YA Book Gang!! discussion

Hi guys :)

So I'm crafting up a post for my blog A Blonde Librarian about ghostwriters and I just wanted a few opinions.

I recently read a book (Girl Online by Zoe Sugg et al), which although it has never been officially stated - was obviously not all Zoe's work...and it left me in a pickle.

I wanted to review the book on my blog...but who do you praise? Although the ideas may be Zoe's...the process of turning ideas from your head into a readable, coherent book is a tricky one that not everyone can do. Whilst I did thoroughly enjoy the book actually....I decided not to review it as the subject of ghostwriters leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

I was just wondering what your thoughts are. Do you agree with people using ghostwriters, and not disclosing it? Where their name appears on the cover...and not the person who actually wrote the words inside?

Do you think that it should be a law that ghostwriters are disclosed and given proper credit for their work? Or do you not really care?

Do you think it's okay for 'authors' to credit a book as their own, when they didn't write it?

Do you lose respect for people who use ghostriters? Do you feel betrayed/duped?

I'm just curious for other people's opinions on the subject??

Thanks

Lauren

I think ghostwriters are okay sometimes, but they can turn a good series into a crappy one. It happened with The Baby-Sitter's Club, with Animal Ark, and--to a lesser extent--with Warriors.

the vampire diaries book series, it got bad when they decided to make Damon human.

Raevyn wrote: "I think ghostwriters are okay sometimes, but they can turn a good series into a crappy one. It happened with The Baby-Sitter's Club, with Animal Ark, and--to a lesser extent--with Warriors."

Warriors weren't written by a ghostwriter they were written by four different people under one pen name

Sorry........I thought that was the same thing. This is the reason I leave groups.

Raevyn wrote: "I think ghostwriters are okay sometimes, but they can turn a good series into a crappy one. It happened with The Baby-Sitter's Club, with Animal Ark, and--to a lesser extent--with Warriors."

I've heard of ghostwriters taking over certain series when the demand is higher than the author can write the books, so they bring someone in to help. Even though they can study the style of the series etc, it will never be the same as the original author's work and I think people notice the difference

Once Upon A Time wrote: "Raevyn wrote: "I think ghostwriters are okay sometimes, but they can turn a good series into a crappy one. It happened with The Baby-Sitter's Club, with Animal Ark, and--to a lesser extent--with Wa..."

although the meaning is a little different, this is still technically ghostwriting in definition

Personally, I'd judge the book for what it is rather than worrying about who to praise personally. I mean, I get your distaste. It's very understandable. But even if she only had the idea and paid(or made another agreement) with someone else to actually write it, everyone played their part and was compensated. And if the book was good, then who cares how it came to be?

That's just my two cents, though. Personally, I'd rather fail at publishing forever than hire a ghostwriter, but I can see how/why someone would get to that point.

A ghostwriter is paid to be exactly that - a ghost. No, they should not be credited. That's the point of the large sum of money they are paid up front. That is how a ghostwriter makes a living. And I imagine the writers who support themselves that way have a high opinion of people with money and no talent.
If you have a great story, no writing skills, and an excess of cash, call me. I'll write your book for you. But you need to know that when I say an excess of cash...I mean it.

Lauren wrote: "Once Upon A Time wrote: "Raevyn wrote: "I think ghostwriters are okay sometimes, but they can turn a good series into a crappy one. It happened with The Baby-Sitter's Club, with Animal Ark, and--to..."

If you think about its not they are just under a pen name like Dr.Seuss or Mark Twain neither of these names are of actual people but pen names for the real people. Where Erin Hunter is made up of four actual writer's instead of an unknown writer.

Tommy wrote: "Personally, I'd judge the book for what it is rather than worrying about who to praise personally. I mean, I get your distaste. It's very understandable. But even if she only had the idea and paid(..."

Yes I agree...good writing is good writing no matter who's name is on the cover. I was just unable to word my review properly when writing it...and that boiled down to the fact that it was ghostwritten

Brian wrote: "A ghostwriter is paid to be exactly that - a ghost. No, they should not be credited. That's the point of the large sum of money they are paid up front. That is how a ghostwriter makes a living. And..."

Yes definitely, I am in no way discrediting the profession of ghostwriting...my issue lies more with the people who hire them....and then insist that they wrote every word themselves if you get my point? I would rather them not address it at all rather than lie...as a reader you lose confidence

Once Upon A Time wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Once Upon A Time wrote: "Raevyn wrote: "I think ghostwriters are okay sometimes, but they can turn a good series into a crappy one. It happened with The Baby-Sitter's Club, with Anim..."

when I was researching this topic, I discovered that ONE writer using a pseudonym is not ghostwriting...but a NUMBER of authors under the same name is

Ghostwriters are people who basically have stage fright and don't want attention. If you have an idea there's nothing wrong with it. Ghostwriters want to stay in the dark they don't want to be noticed at all.

Once Upon A Time wrote: "Ghostwriters are people who basically have stage fright and don't want attention. If you have an idea there's nothing wrong with it. Ghostwriters want to stay in the dark they don't want to be noti..."

I don't agree with that at all. Most ghostwriters also publish their own work alongside work under other people's name. It's a matter of income, networking and making connections within the literary world that makes the ghostwriting occupation appear appealing to some

Lauren wrote: "Once Upon A Time wrote: "Ghostwriters are people who basically have stage fright and don't want attention. If you have an idea there's nothing wrong with it. Ghostwriters want to stay in the dark t..."

Yeah, from what I've gathered(knowing people who have done it) ghostwriting is basically taking someone else's idea and writing it for guaranteed pay upfront instead of writing your own idea for potential pay down the road.

Tommy wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Once Upon A Time wrote: "Ghostwriters are people who basically have stage fright and don't want attention. If you have an idea there's nothing wrong with it. Ghostwriters want to sta..."

yeah there is that certain security of a paycheck that is obviously one of the reason's they do it versus the uncertainity of publishing their own work

There's got to be an amount of liberty there, too. To take an idea that isn't your baby and be able to hone your writing that way. Now I kind of want to ghostwrite haha.

R L Stine uses other writers for his Goosebumps series yet R L Stine's name is on the cover. But this is well-known. Goosebumps is a franchise and Stine simply can't keep up with demand.
There is not a large number of people financially able to hire a professional writer to produce a book for them just so they can pretend to be an author (I assume we're talking about genre fiction and not Jennifer Lopez writing her autobiography). To give you an example of cost, I was asked last year to write a book based on a person's notes and a short story she had written. Her name would be on the cover and I would get no credit whatsoever. I happily agreed. For $30,000 I would produce a full-length, 150,000 word novel - edited, proofed and ready to go. When asked why so expensive, I explained to her the time involved and the fact that it would take away from my own projects that make me my living. When she asked if there was a way to get it done cheaply I told her yes. Write it yourself then hire an editor. That would save $25,000.
The fact is that there are a vast number of wonderful writers who never get noticed in spite of their talent. Someone who would pay for a "ghost writer" would soon discover that their money was needlessly wasted. On Amazon alone there are several million books being sold. Only a small fraction get read by more than a few people.
The real problem emerging is not ghost writers. It's something much more distasteful. Rogue publishers are hiring writers to plagiarize well-known hybrid and indie authors. They give them a pseudonym similar to the original author, give the book a new title, a nice cover, then release. To me this is far worse than some wannabe who has some spare cash in hand.

Brian wrote: "R L Stine uses other writers for his Goosebumps series yet R L Stine's name is on the cover. But this is well-known. Goosebumps is a franchise and Stine simply can't keep up with demand.
There i..."

This is such a great comment and I agree with you entirely

I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwriter-we...

Dee wrote: "I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwriter-we..."

that's fantastic thank you Dee, I will definitely check that out

Dee wrote: "I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwriter-we..."

That was really interesting. Such a positive view of ghostwriting by someone who actually works in the profession. It's becoming more and more obvious that it's the readers who seem to have more of an issue with ghostwriters and not the authors themselves, who appear happy enough with their profession

Lauren wrote: "Dee wrote: "I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwriter-we..."

That was really i..."

Yes, Lauren, in fact as a reader I am also a bit put off when I find out a new favorite book was ghost written. I feel cheated somehow. But as an author with a story to tell, I understand how someone with a burning story inside but who also may lack the expertise to write that story themselves would seek out a ghost writer to get the story down. But also as a writer, if I were to be a ghost writer I would feel a bit slighted if I can't put my name on the book. Go figure, right? The mind of a writer...who can ever figure it out?

Dee wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Dee wrote: "I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwriter-we..."

Th..."
As a ghost writer you would be paid not to mind if you didn't get credit. That's the point. You get paid up front with no risk. .If the book doesn't sell and royalties suck. so what? You are a contractor selling your particular brand of expertise. To give the ghost writer credit would defeat the purpose. I don't know if you are making a living writing, but if so, the idea of a guaranteed paycheck is appealing.

Brian wrote: "Dee wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Dee wrote: "I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwriter-we......"

Hi Brian, I am a writer making a living writing my own novels. I interviewed Wendy Scheuring on my blog who is a ghostwriter and found her work very interesting. My comments were made from my perspective of how it would make me feel if I chose such a profession. I agree with you - ghostwriters go into the deal getting paid up front as a contractor and know that they are not being recognized as the writer, however in Wendy's case some of her clients actually list her name in their books, but it is not the norm. Ghostwriting isn't for me, but I respect anyone who chooses the field.

Dee wrote: "Brian wrote: "Dee wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Dee wrote: "I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwr..."
I wouldn't choose it either. And I'm not sure I would even be very good at it. But I have to admit, the idea is not unappealing. Releasing a novel is risky every time.

Dee wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Dee wrote: "I did an interview of a Ghost Writer, Wendy Scheuring. Very interesting. You can check it out here if you'd like. http://deeannwaite.com/ghostwriter-we..."

Th..."

I think with the Zoe case, she didn't necessarily have an idea before she was offered a TWO BOOK deal with Penguin...which is crazy. All the dotted lines were signed before she even knew what book she would do. So it's less like she had a burning desire to write...more like she got offered a helluva lot of money to release a book...came up with an idea...got someone else to write it...then put her name on it. Ghostwriting in general isn't bad...but this particular situation is quite shady for many reasons