Goodreads Authors/Readers discussion

I'm an avid reader and have enjoyed historical fiction for years. I recently had the (dis)pleasure ofreading work by one of your authors, Phillip Hore. At first I thought it was a deliberately employed writing tool, but then realised I was in the hands of a terrible writer. Factually stretched, disjointed concepts and ridiculous sentences missing basic language skills (forget any literature talent).
Good Reads you let your readers and customers down with such amateur dribble.
I won't be buying through you again.

Your experience is awful to hear, albeit understandable, like when you keep watching a movie thinking it HAS to get better and it only gets worse so you just wasted two hours of your time. I would love to try to convince you that while there is a ton of good writing here and some really great writing, there is also some bad - just as there is in all aspects of life. It was so unfortunate that you happened upon the really bad. Actually, one of my books is based upon that concept, but not my point. Thank you for the time you have spent here. I'm sure the authors you liked appreciated it. Take care.

Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against their high standards. One buys from established publishers knowing that their books meet a certain standard. Mr Hores work is far far far below any intelligent readers standards

Hello!

I am late for the show, but curious now. Just who is this Mr. Hore? Or is it Hores? I looked him up and can't find him anywhere. What exactly did he write which turned out so badly?

Links please, if possible? Thanks in advance!

Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that their work is substandard and undeserving of serious consideration. As with most assumptions which lump everyone into one category, this is not true.

Many self-published authors which I have read, or attempted to read, exhibited a total lack of even a basic knowledge of spelling, proper grammar, narrative flow, or syntax. That said; some have proven to be just as good, if not better, than many traditionally published books I have read.

It is up to the reader to pursue due diligence before purchasing any book. If the author's posts within discussion groups are rife with misspellings, poor grammar, and improper syntax, their published work will more than likely exhibit the same poor quality. However, if the author consistently displays an excellent grasp of basic writing skills and the ability to capture and hold the reader's attention and interest, their published work will probably not disappoint and prove worthwhile reading.

Very few novice authors ever achieve commercial success within this extremely competitive field. That said; some have. There is no reason why you might not eventually become one of them. I wish you success.

Jim wrote: "If the author's posts within discussion groups is ripe with misspellings, poor grammar, and improper syntax..."

I believe the word you intended is "rife", rather than "ripe", but it doesn't detract from your very valid point. Most likely, you're yet another victim of the ever-present Autocorrect Syndrome.

Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard and undeserving of serious consideration. As with mos..."

Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard and undeserving of serious consideration. As with mos..."

As a self published author, you make me think twice about posting here. I am from Wales, but I write in American English because that's where most of my readers come from. I pay an expensive American editor to make sure my manuscripts are in good shape. The same can't be said for my posts. I hope that doesn't deter readers.

Brian wrote: "Jim wrote: "If the author's posts within discussion groups is ripe with misspellings, poor grammar, and improper syntax..."

I believe the word you intended is "rife", rather than "ripe", but it do..."

Brian,

Thank you for the observation. I had intended to utilize the word rife. I am not sure whether auto-correct or my fingers moving faster than my brain is responsible. In either case, you will note that the error has been corrected.

Jim

Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard and undeserving of serious consideration...."

Amanda,

Please, do not allow my initial post to discourage you. Becoming bi-lingual is a skill and talent few, including myself, fail to ever accomplish. I admire you for having done so.

My comments were directed at those for whom English is their native, and in most cases, only language. I apologize for not having made that obvious.

Jim wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard and undeserving of serious..."

Jim wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard and undeserving of serious..."

Thank you for that, Jim. Wales is part of Great Britain so British English is my first language. I wish I was bi-lingual. Still, the grammar and punctuation are quite different. Sometimes I get lost between the two. The key is professional editing. I have tried to make my books to traditionally published standards. Although your kind words didn't quite apply to my situation, the sentiment was certainly appreciated. Thank you.

Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard and undeservin..."

Amanda,

I thought that Wales had preserved their native language even after becoming part of Great Britain. If I am wrong and British English is now your everyday language, I would like to paraphrase a famous comment by the late Winston Churchill: "The United States and Great Britain are two great countries separated only by a common language".

Jim

Jim wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard..."

Welsh is spoken in many places here. Sadly, not by me.

G wrote: "Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against their high standards. One buys..."

Looking at ‘one’s profile, ‘one’ sounds like a straight up troll.

Jim wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard..."

I know that this is not truly relevant to this subject, but I can't resist adding another quote about the United States and Great Britain, this one made by a British general, about the United States being an ex-colony presently controled by separatist forces.

Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that the their work is substandard and undeserving of serious consideration. As with mos..."

Hi there, Jim!

I saw your post right below mine. And even though I am displeased over the fact in which nobody who posted after us responded to my comment, I feel I must notate one thing. I am one of many countless authors who are self-published.

But unlike many of those, who have poor spelling and grammar, I do my absolute best to ensure my own spelling and grammar are top-of-the-line. Plus, whenever I am getting ready to publish one of my own works, I do my own proofreading and spelling and grammar checks. I consider myself to be a self-taught, self-published author. And now, since I've gotten us on the subject of this matter, I'd like to know if any of you are also self-taught, self-published authors. Or perhaps you know of any?

I know Amanda above said she is from Wales and so, she hires an expensive American editor for her own manuscripts. Unfortunately, not everyone who decides to self-publish can afford the hiring of an editor. I just thought I'd point this out, but I'm not trying to de-rail this thread either. Ta-Ta!

Ross, I am a self-published author. I'm a little less certain about what you might mean by "self taught". I have not attended courses or taken classes intended to teach or train authors. I have been an avid reader through most of my life, and have developed "my style" based upon books that have impressed me and authors I have come to admire.
Believe me when I say that the numbers of self-published authors have never been so high, and they increase significantly each day, for better or worse.

Ross wrote: "I'd like to know if any of you are also self-taught, self-published authors. Or perhaps you know of any?...."

I am a self-published author, although I write purely as a hobby and put my novels online for free. As for being self-taught, if you mean by that that I didn't follow classes on how to be an author, then I am one. I also happen to be French-Canadian, so my native language is French, not English. However, I write my novels in English (US variant) as the francophone readership is simply abysmal compared to anglophone readership. As an example of that, the lone novel in French I advertised on my Goodreads author's page has garnered ZERO rating in eight years, while my other 25 novels have garnered a total of 280 ratings since 2012. So, if I want to help entertain readers around the World with my novels, I definitely need to write in English. Since I am a pensioner with limited means, I cannot pay for editorial or proofreading services, but do my damn best to present as good a product as I can.

I wish I could take credit for the following advice, but I cannot. The credit must instead go to the professional authors and editors of several books on the subject of writing, editing, and publishing obtained from the local library.

If one cannot afford to acquire the services of a professional copy editor, it would prove very beneficial to have a few willing friends and/or relatives read and critique the manuscript before publishing it.

Attempting to effectively proofread one's own work is extremely difficult since the eye often tends to see what was intended instead of what is actually there and the brain interprets the the intention, not the reality.

Jim wrote: "I wish I could take credit for the following advice, but I cannot. The credit must instead go to the professional authors and editors of several books on the subject of writing, editing, and publis..."

I would agree with this. You need fresh eyes on work. Even trad published work can end up going to print with mistakes.

G wrote: "Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against their high standards. One buys..."

G wrote: "Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against their high standards. One buys..."

G wrote: "Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against their high standards. One buys..."

Hi G...you mentioned: (One buys from established publishers knowing that their books meet a certain standard.) I have bought new books from established publishers and I very often find myself thinking, 'what could they possibly have ever found interesting enough to publish this book?' And then I'm angry because I spent that amount of money on a dud. I really try to pick up second hand books from library sales.

Patricia wrote: "G wrote: "Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against their high standards..."

It is important to realize that one's review of a book is merely their personal, and therefore subjective, opinion. One reader's "Best book ever! might very well be another reader's "Worst book ever!".

Patricia wrote: "G wrote: "Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against their high standards..."

Hi Jim...it sounds like you think I made the comment about Mr. Hores book. I didn't. Maybe I'm not posting my comments correctly?

Patricia wrote: "Patricia wrote: "G wrote: "Thank you Gail, your response has been appreciated. Mr Hores work is almost laughably bad so I hope the professional editors reread this author and revisit it against the..."

Patricia,

My comment (message 21) pertains to any rating or review, whether posted or not, for any book at any time.

There have been some books which I personally judged to be boring and a waste of time, yet some of my acquaintances and adult children thought to be very entertaining.

What a terribly boring place this world would be if everyone agreed about everything all the time.

I totally agree with you about different opinions - I just didn't want anyone to think it was me commenting on Hore's book because I've never heard of him or read a book by him.

Brian wrote: "Ross, I am a self-published author. I'm a little less certain about what you might mean by "self-taught". I have not attended courses or taken classes intended to teach or train authors. I have bee..."

Brian, what you said in your post above is pretty much what I meant by 'self-taught'. Like you, I have not attended courses or taken classes intended to teach or train authors. I have studied thousands upon thousands of words, definitions, and proper grammar and punctuation techniques. And yet, this market is indeed highly-competitive, so I've yet to find my 'niche' within it.

And yes, I realize it is always beneficial to have a second or even third pair of eyes to scan my works for mistakes I may have missed. And I actually do have one friend, who is helping me out with catching everything I may have missed.

Thanks to those who spoke to me on this thread!

Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that their work is substandard and undeserving of serious consideration. As with most as..."

When I first started writing in the 90s (and self-published with my sole proprietorship OmegaBooks) I DID make mistakes and my proofreader/beta reader did NOT catch some of the mistakes. Plus, being American but having been to England in 1970, I did NOT quite get all of the British English correct (example: I use "pants" instead of "trousers" in some spots, and in one place I used "phone" instead of "ring" (or "rang")) but in most places I likely did use the proper British English words, including slang ("me" instead of "my" for instance, in dialogue).

What gets me though is in some books a complete disregard for proper grammar and punctuation (or closely proper...everyone makes mistakes) and even spelling. Again, I don't know an author who doesn't miss a typo every now and then (I even missed a couple when I sent the final manuscript to Lulu). But still...it just seems like a lack of regard for the English language (Brit, American, Canadian, whatever) in some writers these days. And it is worse on blogs, where some say grammar, etc. is no big deal, so-to-speak.

And who is Phillip Hore or Hores?

Jim wrote: "I wish I could take credit for the following advice, but I cannot. The credit must instead go to the professional authors and editors of several books on the subject of writing, editing, and publis..."

Yep, proofreading one's own work can be problematic! Especially with typos!

Deborah wrote: "Jim wrote: "Unfortunately, the title 'Self-Published Author' is interpreted and assumed by many avid readers to indicate that their work is substandard and undeserving of serious consideration. As ..."

Your quote: And who is Phillip Hore or Hores? ...I can answer this right here. I was wondering this myself. He is a lesser-known author, who has published The Brotherhood of the Dragon. It seems to have garnered a lot of reviews and even more than most of my works combined.

The reason he can't be found by searching the name Phillip Hore is because his Author Name is actually Phil Hore. EDIT: Sorry for the late reply.