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They Found Him Dead
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They Found Him Dead Group Read Chapters8-15
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I haven't started my re-read yet but I read the first sentence and the Birthday Boy is exactly my age: "about to be 60". when I first read this book, I thought that was pretty darn old but now I know better!
I don't read enough detective novels so I am rubbish at guessing the murderer. I am about 80% of the way through and so far I have suspected absolutely everyone. At least when I reach the denouement I will have the satisfaction of saying, 'Aha, I knew it was them!'.
we can't help but suspect everyone: they act so suspicious!
Jackie wrote: "we can't help but suspect everyone: they act so suspicious!"Which is one of the marks of skillful mystery writing!
Well, I'm done so may I just say: I KNEW IT! :D
One thing that is striking me is how much smoking there is - felt like I was in a Mary Stewart novel!
Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "One thing that is striking me is how much smoking there is - felt like I was in a Mary Stewart novel!"Yes! I just read Lady Harte’s arrival scene, I didn’t remember her at all, and she lights one cigarette right after another, stalking up and down the room, chewing up the scenery! It was such a cinematic scene, I could really picture it.
Nick wrote: "Well, I'm done so may I just say: I KNEW IT! :D"Good on you, Nick! I haven’t a clue - well, suspicions, but one planted by another suspect, so I don’t think that’s any good, too obvious...🤔
Margaret wrote: "Jackie wrote: "we can't help but suspect everyone: they act so suspicious!"Which is one of the marks of skillful mystery writing!"
I always think so - rather disappointing when you’re chugging along, deep into a mystery (my fave genre, so I’ve read a lot), and suddenly realize the writer has painted themselves into a corner, only one or two suspects left! Then it’s quite trick to still pull off a surprise ending that satisfies a reader...much more fun to have several solid possibilities!
I finished last night - I remembered the murderer from previous reads. Some wonderful characters.I'll comment further when more people have finished!
Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "One thing that is striking me is how much smoking there is - felt like I was in a Mary Stewart novel!"My goodness, yes! And not just always smoking, but the way that people fiddle about with their cigarettes, or tape their cigarette cases, or blow their smoke. There's so much characterisation in just how people smoke. It's like a mirror into the soul.
Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "It is a reasonably large cast & I don't have any trouble remembering who is who!."Yes, the characters are all so vivid that it's easy to keep who's who in line. I must admit it took me a while to fix in my mind how everyone was related, though. I kept forgetting how the Pembles tied into the larger family.
Nick wrote: "Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "One thing that is striking me is how much smoking there is - felt like I was in a Mary Stewart novel!"My goodness, yes! And not just always smoking, but the way tha..."
Good point! Makes me think of older films, when smoking was still common, different actors could really convey a lot, depending on how they handled the physical act of smoking! I guess they learned to treat cigarettes and lighters, cases, ashtrays, etc., like props, and use them to convey emotions.
that's a good point about the smoking: you can convey so much. there is one mystery (Behold, Here's Poison?) where a female character taps her ashes right on the carpet, can you imagine? I just read the part where Rosemary is forcing her feelings on Miss Allison who finally says "Snap out of it!" - which is a great line delivered by Cher in Moonstruck when told "I love you" by the Nicholas Cage character.
is Rosemary the most dramatic character ever? I'm surprised she hasn't been murdered! She has no idea how close Trevor might come.
Jackie wrote: "that's a good point about the smoking: you can convey so much. there is one mystery (Behold, Here's Poison?) where a female character taps her ashes right on the carpet, can you imagine? I just r..."
Oh my gosh, Moonstruck is one of my all time favorite films, I know exactly the scene!😂 Patricia is absolutely right, glad someone finally told Rosemary that...
Nick wrote: "Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "It is a reasonably large cast & I don't have any trouble remembering who is who!."Yes, the characters are all so vivid that it's easy to keep who's who in line. I m..."
Me, too - and I would get distracted by the brainless Betty and forget to figure it out by returning to the first few pages!
Well I almost picked it (view spoiler)I actually liked my version better than the final one - but the final one was OK.
It was my first Heyer detective story and I enjoyed it. I am a huge Agatha Christie fan, so it is very similar. I loved some of the characters particularly Norma and Adrian. I also liked Terrible Timothy - although I felt he seemed (at times) younger than 14, but that might be because teens these days grow up so much faster.
I did find the number of characters at the beginning a little overwhelming and had to drawn myself a family tree; but then after the first few chapters they each had such well drawn characters that it was not hard to keep track.
Looking forward to next month already
wow, Susan, that would have been a very surprising ending if Patricia Allison was in on it! what a good idea! I think Norma and Adrian are very good characters and would be interesting enough for their own book.
Susan wrote: "Well I almost picked it [spoilers removed]I actually liked my version better than the final one - but the final one was OK.
It was my first Heyer detective story and I enjoyed it. I am a huge Ag..."
Wow, great ideas! And I think if this was a Christie (huge fan also), your twist would be the perfect Christie red herring ending! Well done. This is a reread for me, but it’s been years and I don’t remember who the killer is, but I don’t care, I’m just enjoying all of the characters (the audiobook I’m listening to makes it like a play, very entertaining!) I’ve got a few favorites I’d like it to be, but I’ll finish today while I finish knitting a scarf for my husband- we’re having a nasty cold snap, not all the snow they’re getting up north, but plenty cold for North Carolina 🥶!
Just finished - down to four stars just because I have enjoyed some of Heyer’s other mysteries more, but it was fun to revisit the first Heyer mystery I read many years ago.
Lady Harte tells off Rosemary and it's awsome"you are not only selfish" said Lady Harte, "you are indolent, shallow, parasitic, and remarkably stupid".
that's going to leave a mark!
I couldn’t help wondering, how long will Rosemary stay at Cliff House? I mean, she had to stay during the investigation, but now that it’s all over? I know she commented how she wanted to move in after Silas’ death when Clement was heir, because she didn’t want to bother with housework and stuff, and they’ve got a full staff - but once the case is over, I don’t think she’d be very popular with the other residents! I’d think she’d want to hightail it to the bright lights of London! I think the family should have a whip-round for an allowance to get her to leave, before old Emily clubs her...
Susan in NC wrote: "I couldn’t help wondering, how long will Rosemary stay at Cliff House? I mean, she had to stay during the investigation, but now that it’s all over?"I think she'll persuade her idiot Adonis to take her to the Côte d'Azur where they will have a marvellous time until his money runs out. Then they will break up and he'll go home, but she'll fall into the arms of some wealthy traveller, telling sob stories about how her husband was tragically murdered and her lover abandoned her.
Nick wrote: "Susan in NC wrote: "I couldn’t help wondering, how long will Rosemary stay at Cliff House? I mean, she had to stay during the investigation, but now that it’s all over?"I think she'll persuade her..."
Oh, good one! I wonder if she’ll tell him about her “Russian blood”?
I think at heart Rosemary is quite conventional & she will marry her "idiot Adonis."She would be Clement's heir & have some money of her own, so I imagine she will move to a fashionable hotel as soon as probate is granted.After the trial it will be a quiet wedding (in spite of Rosemary's Russian blood!) then off to the Côte d'Azur.
I doubt if either of them will be happy, once their looks start to fade.
Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "I think at heart Rosemary is quite conventional & she will marry her "idiot Adonis."She would be Clement's heir & have some money of her own, so I imagine she will move to a fashionable hotel as so..."True - as long as the money holds out, and she can have staff to handle any dreary details, I imagine she’ll be relatively comfortable, if not happy- especially, as you wisely point out, once her looks begin to fade!
Susan wrote: "Well I almost picked it [spoilers removed]I actually liked my version better than the final one - but the final one was OK.
It was my first Heyer detective story and I enjoyed it. I am a huge Ag..."
Sir Adrian is very droll, though shockingly offhand with his offspring (he even forgets where he’d arranged for Timothy to go...) But I like Adrian’s scenes.
I’m up to Ch 15 and, like Nick, have probably suspected almost anyone and everyone. Still don’t know who did it.
does anyone else smile to think of the detectives out in the country and having to take the bus to get around?
Jackie wrote: "does anyone else smile to think of the detectives out in the country and having to take the bus to get around?"Yes! Very different to now, you can't imagine how the police would get their work done if they couldn't drive around.
Lots of drama in this section but it also makes it easy to guess whodunit. Roberts was on my suspect list all along but it wasn't obvious until Tim's accident on the boat. Roberts jumped into action too soon, before he knew Tim was in danger. Why would he do that if he didn't know the boat had been tampered with? Then it became more obvious when Jim got into the car accident. There were only 3 people with opportunity and two had motives.I did wonder if the killer had used a Rube Goldberg device but thought she used that in another book.
The villain being the Australian heir's husband was a little silly.
Rosemary is just awful and insensitive. Her husband was not killed before her eyes, she did not hold him while he was dying and she was off with her lover and didn't know about the murder until after the fact. What a drama queen! I was glad Norma put her in her place!
When I started this reread, I did not remember who the culprit was, but it did seem obvious once Roberts jumped out the window. Also, there were not many possible suspects. I think it was unusual for the romance to be so far progressed so early in the story, usually that is resolved later in the book. And, of course once that has been tied up nicely, I can't bring myself to seriously suspect either of the couple.
Timothy was entertaining, I didn't mind him at all. And it was a nice dynamic to have brothers - Heyer does create a lot of interesting brothers in her books.
I liked Timothy and thought it was great that, even though he is a very smart kid, he was completely taken in by the murderer.
Jackie wrote: "I liked Timothy and thought it was great that, even though he is a very smart kid, he was completely taken in by the murderer."I actually think Roberts liked Timothy too. When he realizes that it's Timothy and not Jim in the boat ("That's the boy!") he immediately goes to the rescue so he'll be there to haul Timothy out of the water when Jim's boat sinks.
Jackie wrote: "does anyone else smile to think of the detectives out in the country and having to take the bus to get around?"So true! What a hassle...
I liked this mystery! Everyone came up with great ideas. I agree this would make a great play! And oh! Hahaha! I loved the new ending with Agatha Christie red herring twist I'm a big fan of hers also! And Rosemary talk about driving people crazy! Yes hear hear for Lady Harte and Allison giving her what for and yes her and her latest can go to the Cote De Azur and spend their money.
I had two or three suspects in mind that could of done it, it wasn't until almost to the end I decided on Robert.
I enjoyed reading this one!
I am already reading the next one, Duplicate Death, and it's nice to see a little of Pat and Jim, and a lot of a mature Timothy.
I enjoyed reading them back to back, also!
I started last night and I am already up to Chapter 12. As Punch said, all the characters really come alive for me. It is a reasonably large cast & I don't have any trouble remembering who is who!