Fans of Angelfall discussion

Katie wrote: "I agree after reading what you guys have to say. Do you guys think Raffe killed the daughter of men? Someone asked what Beliel meant when he said Raffe went through them. Ism just wondering what th..."

I couldn't imagine him killing them, i presume they were killed by nephillim/hellions. i wonder why he had companions anyway its not like he needed help he's a badass angel lol

Hahaha Raffe is awesome!! :) I seriously want to see Raffe fight like a huge battle with another angel or something,

Katie wrote: "Hahaha Raffe is awesome!! :) I seriously want to see Raffe fight like a huge battle with another angel or something,"

OMG yes! he needs to lead the angels into another epic battle! also would like to meet some of his angel friends!

Raffe better kick Uriel's arse and Laylah need get a slap too!

if he becomes fallen or human ( which i doubt is possible) i will cry!

Me too!!! I love these books so much I have a feeling Susan won't disappoint. :)

Me too!!! I love these books so much I have a feeling Susan won't disappoint. :)

i hope not! she did so well with the first two books, i have faith in her! only thing im worried about really is Raffe's fate!

Same here!!! I'm so nervous I bet when I get the book I'll be to thrilled and scared to open it hahaha.. But I'm excited! :) I love her books and I know End of Days will be great. :)

Same here!!! I'm so nervous I bet when I get the book I'll be to thrilled and scared to open it hahaha.. But I'm excited! :) I love her books and I know End of Days will be great. :)

Same here!!! I'm so nervous I bet when I get the book I'll be to thrilled and scared to open it hahaha.. But I'm excited! :) I love her books and I know End of Days will be great. :)

Same here!!! I'm so nervous I bet when I get the book I'll be to thrilled and scared to open it hahaha.. But I'm excited! :) I love her books and I know End of Days will be great. :)

Same here!!! I'm so nervous I bet when I get the book I'll be to thrilled and scared to open it hahaha.. But I'm excited! :) I love her books and I know End of Days will be great. :)

Same here!!! I'm so nervous I bet when I get the book I'll be to thrilled and scared to open it hahaha.. But I'm excited! :) I love her books and I know End of Days will be great. :)

i've asked this question on here before but no one has answered me did raffe come down with Gabriel and the other angels? i know he was on earth for centuries...

Hmm I never thought of that.. I think he did.

I had that impression too, i just don't get raffes timeline at all lol, but the angels in aerie haven't seen raffe in ages?

Maybe that means he was on earth for centuries I mean we know he was hunting down hybrids. So I think he was. But does that mean when the Angels attacked earth that Is why Raffe didn't know about why they took Paige and stuff? And why he knew so much about earth life and stuff? Like tv and everything?

it dosen't say though in the books that he came down with them if he was doing stuff on earth and none of the angels have seen him can't of come down with them, when uriel says gabriel came down with 'two other archangels' i presumed he meant raffe and michael i guess he was on about himself and michael and raffe wont of known the angels were coming down but he would of seen gabriel get shot on tv.

Oh I see! Thanks for explaining

I know i just came to that conclusion lol do you think gabriel is dead?

Just because he was shot down doesn't mean he died. I mean he could of got away. They heal fast right? Maybe an Angel helped him or something. Raffe healed his wounds.

Yes i those angels in the aerie got like buried under rubbel and they didnt die, i think hes been killed or captured by uriel and i think maybe gabriel came down in the first place was because of the hellion/nephillim raffe was hunting just a wild guess

Yeah it's possible. I mean didn't Penryn say that Gabriel was shot down she didn't really say he died that could be a plot twist.

yes i doubt the bullets could of killed him i remeber raffe saying angels are really hard to kill and only an angel sword can kill them so i cant see how the humans killed him tbh and never mentions his body but the angels all seems to think hes dead and if uriel came down with gabriel he could of been behind it, it would be cool if gabriel appears in the end. i think penryn is a descendant of one of the watchers wives, raffe saved some of them and they could of remarried would explain why penryn mum is trying to protect her and stuff and why her mum is crazy

Yeah that was what I was thinking too!!! What if the gold wings on the cover are Gabriel's????

Are they gold?? they look white with black tips, what does it mean? what the gold light shining about??

The wings looked kinda gold.

Yeah but that because the lights shining on them

Oh. Okay, I think I was so excited I didn't really look at it.

lol they're white so i think they are raffes but god knows why they have black tips

Hmmm maybe they represent his dark past? Idk lol

good thinking lol i cant wait to see beliels memories of raffe!

I think it might just be the light...

i thought they were shadows too, i suppose makes them looks nicer

The best thing I love about Susan's books is how the second one started. :) at least the third will have Raffe and Penryn together and not separated.

Polly wrote: "Katie wrote: "I agree after reading what you guys have to say. Do you guys think Raffe killed the daughter of men? Someone asked what Beliel meant when he said Raffe went through them. Ism just won..."

I think he may have had companions because in one of the books, it says that Raffe was very lonely throughout the centuries that he had been on earth hunting hellions, so maybe that's why he had temporary companions?

I. Need. This. Book. NOW! I'm dyyyiinnngg! :/

But weren't Raffe's wings "snowy white" as per description in Angelfall? There was no mention of black tips? I would have thought that would have shown up before in Susan's descriptions. Also I thought the wings looked golden and immediately jumped to the conclusion they might be Gabriel's. But the style is very reminiscent of the other books so I just don't know now. More interesting I think is the fact they are shattered or torn out? Could Raffe really have fallen this time particularly if he chooses Penryn over the Angels in the battle in End of days? I can't wait to find out what Penryn thinks when she gets to touch the sword with Beliel. I can't image she would pass up that offer!!! But we know Beliel can't be trusted.... Right???!!!!! Aghhhhhh!! It's killing me!!!

Polly wrote: "HurrikanKathrina wrote: "Yep, it totally looks like he falls...

I'm more worried about that excerpt though. Can we please discuss the fact that Raffe apparently broke his "No daughters of men" ru..."

Also don't forget he told Penryn in WA HOW HE COULDN't risk anyone (daughters of Men or camp anions) getting close to them as that was how the Hellions would track him down and drag him to hell. Surely if Raffe had done something awful with the daughters of Men he would already be fallen? He says to Uriel he would never go there after seeing what had happened to his fellow Angels and how he had been sent to clear up the nephilium.

Polly wrote: "He didn't break his 'no daughter of men rule' as we know yet, all beliel states is that Raffe has daughter of men companions who wanted to wins his love, they were loyal to him but he wasnt to them..."

You are right! The more I think about it, the more I come to the conclusion that this whole "he's been through Daughter's of men" - business might not have anything to do with Raffe being in any kind of sexual or romantic relationship with them.

I think it could mean that they were companions to him and that they fell in love with him (no surprise there) and felt like they could win his love, too. I think, like Penryn, they might thought they were the only ones for him and when it came to a point where he had to choose between them and something else (himself, his status, wings, idk) he choose against them without second thought and broke their hearts. And that he did that multiple times over the centuries, leaving a trail of broken hearts, but not really caring about it...
And maybe one of those girls was someone Beliel cared about? Because it is personal! . That much is clear from the way Beliel behaves toward Raffe in the books and talks about him in this excerpt.

Now, as to Penryn, do you guys remember that scene in WA, where she says to Raffe that it was kind of "heartbreaking" to watch him after she died (and then she goes on and says "i didn't mean you were heartbroken..."). Now look at what it says in the book there:

"Heart." He looks deeply into the flames. "Breaking." The sounds flow out between his lips like they're new to him, like he's never said them before. He nods. "Yeah. I suppose that's one way to put it."

I had to think about that line when Beliel says that he's heartless. It kind of fits. It seems as in WA, it's the first time Raffe ever experienced getting heartbroken himself...

HurrikanKathrina wrote: "Polly wrote: "He didn't break his 'no daughter of men rule' as we know yet, all beliel states is that Raffe has daughter of men companions who wanted to wins his love, they were loyal to him but he..."

Totally like your take on this HK . Raffe had to be hard and ruthless to get the job done, he is after all a warrior, he has no empathy or care about Daughters of men , he's on Earth to do cold bloodied killing of the Nephilium, an abomination, I think he describes them as. All the descriptions Susan gives, through Penryn's eyes to his arrogance and his despise of Humans only changes because of Penryn, She is clearly so different from all the other daughter's of men, in her feistiness, kick-ass, proud. Kind, loyal and steadfast behaviour which he begins to see the value of and respect which turns into a higher regard (even if at the beginning it's like having a pet... Ironic as that is how Beliel first treats Penryn's sister, there are definitely paralells between Raffe and Beliel I think). And yes, the revenge that Beliel wants to extract on Raffe, means it is definitely personal between them!

I agree with everyone. I think the whole "he's been through Daughter's of men" means those human girls fell inlove with Raffe but he REJECTED them.

HurrikanKathrina wrote: "I had to think about that line when Beliel says that he's heartless. It kind of fits. It seems as in WA, it's the first time Raffe ever experienced getting heartbroken himself... .."

True!

I totally agree. These discussions just keep getting better!! I'm ready for some answers and awesome battle scenes! I'm ready for the End of Days!!

Nikita wrote: "Polly wrote: "Katie wrote: "I agree after reading what you guys have to say. Do you guys think Raffe killed the daughter of men? Someone asked what Beliel meant when he said Raffe went through them..."

I totally agree i couldn't imagine raffe having any romantic feelings for any of his companions, he knows the rules better than anyone and his own angels were condemned and their wives he knows the risk, besides in his flashback of saving the wives he didnt seems to like humans he said they're ugly and smell like pigs lol and uriel said he was really preachy about the whole daughter of man and angels, you could tell from the first two books that he hasnt felt anything for anyone until penryn. i cant blame the companions for falling for him though raffe is gorgeous :p lol i think his companions were killed by hellions they hunted raffe because he saved the wives and im guessing they wont stop until they get revenge on raffe and kill the wives and maybe descendants... i think that penryn is related to one of them.

laylah said angels wernt made to be alone so i presume thats why he had companions, its abit weird how beliel knows all his companions why has he been stalking raffe? and the hellions are just demons right? is that why beliel been stalking him.

Hmm I thought Penryn was a hybrid or something lol but a descendant is good too. Well bad for her lol idk

anyone got any theories to why penryn mums crazy? and what she is protecting penryn from?

Maybe Penryns mom is protecting her from the Helllions I mean it could explain the combat classes, her mom talking to demons and stuff. Not really sure.

Remember earlier when we were debating if Raffe would fall? Well it made me think of when Pen and Raffe get that room in the hotel and Raffe had to use the elevator instead of flying and when he went into their room he went straight to the window and saw all his angel friends flying and how sad he was because he couldn't fly??

Remember earlier when we were debating if Raffe would fall? Well it made me think of when Pen and Raffe get that room in the hotel and Raffe had to use the elevator instead of flying and when he went into their room he went straight to the window and saw all his angel friends flying and how sad he was because he couldn't fly??

Katie wrote: "Hmm I thought Penryn was a hybrid or something lol but a descendant is good too. Well bad for her lol idk"

I don't think shes a hybrid, i'm certain penryn is human, the reasons i think pernyn is a descendant of the watchers wives

in wa raffe saves some of the wives we don't know their fates, i presume they live but the hellions woudlnt stop hunting for them because of what they did, so they would need to stick close to raffe.

they may of remarried and had children, im not sure if the hellions would be bothered about there children though but if they did and penryn was a descendant that would explain why her mums crazy because the wives went mad didnt they? and that might be the reason penryns mum tries to protect penryn and paige because the hellions are after them.

penryns mum makes them take self defense lessons and wear the stars on their clothes why else than protect them from demons.

about raffe being fallen i doubt it his sword didnt reject him, i think he was just sad because he lost his wings.

'a startling revelation about Raffe’s past unleashes dark forces that threaten them all.'

do you think that could be the reason gabriel came down?