You'll love this one...!! A book club & more discussion

I have just been reading this article which states that analysis carried out by Goodreads has discovered that a large number of readers prefer reading books by authors of the same sex as them and many only select books by same-sex authors (although this seems to be largely unintentional).

http://www.theguardian.com/books/2014...

I'm curious about what others think about this survey. Do you prefer books by authors of the same sex or the opposite? Or do you not really have a preference? Does the sex of an author make you more or less likely to choose a particular book or does it not make any difference at all? Do you find you gravitate towards one gender more than the other due to the types of books you like to read?

Personally, I don't have any preference when it comes to male and female authors. I try to read as widely as possible and I am not influenced by the gender of the author when it comes to choosing what books to read. I like to mix it up and have variety :)

I read it too, interesting!

I don't think I let gender influence me. I don't consider it important and actually find it a bit strange to make the distinction, because all writers are so different and there are no characteristics ALL female authors or ALL male authors have. I have to admit though that a couple of years ago, when I read few books and almost only chicklit, I only read women ;-)

I don't let gender of the author sway what book I read at all :-)

Me neither, doesn't matter to me as long as the cover or blurb is interesting I will read it

I read this and thought it interesting. Great idea for a discussion Lisa!

Out of the books I have read in 2014, approximately 36% were written by women and 64% by men. This year, I took part in a challenge in another group to read more books by female authors so my percentage is possibly slightly higher than the previous year because of this.

I am not swayed by the sex of the author when choosing whether to read a book or not. That said, I do seem to read more books by male authors but this is mainly to do with the genres that I read. On the whole, I read Fantasy and Science Fiction and most authors in these genres are male, apart from the Urban Fantasy genre which there are quite a few female authors.

I don't specifically look one way or the other but I know I read far more male authors. With the books I read I don't think the genres have many female authors though. I do know in urban fntasy there are many female and most of them sway over into the paranormal romance side and that is where I am hesitant seeing female auhors. I have to read a lot of reviews to see how much romance there will be. If little to no e then the female authors put out some excellent selections.

I have read slightly more books by male authors this year so far. Out of the 54 books I have completed, 29 were written by men and 25 by women so the ratio is fairly even. Most of the books I am planning to read in December are also by male authors so the gap will increase a bit more. I have read a fair few fantasy books this year so I think that it is why I have gravitated slightly more towards male authors.

I also did a quick count, and if I made no mistakes I read 29 books by male and 31 by female authors.

Well i have a 2 hr drive to thansgiving #2 tomorrow if my wife drives I'll take the time to count em up. It would be interesting

I don't care about the gender of the author, and I commented in that article posted here in GR that I think statistics based on gender are, for the most part, meaningless as readers really actually choose their books by genre.

I don't chose books based on the gender of the author. Like Sarah mentioned, the genres I prefer may dictate that somewhat. I will have to peruse my 2014 reads when I get home to see if there are any staggering statistics.

Same here...

Of the 113 books that I've read in 2014, 65 were male authors. (8 of those were written by Stephen King.) 48 books were written by female authors.

I'm not sure what that all proves, quite frankly.

I do not go out of my way to choose the gender of the author of the books I read, but because of genre, it looks like males are the authors of most of my books. Of the 129 books completed this year so far, 87 were by males and 42 were by females. Series accounted for many of the books but the male to female ratio there was 50/50, I just read more of the books by the male authors.

Gavin wrote: "I don't care about the gender of the author, and I commented in that article posted here in GR that I think statistics based on gender are, for the most part, meaningless as readers really actually..."

*gets her stats nerd on*

Stats are never meaningless. They can be used in a meaningless way of course. While people may not make a conscious choice, I've read research that shows that there is a lot of subconscious thought about it. Some of which is for the reasons Travis highlighted. And also on how female and male authors are marketed.

And even if there isn't a problem (which in some cases there is) it's always interesting. And it does then make people think about why they make their own choices. You can't go wrong with facts, self awareness and interesting in my book ;)

As for me, I've read/reading books 21 by female authors and 16 by male authors this year.

This switches around for me, I think last year was more male heavy. While I have no issues at all reading either gender, I pay a lot of attention to how female authors are marketed.

Unfortunately you can see that a lot of male authors are pushed more by marketing and publishers than women, as well as reviewed by critics, of which there are more males. This is well documented. There are unfortunately a lot of stories about female writers writing gritty thrillers and then the publisher sending back covers with hot pink shoes and glitter on them. As they are women, that must be what the book is about? Or that is what "appeals" to the female market (cyclical thing there... another story)? This then reinforces the idea that women only write for women, which to be fair, can be very true. Publishers then target those types of authors to publish, it fits their market. Again, cyclical.

Just a bit more to explain my comment above. Gender equality is one of my big things I fight for in all areas: books, toys, science education, pay etc. The problem we have now days is that the "big" problems like women not being able to work, are solved, so we think we're all good. What we have now, and what is the hardest fight, is to work out what attitudes we have internalised and have ever thought about that are unequal. That's why stats like this are important, we think about why we read things, why we don't read others. Do we not read male writers as they are marketed as gun toting, unbelievable alien spy novels like Matthew Reilly? Do we not read female writers as we may end up with some romancey, shopping related (wtf?), glittery chick lit?

- Interesting side point, I read a study that showed that guys are slightly off put to read sex scenes from a woman's perspective, were as women read the other way around frequently and are fine with it. We have to be as so much of our culture is from a male perspective -

But thinking about what we do is important. Even if we do the same thing, we've challenged ourselves. YAY! More challenging ideas I say!

I never really realized that even in books there's so much gender inequality, although it makes sense, because as you say, so much in our society is still male-dominated. But even books, it's a shame that gender stereotypes play such a big role and might even put people off reading certain books, just because the cover or description is not doing the book justice but fits stereotypical images.

Wasn't JK Rowling encouraged not to use her full name because boys wouldn't read her books? So much wrong with this world!

JK Rowling, I don't think she's the only one who was encouraged to use just initials rather than first names - there are a number of female authors that this applies to, in particular in the Crime genre. Rowling's a good example too because she marketed her adult crime books under a male pseudonym!

After reading Travis' comment about erring with the female written Urban Fantasy, I would have to admit I'm the same. I don't like overly romantic stuff - a bit of romance and sex is fine in a book, just not the whole book, and I think there are quite a number of female authors who will put this in their stories without fail. It's like a romance is obligatory in a story. Male Urban Fantasy doesn't tend to go down that route.

Also there is a lot of stereotyping in some genres and that may be down to the author or the publisher itself - not all women are the same. I do not read Chick Lit because I'm not in to shopping, doing my nails and makeup, spending horrendous amounts of money getting my hair done, gossiping for hours to my friends on the phone etc. etc. Yes there are many women who do that and therefore will identify with characters in books who do this. But that's not me. Maybe I'm assuming that all Chick Lit is like that and I'm stereotyping the genre now ;-)

That is true about female perspective on sex. That is the only problem I have ever had with Kalayna Price. Descriptions of men and their hot bods. Do I hold it against her. Certainly not. It is only natural for a woman to write about men and vice versa. Exception would be a gay author then it would ve unnatural for them. Perfect case would be women at times faulting Dresden files for Harry's view of women. Most men don't notice most women do. Yet many women stick with Dresden even with that flaw where if it were reversed, I bet most men would quit it.

Exactly Sarah. I have never been one for clothes, hair, shoes, nails, shopping, etc. In fact I avoid shopping as much as possible. But the problem for me is, what am I avoiding because of the active marketing towards that chick lit genre? I have my own biases is my point, so not perfect.

I am so probably really missing out out of some great authors because of my own aversion to a certain idea. Same with romance, but I must say book blogs/vlogs have helped with that. I get people to test read them in a way. You know, outsourcing!

Travis, Dresden is a great example. I don't think Butcher is a bad person or sexist, he's just written a character in a certain way. I wonder if he realised at the time how much it would rub women readers the wrong way? Luckily for him he;s written such a great series that most of us who notice (Lexx is asserting his noticing again, /pats Lexx) that we can groan and move on.

So with you Peggy, so much wrong.

Rusalka wrote: "Gavin wrote: "I don't care about the gender of the author, and I commented in that article posted here in GR that I think statistics based on gender are, for the most part, meaningless as readers r..."
Well, I just don't think this stats say anything, It's like having statistics on what books do left-handed and right-handed people read. But maybe it's subconscious... I swear, the concept of the 'subconscious' gets abused so much in pop culture. Anyway, why we read what we read is indeed a interesting question, but I don't think stats like this do absolutely nothing to answer that question. But, well, seems like no avenue of human entertainment is safe from this pointless gender analysis...

I think you are a bit wrong on the chicklit genre (which you both realize already anyway I think ;-)) I don't read it much anymore, and I too don't like these girly shopping, hair, nails, gossiping, hour-long phone calls, but I have to say that the chicklit books I used to read don't have much of that in them anyway. If you have an aversion for romantic stories though, it might be good to keep away from chicklit!

I have a similar thing with urban fantasy. Many of the book covers show good-looking women in little clothing, and just the fact that it has to be such a cover puts me off reading the genre, even though I might actually like it.

I notice these kind of things in my boyfriend too. He reads action/adventure books mostly, Lee Child, John Sandford, Matthew Reilly, Dan Brown kind of books. He only reads male authors, and I'm not sure how opposed he is to reading female authors in this genre, but a couple of years ago I remember him rejecting a book I suggested to him, same genre, only because it was written by a woman. Maybe he had a really bad experience once? I think now he would not make such a big deal out of it anymore, hopefully. Similarly, I try to get him to read some fantasy books which I read and I think he might like as well, but it seems he still believes I only read chicklit which automatically makes any book I read not suitable for him ;-)

Sarah wrote: "JK Rowling, I don't think she's the only one who was encouraged to use just initials rather than first names - there are a number of female authors that this applies to, in particular in the Crime ..."

Absolutely agree, Sarah. There are so many female authors out there who use initials while male authors write their complete name and I have always wondered about that. It's difficult sometimes to be a women writing thriller/crime.

As for me, I read books by both male and female authors. Half the time I don't even know if the author is male/female (sometimes names can be tricky).

I read 60 books by female authors and 19 books by male authors this year. A huge discrepancy but I guess that's owing to the genres I read.

It makes me mad that women have to change their names or use initials only to get the attention or appreciation they deserve. And that this affects little boys already (as in the JK Rowling example) is even worse.

I wonder though if many women or girls would (either implicitly or explicitly) also expect an action or adventure book (like Harry Potter) to be better when the author is male, or less inclined to try out a new female author in the genre.

Gavin wrote: "Rusalka wrote: "Gavin wrote: "I don't care about the gender of the author, and I commented in that article posted here in GR that I think statistics based on gender are, for the most part, meaningl..."

Fair enough, and please don't take any of these as an attack on you of course :) Everyone can think exactly what they want, I was just defending the poor, misused and abused rep of statistics. Poor little guy.

Agree the concept of subconscious get abused, but you can't deny the fact that you and I and everyone makes decisions based on information/attitudes/things we consider facts/etc that we don't think about. We do it, but sometimes we should stop and wonder why. Like I said before, doesn't mean we have to change, just I think we should think about why we think what we think.

And fair enough about the "pointless gender analysis". I agree, until you are discriminated against every day because of your gender, have your worth judged because of your sexual organs, have your rate of pay determined due to your gender, your intelligence doubted, your performance belittled by a gender associated biological function, I can totally understand why gender analysis would be pointless.

I'm with you Rusalka!

I wonder how making all book covers plain black with no pictures on them would affect our reading habits?!? I do think the cover can sway. Earlier in the year I read a book which had a picture of a rough and ready looking guy on the front - some people I know (off GR) said while it sounded like a good book, they wouldn't have picked it up as it looked too violent, too male. I read it and while there were some bits I wasn't totally happy with, it was a great book. If I had thought like them, I would have missed out on a great book! Another example is Chocolat which I avoided like the plague because it was listed as Chick Lit AND a Romance - yet there was little romance in it and was a fantastic read - made it on to my favourites list too.

I'd be interested in how much female vs male authors earn from their book commissions! I'd also be interested in the percentage of female authors having books accepted versus men.

Peggy wrote: "I think you are a bit wrong on the chicklit genre (which you both realize already anyway I think ;-)) I don't read it much anymore, and I too don't like these girly shopping, hair, nails, gossiping..."

You reckon we can group challenge him to read something you think he would like, male or female? I think he needs to at least give a suggestion from you a try. Peer pressure!

Sarah wrote: "I'm with you Rusalka!

I wonder how making all book covers plain black with no pictures on them would affect our reading habits?!? I do think the cover can sway. Earlier in the year I read a book w..."

Sounds like our plain packaging cigarettes laws. All our cigarette have to be sold in a mottled/khaki green box, with the font in white or black (forget which) Courier new font, 12pt. Takes away the branding possibilities so argument is takes away some of the reasons to smoke, and to start smoking.

Sarah wrote: "I'm with you Rusalka!

I wonder how making all book covers plain black with no pictures on them would affect our reading habits?!? I do think the cover can sway. Earlier in the year I read a book w..."

Haha, I was thinking the exact same thing earlier! Book covers do have a huge effect. Not only covers showing attractive or non-attractive people, but also covers with neutral things, just because of the design. If I browse through books in a shop or online, and I don't have time to read all descriptions, first impressions are based on titles and covers. I'm sure there are great books I missed out on because I did not even take time to read the description, only because the cover or title was so unattractive.

Rusalka wrote: "Peggy wrote: "I think you are a bit wrong on the chicklit genre (which you both realize already anyway I think ;-)) I don't read it much anymore, and I too don't like these girly shopping, hair, na..."

We should! And he should be smarter than that. I often buy him books which I'm sure he will like and he actually likes them (I think 90% of new authors he discovers are because I came across them and figured it sounded like something for him), but for some reason, if I read a book first and like it, it becomes a different story.

I wonder what would happen if I suddenly started reading (and enjoying) his Lee Child collection ;-)

Peggy wrote: "I wonder what would happen if I suddenly started reading (and enjoying) his Lee Child collection ;-) "

Hahah!

Peggy wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I'm with you Rusalka!

I wonder how making all book covers plain black with no pictures on them would affect our reading habits?!? I do think the cover can sway. Earlier in the year I..."

Maybe this is where the ugly orange penguin classics work?

Sarah wrote: "I'm with you Rusalka!

I wonder how making all book covers plain black with no pictures on them would affect our reading habits?!? I do think the cover can sway. Earlier in the year I read a book w..."

I'm currently reading The Ryiria Revelations and there's a pretty good-looking guy on all three book covers, and I have to admit that, besides the good-sounding story, that made the book seem even more interesting :$

Would that be a deliberate way of getting women into reading more fantasy? ;-)

That's kind of interesting, Peggy. I was just thinking that some of these covers that show sexy women in spiked high heels may be designed to appeal more to women, because they want to be that woman. Then we have covers with handsome virile men on the covers also appeal to women.

I admit that I am very swayed by the cover. If I can't see the cover of a book, I will probably pass right over it.

Wouldn't it work for men as well? Perhaps being attracted by the sexy women, but also wanting to be like the strong men?

Pfew, you could make a living figuring this all out! There must be a whole team behind designing the right cover: who will buy the book anyway and which population needs an extra push and how do we reach them most effectively?

Good point, Peggy.

Heres my perspective on sexy women covers. As much as I enjoy looking at beautiful women those covers give me a great fear of romance inside and I will avoid them unless a reliable recommendation comes in.

I definitely find that what genre I'm reading affects the percentage of male to female authors I read. This year I'm at 52% female authors. Though in general that number is usually at the 35-40% mark.

Historical fiction and science fiction are the genres where I read about 3 times as many male vs. female authors.

Rusalka wrote: "Gavin wrote: "Rusalka wrote: "Gavin wrote: "I don't care about the gender of the author, and I commented in that article posted here in GR that I think statistics based on gender are, for the most ..."
Sure. I guess they're not meaningless as they gave some people some work to do. If I think of it that way, I can agree.

Maybe people make assumptions about daily life, but I don't think that concept should be extended beyond basic aspects of reality that simply gets us to through the day without going on an existential crisis. It has to 0 to do with what books people buy.

That last paragraph is exactly what I mean by pointless gender analysis. What does what books people have to do with the perceived oppression someone feels they're being subjugated to everyday? Reading is meant to be fun, not a place for this whole 'are you reading enough books by women? No? You're probably sexist then' guilt-tripping.

185 male author books and 13 female author books this year for me

Wow Travis - that's quite a difference between the two!

When Lisa started this thread, it was off the back of the GR stats. Since then, the conversation has lead down other pathways talking about authors generally, covers and how books are marketed at different readers.

We cannot deny that sexism exists. It may not determine which books we read (although I'm sure it does with some readers) but it does impact authors (female authors having to abbreviate first names/use pseudonyms) and it is also a factor with publishers (pretty pink sparkly books for women).

No one is laying a guilt trip here. Nor is the GR article guilt tripping either - it's just one of many infographics they will be publishing. I read the books I want to read regardless of the author's sex as appears to be the case of everyone who has commented on this thread. Everyone is entitled to read books they want to read...for fun!

EDIT: On mobile device so could't quote previous posts.

It's really interesting to see the paths this discussion has gone down. However, I hope no one thinks that I started it in order to make a 'point' about gender equality in reading. That was not my intention at all. I just thought that the results of the survey would make for some good discussion about various aspects of the topic (which they have) so I hope I haven't made anyone feel uncomfortable or anything. If I have then I apologise :)

No need to apologise Lisa - it has indeed generated some interesting discussion! ;-)

Don't worry Lisa all you have to do is add a spark in this group we'll fuel the fire.

I looked through the books I've read this year, and apparently I've read roughly twice as many books by women as by men. I think a lot of the difference though, is attributable to about four authors who have written series, in some cases multiple series, that I really enjoyed. Three of those authors publish cheap e-books that they primarily market themselves. Most of them write mysteries, some with a paranormal flavor and some not. But the point is their books are a little like popcorn, and I could read through a four or five book series in a couple of weeks with no problem. The authors I seriously follow, and read whatever they put out out, tend to be be female. I read all the Dresden books, but they only come out about once a year.

Rusalka wrote: "Stats are never meaningless. They can be used in a meaningless way of course.
I agree, until you are discriminated against every day because of your gender, have your worth judged because of your sexual organs, have your rate of pay determined due to your gender, your intelligence doubted, your performance belittled by a gender associated biological function, I can totally understand why gender analysis would be pointless. "

Impossible to put it better!

Lisa wrote: "It's really interesting to see the paths this discussion has gone down. However, I do hope no one thinks that I started it in order to make a point about gender equality in reading. That was not my..."

No statistics disaggregated by gender is not related with gender equality

I mostly read women authors, however there are a few male ones I really like, such as John Sandford and Lee Child. I just started reading those two this year, though.

I've wondered about these questions too, Lisa. In recent years I've intentionally tried to increase the number of books I read by female authors. This to compensate for many years of earlier bias towards reading a preponderance of male authors.

Growing up the lit in public school and then in college had definite male bias in my experience. And the genres I read as a young adult were sci-fi and spy/detective mystery thrillers, and here again there was skew towards more male than female authors.

It just worked out that way tho. I didn't intentionally pick books written by guys. I think it was because the books I chose were popular and/or readily available - and they were (more often) authored by male writers.

Here's my nerdy personal stat to offer:

Of the 525 lifetime total books read on my GR shelf, 209 are by female authors, 316 by males. I was surprised by this result and may do a recount to confirm.

This has been a very interesting thread, and I'm glad you started it Lisa. It's obvious from the discussion that there is more to consider than just women reading women authors and men reading men. If anything, it will give us pause to evaluate our attitudes towards gender issues.