Reading the Detectives discussion

Nominations please for our November group read. Please only nominate books written and published in the Golden Age period, or a little earlier or later - if in doubt whether a title is eligible, please ask. As usual, just one nomination per group member, and only one book by any individual writer can be nominated per month.

If you aren't sure whether we have read something, the group bookshelves may help, or just ask. If it was at least 3 years ago that we read it, it is fine to renominate.

I am going to recommend another Lorac, though by her alternative name of Carol Carnac:



Near St. Brynneys in the Welsh border country, isolated by heavy snow and flooding from the thaw, a calamity has occurred. Old Dr. Robinson, a known ‘menace on the roads’, has met his end in a collision with a jeep on a hazardous junction. But when the police arrive at the scene, a burning question hints at something murkier than mere why was there a second body—a man not recognised by any locals—in the back of Robinson’s car?

As the local inspectors dive into the muddy waters of this strange crime, Chief Inspector Julian Rivers and Inspector Lancing are summoned from Scotland Yard to the windswept wilds, where danger and deceit lie in wait.

I read it recently and thought it excellent!

I will nominate Bleeding Hooks by Harriet Rutland

They grabbed their fishing bags, and made a dive for their rods which were standing, ready for use, outside the front door.'Well, tight lines!' they called over their shoulders.'Bleeding hooks!' grinned the Major.Gladys 'Ruby' Mumsby was more interested in fishermen than fish. When her corpse is discovered near a Welsh sporting lodge that is hosting a group of fly fishing enthusiasts, it seems one of them has taken an interest in her too - of the murderous kind. For impaled in the palm of her hand is a salmon fishing fly, so deep that the barb is completely covered. Her face is blue. It is thought at first she died of natural causes, but the detective Mr. Winkley, of Scotland Yard, almost immediately suspects otherwise. And what happened to the would-be magician's monkey that disappeared so soon after Mrs. Mumsby's death? Bleeding Hooks was the second of Harriet Rutland's sparkling mystery novels to feature the detective Mr Winkley.

Thanks for the great nominations to start us off, Rosina and Jill.

Looks like there is an edition of Impact of Evidence out in the US on Kindle, published under the ECR Lorac name, although the new edition under the Carol Carnac name isn't out there until April. I checked by putting a US zip code into the Amazon US site, so hopefully that's right!

I missed the deadline last month

I was going to nominate The Horizontal Man but the cheap edition has disappeared from Amazon for me.

So I would like to nominate In a Lonely Place by Dorothy B. Hughes which is showing as slightly less this month (but still a bit expensive.)

Postwar Los Angeles is a lonely place where the American Dream is showing its seamy underside—and a stranger is preying on young women. The suggestively named Dix Steele, a cynical vet with a chip on his shoulder about the opposite sex, is the LAPD's top suspect. Dix knows enough to watch his step, especially since his best friend is on the force, but when he meets the luscious Laurel Gray—a femme fatale with brains—something begins to crack.

But both books are included in the book below. This has gone up considerably since I bought this but if you divide the price four ways - not too bad.

Women Crime Writers: Four Suspense Novels of the 1940s: Laura / The Horizontal Man / In a Lonely Place / The Blank Wall

I'm happy to change my nomination to The Horizontal Man if a cheap edition is still showing up for other people. Sometimes things aren't available in New Zealand.

In the US:

Judy is right, Impact of Evidence is $1 when it is by Lorac

Bleeding Hooks, $1

Horizontal Man, $5
In a Lonely Place $12
The four book collection, $20

Sandy wrote: "In the US:

Judy is right, Impact of Evidence is $1 when it is by Lorac

Bleeding Hooks, $1

Horizontal Man, $5
In a Lonely Place $12
The four book collection, $20"
Thanks for the extra info, Sandy.

Rosina wrote: "I am going to recommend another Lorac, though by her alternative name of Carol Carnac:



Near St. Brynneys in the Welsh border country, isolated by heavy sn..."
That was a good one!

I’ll nominate Clouds of Witness by Dorothy L. Sayers:

“Rustic old Riddlesdale Lodge was a Wimsey family retreat filled with country pleasures and the thrill of the hunt -- until the game turned up human and quite dead. He lay among the chrysanthemums, wore slippers and a dinner jacket and was Lord Peter's brother-in-law-to-be. His accused murderer was Wimsey's own brother, and if murder set all in the family wasn't enough to boggle the unflappable Lord Wimsey, perhaps a few twists of fate would be -- a mysterious vanishing midnight letter from Egypt...a grieving fiancee with suitcase in hand...and a bullet destined for one very special Wimsey.”

I would like to nominate A Shilling for Candles by Josephine Tey, the second in her Alan Grant series. It's quite some time since I read Tey and want to reaquaint myself with Grant, whom I like. The book is available for free download in a variety of formats from Project Gutenberg Australia.

When a woman's body washes up on an isolated stretch of beach on the southern coast of England, Scotland Yard's Inspector Alan Grant is on the case. But the inquiry into her death turns into a nightmare of false leads and baffling clues. Was there anyone who didn't want lovely screen actress Christine Clay dead?

Oh, this one’s been on my TBR for ages, Neer! Thanks for nominating!

Susan in NC wrote: "Oh, this one’s been on my TBR for ages, Neer! Thanks for nominating!"

Glad you liked it. I have been thinking of giving Sayers another chance (after being underwhelmed by Whose Body?) so your nomination would give me that:) Perhaps we could go for Buudy Reads if the books do not win.

Good idea! I found Lord Peter became more serious and less dithery as the books progressed. I started rereading the Lord Peter books several years ago, but got sidetracked; our group read of The Nine Tailorslast year reminded me how much I loved Sayers’ writing, so I thought it would be good to get back to Lord Peter and company.

Sandy wrote: "In the US:

Judy is right, Impact of Evidence is $1 when it is by Lorac

Thanks for confirming this and the other prices, Sandy.

In the UK, In a Lonely Place is £5.99 on Kindle and The Horizontal Man is £6.95, so they are fairly similar prices.

Carol, do you want to swap, as The Horizontal Man is the cheaper of the two in the US? I'll put The Horizontal Man for now as you said you were happy to go with the cheaper one, but let me know if I've got that wrong.

I am happy to swap as I am intending to read both. The descriptions I found on Gr are brief & could be spoilerish so I won't put that up.

Thanks Carol - I was actually editing my post as I'd got myself in a muddle but you understood me and replied! ;)

Nominations so far - we have a very tempting selection this month! Last call to add any more before the poll goes up.

Rosina: Impact of Evidence by Carol Carnac/ ECR Lorac

Jill: Bleeding Hooks by Harriet Rutland

Carol: The Horizontal Man by Helen Eustis

Susan in NC: Clouds of Witness by Dorothy L Sayers

Neer: A Shilling for Candles by Josephine Tey

Neer wrote: "Susan in NC wrote: "Oh, this one’s been on my TBR for ages, Neer! Thanks for nominating!"

Glad you liked it. I have been thinking of giving Sayers another chance (after being underwhelmed by Whose..."

Try 'The Nine Taylors', Strong Poison' 'Have his Carcase' and 'Gaudy Night' for much more real characters

& the description of The Horizontal Man

Is better on the 4-in-1 book I linked to;

Helen Eustis’s The Horizontal Man (1946) won an Edgar Award for best first novel and continues to fascinate as a singular mixture of detection, satire, and psychological portraiture. A poet on the faculty of an Ivy League school (modeled on Eustis’s alma mater, Smith College) is found murdered, setting off ripple effects of anxiety, suspicion, and panic in the hothouse atmosphere of an English department rife with talk of Freud and Kafka.

Keith wrote: "Neer wrote: "Susan in NC wrote: "Oh, this one’s been on my TBR for ages, Neer! Thanks for nominating!"

Glad you liked it. I have been thinking of giving Sayers another chance (after being underwhe..."

Thanks for the recommendations. I did try Nine Tailors once but couldn't go very far but am keen to try Sayers once again.

The characters are made 3 dimensional when a sort of love interest between Peter and Harriet enters the fray . There are 7 novels altogether as well as a couple or so shorts. It all starts with 'Strong Poison', then 'Have His Carcase' Gaudy Night' and Busman's Honeymoon. Sayers started 'Thrones. Dominations, completed by Jill Paton Walsh who also wrote 'Presumption of Death ' followed by 'The Attenbury Emeralds' and her final 'The Late Scholar' set in 1956. She also wrote 4 with her own character, Imogen Quy, a college nurse at Cambridge although they are 'present day', not in the right period for GA.

Sayers is my most favourite author, she is a scholar (an Oxford M.A.) and writes scholarly which I enjoy. I continue constantly rereading her books when I tire of other GA authors, I'm plodding through Patricia Wentworth and Lorac, Ngaio Marsh's Alleyn and Troy are good, As a Kiwi myself, I like her NZ based books as well as all the British ones.

The poll is now open - please cast your vote for the book you most want to read! A tough choice this month (I know it always is, but even tougher than usual...)

https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/3...

Neer wrote: "Susan in NC wrote: "Oh, this one’s been on my TBR for ages, Neer! Thanks for nominating!"

Glad you liked it. I have been thinking of giving Sayers another chance (after being underwhelmed by Whose..."

I would be happy to join a Buddy Read if these don't win. I haven't read them in ages!

The Sayers titles? Me, too - I had started rereading them, got sidetracked, I definitely want to get back to her! Keith’s devotion to her writing reminds me what I loved about her from the first, but appreciate more deeply as I get older!

Or the Tey book - I picked up a couple years ago at a used book shop, want to read more. I’d be up for either, sorry I can’t always tell which comment, how far up the thread, people are responding to!

At present I'm reading Patricia Wentworth, mostly Miss Silver and finding it all pretty heavy going, Not so much pleasure as a chore to be completed unfortunately, I'm halfway through 'The Gazebo' and it really is heavy going so (surprise, surprise) I've taken a break and reread (for the umpteenth time) 'Gaudy Night' . It's not so much the actual story which I pretty well know by heart but the sheer pleasure of reading good English. Next time I need a break, I'll go back to 'The Nine Tailors' I think.

Keith wrote: "At present I'm reading Patricia Wentworth, mostly Miss Silver and finding it all pretty heavy going, Not so much pleasure as a chore to be completed unfortunately, I'm halfway through 'The Gazebo' ..."

I really enjoyed Nine Tailors when we read it recently; it was only my second time reading, and it had been a long time + two brain surgeries since, so virtually a new book to me…Gaudy Night definitely overdue for a reread!

As I wrote before, I would like to go for both Sayers and Tey, perhaps one in November and the other in December. Sayers might still win the poll but it doesn't seem Tey will.

I just checked and in fact Sayers is in the lead.

Oh good, I really enjoy 'Clouds of Witness', and I have all Tey's books on my Kindle so it will all fit in

I suspect I have read Clouds of Witness once, but do not remember any of it. I voted for it and am glad to see it in the lead.

Clouds of Witness is the second book about Lord Peter, he is still somewhat two dimensional but, to me is slowly 'coming to life' and not quite the 'silly ass' he is in 'Whose Body'

Keith wrote: "Clouds of Witness is the second book about Lord Peter, he is still somewhat two dimensional but, to me is slowly 'coming to life' and not quite the 'silly ass' he is in 'Whose Body'"

Yes, I find it fascinating to trace his growth from silly ass to the beloved character at the end of the series!

Our Dorothy brought Harriet Vane into the story in Strong Poison which develops a 'back story' giving depth to both characters which is developed in the later books.
To me, in many ways, Harriet is a mystery in herself, her refusal to accept her own emotions does not really ring true, she has too many inconsistencies. Jill Paton Walsh does an excellent job of completing the story in her four Wimsey/Vane books although she has many errors about wartime life in 'Presumed Dead' She did not experience it herself; I did.

Neer wrote: "As I wrote before, I would like to go for both Sayers and Tey, perhaps one in November and the other in December. Sayers might still win the poll but it doesn't seem Tey will."

Sounds good to me, Sayers in November (as a buddy read if it doesn’t win), and Tey’s A Shilling for Candles in December.

It was a very close poll in the end, but the winner was Clouds of Witness by Dorothy L. Sayers, which will be our November group read.

As it was so close, with just one vote between the top two books, we'll do the runner-up, Impact of Evidence by E. C. R. Lorac aka Carol Carnac in December, so there won't be a vote next month.

Thanks to all who nominated and voted.

Full results:
Clouds of Witness (Lord Peter Wimsey, #2) 8 votes, 40.0%
Impact of Evidence 7 votes, 35.0%
Bleeding Hooks 2 votes, 10.0%
A Shilling for Candles (Inspector Alan Grant, #2) 2 votes, 10.0%
The Horizontal Man 1 vote, 5.0%

Excellent, thanks Judy.

Great! Thanks from me too Judy

Thank you, Judy!

Missed the nominations and votes. I just picked up the Lorac edition of Impact. 99 cents vs. $7.99. I have read the Sayers, Tey and Rutland books.

There was interest in reading Tey's book: A Shilling for Candles as buddy read. If people are still keen, could it be set up as a buddy read for December?

I’d enjoy that! I’ve got my used paperback ready !

I can get the audio book, and it's abridged! yay! so I'm in.

What's the point of reading an abridged book ? To me. it seems to defeat its purpose. If you are going to read a book, read it - all of it, not bits selected by someone else !

A Tanner for Candles ...

A tanner - sixpence ! I haven't heard that for years, but then I live in New Zealand these days and sixpences disappeared when we went metric in 1967. (10 July) What a day, we had been playing with plastic currency for months to be ready for the big change bit when it actually happened - Oh Boy !!

We'll set the buddy read up for December, Neer.

Tey's books are all in the public domain in the UK now and some other countries, so there are likely to be a lot of free/cheap editions around.

Keith wrote: "What's the point of reading an abridged book ? To me. it seems to defeat its purpose. If you are going to read a book, read it - all of it, not bits selected by someone else !"

typo - I meant it was unabridged

ETA: but i can tell you the point is sometimes that's the audio book available at the library. I've been avoiding them since I like unabridged.

Susan in NC wrote: "I’d enjoy that! I’ve got my used paperback ready !"

I apparently got it on kindle in 2014. So I'm good.

Judy wrote: "We'll set the buddy read up for December, Neer.

Tey's books are all in the public domain in the UK now and some other countries, so there are likely to be a lot of free/cheap editions around."

Thank you, Judy. Also thanks to all those who have shown an interest.

I have added A Shilling for Candles to the reading list. I will set the thread up in December, along with the other group/challenge/buddy reads at that time. If I do it now, it will just vanish, but it is in the main list now so we don't forget.