SciFi and Fantasy Book Club discussion

https://io9.gizmodo.com/amazons-new-l...

Amazon will be creating a new series based on the world of Middle-Earth, apparently set prior to LOTR. I'm not sure how I feel about this.

Well, I seem to recall seeing a trailer for Beren and Luthien, so who knows, maybe they are using the source material that Christopher used?

Amazon's put out good content in the past. I do get nervous at things that take license with a beloved idea. Why use Middle Earth but not the stories set there? Unless it's taking bits from the Silmarilion and removing the headache inducing parts? Did they torture a bunch of writers and make them all read that thing? Because if not, just make a generic fantasy world and leave this one alone.

I'm more open to the idea of them mining stories from the history of Middle Earth as opposed to just doing another adaptation of LOTR. I also think that Amazon has put out some good stuff so...I'm cautiously optimistic.

I hope it's a huge success and leads to them developing more fantasy series.

All I know is Man in the High Tower is AMaze-balls. And the best kids shows are Amazon originals....

Kim wrote: "https://io9.gizmodo.com/amazons-new-l...

Amazon will be creating a new series based on the world of Middle-Earth, apparently set prior to LOTR. I'..."

Well now will this be reading or will it be in movie form? If reading I would be willing to give it a go as I loved the whole LOTR series and have read them several times. First time being when I was in 8th grade; which believe me it's been what seems like a lifetime ago. Another plus it will have going for it is the fact that it's will be in my favorite genre as well.

I'm not looking forward to yet another onscreen interpretation of Middle-Earth after six films - especially since The Hobbit trilogy was such a mess. I wrote in more detail about my thoughts on Amazon's planned LOTR series on Medium:

https://medium.com/@RodFaulkner/why-a...

Terez wrote: "I'm not looking forward to yet another onscreen interpretation of Middle-Earth after six films - especially since The Hobbit trilogy was such a mess. I wrote in more detail about my thoughts on Ama..."

I'll have to agree with you a lot of time the movie adaptions of some books just don't do the books any justice at all. When I heard the Hobbit was being done into a movie I thought cool. So I went and got the books from the library and re-read them to refresh my memory, after all, it was high school since I read them. And when the Hobbit came out it was a real mess.

Since then I tend not to watch movies that were adapted from books.

Terez wrote: "I'm not looking forward to yet another onscreen interpretation of Middle-Earth after six films - especially since The Hobbit trilogy was such a mess. I wrote in more detail about my thoughts on Ama..."

That's a really good article. (My only minor quibble being that the Harry Potter movies were developed concurrently with the LotR movies rather than in reaction to them.) I was likewise blown away when I heard it cost Amazon 250 million just for the rights. And they are only *partial* rights, which is crazy. They're going to have to make LotR shows forever to amortize that investment.

I did just read that Bezos' personal fortune topped $100 billion due to Black Friday sales, so he can just write a check to cover it, but dayum.

Rachel wrote: "All I know is Man in the High Tower is AMaze-balls."

True that. I wonder how many people have seen it, although it does tick the "critical acclaim" checkbox Terez's article mentions. But it didn't engender (heh) the cultural conversation that Hulu's adaptation of The Handmaid's Tale did, which is one of those cases of coincidence conspiring to make fiction relevant by having the national zeitgeist already on that particular topic. The Handmaid's Tale TV series slots neatly between the Women's March in protest against Trump and the outpouring of stories about sexual assault from disgusting men in power.

The only other time I can recall events lining up on-topic this perfectly was when the movie The China Syndrome was released just after the Three Mile Island disaster, and that was minor by comparison.

John wrote: "Terez wrote: "I'm not looking forward to yet another onscreen interpretation of Middle-Earth after six films - especially since The Hobbit trilogy was such a mess. I wrote in more detail about my t..."

The movies spend an inordinate amount of time in the battles as compared with the books and leave out some of the best parts and best characters. I did NOT watch all of the movies for LOTR and did NOT even bother with The Hobbit. If it's going to be a long enough mini-series it could work better because they won't have to leave out so much, etc.

I think the actual LOTR plot is overdone, but I would definitely welcome other stories, whether they're from the canon or something Amazon makes up. In particular, I would very much enjoy something from the Unfinished Tales — the forging of the rings and the fall of Númenor would be very cool.

Karin wrote: "The movies spend an inordinate amount of time in the battles as compared with the books and leave out some of the best parts and best characters. "

That was my problem with the LOTR movies also. I hope the Amazon version can improve it.

Trike wrote: " I was likewise blown away when I heard it cost Amazon 250 million just for the rights. And they are only *partial* rights, which is crazy. They're going to have to make LotR shows forever to amortize that investment."

I remember back in the 90's when companies were shedding businesses in an attempt to focus on 'core competencies'. Now I see companies like Amazon and Google getting into anything and everything. Original movie content to food to books? Something's got to give at some point.

Let me just say this. This better be the All Tom Bombadil, All The Time channel. That's really all I want.

Allison wrote: "Let me just say this. This better be the All Tom Bombadil, All The Time channel. That's really all I want."

LOL! I know, it was such a crime they left him out of the movies.

But honestly, I have zero hopes for this series. They'll cock it all up, I'm quite sure.

Allison wrote: "Let me just say this. This better be the All Tom Bombadil, All The Time channel. That's really all I want."

I'm with you, Allison. I'd watch a Tom Bombadil series for sure.

Shomeret wrote: "Allison wrote: "Let me just say this. This better be the All Tom Bombadil, All The Time channel. That's really all I want."

I'm with you, Allison. I'd watch a Tom Bombadil series for sure."

Doesn't he sing? Would it be a musical, then?

Bruce wrote: "Doesn't he sing? Would it be a musical, then? "

Depending on which parts you focus on, the LotR could be a royal family drama, a war movie, a comedy or a musical. There’s no reason a TV series can’t be all of the above.

Bruce wrote: "Shomeret wrote: "Allison wrote: "Let me just say this. This better be the All Tom Bombadil, All The Time channel. That's really all I want."

I'm with you, Allison. I'd watch a Tom Bombadil series ..."

haha!

I'm with Trike. All of the above! As long as it's all about Tom. Or at least "so much about Tom we can just pretend he's the titular character."

How about darker plotlines closer to LOTR timeline e.g. Saruman's path to darkness, Wormtongue arrives at Edoras and meets Theoden, Sauron consolidating his powers (the Siege and Fall of Minas Ithil), the Fall of Moria, Elrond's wife leaving him and Middle-earth, Battle of Azanulbizar and so on.

When it comes to The Lord of the Rings and related literature, I tend to think less is more.

I liked the first three movies. They had to leave out a great deal by necessity, but they were well done. I would have been happy if they ended there.

I wanted to like The Hobbit movies, but God, they were a train wreck.

With this new series, they will be making up a lot of stuff, and without J.R.R. Tolkien here to oversee it, I'm worried about capturing the "spirit" of the lore.

It could be good. I just find myself unable to get excited about the whole thing.

Joed wrote: "I'd like to see a day in the life of a Ring Wraith--he polishes his ring, he polishes his sword, he mends his cowl, he chases hobbits all over middle earth. Never mind, I like this Tom Bombadil ide..."

Actually, seeing how the nine kings become ringwraiths would be an intriguing story. I’ve always felt that one of the best “fall from grace” or “seduced by the dark side” stories was the corruption of Arthas in Warcraft III. He becomes the personification of evil by trying to do the right thing while trapped between a rock and a hard place, having to make hard choices which ultimately lead to his downfall. Seeing that play out with numerous variations would be fascinating.

Did Tolkien ever go into the backstory of the ringwraiths?

He did, it's described in the Unfinished Tales of Númenor and Middle-Earth. I agree that would be a very cool story to portray, along with the overall fall of Numenor.

Cool, thanks. I’m going to check those out.

Ian McKellen says he'd play Gandalf for Amazon's show if asked.

"Gandalf is 7,000 years old, so I'm not too old," he says. Man has a point.

http://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/new...

You could have them doing the Elf Wars against Melkor. That would be fairly epic.

Dj wrote: "You could have them doing the Elf Wars against Melkor. That would be fairly epic."

I don't think that's what they bought the rights to, but that would be hilarious purely because of how many beautiful people they would have to hire. Everyone was gorgeous back in the First Age!

Just hire the actors they cast in CW shows. All beautiful people.

I'd love to see the Two Trees though.

Abigail wrote: "Dj wrote: "You could have them doing the Elf Wars against Melkor. That would be fairly epic."

I don't think that's what they bought the rights to, but that would be hilarious purely because of how..."

Well except of Melkor, the dwarves, oh and the Humans but they show up late. LOL.

Dj wrote: "Abigail wrote: "Dj wrote: "You could have them doing the Elf Wars against Melkor. That would be fairly epic."

I don't think that's what they bought the rights to, but that would be hilarious purel..."

In the beginning Melkor was super fair of face, yo. He was an "angel" like the rest of them. Sure, he gets ugly later on, but for most of the time that he's called Melkor and not Morgoth he's out there charming the Maiar to his side.

And dwarves are ~beautiful~.

(Humans though, who cares.)

Abigail wrote: "Dj wrote: "Abigail wrote: "Dj wrote: "You could have them doing the Elf Wars against Melkor. That would be fairly epic."

I don't think that's what they bought the rights to, but that would be hila..."

Dwarves are beautiful? Your a ZZ Top fan aren't you?

I forgot about Shelob. Now there is an ugly to the core character, but they could do close ups of some Auzzie Spider for those shots.

Dj wrote: "Dwarves are beautiful? Your a ZZ Top fan aren't you?."

My favorite bit about ZZ Top is that the drummer’s last name is Beard and he’s the only one who doesn’t have one.

Trike wrote: "Dj wrote: "Dwarves are beautiful? Your a ZZ Top fan aren't you?."

My favorite bit about ZZ Top is that the drummer’s last name is Beard and he’s the only one who doesn’t have one."

Guess he can't really grow one that long so that is why he doesn't do that. I do like some of the music they have. But then I am somewhat eclectic when it comes to music

One day around the turn of the century while standing in line at the music store I overheard a teenager say, “I have eclectic music tastes. I listen to everything from Britney Spears to Christina Aguilera.”

I was like 0.o

I was standing there with CDs by Duke Ellington, Sarah McLachlan, Santana, Rancid, and Steve Reich.

Trike wrote: "One day around the turn of the century while standing in line at the music store I overheard a teenager say, “I have eclectic music tastes. I listen to everything from Britney Spears to Christina A..."

How long ago was that there? After all I didn't know anyone bought cds any more to be honest with you. I know I've not bought any in years. As for my taste in music oldies to classic rock to coutnry.

John wrote: "How long ago was that there? After all I didn't know anyone bought cds any more to be honest with you. "

“Around the turn of the century” is a pretty big clue.

Trike wrote: "John wrote: "How long ago was that there? After all I didn't know anyone bought cds any more to be honest with you. "

“Around the turn of the century” is a pretty big clue."

I don't know how I missed that one there. Guess that's what happens when I answer these post at 2am after working 12 hours.

John wrote: "Trike wrote: "One day around the turn of the century while standing in line at the music store I overheard a teenager say, “I have eclectic music tastes. I listen to everything from Britney Spears ..."

I buy CDS and then rip them onto my iTunes on my Computer. I like having physical copies of my music and I like the full disk since then I can find gems like 'No Anchovies Please' or 'Rivendell'

Plus, after the apocalypse the party is at my place. You fancy “store it in the cloud” types will be SOL without tuneage.

Trike wrote: "Plus, after the apocalypse the party is at my place. You fancy “store it in the cloud” types will be SOL without tuneage."

If and when the apocalypse happens I don't think we've got will have to worry about where we store our music or anything else.

John wrote: "Trike wrote: "Plus, after the apocalypse the party is at my place. You fancy “store it in the cloud” types will be SOL without tuneage."

If and when the apocalypse happens I don't think we've got will have to worry about where we store our music or anything else. “

...says the man who doesn’t live in the woods in the middle of nowhere. :p

I used to live next to a prime nuclear target (Wright-Patt), so I never bothered thinking about The Day After, but now I’m rather off the beaten track. My (few) neighbors are all very tech-savvy and have gardens, so we’ve been looking into getting solar power for the entire neighborhood since our power goes out all the time. (My dogsitter tells me the power has gone out twice since Friday and they’re expecting another big storm for Christmas.) We just voted to allow windmills.

Each house has its own well and septic. Half of us have electric or hybrid cars, so we don’t need guzzleline (#MadMaxVoice). Once we have solar and wind, we’ll be a self-contained community. If any of us were religious we could also be a cult. But we’re all heathens, sadly.

You big city folks will have to eat each other while we kick out the jams.

Trike wrote: "John wrote: "Trike wrote: "Plus, after the apocalypse the party is at my place. You fancy “store it in the cloud” types will be SOL without tuneage."

If and when the apocalypse happens I don't thi..."

I might be a city folk but I've been taught to live off the land as well. You see I've had various survival training in the Marine Corps not to mention I can hunt and fish so I won't no problems when it comes to surviving.

Yeah, but you won’t be able to get out of town. 😵☠️

Trike wrote: "Yeah, but you won’t be able to get out of town. 😵☠️"

I've got 2 feet and I'm not afrait to use them.

So, I just got done watching this segment on YouTube about the new Amazon series for Lord of the Rings. It was about what fans wanted in the new series. Not sure that he actually talked to anyone but he did give a synopsis of the source material that Amazon has to draw from for the new series.

Seems that the new series is going to be based on the 2nd Age so it does have a lot of ground it could cover. Years worth without even working hard at it. Depending on how Amazon does it, the show could be epic. We will have to wait and see how it all turns out.

Dj wrote: "So, I just got done watching this segment on YouTube about the new Amazon series for Lord of the Rings. It was about what fans wanted in the new series. Not sure that he actually talked to anyone b..."

Link please?

Michele wrote: "Dj wrote: "So, I just got done watching this segment on YouTube about the new Amazon series for Lord of the Rings. It was about what fans wanted in the new series. Not sure that he actually talked ..."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PP0XR...

Did Tolkien ever go into the backstory of the ringwraiths?

I was actively mapping out a story to tell The Ride of the Nine (as I called it) when they changed the copyright laws to 75 years protection instead of 50.

I was so looking forward to writing that but it can't be published (except by Tolkien's estate or licensee) until 2048, so...no point.

If I can't write it myself I'd love to read (or watch) the story of the Ringwraiths and their part in the War of the Ring.