring Europe to any kind of lasting peace. And wars fuelled by religious zeal are the most intractable of all.
Things may improve a little when the tyrannies of the Arab countries are finally overturned but don't hold your breath.

Neither side in this conflict believe they can come to a rapprochement with the other, even though the citizenry of both are desperately hoping for one. They feel they cannot trust the other side by making any concessions as they fear for it will lead to crushing defeat. Meanwhile Israel builds an apartheid wall, steals land in which to do it, steals water by redirecting water courses, has an aerial bombardment on some of the densest packed urban areas in the world, no matter how accurate these laser guided missiles, there are always innocents killed and they are not meeting like with like - mortar rockets being met with attack helicopter rockets. All of these I would say are war crimes and yet Israel proceeds with impunity as the world stands by tutting at their actions because of who Israel's powerful friends are. I'm afraid there is no solution, just periodic flare-ups like this one. And the greater problem is that it fuels recruitment to terror groups like ISIS & other Al Qaeda inspired groups as the recruits seek to right the injustices as they see it. The four gunmen who tried to sail into Israel yesterday I'm betting were not Palestinian at all, but foreign fighters as might be currently found in Iraq or Syria.

"My Flying Spaghetti Monster is better than yours!"

Did you know that in Israeli cities on the border of the Gaza strip everyone has a bomb shelter? In Sderot there are over 200 bomb shelters. There are no outside playgrounds. Bomb alarms go off every day and citizens know they have 15 seconds to get to a bomb shelter. Over 50% of children in Sderot present with symptoms of PTSD. I don't think that we can know what it is like to be on either side of this conflict. I think that unless we are living in the middle of it we can't imagine it and we certainly should be careful about our judgments on those who do live in the middle of it.

Terrible. Some quarters are out to sell guns and bullets to make profits that's for sure.

Becky wrote: "Did you know that in Israeli cities on the border of the Gaza strip everyone has a bomb shelter? In Sderot there are over 200 bomb shelters. There are no outside playgrounds. Bomb alarms go off eve..."

Absolutely.

Even though I am sympathetic towards the Israeli nation and their claims to what they consider their territory, land, country, etc. I do understand the claims and arguments coming from the Palestinians. It is very unfortunate that this area has been used and abused by outside forces and the people who reside within these lands end up being just pawns, dating back to the Roman Empire and beyond.

I suppose my biggest issue with the Palestinian people or claim over this area is that ethnically, and I may be wrong in this, many Palestinian peoples are related to the Lebonese or Jordanians, or even the Syrians, so why dont these countries welcome these people into their borders. For the ethnic Jews (Hebrew) they have been displaced so many times.

Anyways, just my two cents.

Christopher Patterson
A Chance Beginning

Firstly I am a member of the same ethnicity. I have heard the spiritual leader of that ethnicity/religion in the UK talk in terms of Israel's ordained territory as per the Old testament and that was all that counted in the matter. I have lived and grown up with a very one-eyed view from my community of the situation in Israel/Palestine. My family gave blood for Israelis in the 1973 war and hosted wounded Israeli soldiers when their vet groups organised tours in the 1970s and 80s. I always steered clear of getting involved in arguments on the issue and instead I was more concerned with the situation on my geographical doorstep of Northern Ireland. But when Britain produced its own suicide bombers on our underground network, I could no longer keep my distance from the issues involved. I did my research and I wrote a book about how a British citizen undergoes that slow transformation into someone who declares war on their own country. it's a book that honours the intricacies and complexities of such psychologies and makes few judgements. And now as our citizens enlist for fighting alongside ISIS in Syria and Iraq, the issue is as live as ever. Everyone in the UK is scratching their heads and wringing their hands about how this can happen. Not me, my book dealt with all this 5 years ago and is still absolutely relevant. So yes, I will dare make pronouncements on the Israel/Palestine situation.

I studied these issues many years ago from both points of view. I'm very unsympathetic to both sides.

Stan wrote: "I studied these issues many years ago from both points of view. I'm very unsympathetic to both sides."

Exactly, which is where we currently end up in the mess they are in

Hamas and the Moslem Brotherhood are terrorist organizations that have united in their fight against Israel, Jews and Christians and in fact anyone who wants to think and act independently. Walls are built to keep terrorists out and civilians safe. The one in Israel is 3 miles long and the rest of the border is divided by a fence. There is a barrier around the White House and many buildings in the US to keep our elected officials and ordinary people safe.
Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East, a place with healthy debates in uncensored newspaper and media, and with elections from voters who are men and women and of all religions. Where else in the Middle East does this occur? We need to support Israel and said no to terrorists who have no regard for the lives of their own men, women and children. Then war can stop and perhaps peace can begin.

In the age of open sky, I don't think prejudice,ignorance and misinformation will stand out for long.

Susan wrote: "Hamas and the Moslem Brotherhood are terrorist organizations that have united in their fight against Israel, Jews and Christians and in fact anyone who wants to think and act independently. Walls a..."

Wake up, Susan. Peace is never going to come to that section of the world. Never.

I disagreed. History have shown that a just leader could bring peace to the region. Being just is the key, no matter whether you are Jews, Christians or Muslims.

Well, I suspect people are going to think I'm kidding about this, but I'm of the opinion that that whole part of the world should be declared the Free Abrahamic International Theocratic History Land and turned into a giant religious theme park: FAITHland. There should be a Jesus themed fish and loaves restaurant, a Moses monorail and a Muhammad dance hall. There should be a casino on the site of the Dome of the Rock, the Holy Sepulchre should be turned into a wine bar and the Wailing Wall should be covered with neon signs advertising Coke, McDonald's or any other standard, corporate mass market swill. The Walk on Waterslide. The Menora Mall. The Real Housewives of Mecca.

The idea of any religious state (Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu, Sikh, Zen, Shinto or Rasta) at all strikes me as being ridiculous and fundamentally flawed. There should be no attempt at creating so-called Kingdom of God on Earth. Any attempt to bring one about is inevitably (if not automatically) corrupt and corrupting, and should be recognized as one of the errors of history rather than something to aspire to in some delusional soon-to-be-ended-by-the-Apocolypse-anyway thinking.

S. wrote: "I disagreed. History have shown that a just leader could bring peace to the region. Being just is the key, no matter whether you are Jews, Christians or Muslims."

That region has a tradition of having the worst political leaders.

Jerusalem should have been created as a UN world city, not owned by any one of the 3 monoatheist religions it plays host to. But that ship sailed.

Israel may well be a democracy but their democratic system allows the nutcases to wield a disproportionate amount of power.

It's a mess. Always has been and always will be until both sides agree they can live in peace together, or one side utterly destroys the other.

IMO, the problems began before Israel was even created. Or rather, the problems began with the way the state was created. People like Menachem Begin and Yitzhak Shamir engaged in violent actions to force the creation of the Jewish state, and were denounced at the time by many prominent Jewish leaders such as Sidney Hook and Hannah Arendt.

In a letter to the New York Times on December 4, 1948, these prominent Jews condemned their actions as “fascist” and espousing “an admixture of ultra-nationalism, religious mysticism and racial superiority.”

Albert Einstein, who also signed that letter, had the following to say about the Jewish state (this from a speech originally given to the National Labor Committee for Palestine on April 17, 1938 and then republished by Einstein after Israel’s creation):

"I should much rather see reasonable agreement with the Arabs on the basis of living together in peace than the creation of a Jewish state. Apart from the practical considerations, my awareness of the essential nature of Judaism resists the idea of a Jewish state with borders, an army, and a measure of temporal power no matter how modest. I am afraid of the inner damage Judaism will sustain – especially from the development of a narrow nationalism within our own ranks, against which we have already had to fight without a Jewish state."

Source for much of the above -- http://dissidentvoice.org/2010/01/ein...

NOW...I think what we see in Palestine with the likes of Hamas is basically exactly the same mistake reflected on the opposite side of the debate. The Palestinians are giving Israel a taste of its own bitter medicine, while Israel is responding as the iron-fisted oppressors.

And Hamas's actions are just as wrongheaded as the actions of Zionists back in 1948, though so far they haven't been nearly as brutal or effective (reference the Deir Yassin massacre).

So basically there are no innocents in this struggle as far as the political leaders go. And it'll all just keep ending in tears unless some miraculous reconciliation can take place.

Basically both sides have to "change their heads and the rest will come after."

Good luck with that.

Does anyone who has posted here live in Israel or the Middle East? Maybe if we don't live there we should stay out of it. I am not Jewish or Arabic. I don't know what it feels like to have in my history millions of my people killed. I don't think I have the right to judge the actions of people who have lived with that level of hatred.

Becky wrote: "Does anyone who has posted here live in Israel or the Middle East? Maybe if we don't live there we should stay out of it. I am not Jewish or Arabic. I don't know what it feels like to have in my history millions of my people killed. I don't think I have the right to judge the actions of people who have lived with that level of hatred."

I appreciate a call for folks to mind their own business. It's a good thing for people to bear in mind in any particular issue.

However, I have to say I think "live and let live" breaks down when it turns into "live and let kill each other." At that point, it starts to become other people's business. That's especially the case when both sides take (or have taken) a lot of foreign aid. And when it comes to this particular part of the world, things tend to spill out onto the rest of us in terms of political conflict, economics, military actions and even the T word. (Whisper: terrorism. I'd argue that terrorism is over-stated very often as a justification for political manipulation, but it is a factor, and we can't pretend it doesn't exist.)

So, no, I don't live in Israel, nor in the Middle East. But the politics of that region has more than once jumped up and influenced the politics where I do live, so commenting is not all about judging people from afar. Try to understand where they are coming from? Sure. Stay out of it under the assumption that it's nobody else's business? I don't think that works out well for anybody.

Both communities have diaspora which means the issues export from beyond that very narrow strip of land being contested. When you grow up in one or other of those diaspora, then you are saturated in the politics, the propaganda and the issues. You are probably taken on trips to the 'homeland' and fed an even more remorseless diet of the ethnic party line. So yes, I do feel emboldened to contribute to the debate. More than that, I've written novels on the subject. Whether I go with the flow of the political line of my community, or stand in opposition to it, I am still very much defined by it.

Since my new biotech thriller novel, “The True Virus”, takes place during the last Gaza/Israeli war, I had to do a lot of research. At the beginning, I sided with Israel. I even had a Hamas bioterrorist hack into the main CIA computer. But as I soon discovered, Israel wasn’t that innocent in the way they invaded Gaza. Therefore, I decided to create subplots involving a family living in Gaza while at the same time I created characters in the Israeli Defense force. I tried to stay neutral as the author and developed points of view from both sides.
Now that my novel is available, I would be pleased to hear from those who decide to read my book and comment on how I handle this delicate situation. However, you can just read the excerpts below and get an idea of how I tried to accomplish this task.
It just so happens that during the month of July, my novel is only $0.99 as a Kindle book.
http://www.amazon.com/True-Virus-Thri...


The following excerpt from my book has my main character interviewing the Palestinian President – Mahmond Abbas. Abbas’s responses are taken from some comments he has made in the past.

[John followed up with yet another question involving Gaza. “Do you see any end to this recent Gaza conflict?”
“Yes, we will see the last day of this military display in the Gaza Strip and move on to rebuilding areas which were destroyed by Israel. We will continue to follow up on these issues and our main goal is to prevent a situation where the Gaza Strip would be turned into a big prison. The Gaza Strip should be open to the world and the West Bank.”
John changed the line of questioning away from Gaza. “Do you see any chance of a peace agreement between Israel and Palestine?”
Abbas looked directly at the camera as he answered, “Until Israel withdraws completely and the Palestinian state is established, there can be no peace. Peace and security cannot be guaranteed by the construction of walls, by the erections of checkpoints and the confiscation of land, but rather the recognitions of rights.”
Knowing that they needed to get on with the main purpose of their mission here in the West Bank, John decided to ask his final question. “What is your hope for the future of Palestine?”
Ralph adjusted the camera lens for a close-up as Abbas answered. “There is a difficult mission ahead – to build our state, to achieve security for our people, to provide a good life for our people, to give our prisoners freedom, our fugitives a life of dignity and to reach our goal of an independent state. We affirm that we want to live in peace, security and stability next to the state of Israel.”]

Here’s another excerpt depicting a conversation between two members of the Israeli Defense Forces just before they invade Gaza.
[Sergeant Epstein knew that Lieutenant Shulman was aware that he was a veteran of Operation Rainbow which was an Israeli military campaign against Gaza in May of 2004. The main objective of this new assault was to clear terrorist infrastructure and find smuggling tunnels in and around Rafah. So since they would be entering the same territory as the 2004 battle, he knew his expertise would be important in this clash. Therefore, with confidence he said. “Believe me sir; there will be lots of these Al-Qassam fighters left. These damn Palestinians know how to hide. I’ve been up against these bastards before. Most of them are hiding in homes behind women and children. Our jets have been told not to fire at civilian targets, that’s why most of the Hamas militants are still over there. We can’t worry about civilians. As far as I’m concerned everyone over there is our enemy.”
“Sergeant, Captain Auerbach gave us orders not to fire on any civilians unless they fire at us.”
“Sir, I’ve seen buddies of mine killed by some innocent looking Palestinian woman running up to them looking like she was going to give them a big hug, but instead blew herself up and them too.”
“I understand sergeant, but we must try and not kill civilians. Our orders are to be the infantry support for Captain Auerbach’s tanks. We are only to engage with Al-Qassam fighters who fire at us.”
“Sir, they all look alike. All I’m trying to say is to watch out. When you see one of them running at you, point your gun at them and yell halt. If they don’t stop, then kill them.”
“Okay sergeant, I’ll agree to that. You’ve been through this before, so I’ll trust your judgment.”]

Gary wrote: "Well, I suspect people are going to think I'm kidding about this, but I'm of the opinion that that whole part of the world should be declared the Free Abrahamic International Theocratic History Lan..."

Ha! Abrahamic Theme Park. As good an an idea as any at the moment, Gary

yes and the lateral thinking guru Edward de Bono also proposed that due to a lack of zinc in the diets of people of the desert, that both Israelis and Palestinians could reduce enmities by consuming Marmite (vegemite for any Australians here). That's as good a plan as any in this madhouse of a region. It's a lateral solution I'll give him that.

Here's more on the plan:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wor...

Charles wrote: "Since my new biotech thriller novel, “The True Virus”, takes place during the last Gaza/Israeli war, I had to do a lot of research. At the beginning, I sided with Israel. I even had a Hamas bioterr...

Are orders are to be the infantry support "

Our orders are... ?