The Sword and Laser discussion
TV, Movies and Games
>
Supergirl on CBS
This show would have been a big hit in 2005.
I'll reserve judgement until I see an episode, but I'm not encouraged by this. A lot of people seems to be enthused though. So maybe they're doing something right?
It looks exactly like that SNL Black Widow skit from last week.I'll be shocked if this makes it to mid-season.
Mod
If it's not, who are they targeting? 15 year old girls who are into superheroes but want it told in a teen rom com girl power disney style way. Ok I'm out.
See, I spent the entire trailer smiling. I suspect that 15 year old girls who are into superheroes is *exactly* who they're targeting. And I'm speaking as a late-20s woman who's not particularly into most girly stuff, but is so down for this show. For me, the trailer hits the Buffy space that has been largely empty on TV (for me, anyway. I don't watch a ton of TV, so I may have missed something) for a while. Agent Carter's the only thing on TV that comes close, and that's definitely targeted a bit older.
I've made the crack that they are targeting 10-year-old girls, but I've since heard from a number of people that their daughters in that age range really enjoyed it.Problem is, 10-year-olds don't buy cars, so this isn't likely to last more than 6 episodes. CBS is currently the ratings leader and they are ruthless about cutting shows which don't deliver the desired demo.
CBS is trying, with this, to move younger. I doubt they're after 10 year olds, but 18-30? Sure. That's a demo that they currently don't have and they DO appeal to an older demo. Guess what people do as they into retirement? Spend less. Buffering that with millennials is a good idea. Is this the right show? I think it might skew TOO young and too genre and would fit better on the CW (half owned by CBS), but we'll see.
I love the idea that 'rom-com' is somehow pejorative. What, you don't like a well done romantic comedy? Really? How sad. I suppose another CSI spinoff appeals more?
"I've made the crack that they are targeting 10-year-old girls, but I've since heard from a number of people that their daughters in that age range really enjoyed it.
Problem is, 10-year-olds don't buy cars..."
Their parents do...
Which is why Cartoon Network commercials skew to the 30-49 age range. Car commercials, and financial planning. With toy commercials mixed in.
Personally I like most genres, including romcoms. I watch While You Were Sleeping at least once a year. What I don't like I stuff that is obviously a rip-off of other work. Remixing is fine -- that's how art is made, after all -- but straight-up stealing bits is lame. That's all this show is doing.
Compare this Supergirl preview to the new CW spin-off from both Arrow and Flash, Legends of Tomorrow. LoT is fun and inherently epic, without swiping specific bits from other shows.
https://youtu.be/4MubNoWQiSc
Rick wrote: "Problem is, 10-year-olds don't buy cars..."
Their parents do... "
Who won't be watching. That's kind of how advertising works.
I'll give this show a shot, just like I will with most geek TV. Not expecting to be impressed, though.It could happen - I thought Flash looked goofy and pointlessly PC. After two episodes I was hooked.
The trailer worries me a lot. I will still give it a try but it really felt at first like I was watching the SNL Black Widow trailer again.
Mod
Groundhog Day is a rom-com I think is actually good. Different enough to break the mould, while still being a rom-com. Plus Bill Murray is so everyman, it is easier to relate to him than a normal rom-com pretty boy.
I have the same problem with comedies. I can't remember the last good comedy movie I've seen. Probably Guardians of the Galaxy. Unless they break the rules like Fargo & Pulp Fiction, both movies I would put in my comedy pile, I am not a fan of typical "Comedy" or "Rom-Com" genre movies. A funny line in a serious scene will impress me more than a funny line in a comedy situation.
I'd be more inclined towards rom-coms if a happy ending wasn't guaranteed. Like in real life. Mix it up to keep us guessing.
Tassie Dave wrote: " I can't remember the last good comedy movie I've seen. Probably Guardians of the Galaxy."Uh... GoG was last year. I mean, if you're going to use the I Can't Remember line at least reach back a bit. :)
Look, if you're so picky that you hate most romantic comedies and straight comedies, fine. By definition you won't like most things. But... that's kind of about you vs the product, too. Don't get me wrong, I think standards are a good thing, but applying high expectations to a network TV show about Supergirl might be asking just a bit too much. It's supposed to be a fun diversion, not necessarily high art and at least for me, there's room for both things.
All we've really seen so far is the setup. Where it goes from there is what's really important. How can a character grow if it has no where to go?
Well I for one am super excited. FINALLY one of the DC girls gets their own show. I was hoping Wonder Woman would be the gal to do it but alas, still waiting on that. I think the tone matches what she is perfectly. Her problems are gonna be way different and that for me is refreshing. It's going to be fun to watch her grow into her new role. I already love the character.DEFINITELY made for a younger audience, but taking it to a much lighthearted tone worked for the reboot of the Batgirl comics and helps introduce more girls into the comic world which is an initiative that is always welcomed. I think this was smart on DC's part to attract more girls into this genre and introducing them into their world and that is something that is sorely needed.
If this fails -- and it really looks like it will -- then the studios are going to look at the trend of failed female superhero shows and declare them dead.It's critical that this one succeed if we're going to see more of them. Even Marvel, which bucks trends like a champion rodeo bull, is only releasing a single female-centric movie and both of their TV shows featuring women characters are really miniseries.
This feels like it was made in 1994. They actually used the, "Oh, you're a lesbian! THAT'S why you aren't attracted to me!" line. Did no one else cringe at that? Not to mention half the other dialogue? What's next, fat jokes? It's so out of touch and tone deaf that it's embarrassing.
Do lighthearted Supergirl, absolutely. But don't do it badly.
Oh no! I hope it doesn't fail! I want to see more female protagonist super hero stuff! There's barely any of that around!I'm gonna keep my fingers crossed. Though hopefully it will get stronger from this initial setup. That's the hope. >.<
First, this says a lot of what I think about the Supergirl show, especially that we all need to realize that not everything is aimed at us. Second. If this fails -- and it really looks like it will -- then the studios are going to look at the trend of failed female superhero shows and declare them dead.
.
There are at least two shows with female superhero coming.. AKA Jessica Jones and Captain Marvel. But as the above link also notes, one of the issues with the reaction to Supergirl is that there are so few female lead superheroes that people overload each one. To quote that post:
Again, look at it from the male perspective: if you're a nerdy loser looking to see your experience reflected, you've got your Hulk and your Spider-Man. If you're after a confident and super-capable badass, you've got your Batman and your Iron Man. If you want a morally certain boy scout you've got Superman and Captain America. If you want a hero with a dark side you've got The Punisher or Wolverine. No-one complains that Hawkeye isn't a geek or Wolverine is a killer because there are other options out there. With superheroines, there are so few around that disliking even one closes off a significant portion of them all.
So if your disappointment with Supergirl is that you wanted something else entirely, that's fair enough. Perhaps AKA Jessica Jones will scratch your itch. Perhaps Captain Marvel will. Perhaps they won't. But there's a difference between "this is bad" and "this isn't what I wanted". Supergirl might not be the show you were hoping for, but it's going to be the show some people wanted. The only way to make that sting less is to make sure the variety of female heroes one day matches the variety of male heroes.
I guess I also viewed Agent Carter as a superhero show because it covered some of the same territory. Yes, Carter isn't powered, but neither is Green Arrow or Batman. Or Iron Man, for that matter.
John (Taloni) wrote: "I guess I also viewed Agent Carter as a superhero show because it covered some of the same territory. Yes, Carter isn't powered, but neither is Green Arrow or Batman. Or Iron Man, for that matter."I see your logic, but I didn't count Agent Carter as a superhero show because it didn't seem to play like one/try to be one, whereas Batman, Ironman and Green Arrow do.
Still, we may disagree on how to label it, but either way it's a comic based female hero and, in my opinion, was an awesome show.
Rick wrote: "There are at least two shows with female superhero coming.. AKA Jessica Jones and Captain Marvel."Really?! Noted! I'll make sure to keep a lookout for these. I had no idea. Yup, living in a cave for the past several weeks. ^_^;
Keidy wrote: "Really?! Noted! I'll make sure to keep a lookout for these. I had no idea. Yup, living in a cave for the past several weeks. ^_^;"AKA JJ is going to Netflix. I've heard very, very little about Captatin Marvel.
@Tommy: Aw nuts! I don't have Netflix streaming. Well... hopefully it will be going on DVD. Especially if it's any good. Same for Captain Marvel if that comes out. I like having hard copies of the shows that I like. <3
Keidy wrote: "@Tommy: Aw nuts! I don't have Netflix streaming. Well... hopefully it will be going on DVD. Especially if it's any good. Same for Captain Marvel if that comes out. I like having hard copies of the ..."Hopefully. The success of Daredevil is a good sign. AKA Jessica Jones is being made, along with a few others, to intermingle with that one. Pretty exciting time for comic folks right now haha. For this one at least :)
Yup. An explosion of TV-based comic stuff recently. I'm not complaining. There's a lot of series that are better off on TV than as a movie so I'm excited. Plus longer story lines makes for better character development. I'm all for that. ^_^v
Yeah, Daredevil has really led the way. I got a few of the animated DVDs but they were not impressive. I'm a huge fan of Thor and the DVD did not leave me wanting more. Same for the Dr. Strange one. So I approached Daredevil with some trepidation, but it really delivered. Even minor characters got their due. The interaction between Kingpin and Vanessa was among the best I've ever seen on TV. You really get to understand how she came to love the man before he changed.
Rick wrote: "First, this says a lot of what I think about the Supergirl show, especially that we all need to realize that not everything is aimed at us. "It doesn't have to be aimed at me, but it does have to be aimed at quality.
Trike wrote: "It doesn't have to be aimed at me, but it does have to be aimed at quality. "
And it might be. Might not be. We don't know yet since neither of us have seen an episode yet. Why assume the worst?
Oh, another one that isn't a Superhero show but is based on a comic and starring a female hero: iZombie. While lamely named, I'm really liking it so far.
But we have seen it. Do you honestly think the actual show is going to be better than the bits we've seen already?I've consumed so much media at this point in my life that I don't even have to watch most shows to know what's going to happen. Trust this trailer: it's showing you the pilot.
When they can't cut a preview together to give you an interesting spin on a show, there are fundamental problems with it. This reminds me of the first Green Lantern trailer and everyone went, "Wow, that looks terrible." The next few trailers were better, but our first instincts were right. Same with the movie Hot Pursuit. If those were the bits they put in the trailer, then the movie must stink. And by all accounts it really does.
The only way they can improve this is to rewrite and reshoot it. Which isn't out of the question. They did that with the original Buffy pilot, and the most famous example is probably Star Trek, which was completely retooled with an almost entire new cast, new script and new background bible.
Thing is, though, they don't usually show the pilot to anyone if they're going to recast it.
@Tommy: Yup. Watching that through Hulu. Thank goodness it's a program I don't have to pay for (as long as you don't mind watching on your computer, which I don't). I'm having a blast watching it. It's a great fun show that doesn't take itself too seriously and yet has a storyline that grips me.
The trailer was god awful. So much lame superman name dropping. urgghhhhhh. Daredevil really did set the benchmark for tv comic adaptions. Bring on JJ, Luke cage, iron fist and defenders!!!!!
For those talking about Captain Marvel: its a phase 3 Marvel movie not a TV series. I'm betting she gets introduced in Captain America: Civil War (Cap III) before getting her own movie.
I really don't get the angst that studio heads have over female superhero shows / movies. BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER. She was basically a superhero who fights vampires and it was awesome. It proved that the female hero genre can be done if handled correctly. Though I'm mostly talking TV as movies are a whole different animal. That said, on the movie front though I just don't see any female led movie outside of Wonder Woman being bankable on its own merits. Not even Black Widow as she's just a generic spy with a generic spy background without the other Avengers - if done with a reasonable budget it might make money but it will do much less than other Marvel movies. Captain Marvel will be an interesting experiment, hopefully they ace the casting and she doesn't come across poorly in Civil War.
Buffy the movie was a failure and the TV series was never a ratings hit.Black Widow isn't a generic spy. There's clearly something else going on with her. I don't know how a Black Widow movie could miss, given how popular a character she is, and she has had plenty of exposure in four movies so far, soon to be five in Cap 3.
She'd be the perfect vehicle to introduce other players in the MCU, since she's familiar and has already been used as a recruiting tool in two films (Iron Man 2 and Avengers). I'd watch a movie where Widow and Maria Hill team up to recruit Spider-Woman.
Trike wrote: "Buffy the movie was a failure and the TV series was never a ratings hit.Buffy's ratings were never great because it was on a 5th tier network that many like me didn't get it for much of its run. I forget if it started on the predecessor to the WB or UPN but whichever it was a majority of the country didn't have access to it at the time. I only finally got to start seeing it as it came out in season IV. Then in season VI when it switched to UPN I completely lost access to it except for late Saturday night rebroadcast on the local CBS station and then only sometimes as it was constantly getting pre-empted. Nonetheless it was a critical success and a cultural phenomenon.
Widow would be much better suited to a Netflix type of series than a feature movie. However, I find it very unlikely that this will happen since I don't see ScarJo forgoing her successful movie career for a TV series on Netflix.
If someone wants to do a fun, gitchy, super heroine movie?Squirrel Girl!
But for serious action I'm content to wait for Captain Marvel.
I would LOVE to see a Squirrel Girl TV series!!! XD
Threadnecro: The entire pilot ep leaked online. I, uh, watched it at a friend's house...
I really liked it and I look forward to the series. Sure, it has it's problems - but it was was nice that it's mostly happy and fun: more The Flash than Arrow.
The pilot pretty well lays out the basis for at least the first season as far as primary bad guys go, or so it seems.
Oh yeah. I heard it was leaked online. Shame, but I'll wait till it actually comes out. I can wait. The trailer showed a lot of promise and I'm excited for the series to come out. ^_^
I'm hoping the show does well only for the simple fact that DC needs to get a clue that female superheroines can be very successful franchises. That being said.
The Supergirl pilot looks super campy and is totally going to alienate the male demographic. Which is fine of course, but it would have been nice to be able to watch the show without gagging on how corny it is.
The acting is cringe-worthy, the CG tunnel that Kara is launched from is horribly amateur, and the music for the pilot was just a terrible and cliché. There's a million different tracks that would have better suited the pilot trailer and that was not one of them.
Best of luck to the series but unless it drastically changes direction during the season, it is not for me.
Seems like most reactions are, "Yeah, it's really not that good, but it's not quite as bad as that terrible trailer would have you believe."It still really looks like "Kimmy Schmidt Gets Superpowers." It seems like these guys are pretty binary. Yes, they make The Flash, but they are also responsible for Green Lantern.
Mod
I had a problem with her motivation to perform her first major superhero moment. (view spoiler)
It is almost like the writers felt she needed a reason to do good, instead of doing good because it is the right thing to do.
Then we have her sister's reaction to her super deed. (view spoiler)
Then there is also (Major spoiler)(view spoiler)
All that stuff combined with stealing bits from better material just breaks it for me.
Wilmar wrote: "The Supergirl pilot looks super campy and is totally going to alienate the male demographic."
I'd say it is just as alienating for the female demographic. The idea that some studio guys were all like 'this is what 'girls' like. Lets do that!' rubs me up the wrong way. Don't try to appeal to me as a female. Try to appeal to me as a person who likes good stuff!
Ruth (tilltab) wrote: "Wilmar wrote: "
The Supergirl pilot looks super campy and is totally going to alienate the male demographic."
I'd say it is just as alienating for the female demographic. The idea that some studio..."
It makes you debate watching. If I watch it, then I lead them to thinking this is what I as a woman am interested in. If I don't, the chances of a female superhero that matches my interests in the future, decrease.
Also, Tassie that's not fair. Spiderman didn't become a superhero until his uncle died despite having powers and Batman didn't go into crime fighting until his parents were killed. This is nothing new in superhero lore.
The Supergirl pilot looks super campy and is totally going to alienate the male demographic."
I'd say it is just as alienating for the female demographic. The idea that some studio..."
It makes you debate watching. If I watch it, then I lead them to thinking this is what I as a woman am interested in. If I don't, the chances of a female superhero that matches my interests in the future, decrease.
Also, Tassie that's not fair. Spiderman didn't become a superhero until his uncle died despite having powers and Batman didn't go into crime fighting until his parents were killed. This is nothing new in superhero lore.
I honestly thought this was a Funny or Die skit. If this is legit, I'm calling it now: #Supercanceled
It's like they asked people in the office what their favorite movies were and then just straight-up stole scenes from them.
Janet: "The Devil Wears Prada!"
Steve: "Men in Black!"
Achmed: "The Incredibles!"
So they mash those all together, make it as super lame as possible by substituting crane shots for content, and try to skew their audience demographics from 65+ to under-10 in one fell swoop. This is just embarrassingly bad.