The Sword and Laser discussion

I always think horror is S&L adjacent, and sometimes "dark fantasy" and horror are the same thing.

A few days ago I finished Certain Dark Things by Silvia Moreno-Garcia. She is more famous for Gods of Jade and Shadow and Mexican Gothic but I literally am months behind on getting those from the library.

Certain Dark Things is a vampire novel, not usually my thing but I enjoyed it. It's set in a walled off Mexico City where the rest of Mexico is at the mercy of vampire gangs. Many are immigrant groups that had to flee Europe, but one subspecies has been around since Aztec times.

A month or so ago I read The Only Good Indians by Stephen Graham Jones. Sometimes he is more humorous but this one is full-out gore, reader beware.

Do you read spooky/scary books in October more than other times of the year, or am I the only one?

(I know it's not October yet.)

Other reads I'm considering:

A reread of North American Lake Monsters by Nathan Ballingrud since the Hulu adaptation goes up October 2 (Monsterland) - I've read it twice already and I don't know if it's better to refresh my memory or see the show as a separate thing.

The Southern Book Club's Guide to Slaying Vampires by Grady Hendrix - another vampire novel, bizarre. I have this on hold at the library and will be lucky if it's available this year. Thinking about buying it in Audible. Hoopla has two of his earlier books though, so maybe I should start there - Horrorstör and My Best Friend's Exorcism.

The Missing by Sarah Langan - recommended to me by one of my podcast guests, so this author is one I mean to try this year

How about you? Do you have plans or recs?

I don't often seek out horror novels to read, but sometimes I can't resist books like Killer Flies by Mark Kendall (a pseudonym of Melinda M. Snodgrass). Killer Flies is set in New Mexico and reads like some of the real sh*t that happens in my home state.

This is one of the books found in Paperbacks from Hell: The Twisted History of '70s and '80s Horror Fiction by Grady Hendrix which is where all good horror novels have gone to die and be resurrected.

Another place I like to go for wallowing in schlock horror paperbacks is http://toomuchhorrorfiction.blogspot....

Yes, with Spooktober coming up, its time for something horrific. I've had this book lying around for awhile. Seems like a good time to read it.

Konga by Dean Owen

I suppose saying "The News" is too old a joke. ;-)

But man horror is not where I want to escape right now. I wish the best for those who find enjoyment in them currently. But it is just not for me.

The first part of this was pretty creepy:

I've reread A Night in the Lonesome October every October since it was an unofficial pick for S&L a few years ago, doing the one chapter/day a day thing. I just went to put it on hold at the library though and someone beat me to it! I am also in the mood for other spooky reads, but I have so many other ongoing books I really need to focus on, I can't really justify starting anything else yet.

Anyone wanna do an alt-read of something spooky? The book of the month is short and it's Halloween. I'm good for anything Bradbury - say, Long after Midnight, Halloween Tree, Something Wicked This Way Comes. Or other suggestions?

John (Taloni) wrote: "Anyone wanna do an alt-read of something spooky? The book of the month is short and it's Halloween. I'm good for anything Bradbury - say, Long after Midnight, Halloween Tree, Something Wicked This ..."

One I forgot to mention that I'm super interested in is Empire of Wild by Cherie Dimaline. But I would do a Bradbury reread.

John (Taloni) wrote: "Anyone wanna do an alt-read of something spooky?"
Definitely. Bradbury is always good (the animated Halloween Tree is a staple in my house this time of year) but I'm open to something a bit less cozy and a bit more pure terror too.

I'm reading Covenant with the Vampire and it's pretty good. The Only Good Indians is definitely on my radar too.

Reading may be your only way to celebrate Halloween this year.

Is there going to be any traditional Halloween in the US this year with social distancing restrictions and lockdowns? 🤔

It has effectively been cancelled here because of restrictions, and we are fully covid-19 free.

Tassie Dave wrote: "Reading may be your only way to celebrate Halloween this year.

Is there going to be any traditional Halloween in the US this year with social distancing restrictions and lockdowns? 🤔

It has effec..."

On my town’s Facebook page we are fighting about it. Americans are insane. It’s CANDY ffs, not something worth dying for.

I think if you have kids you can easily do an alternate version, e.g. decorate your house, hang candy up in fake spiderwebs or hide it in the garden, bake a cake, start a great spooky movie, done. Explain that while trick-or-treating is fun, it's not worth accidentally killing our neighbors for. It's called loving and caring about your fellow human beings. And if you don't have kids you could just put some candy in a bowl outside (or not).

My generation spent almost a whole year mostly inside to avoid the radioactive sour rains (and plants outside) after Chernobyl - we still need to wait a few more decades until our mushrooms become edible again - and while it wasn't a great childhood experience, it was fine, no big deal. We read a lot instead! 😄

Obituary: https://www.mtexpress.com/obituaries/...

I’d love to read an alt-pick for some added spookiness in October. I recently started reading The Year of the Witching, which definitely has a spooky feel to it.

I've decided I'm going to read The Halloween Tree, partly because it's been decades since I read it, partly because it's short, and partly because it's educational. I'll start a thread when I do and others are welcome to join in. Would be glad to join in another book as well.

Planning to read Spirits Abroad by Zen Cholater this month. One of the stories features one of the scariest beings in Malay culture, the pontianak, so I am looking forward to it.

I'd be glad for a Halloween reprieve because every time the doorbell rings my dog throws a dramatic fit. *eyeroll*

Jenny (Reading Envy) wrote: "I'd be glad for a Halloween reprieve because every time the doorbell rings my dog throws a dramatic fit. *eyeroll*"

Same.

My dogs also do that for animals they see on TV.

My dog used to howl along with my piano playing. I never knew exactly if it was meant to express agony, enthusiastic participation, or commiseration. 😄

Eva wrote: "My dog used to howl along with my piano playing. I never knew exactly if it was meant to express agony, enthusiastic participation, or commiseration. 😄"

“It’s a little pitchy for me, the dog.”

I think Middlegame by Seanan McGuire would be a good read during Spooktober. :)

Charles wrote: "I think Middlegame by Seanan McGuire would be a good read during Spooktober. :)"

Because she’s never met a human, yes?

Trike wrote:
Because she’s never met a human, yes?"

The author or the characters? I don't know, I haven't finished the story yet. :)

Hey, Trike, there's no need to be so full of contempt when talking about an author someone else is enjoying. Of course you can do that in reviews, but when talking to fans directly it would make it much more fun if you could just say something like "I wouldn't want to read it, I've tried other books by her before and the characterization didn't convince me." It says the same thing but doesn't invalidate the other person's opinion as worthless, you know what I mean? Makes people feel more welcome and at home, and free to share things they enjoy.

Eva wrote: "Hey, Trike, there's no need to be so full of contempt when talking about an author someone else is enjoying. Of course you can do that in reviews, but when talking to fans directly it would make it..."

What did I miss? *queue the object flying over my head...zoom!

Eva wrote: "Hey, Trike, there's no need to be so full of contempt when talking about an author someone else is enjoying. Of course you can do that in reviews, but when talking to fans directly it would make it..."

Thanks for telling me how to feel and which opinions I’m allowed to express, Madame Gestapo. I appreciate it.

I was gently requesting you to express yourself a bit more politely sometimes to encourage a more friendly atmosphere.

(Charles: Trike has repeatedly expressed the opinion that Seanan (the author) writes characters so badly that she must obviously have never met a human being.

Trike: I never meant to tell you what you should feel, it was just a suggestion for how we could create a more friendly environment in which people feel welcome regardless of whether someone else agrees with their opinion or not. Do you really want to call a German such s myself "Madame Gestapo" for that, and if so, how would you say this differs from using racial slurs? Isn't it pretty much the same?

Eva wrote: "I was gently requesting you to express yourself a bit more politely sometimes to encourage a more friendly atmosphere.

(Charles: Trike has repeatedly expressed the opinion that Seanan (the author..."

Okay, a few things:

A) I didn’t know you were German. I am hilariously intuitive, apparently. I just looked at your profile and it’s set to private. How am I supposed to know anything about you?

2) You were literally telling me what I am allowed to say. You ain’t got a leg to stand on there, sister.

III) Calling me negative is very much the pot calling the kettle black. I notice that you have not commented on the fact that Charles requested more books like Finder and I offered four similar suggestions of books that are light, fun space opera. As I write this, I am, in fact, the only person to make any suggestions.

3a) I do that a lot. I support people a lot. Like all the time. Go look. Yet you are only focusing on the one time out of, what?, every 12 to 15 times I post something funny or helpful or constructive.

D) Humor is subjective, I know, but if you’re aware that I trot out the “never met a human” thing once a year then you should also be aware that I’m doing a bit.

Interlude: Why are you aware of my opinions on any specific author? That’s weird.

Five) Read my rave review of The Calculating Stars: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show... I actually post more positive reviews than negative ones, but humans are predisposed to focusing on the negative, as you are proving with your thread hijack.

VI) “Before thou criticizes the splinter in thy brother’s eye, first remove the plank from thine own.” The Gospel according to Matthew. (16 years of Bible study, handy for Jeopardy and times like these.)

Trike and I have a reputation for being the Grumpy old men of Sword and Laser. It is our schtick.

Trike is a bit more crotchety than me :-) I think it's all the age related meds he takes ;-) being old and all :-)

Opinions even negative ones, are just opinions. We don't have to agree.

Lets get back to discussing books and having fun.

We don’t have to agree, but we don’t have to be jerks either. I keep leaving this group because of the lack of moderation. (I keep coming back because I used to love being here. Not so much anymore. ) I think Trike is kind of a bully sometimes and that his response to Eva was inappropriate. He’s not disagreeing with her, he’s pushing buttons hard.

Yeah. I’m out again.

We do moderate.

You may not see it, but much spam is deleted and topics moved to the correct sections. Members have been warned about inappropriate behaviour and asked to desist. I try to do it it a non-confronting way. Some of it happens via the private message feature. But I have stepped in when people have been being jerks.

The whole disagreement lasted only 5 comments over a 3 hour time frame. It wouldn't have been allowed to continue ad nauseam. Hence me suggesting (once I saw the comments) that we "get back to discussing books and having fun" to try and diffuse the situation.

I don't consider Trike to be a bully. His humour can be mistaken at times. As can mine. He has strong opinions about the media he consumes, as do many here and some threads can become quite passionate.

With so many countries, age groups, genders etc represented, miscommunication and differing views are bound to happen.

His comment was only inappropriate in hindsight. I personally wouldn't have used that word. I would have apologised once Eva took offence. But that's me.

This forum is quite civil and tame compared to many on the internet. It is, mostly, self moderating.

I have tried to be the 'good cop', to Rob's 'bad cop' 😉, but I will be more mindful in future to keeping discourse civil and friendly.

Adelaide wrote: "We don’t have to agree, but we don’t have to be jerks either. I keep leaving this group because of the lack of moderation. (I keep coming back because I used to love being here. Not so much anymore..."

My final comment on this: I am not being a bully, as far as I can tell. I have no power here. Nor did I belittle Charles or his opinion, as Eva accused me of doing.

This will be long, so... (view spoiler)[

Maybe she really likes that author. I have no way of knowing, because her profile is private. I have never understood why people get so upset at others who have differing opinions about things that aren’t theirs, that they didn’t create and don’t belong to them. For instance, I had a terrible experience with a poorly-designed and badly-built Chevy rental car. When I mentioned this on Facebook, one of my cousins had a full-on meltdown. He is, apparently, a die hard Chevy truck guy, something I didn’t know. It’s like a religion with him.

He doesn’t work for GM or anything, he just likes their trucks, I guess. He hasn’t spoken to me in 7 years, simply because I didn’t like a crappy Impala that one time. That is the very definition of insanity to me, and I get that with books and authors (and films — hello, Star Wars fanatics) all the time. I quite literally can’t understand it.

If the person were the author, I can kind of understand it. It’s not how I would react, but I get it. As a reader, though? It’s just weird.

But here’s some background to my above reaction:

When Chadwick Boseman died last month, it bummed me out. More than it otherwise would, because I suddenly have a massive amount of bad news in my personal life. But on social media I expressed my sadness and moved on. Then I had people telling me I was expressing my sorrow incorrectly. Like, WTF, right?

A couple weeks later Ruth Bader Ginsburg died. I was a fan of Boseman’s and 43 is way too young, but her death is important, not just to me and my friends but to this country. The change in the Supreme Court is going to fundamentally alter America for decades. In the immediate future there will be demonstrations and riots. My gay friends and family already have contingency plans in place and my normally laid-back neighbors are talking about buying guns for the first time in their lives. Things are tense.

All I posted on social media, though, was “RIP RBG”, because I didn’t want to get dragged into that particular culture war right now. And AGAIN people started telling me that I was wrong for saying that. Things like, “stop forcing your Christian oppression on Jewish people, because RIP is a Christian thing, you antisemite!” I saw someone else say sincerely “May Allah hold her in his hand”, and she was attacked, too.

Again, WTF. I mean, first of all, “rest in peace” was originally a Jewish saying. I won’t attempt the Hebrew phrase because I’ll get it wrong, but it was yet another thing co-opted by Christians. So it’s just factually incorrect. But even if that were true, telling someone that their expression of sorrow, or grief, or condolences is wrong and hurtful is a dickish thing to do.

I’m not religious, but when my Christian friends say things like “I’m praying for you”, I just say thank you, because the spirit in which it is intended is positive, and from their perspective is the most powerful intercession they can muster.

The truly bizarre aspect was that those attacks were coming from so-called “woke” people who claim to be inclusive but really have an authoritarian streak similar to any fascist and are behaving like the self-appointed Purity Police.

Which is why I tweeted this:

So many people telling others that they're grieving wrong. This kind of thing is why Trump is going to win again.

— Trike (@Trike) September 19, 2020

So when Eva did THE EXACT SAME THING, it rubbed me the wrong way.

The Gestapo comment was just because we had recently heard that American immigration has been taking women from what are, for all intents and purposes, concentration camps, and forcibly sterilizing them. (https://ccrjustice.org/home/blog/2020...) Shades of the Nazis. If it had happened a week earlier when Russia meddling in the US election was at the forefront of my mind, I likely would’ve said “Comrade KGB” instead.

Again, I had no idea she was German. Coincidences happen. But also? It’s not racist. So for her to trot *that* BS out on top of everything else really pissed me off.

Despite that, my response doesn’t look that angry to me. But then what do I know? I was raised by wolves for whom argument is a full-contact sport. My interior designer bought me a shirt that says, “I’m not yelling, I’m Italian.” (That was the result of a drug-addled contractor screwing up my kitchen floor install.)

But as I said above, the vast majority of things I post are positive and supportive. Because mostly I am those things. There are things I don’t like, and I don’t hide them. Focusing on just *that* stuff, though? That’s not a me-problem, that’s an other-person-problem.

As the saying goes, I’m strong coffee. I’m aware. For the most part I use that power for good. I feel confident in saying that simply looking at the totality of my posts with a dispassionate eye will show that.

(hide spoiler)]

So that’s where I’m coming from and I hope that clears it up.

My apologies to Jenny.

Trike doing Trike things.

he is a bully that's why he is to afraid to post his real name and picture. we all know the profile of a cyberbully when we see it.

i don't need this crap with this election going on i hear this junk at work all the time. this group and book are suppose to be a escape to me.

I'm out to!

i don't want to sound like i'm attacking trike. because i read his whole diatribe and get it! but as someone who has felt bullied here at least 3 times in a short time and by trike (which i believe he did not mean to) when i'm just trying to get people to share their viewpoints.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSBrn...

Trike wrote: "My apologies to Jenny."

Don't apologize, fix it. Where'd my thread go? Harumph.

^ Yes, indeed! In addition to Halloween Tree, currently working its way down the LA Public Library hold list, I am also likely to receive the new Twilight book off hold in October. I'll read it unironically, but to some peeps here that just might constitute a horror.

Alan Moore's take on HP Lovecraft. It's very suspenseful:

John (Taloni) wrote: "^ Yes, indeed! In addition to Halloween Tree, currently working its way down the LA Public Library hold list, I am also likely to receive the new Twilight book off hold in October. I'll read it uni..."

I just listened to Midnight Sun & I gave it 4 stars & added it to my Sword shelf even though I have a Horror shelf. It's got vampires in it, but it's really not a horror story.

Tamahome wrote: "Alan Moore's take on HP Lovecraft. It's very suspenseful:

"

This is a great pick for Banned Books Week too, which is this week. I always talk about this in my reading class because my local library system made international news removing it from the shelves without even taking it through the process. So I ordered two for my university library.

I just started House of Leaves by Mark Z. Danielewski. It's the weird and cool book that does a lot of tricks with typography and writing standards. For instance, the word house is in blue color type throughout the book, and there are foot notes that take over the novel.

Because these type of tricks don't necessarily work on a kindle, I went to our local book store, near my favorite Pasty shop, and ordered the paper version. It's pretty nice with some a interesting diorama picture in the front, where there are lots of objects and letters to read before you even open the book.

So far, it feels like it's using all the tropes from movies like the Ring and the Blair Witch Project. The first couple chapters have been slightly boring, and seem pointless, but I can see he is laying out a psychological foundation on which to build the creepiness. It looks like there are three stories being built around a book found by the person distributing it. The found book is about a movie made by a photographer about his family settling into a new home. I hope it picks up as it goes along.

If I disappear and am never heard from again, probably the book ate me :-)

Tamahome wrote: "Alan Moore's take on HP Lovecraft. It's very suspenseful:

"

Do you have to read The Courtyard first?

No I think it was first? Or not. Now I'd like to. I got bored with the one after it, Providence.

I picked up Alan Moore's The Courtyard yesterday, not a bad read but wouldn't consider it spooky. Will see about the next one.

The Halloween Tree is now at #2 on 5 copies at LA Public Library for me.. *tap, tap*

Aaaand Midnight Sun has come in before Halloween Tree. So it will be vampires before Bradbury. On the plus side, I'll be reading Halloween Tree closer to actual Halloween.

Picked up a friend's Edgar Allen Poe mini-anthology, release on the anniversary of Poe's death (Oct 7.) Title is Poe-ish Tales Forevermore: A Mini-anthology. It's properly spooky, with grave robbers, ravens of various kinds including a suspiciously intelligent flock, and a musician who will go to extremes to create the best possible music. A well-done tribute to Poe. It's a little pricey at $3 for 42 pages, but *shrug* I've spent more for a cup of coffee.

Today I started The Hollow Places by T. Kingfisher and it just got weird and spooky. The previous one by her – The Twisted Ones is a good fit for Spooktober too.

I hadn’t seen this thread when I updated the what else have you been reading thread so I’ll just copy paste.

I just finished The Hunger by Alma Katsu. I thought it was very atmospheric and spooky. It reminded me a lot of The Terror. Then I read a couple of stories from Joe Hill’s 20th century ghosts and was really surprised at how good they were given this was his first book. Now I’m on to The Troop by Nick Cutter.

As for audiobooks I’m just about to finish Tales From the Gas Station by Jack Townsend. Apparently this was originally multiple creepypastas from Jack Townsend which he adapted into a book. It was no great work of fiction but it was a creepy, fun read to kick off my month of horror. I think I’ll be moving on to some stories from Full Throttle by Joe Hill next and then on to finishing Relic by Douglas Preston and Lincoln Child that I had started this summer.

For comics I’ve been working my way through all of the DC Hill House (Joe Hill’s DC Imprint) stuff. I also started back in on Nailbiter. I expect I’ll be getting to some more Junji Ito at some point here too.

From the New York Times

50 States, 50 Scares

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/21/at...

the scariest novel set in every state

The Good Story is Hard to Find podcast just did an episode on The Shining. Scott says it's one of Stephen King's three best books. http://agoodstoryishardtofind.blogspo...