Old Books, New Readers discussion

Hello all,
Thank you to those who nominated and voted on the book of the month. Our winner is Slaughterhouse-Five by Kurt Vonnegut Jr. I am looking forward to the discussions and comments everyone has on this read!

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/4...

I'm very pleased this book won. I voted for it because it has been on my TBR list for so long. I didn't realise until just now that it is less than 200 pages long so not exactly a weighty tome to get through.

I started this morning and am already at about 15% of the way through. So far a bit odd but I like it.

I read this book for the first time last September. It was brilliant and went on my favorites list.

I’ve read this already a while back but I enjoyed it so I’ll join in for the discussion.

I read this about 10+ years ago, but I don't have much of a memory of it, so I will reread it and join in the discussion.

Super excited for this one!

Cheryl wrote: "I'm very pleased this book won. I voted for it because it has been on my TBR list for so long. I didn't realise until just now that it is less than 200 pages long so not exactly a weighty tome to g..."

Thats great! I can't wait to hear your thoughts

Henry wrote: "I read this book for the first time last September. It was brilliant and went on my favorites list."

I'm glad you enjoyed it, excited to read it knowing there's some positive feelings towards it from recent readers

Michelle wrote: "I’ve read this already a while back but I enjoyed it so I’ll join in for the discussion."

Thanks for getting involved! How did you feel about the first few chapters?

Ian wrote: "I read this about 10+ years ago, but I don't have much of a memory of it, so I will reread it and join in the discussion."

Thats great Ian, you will have to let us know if you start to remember anything when you start reading! :)

anna ☆ wrote: "Super excited for this one!"

Me too Anna!

I'm not entirely sure what I was expecting but not this. I didn't realise it was so war focused or so bonkers! I was thinking it was more science fiction. Anyway that is not to say I am not enjoying this book, I really am

So it goes!

How is anyone else doing? I am at about 90% now and think I may well finish it this evening, and then mull over my review tonight/tomorrow.

Was anyone else expecting the level of crazy that is in this book?

Cheryl wrote: "How is anyone else doing? I am at about 90% now and think I may well finish it this evening, and then mull over my review tonight/tomorrow.

Was anyone else expecting the level of crazy that is in ..."

Hi Cheryl,

I am about 30% of the way through the book. I had forgotten about the whole being unstuck in time part of the book and just remembered the war part.

Do you like the unstuck in time element?

I don’t think I’d enjoy the book as much if it was more war, the added lightheartedness works for me.

Cheryl wrote: "I'm not entirely sure what I was expecting but not this. I didn't realise it was so war focused or so bonkers! I was thinking it was more science fiction. Anyway that is not to say I am not enjoyin..."


I have just made a start and I am surprised too!

Cheryl wrote: "Do you like the unstuck in time element?

I don’t think I’d enjoy the book as much if it was more war, the added lightheartedness works for me."

Do you have a favourite quote or line?

I'm not sure it is my favourite (I highlighted 43 sections!) but I did like the line...

"The time would not pass. Somebody was playing with the clocks, and not only with the electric clocks, but the wind-up kind, too. The second hand on my watch would twitch once, and a year would pass, and then it would twitch again. There was nothing I could do about it. As an Earthling, I had to believe whatever clocks said—and calendars."

I think we have all be in those situations, haven't we?

Oh and just a couple of other great quotes (offensive but amusing)

"All this responsibility at such an early age made her a bitchy flibbertigibbet."

and

"This was a fairly pretty girl, except that she had legs like an Edwardian grand piano."

LOL.

I could go on, there are some great quotes here.

Having read the first 3 chapters, I'm enjoying this book a lot. Just like Cheryl, I also didn't think it would be so much about war.
My expectations remain high. So it goes.

Cheryl wrote: "I'm not sure it is my favourite (I highlighted 43 sections!) but I did like the line...

"The time would not pass. Somebody was playing with the clocks, and not only with the electric clocks, but t..."

That quote was brilliant!

So it goes, Vera, so it goes.

I took out my copy and skimmed through it to refresh myself.

I remember thinking this book was a dystopian before I read it, but not sure why. I wasn’t expecting the war bits either.

I did enjoy the time traveling.

Since having read this now I keep thinking how bonkers it was, it seems get more crazy with hindsight than when I was actually reading it.

Cheryl wrote: "Do you like the unstuck in time element?


Hi Cheryl,

Yes - I like the added layer on the story with the stuck out of time and space travel elements. It seems like this is added to make a larger point that humans just keep doing terrible things; it seems to be in our nature to be fated to keep repeating atrocities.

Along that line, I like this quote from the book:

“Why don’t you write an anti-glacier book instead?’
What he meant, of course, was that there would always be wars, that they were as easy to stop as glaciers. I believe that too.”

That's another great quote, I highlighted that too.

I like your thinking about the time travel, stuck out of time emphasizing the point that "humans just keep doing terrible things; it seems to be in our nature to be fated to keep repeating atrocities". You make a really good point Ian.

Ian wrote: "
Yes - I like the added layer on the story with the stuck out of time and space travel elements. It seems like this is added to ..."

That's a very interesting point Ian.

I kind of interpreted the unstuck in time element, as a metaphor for the absurdity of war and how one deals with all the trauma in the aftermath of it... it seems to me that the terrible events of the war and the bombing of Dresden are incomprehensible to the narrator that the only way to deal with the atrocities of war is to
combine snippets of memory with the fantasy world of Tralfamadore.

Just like Vonnegut himself describes his difficulty in writing about Dresden in the first chapter were he says he cannot find the right words and keeps going round and round in circles and introduces various quotes from other texts until he comes to the conclution that he can only write about Dresden in a "jumbled and jangled" manner.

PS: Do we know why this book was banned?

Angie wrote: "PS: Do we know why this book was banned?"

I was wondering the same thing over the course of the past days, so I read an article by The Atlantic.
To summarize, the book was banned from the libraries of a lot of High Schools, that claimed the book was "depraved, immoral, psychotic, vulgar, and anti-Christian", and in other cases for being "anti-American, anti-Christian, anti-Semitic, and just plain filthy".
If I understood correctly, in most cases it was banned because of the cursing and the sex, essentially.

The article also stated "As a literary device, this was a way for Vonnegut to impress upon readers that we keep making the same mistakes, and it doesn’t have to be that way", so Ian's comment was really spot-on!

Angie wrote: "Ian wrote: "
Yes - I like the added layer on the story with the stuck out of time and space travel elements. It seems like this is added to ..."

That's a very interesting point Ian.

I kind of in..."

Totally agree, Angie. I've only just finished chapter one, and he kept saying phrases like "so it goes," and "hey, this may or may not be a true story." His use of blurring the line between real and fiction, like you said, not only shows that he can only comprehend the atrocities of the war by using science fiction, but also to highlight to the audience that what happened at Dresden/rest of the war was so horrific it could only be compared to fiction.

I'm just about to start. I was a bit sad to see how short this book is. I'm looking forward to the war parts, but I'm kind of dreading the timetravel parts.

It's interesting that so many of you expected a sci-fi book! Before reading this, I had only been told that it was "semi-autobiographical" and "anti-war," nothing else. It came as quite a surprise when the time travel came into play. But my brother made a point to me recently about time and experience being relative in our minds. And I wondered if maybe Vonnegut was trying to talk about the experience of war, the emotions tied up in that experience, PTSD, and how those experiences never really go away? People cycle through their past experiences internally throughout their lives.

I'm so so sorry everyone, but I just can't finish this book. I've read about a third. The writing is too jumbled, and the story too irratic. I know you all think that the constant repatition of the phrases "And so on" and "So it goes" is cute, but for me I feel like the author is banging me over the head with them. I really wanted to like this book, and I feel so guilty for copping out. I'm really sorry. I'll hopefully chat to you all in March. :)

Don't worry Kathryn, we can't all like the same things or the world would be a really boring place! Life is far too short to force yourself to read a book that you are really not enjoying - it is not copping out! Speak again soon though!

On a separate note: I am really loving reading everyone's views on this book; so many insights and interpretations that hadn't occurred to me and which have made me think. Thanks everyone for taking the time to share.

Thank you Cheryl. :)

Anyone knows why is everything blue and ivory?

I thought that was about the dead bodies, I think near the start it is mentioned about blue veins and ivory skin or something like that, on feet I think?

Hannah, that’s an interesting insight about time traveling and PTSD. I hadn’t thought of that but now it makes a lot of sense. Flashbacks, a common symptom of PTSD, are essentially traveling back to the past.

Kathryn wrote: "I'm so so sorry everyone, but I just can't finish this book. I've read about a third. The writing is too jumbled, and the story too irratic. I know you all think that the constant repatition of the..."

I agree with you. I don't like the writing style and those phrases are repeated so often they've become trite. I haven't decided if I'll finish it.

Kathryn wrote: "I'm so so sorry everyone, but I just can't finish this book. I've read about a third. The writing is too jumbled, and the story too irratic. I know you all think that the constant repatition of the..." Don't apologise for not finishing the book, differences in opinion make for interesting debates!

I loved it and read it all in one sitting!

I just finished this book!

The time traveling allows the audience (and Billy) to look at the before, during, and after, of Dresden. And cruelty, suffering, and death is present in all of these times. Billy's own son Robert continues on to be a Green Beret, more evidence of this ongoing cycle of destruction. I also saw his transition from kind of a teenage delinquent into a soldier as how we glorify war, how we ignore some of the atrocities (as the Tralfamadorians advised Billy to do) we commit and focus on the sacrifices OUR side made, the massacres that wiped out OUR civilians/troops, and the heroism.

Lots of great discussion here . Here are a few of my thoughts.
I think PTS is the main driver for most of this story. I started out laughing out loud at his back sided commentary but as the story progressed and I realized the pain he must have gone through my mood changed to concern not only for him but for the many soldiers from our many wars and what it is like to live through a hell like that and have to keep it mostly to yourself. Vonnegut used his talent as a writer for an outlet for his tortured past and also his attempt to help others through the mental torture of war.
This is defiantly a anti war story but also a war survival story and some can still relate to this attempt at helping us all see inside the casualties of war the physical and the mental.
Peace !!!

Peace indeed - well said Larry. I like your thoughts on this book.