Reading 1001 discussion

Review thread: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

1. The color green is not only in the title but is mentioned several times throughout the novel, can you name a few?

2. Iris Storm, in a man’s world she tries to play as a man and loses tragically. Discuss.

3. The characters are studies in fashionable absurdity; sincere caricatures. Discuss or give examples.

4. Did you like the book? Why or why not?

5. Does the book belong on the list?

I'm only 34% in, but I'll forget the examples of green if I don't note them now.....

1. The color green is not only in the title but is mentioned several times throughout the novel, can you name a few?

The emerald, the fashionable woman's green 'wrap', stockings and shoes, and Green park, '39 green dresses'.

I saw the green hat as symbolizing the clash between human nature (green) and societal conduct (hat). Maybe that would apply to the other appearances of green, too, since Valerie is noticing it in lots of apparel. I talk about this more in my review, but particularly I liked how Arlen focuses on the confusion the clash creates.

5. Several times while reading I wondered why it's on the list. I wouldn't put this on any list of the greatest books of all time, though that doesn't mean I think it was exactly bad. It just doesn't have the finer resolve that most great books have. In general, of what I've read from the 1001 list so far, it seems mostly focused on 20th Century Europe. I suppose the list maker was a product of his time, but it feels like he had some blinkers on. I feel like I could walk down the street from a scene from The Green Hat, for example, and enter a scene from Quartet by Jean Rhys.

1. The color green is not only in the title but is mentioned several times throughout the novel, can you name a few?

Mentioned above; also the nightclub had a green wall with vermillion accent(s).

2. Iris Storm, in a man’s world she tries to play as a man and loses tragically. Discuss.

I have to admit this annoyed me the most in the story, we find out in the end she was trying to do the 'honorable thing' yet was condemned by the establishment (which includes her supposed friends). Overall, the BS patriarchy was a bit much to take and heavy handed.

3. The characters are studies in fashionable absurdity; sincere caricatures. Discuss or give examples.

I found the portrayals heavy handed, but I will be interested to hear what others have to say.


4. Did you like the book? Why or why not?

Moderately. It wasn't a terrible waste of time to read it, but I suspect there are better examples of whatever this book is supposed to demonstrate.

5. Does the book belong on the list?

No, not really.

Valerie wrote: "I found the portrayals heavy handed....."

I agree. His characterizations are kind of over the top. Give them a conversational tic and then drive it into the ground.

1. The color green is not only in the title but is mentioned several times throughout the novel, can you name a few?

I think everyone else has covered this.

2. Iris Storm, in a man’s world she tries to play as a man and loses tragically. Discuss.

As Valerie mentions Iris has done an honourable thing to protect someone else and is condemned for it but she is also playing as a man at love affairs at multiple marriage and relationships without love. To be fair to Iris it was the attitude of others that lead to her tragic loss. The ideas of the time of what makes a good marriage and a weak willed man who went along with it all.

3. The characters are studies in fashionable absurdity; sincere caricatures. Discuss or give examples.

I honestly didn't really care enough for any of the characters to be able to answer this in depth. We had Gerald the eternal bachelor with the typical drink problem. Our narrator the good guy outsider. Venice the sweet, kind, acceptable wife. Napier poor little rich boy who obeys his father to the detriment of all.

4. Did you like the book? Why or why not? Not really I found it very dull right up until the very end. It just read like a series of society people meeting up doing stupid things together with no cares about real life. Like work, money, relationships. The characters felt flat boring and removed from real life.

5. Does the book belong on the list?

I am not sure why it was included and I could have died happily without reading it.

1. The color green is not only in the title but is mentioned several times throughout the novel, can you name a few?

I wasn't looking out for this, so I only remember the emerald ring and the multiple green hats.

2. Iris Storm, in a man’s world she tries to play as a man and loses tragically. Discuss.

I would agree with this. Her self-destructive act to protect her first husband Boy and her brother's regard for him seemed like something that a stereotypically "honourable" man of the time would have done. But then it is undone in the end by Napier revealing her action to justify her, which he would not have done if she had been a man - he would have respected a man's "honourable" reasons.

3. The characters are studies in fashionable absurdity; sincere caricatures. Discuss or give examples.

I would call them types rather than caricatures, but otherwise yes.

4. Did you like the book? Why or why not?

Yes, I loved it, but I am a big fan of books of this era!

5. Does the book belong on the list?

I think it does. It was very well known and influential in its day, which is a criterion for inclusion. Jean Rhys's 'Quartet' was written later so may have been influenced by this, but not the other way around. I think it evokes its microcosm of a world really well, and I would keep this on the list rather than some of the multiple books we have from later British authors.

2. Iris Storm, in a man’s world she tries to play as a man and loses tragically. Discuss.
I love Rosemary's answer to this question. I had not thought of it myself, but she is right that if Iris had been a man Napier would not have exposed her even if the exposure was to her credit. Throughout the book she is largely disdainful of any of the behavioral guidelines of her gender and her "class", having affairs that were not love affairs and not feeling the need to justify herself in any regard. She goes to see Napier's father to do verbal / mortal combat and feels that she has failed only when she cries (briefly) and when Napier does his reveal against her stated wishes.

3. The characters are studies in fashionable absurdity; sincere caricatures. Discuss or give examples.
Having read that the author was not English but had lived there a long time and was a fashionable English society dandy, I suspect that the author recognized some key characteristics of the social class he depicted and stretched those characteristics for prime satirical effect. In the beginning I couldn't stand any of the characters for this reason but eventually, with our narrator defending Venice simply because she was his friend and his managing to see the positive in people like Gerald and Guy I was able to continue reading.

4. Did you like the book? Why or why not?

No, I can not say that I liked the book overly. I think other books have depicted the change in societal norms during the time between the world wars better and although I can lose myself in noir melodrama, it was difficult for me to enjoy this romantic melodrama.

5. Does the book belong on the list?

No, I don't think so, although as Rosemary says, it was extremely popular and influential in its day.

1. The color green is not only in the title but is mentioned several times throughout the novel, can you name a few?
I didn’t really notice this, but I did like and noted this reference to the green dresses:
“There were many green dresses: jade-green, October green, rusty green, soft green, sea-green, dying green, any shade of green that would suit the expiring voices of formal women in a garden by Watteau.”

2. Iris Storm, in a man’s world she tries to play as a man and loses tragically. Discuss.
I also liked and agree with Rosemary’s point - Iris behaves like a man in the sense of their code, but she is not treated by the men (particularly Napier) in accordance with that code. They judge her as a woman, according to their own ideas. She loses because she is betrayed by Napier’s failure to understand this, and hence is robbed of the chance of living with him on her own terms.

3. The characters are studies in fashionable absurdity; sincere caricatures. Discuss or give examples.
I felt this could apply particularly to Guy and Hilary, they didn’t really seem necessary to the plot but were there to represent elements of British class system. The Iris/Napier/Venice love triangle seemed more like types from the melodrama rather than absurd or caricatures.

4. Did you like the book? Why or why not?
I found it exasperating at times (all the coyness about Iris’s illness, Guy and Hilary’s interventions) , but overall I quite enjoyed it. It was odd, but quite charming in its way.

5. Does the book belong on the list?
I’m not sure it has either the quality or the importance to merit a place on the list, but I’m quite glad it was there as I’m not sure I’d have found it otherwise.

The idea that Napier would not have betrayed her confidence were she a man is an interesting take on that scene, I think, and certainly addresses question #2; but if she were a man, Napier would not have lost his cool due to his being emotionally overwrought. Though I acknowledge I'm assuming hetero-normativity.

I really enjoyed this book and remember it well from when it was last a BOTM in 2016. It was a stylised satire and the fact that it was so popular despite its skewering of the Roaring Twenties made it a worthy inclusion in 1001 books in my opinion. See more in my review at the time.

1. The color green is not only in the title but is mentioned several times throughout the novel, can you name a few?

The most obvious is the emerald ring that Iris wears on her right hand. But, as the narrator notes, the color green was in fashion at the time.

2. Iris Storm, in a man’s world she tries to play as a man and loses tragically. Discuss.

During the climactic confrontation, Maurice asks Iris, “What sort of woman are you?” Iris replies, “You never dream of asking a woman ‘what sort of woman are you?’ so long as she keeps to the laws made by men.” I loved this line :)

Iris does the honorable thing by covering up the truth about Boy. She is also blameless in her second marriage. In that sense, she seems to be living by the English code of gentlemen like Hilary and Guy. However, she is willing to break from this code – “break the laws of men” – and run off with Napier. When Napier reveals the truth about her relationship with Boy, he takes from her the “only gracious thing” she ever did, as she says. This makes her change her mind about him – he can’t accept her as she is, or rather, accept her as the world believes she is. This seems to me to be the tragedy: she chooses death because she realizes she can’t even find happiness with her childhood love.

3. The characters are studies in fashionable absurdity; sincere caricatures. Discuss or give examples.

At one point, the narrator and Iris stand outside Maurice’s house watching three gentlemen playing cards, and Iris asks, “Judge [them] for me... Speak without thinking. It is only thus that truth is made.” He quickly sketches portraits of Hillary and Guy as caricatures of certain Englishmen.

4. Did you like the book? Why or why not?

I was excited to read this because it was referenced in Kate Atkinson’s last novel, _Shrines of Gaiety_, which is set during the same era. I didn’t like the first few chapters at all. It was written in such an impressionistic style that it was difficult to follow. I liked it more as I went along, so I’m glad I had to stick with it for the BOTM challenge. However, I would not recommend it to anyone unless they were a big fan of 1920s British lit.

5. Does the book belong on the list?

Not really – I think there are books from the era that are more important, or artistic, or just plain fun.