Into the Forest discussion

I had a discussion recently about the difference between stories that are "Inspired by" fairy tales vs. stories that are a "Re-telling" of fairy tales.

So, of course, I went searching (Googling) to see if anyone had talked about this topic at length, but found nothing.

This is my ideas of the difference:
Inspired by: to me, this means a story might reflect the themes in a particular fairy tale, lessons learned, only imbuing a flavor of the fairy tale characters' personalities and stories

Re-telling: to me, this means a re-telling of the plot of a particular fairy tale, but perhaps in a different time period, or with a twisted ending, in essence, it's re-visiting the original fairy tale story with a fresh perspective

I could use some feedback on what other people in this group (since you're all lovers of fairy tales) think the difference is, perhaps share links in other on line places that talk about the difference, or maybe tell me there is no difference. :) I'm open to any and all answers.

I'd also like to hear what you think these films are, are they re-tellings, or inspired by, or both:
Ever After
Frozen
Maleficent
Snow White and the Huntsman
Tangled
The Princess Bride
Enchanted
Shrek
Mirror Mirror
Ella Enchanted

Please categorize them as I (inspired by) or R (a re-telling) or B (both).

Feel free to add films that I've not mentioned.

Oh, and there are no right or wrong answers. I'm just curious if I'm alone in my view regarding this subject.

And thanks for sharing your views with me!

Shereen wrote: "Oh, and there are no right or wrong answers. I'm just curious if I'm alone in my view regarding this subject..."

I've always found the difference between "inspired by" and "retelling" to be rather subjective, and sometimes even interchangeable. First and foremost, an accurate distinction between the two would depend on whether you define "fairy tale" based on personal standards or on academic ones?

And what about "fractured" fairy tales or mash-ups? Would they fall under retellings or inspired by?

I think examples would best demonstrate my current opinions:

Beauty by Robin McKinley and The Snow Child by Eowyn Ivey are clear-cut retellings. While Boy, Snow, Bird by Helen Oyeyemi and The School for Good and Evil by Soman Chainani would fall under the definition of "inspired by." Then there's Cinder by Marissa Meyer which seems a solid example of a fractured fairy tale. The School for Good and Evil would also fit within fairy tale mash-ups.

Here's how I would classify the movies you listed:

Ever After - Retelling
Frozen - Retelling
Maleficent - Retelling
Snow White and the Huntsman - Retelling
Tangled - Retelling
The Princess Bride - Definitely a fantasy inspired by fairy tale elements.
Enchanted - Inspired by
Shrek - Inspired by
Mirror Mirror - Seems to be a retelling, though I did not watch this one. (I overdosed on Julia Roberts in the 80s and 90s, and now I cannot watch her.)
Ella Enchanted - Retelling

I realize I asked more questions than answered, but I haven't yet formulated by own belief on the subject. I just have gut reactions and opinions at this point.

I love your questions and I had totally forgotten about fractured fairy tales!

Good listing of books, Leah, I haven't read Cinder, but I've heard about it.

And not sure what Mash-up means. Is that a bit like Grimm (where they have several different tales mixed up)? Love that show. And maybe the Once Upon A Time series? Love that one too!

Thanks for cataloging the movies. Those kind of line up with what I was thinking. Though now I'm wondering if Shrek is a mash-up (depends on the definition of what mash-up is :)

I think your definitions are pretty similar to mine, Shereen. I think "inspired by" means that a story has a general "fairy tale feel," or that a single element is reminiscent of an existing fairy tell. Whereas I think a retelling has to make an effort to include several plot points from the original tale, even if it does so in different ways. As such, I would consider Cinder a retelling because many of the plot "staples" of the Cinderella story remain intact -- the cruel stepfamily, the ball, the lost "slipper" (or "leg"), etc. I consider Frozen to be "inspired by" because it bears SO little resemblance to "The Snow Queen," except that it includes a character with wintry powers. Other than that, I agree with Leah's classification of the movie.

I just finished reading The Real Boy by Anne Ursu, and I would consider this to be a book that falls within the "inspired by" category. It has allusions to pinnochio as implied in the title, but doesn't include any of the key pinnochio plot points, instead just playing with the idea of children made from wood.

Shereen wrote: "And not sure what Mash-up means. Is that a bit like Grimm (where they have several different tales mixed up)? Love that show. And maybe the Once Upon A Time series? Love that one too!"

Yep, that's exactly what I think when I see "mash-up" - the two TV shows you listed, definitely. And I think Shrek would certainly fit as a mash-up. As for books, The Sisters Grimm series by Michael Buckley was the first to come to mind.

Lacey wrote: "I consider Frozen to be "inspired by"..."

I was going back and forth on that one. Since I haven't read the original, I was just going on what I'd heard of it plus the overall "feel" of the movie.

Lacey wrote: "I think "inspired by" means that a story has a general "fairy tale feel," or that a single element is reminiscent of an existing fairy ... a retelling has to make an effort to include several plot points from the original tale..."

When I first sat to think about these two definitions, the second part, about plot points in a re-telling, resonated with me the most.

To summarize, this is how everything seems to sort out:

A Re-Telling:
Ever After - Cinderella
Maleficent - Sleeping Beauty
Snow White and the Huntsman
Mirror Mirror - Snow White
Ella Enchanted - Cinderella
Tangled - Rapunzel
Beauty
The Snow Child
Cinder (though Lacy thinks this might be a fractured)

Inspired by:
The Princess Bride
Frozen
The Real Boy
Boy, Snow, Bird

Mash-Up:
Enchanted (I'm putting it here since it seems to have more than 1 fairytale in it)
Once Upon a Time
Grimm
Shrek
The School for Good and Evil

So, looking at the listing above, these are my takeaways:
1) A Re-telling is way more popular (since that list seems to be the longest)
2) Inspired By can veer so far from the original fairytale's plot points, or incorporate too few of them, to truly classify it a re-telling (kind of like an uncle who looks like the rest of the family but no one wants to sit next to him, yet everyone talks about him when he's not in the room. :)
3) Mash-up is just plain having fun with fairy tales.
4) I'm still unclear what's a Fractured fairytale fits into all this, though I'm tempted to put Blancanieves (a Spanish fairytale silent movie) in that category.

Just FYI: Ella Enchanted, both the book and the movie, are retellings of Cinderella.

Fractured fairy tales are stories that take a fairy tale (or fairy tales) then twist it in an unexpected way. For instance, Cinder not only placed Cinderella in a sci-fi world but made her a cyborg. In The Stepsister Scheme Cinderella (called Danielle), Sleeping Beauty (Talia) and Snow White (Snow) were a trio of kick-ass chicks who team up to rescue the prince.

I think originally fractured fairy tales were ones that made readers laugh aka were humorous. See Fractured Fairy Tales for an idea. But I've heard people mention Angela Carter's work during discussions of fractured fairy tales as well as Gregory Maguire's.

I think the only reason the list of retellings is longer is because more people recognize that genre/label. It certainly offers a broad selection of books and movies, which leads me to believe there's a lot lumped into one place. After all, couldn't retelling be used as an umbrella term that includes inspired by, mash-ups AND fractured fairy tales?

Shereen wrote: "I had a discussion recently about the difference between stories that are "Inspired by" fairy tales vs. stories that are a "Re-telling" of fairy tales.So, of course, I went searching (Googling) t..."

I agree with your definitions Shereen.
"Inspired" for me means just that, inspired. It means the story does not actually retell the original tale as it is, rather works with certain ideas or motifs in the original tale.

On the other hand when a work is a "Re-telling", I expect it to more or less follow the original tale. However as you say, the story might take place in a different time period or have a few changes but still more or less contain the main elements of the original tale.

I only fairly recently heard the term "fractured" in this group when we were creating our 2014 Challenge. So I am also not 100% clear on what the difference would be. I've never heard the term "mash up" until now!

I have not seen most of the movies you mention so I can't comment.

However for novels I agree with Leah that Beauty by Robin McKinley would be a classic example of a Beauty and the Beast retelling. Where as your book A Beastly Scandal I would consider more "inspired" by Beauty and the Beast.
I also think many books fall somewhere in between, for example The True Story of Hansel and Gretel by Louise Murphy
The novel follows the original tale exactly. However it takes place during WW2, the witch is good not evil and there is no magic. So would it be a retelling, fractured or inspired by? I am not so sure.

Leah wrote: "Ella Enchanted, both the book and the movie, are re-tellings of Cinderella..."
Thanks Leah, I had Ella's story confused, fixed now.

Though I'm intrigued by your question:
Leah wrote: "...couldn't retelling be used an an umbrella term that includes inspired by, mash-ups AND fractured fairy tales

We might need more input from people on this provocative question. :)

For now, I'm adjusting my definitions from what everyone has said so far (leaving out my book, since I'm biased there) and re-do my listing:
---------------------
Re-telling:
Re-tells the plot of a particular fairy tale, but perhaps in a different time period, re-visiting the original fairy tale story with a fresh perspective, perhaps expanding on the original concept but ***staying true to the original tale's plot points*** (as done with Maleficent)

Example of Re-Telling:
Ever After - Cinderella
Ella Enchanted - Cinderella
Cinder
Maleficent - Sleeping Beauty
Snow White and the Huntsman
Mirror Mirror - Snow White
Tangled - Rapunzel
Beauty
The Snow Child
The True Story of Hansel and Gretel

----------------
Inspired by: A story that reflects the themes in a particular fairy tale, lessons learned, only imbuing a flavor of the fairy tale characters' personalities and stories. ***The story does not actually retell the original tale as it is,*** rather works with certain ideas or motifs in the original tale.

Example of Inspired By:
The Princess Bride
Frozen
Enchanted (edited: Alicia's suggestion)
The Real Boy
Boy, Snow, Bird

------------------
Mash-Up:
Several different tales mixed up.

Example of Mash-Up:
Enchanted (I'm putting it here since it seems to have more than 1 fairytale in it)
Once Upon a Time
Grimm
Shrek
The School for Good and Evil

----------------------
Fractured: Take a fairy tale (or fairy tales) then twist it in an unexpected way. Originally ones that made readers laugh, aka were humorous.

Examples of Fractured:
Fractured Fairy Tales
Angela Carter's work
Gregory Maguire's work
Blancanieves (a Spanish fairytale silent movie)

I'm starting to get a clearer picture of these 4 types of fairytale variations.

Alicia wrote: Ever After - Haven't seen..."

Of all of those movies listed, my favorite "romantic" fairy tale was Ever After. If you get a chance to pick one of those movies to see, I'd vote for that one. :)