Reading 1001 discussion

London Fields is a black comic, murder mystery novel by British writer Martin Amis, published in 1989. Regarded by Amis's readership as possibly his strongest novel, the tone gradually shifts from high comedy, interspersed with deep personal introspections, to a dark sense of foreboding and eventually panic at the approach of the deadline, or "horror day", the climactic scene alluded to on the very first page.

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London Fields - Martin Amis
et sometime in the near future, London Fields is a darkly comic interpretation of the ennui and decadence of Western civilization. Through examining the lives of four protagonists from different strata of society, Amis depicts the boredom, triviality, and violence of contemporary England.

1. Critics have frequently taken Martin Amis to task for the apparent relish with which he depicts his misogynistic characters’ predilections, which range from pornography and erotic underwear to rape, as well as his portrayal of female characters as the passive victims of male violence. https://link.springer.com/chapter/10....
Discuss this aspect of the book.

Generic questions taken from litlovers.
2. How did you experience the book? Were you engaged immediately, or did it take you a while to
"get into it"? How did you feel reading it—amused,
sad, disturbed, confused, bored...?

3. Describe/comment on the main characters—personality traits, motivations, and inner qualities.

Are the main characters dynamic—changing or maturing by the end of the book? Do they learn about themselves, how the world works and their role in it?

4. Discuss the plot:
• Is it engaging—do you find the story interesting?
• Is this a plot-driven book—a fast-paced page-turner?
• Does the plot unfold slowly with a focus on character?
• Were you surprised by complications, twists & turns?
• Did you find the plot predictable, even formulaic?

5. Talk about the book's structure.
• Is it a continuous story...or interlocking short stories?
• Does the time-line move forward chronologically?
• Does time shift back & forth from past to present?
• Is there a single viewpoint or shifting viewpoints?
• Why might the author have chosen to tell the story
the way he or she did?
• What difference does the structure make in the way
you read or understand the book?

6. What main ideas—themes—does the author explore? (Consider the title, often a clue to a theme.) Does the author use symbols to reinforce the main ideas? (See our free LitCourses on both Symbol and Theme.)

7. What passages strike you as insightful, even profound? Perhaps a bit of dialog that's funny or poignant or that encapsulates a character? Maybe there's a particular comment that states the book's thematic concerns? Any quotes?

8. Is the ending satisfying? If so, why? If not, why not...and how would you change it?

Reviews. You can place them here but

Don't forget to add your reviews over here: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

I am just to go with general answers to all these questions.

How I experienced the book - I never fully got into it for a book described as a thriller the pacing was glacially slow, even when events were building to their climax I found it easy to put the book down and walk away.

Characters - all the characters were unlikeable in their way, I think Amis was playing with satire here but for me satire has never really appealed and I never felt connected to any character. I had no interest in how things would end up or who would kill who.

Women and sex - I think this book is very much a product of its time (1989) sexual assault and rape were common but the victims were either ignored or blamed for what happened it is only now in the light of the #metoo movement that we can actually realise how badly let down women were in the 80s & 90s. At the time of publication the humour about rape while controversial was probably still acceptable in this day and age it is very much unacceptable and it was the repeated "comic" references to rape that made this book uncomfortable reading for me.

Quotes - "Only parents and torturers and janitors of holocausts are asked to stand the sound of so much human grief." page 33 and already the way humour is used is beginning to feel uncomfortable.

""Indeed, burgling, when viewed in Darwinian terms, was clearly approaching a crisis. Burglars were finding that everywhere had been burgled. Burglars were forever bumping into one another, stepping on the toes of other burglars. There were burglar jams on rooftops and stairways, on groaning fire escapes. Burglars were being burgled by fellow burglars and doing the same back." Page 276 I did find this section amusing.

Overall I rate this book as 3 stars I did enjoy some of the humour, I enjoyed the references to other books however I don't feel this is the book that the blurb promised and the sexual and racist humour put me off the story.

1. Nicola Six, a pseudonym,( she plans to die on the 6th, and she is of indeterminate but vaguely foreign origin) is a stereotype of a male fantasy. She says so herself. She is actually a caricature of male fantasy in three different and wildly different versions: the porn star, the clueless virgin and the knowing writer of her own fate. She is improbably successful at manipulating the male protagonists to her will, so she is the antithesis of a passive victim. She also has an endless wardrobe of pitchperfect costumes to reinforce the fantasies she creates. There indeed is rape, child abuse, underage sex, violence, usually gratuitous, and an indelible description of a futuristic London. The novel is a kind of dystopian view of the end of the world as it might have happened at the Millenium. Amis writes vividly and sometimes impossibly comicly about the underbelly of humanity. Does he relish it, absolutely!

2. The novel starts, well, in a novel way. We know that there is going to be a murder. The murderee is known, what is not known, but is revealed at the end, is who the murderer is. What is never adequately explained is why. The first part describes the characters so acutely that the reader is drawn in immediately. These characters are exceptional!
3. I have already described Nicola Six. She is a manipulator, capable of successfully impersonating everyone from a social worker to a darts supporter. Keith Talent is the most exquisitely drawn low life in fiction. He is dumb, illiterate, insatiable sexually and a serial abuser of women. At the same time he is attractive to these women and is also intriguing for the reluctant reader. Guy is the Foil. He is a clueless, well meaning upperclass twit. Samson Young is a New Yorker with writer's block, who has done a house swap to Notting Hill and whose descriptions of London are the novel's biggest highlight. He is dying, but grasps at the chance to write Nicola's story because he has no original ideas. These characters have no right to be together in a novel, but Amis' skill is to have us believe that their lives could intersect in this way.

4. The plot is quite original. Young is writing the story, and he intejects at various points, so it is metafiction. Mostly the story is told in the third person, but there are Young's version of things to muddle it up. Sometimes the same bit of the plot is told in the third person, then Young's version retells it. Occasionally we get one of the character's version of events as well.
5.Because the novel was set a decade into the future, which is now almost a couple of decades into the past, the reader's experience is many layered. First one assumes who the murderer will be, then it seems too obvious, so it must be the other guy, then one doubts that too. Sometimes it is not obvious who the narrator is. This is a book which rewards careful reading.

6. There is the theme of what constitutes literary fiction, and that Young is writing the story as it goes along. There are interludes when the process of writing is analysed. There is also the bleak view of Notting Hill and the possible end of the world at the Millenium. The weather is unusual and ominous and there is talk of the Crisis, for which people are having safety drills, but the exact threat is not explicit. Then there is the Death of Love, which was an alternative title, I believe.
7. The descriptions of London, Notting Hill in particular, from the viewpoint of a recently arrived American are especially brilliant. There was one passage that was eerily prescient.
"For some time now I have thought it possible to believe that America was going insane. In her own way. And why not?
Countries go insane like people go insane; and all over the world countries reclined on couches or sat in darkened rooms chewing dihydrocodeine and Temazepan or lay in boiling baths or twisted in straitjackets or stood there banging their heads against the padded walls. Some had been insane all their lives, and some had gone insane and then got better again and then gone insane again. America: America had had her neuroses before, like when she tried giving up drink, like when she started finding enemies within, like when she thought she could rule the world; but she had always gotten better again. But now she was going insane, and that was the necessary condition.
In a way she was never like anywhere else. Most places are just something, but America had to mean something too, hence her vulnerability - to make-believe, to false memory, false destiny. And finally it looked as though the riveting struggle with illusion was over, and America had lost."
Funny, original and uncanningly apt.
8. This was a re-read for me, because it was on my TBR shelf last August. Then I read it as a who dunnit, but I was intrigued by the question of why, and I had not paid much attention to the Samson Young character. I raced through the last few chapters to finish within the month. But it had lingered in my mind. I was in London at the Millenium and I wanted to think a bit more about what I might have projected about what it would be like from the perspective of a decade earlier. There was much I missed the first time round such as the U.S. President's wife, who was named Faith, and who was terminally ill. And that Guy's wife was named Hope. Also the contrast between the indulged nightmare that was Marmaduke, and the sweet but abused baby Kim. This was one book that rewarded a re-read. I am almost ready to up my assessment to 5 stars!

Critics have frequently taken Martin Amis to task for the apparent relish with which he depicts his misogynistic characters’ predilections, which range from pornography and erotic underwear to rape, as well as his portrayal of female characters as the passive victims of male violence. https://link.springer.com/chapter/10....
Discuss this aspect of the book.

1 and 2) I did have difficulties with reading about rape, child abuse and the incredible mistreatment of a whole slew of female and male characters. Although Amis clearly doesn't treat his male characters well, he is even worse with most of his female characters. Nicole is clearly empowered and and does not appear to be anyone's victim although she is the 'murderee' which by definition makes her some new kind of victim. The fact that she expressly wants to die for no articulated reason than that she is getting too old doesn't sit well either. However, when I was reading about the characters in their settings I was completely taken, engaged and rolling with it. It was when I put the book down that I became confused and a bit ill regarding my own reactions to the book.

3. Describe/comment on the main characters—personality traits, motivations, and inner qualities.

Are the main characters dynamic—changing or maturing by the end of the book? Do they learn about themselves, how the world works and their role in it?

Both Keith and Guy do learn over the course of the book although Guy does not appear to learn more than how incredibly foolish he is. Keith's enlightenment has only vaguely to do with a glimpse of broadening potential that is then taken away from him. It isn't as if either of their basic character changed. Keith however, is incredibly dynamic throughout. Life is to be lived to it's fullest although "full" is rather a heavy load of horror. Nicole, by virtue of being able to in some way perceive the future, does not get to experience anything truly new although she plays multiple characters and roles throughout the book. Samson is the only character who truly matures, and gets to experience unique new behaviors including intense jealously and selfless acts of kindness. It is Samson who actually becomes just a touch more self aware as his very existence dims.

4 and 5) This murder mystery is not a page turning who done it. Although one reads on because of some interest in exactly who and why, I also knew from very early on that that was not the point. The reader knows there will be twists but the plot twists are not as important as exactly how these characters will manipulate, plot, plead, and overall react to what is happening around them and to them. There are large sections of the book when I felt as if Amis needed a different editor, someone who would tell him to shorten, condense, move it along and then of course, I would not be able to find a paragraph that I thought needed to come out. I kept coming back to the thought that his writing has the quality of masturbation (a big theme in the book overall), in that it was all going to take as long as it took....and Amis wasn't writing for me but for himself and here I was being voyeuristic and getting to enjoy the ride.

6 and 7) I particularly enjoyed the time spent in the Black Cross with all its lovely caste/class of characters. There are definitely themes about what humans are doing to the planet and what humans are doing to each other in a largely political sense that play nicely in the background. Amis' insight into how people daydream about their lives just seemed incredibly spot on. I liked the way he paired his characters: Hope and Faith, Kim and Marmaduke, Missy and Cornelia, Guy and Keith so you could always see another side so to speak.

I (like Pip) also liked this bit about America written over 30 years ago:

"In a way she was never like anywhere else. Most places just are something, but America had to mean something too, hence her vulnerability - to make-believe, to false memory, false destiny. And finally it looked as though the riveting struggle with illusion was over, and American had lost."

8. Is the ending satisfying? If so, why? If not, why not...and how would you change it?

The ending was satisfying to me. I still am not sure about how I feel about the violence against women, but still, I thought it was a truly brilliant book.

I forgot to mention the theme of conservation, it was a strong one so I don't know how I managed not to mention it! Also I wondered if non UK readers would realise that all the shenanigans on November 5th was because it was Guy Fawkes night.

I guessed who the murderer was from the first meeting in the Black Cross so that might have made the ending feel flat for me.

I did not know that November 5th was Guy Fawkes day. Thank you for that insight.

1. I have noticed this aspect in his books. This is probably why there are none of his books I can say I've loved. I agree, too, that this book is a product of its time.

2. Even though I didn't care for certain aspects of the story, I felt it is well-written and engaging, and had great character-development.

4 & 5. Overall, I liked the style Amis used to tell the story. I thought the ordering of events and narrative structure was cleverly done. The pacing felt slow to me, however. This story could have been told in half the amount of pages.

7. I found the ending mostly satisfying. I figured out the identity of the killer earlier, so it wasn't a surprise. I did like the way he structured the ending, though.

et sometime in the near future, London Fields is a darkly comic interpretation of the ennui and decadence of Western civilization. Through examining the lives of four protagonists from different strata of society, Amis depicts the boredom, triviality, and violence of contemporary England.

This is all true but there is a whole lot more here. There is the look at fear of death, dying, and the end of the world. A book set in the future, but not science fiction. Rather unique. It also is a lot about writing. An American author dying of writer's block and a successful British author, Mark Asprey (Martin Amis?) and the contract of Keith Talent and Guy Cinch.

1. Critics have frequently taken Martin Amis to task for the apparent relish with which he depicts his misogynistic characters’ predilections, which range from pornography and erotic underwear to rape, as well as his portrayal of female characters as the passive victims of male violence. https://link.springer.com/chapter/10....
Discuss this aspect of the book. This was probably the part of the book that made it the least enjoyable for me but yet it fit the story and developed the "darkly comic interpretation of ennui and decadence" as well as the "different strata of society". The references to violence toward others especially women, and children was a bit over the top and not sure that this was needed to develop the story.

Generic questions taken from litlovers.
2. How did you experience the book? Were you engaged immediately, or did it take you a while to
"get into it"? How did you feel reading it—amused,
sad, disturbed, confused, bored...?
I did not enjoy the book as a "reading experience" but I appreciate the literary devices, expertise of the author. Parts were disturbing.

3. Describe/comment on the main characters—personality traits, motivations, and inner qualities.
Samson Young; dying, trying to overcome writer's block but can't write fiction so using real life
Keith Talent: dart playing, cheat, uneducated in finer aspects of culture, his education is the tabloids and the streets.
Guy Cinch: rich, cultured man, father of a spoiled child and tennis playing wife
Nicola Six: 35 and doesn't want to grow old. She is the antihero
Mark Asprey: successful British author - doppelganger for Martin Amis?

Are the main characters dynamic—changing or maturing by the end of the book? Do they learn about themselves, how the world works and their role in it?
Samson is dying and his death progresses. He is writing, but whether he is successful is never revealed. I am not sure any of these characters get better. Perhaps Keith Talent does.

4. Discuss the plot:
• Is it engaging—do you find the story interesting? not really, but it is unique, creative
• Is this a plot-driven book—a fast-paced page-turner? not a page turner, in fact, probably should be read slow and given thought, there is a lot here
• Does the plot unfold slowly with a focus on character? yes
• Were you surprised by complications, twists & turns? it progresses, we are told where it is going and what is going to happen. We are given two potential murderers. There is a slight twist but you can see it coming
• Did you find the plot predictable, even formulaic? no, it is rather unique. I felt like author was using some Nabokov techniques, there is a lot of literary devices, there is a lot of references to "writing"

5. Talk about the book's structure.
• Is it a continuous story...or interlocking short stories? a continuous story, but we start with the end at least the prediction of the end and then we have the story.
• Does the time-line move forward chronologically? see above
• Does time shift back & forth from past to present? set in near future
• Is there a single viewpoint or shifting viewpoints? the POV is the author Samson Young who tells us he is "reliable.
• Why might the author have chosen to tell the story the way he or she did? he is looking at the various aspects of culture of the postmodern period
• What difference does the structure make in the way you read or understand the book? you read the book, to see how the author is going to accomplish the murder, which he tells you will happen

6. What main ideas—themes—does the author explore? (Consider the title, often a clue to a theme.) Does the author use symbols to reinforce the main ideas? (See our free LitCourses on both Symbol and Theme.)
dying, death, end of the world, youth, unreliable news, writing

7. What passages strike you as insightful, even profound? Perhaps a bit of dialog that's funny or poignant or that encapsulates a character? Maybe there's a particular comment that states the book's thematic concerns? Any quotes? "This is a story of a murder - It hasn't happened yet. But it will.

8. Is the ending satisfying? If so, why? If not, why not...and how would you change it? the end is a bit ambivalent but I think that is not uncommon in this kind of book, we also know what some of the end will be. So not surprised but maybe a bit.

Reviews. I posted my review in the 1001 Reviews thread for London Fields. London Fields

1. Critics have frequently taken Martin Amis to task for the apparent relish with which he depicts his misogynistic characters’ predilections, which range from pornography and erotic underwear to rape, as well as his portrayal of female characters as the passive victims of male violence.

I'm not sure about relish, but yes, there is plenty of all of the above in the book. I had a feeling everything is exaggerated and couldn't really connect with the characters.

Generic questions taken from litlovers.
2. How did you experience the book? Were you engaged immediately, or did it take you a while to
"get into it"? How did you feel reading it—amused,
sad, disturbed, confused, bored...?

it took me a while to get interested. From the beginning it was obvious it was not a book I would pick up myself, and I wanted to read on to avoid coming back to it in the future. Second half of the book was easier to read and somewhat fun.

3. Describe/comment on the main characters—personality traits, motivations, and inner qualities.

Samson Young - desperate dying writer
Keith Talent - as low and awful as could be
Guy Cinch - opposite to Keith, rich, educated
Nicola Six - skilled manipulator, she is leading the story, everyone else are following

4. Discuss the plot:

I wouldn't say I was particularly interested in plot,. It was interesting to follow main characters and see what else they will do.

5, 6, 8

It starts with author telling the murder will happen, who will be murdered and we have a pretty good idea of who will do it, but it's not overly important however who exactly will do it. The story is told in linear manner and the most interesting part for me was to see how Nicole manipulates people around to achieve the result.

I posted my review here: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

I just finished this book on audio, and am coming back here to comment as per newbie rules since I missed this the first time around. I can see that pretty much everyone here enjoyed this book more than I did, and there are some things I appreciate about it more now after reading some of the comments. However, overall I wasn’t particularly engaged by it, which is disappointing considering that I absolutely loved Time’s Arrow.

1) I liked some of the comments others have made here about how Nicola is not a passive victim due to her actually orchestrating her own death. However, yeah, one of the things I didn’t like about this book was the way it seemed to relish misogynistic violence.
2) I was actually bored and only engaged on the surface for most of this book: I guessed the twist ending almost immediately, and just didn’t care about the fates of the characters or their thoughts.
3) Nicola seemed to be insincere as her main trait and I still don’t fully understand her plan. The narrator seemed exploitive but largely in denial about it. Keith is a dirtbag: Guy is a pushover. Maybe I missed it while I was listening on audio, but I didn’t get a lot of depth from these characters or growth.
4) While I enjoyed the conceit of the novel, there was just something about it’s execution that I didn’t find engaging or surprising. It felt like a watered down Burroughs novel. It wasn’t fast paced, with a lot of digressions between the characters.
5) The stories interlock and cumulate at the end, moving forward overall with cuts to inner thoughts and flashbacks frequently. It contributes to the sense of unfolding mystery in the novel, and highlights the self-fulfilling prophecy aspect of Nicola’s diaries.
6) This book explores themes of manipulation and exploitation, as well as the degradation of society, and denial about oneself and others.
7) I was amused by how Nicola gives out the “big Boy’ and “Enola Gay” story and Guy is too thick to understand the reference.
8) Despite my iffy feelings about the book, I wasn’t upset with the ending and it plays into the themes of degradation and denial about what type of people we are.