Invisibooks for Invisipeeps discussion

forgive me everyone, I am glued to homework so I don't have time to read, but please post here to start the discussion!

Okay here is what I started to say on the other thread:
I enjoyed it. It was a fast, easy read that kept me fairly motivated to keep on going. I wouldn't say that I loved it or thought it was great or surprising or anything like that.
What do you think of Flavia? Are there things about her and her voice as an eleven year old that did or did not ring true for you? Did you find her likable?
I think 11 is such an interesting age and a turning point-perhaps for girls in particular-so this aspect of the book was interesting to me. For me, this character was not a complete success. I am interested in what others think.

As for the plot, I thought it was a fairly typical Agatha Christie type mystery.

I kind of adored Flavia. I did not think her voice rang true for a typical 11 year old, but I thought it was perfect for an 11 year old being raised by one distant parent, without much peer interaction.

I really enjoyed the world of this book--the big crazy house, the village where everybody knows everybody else's business...I will probably read the other books in the series just for the chance to go back there.

I also enjoyed the world of this book. Like you, I like the small village, big old house, those kinds of details. I like cozy mysteries and their typical ingredients.
I had mixed feelings about Flavia. Her confidence and self love appealed to me. Many eleven year old girls have those things but lose them soon after. I don't think the author quite captured the voice of child though, even a precocious, intelligent, and confident one. The lack of peer interaction is a good point, though. And at times I didn't find her likable-perhaps in part because she didn't quite ring true. I think she could have done without some of the references and things like that that seemed to suggest an older person.
I read the author interview in the back of the book. He said that part of what he liked about a child protaganist is that she could be sort of invisible to the other characters-in this sense she is a Miss Marple type character, someone who is underestimated and somewhat unnoticed. But I think something about the way the character is drawn undercuts the appeal of that underestimated quality. It's like however diminished she might be to the other characters, to the reader if anything her qualities are a bit overstated. I felt that as a reader I had to be indulgent to believe or like this character.
As far as the story, it seemed that many clues just fell into her lap. I also thought I could see things coming too much. The elements of the mystery were rather unsurprising-I think I was hoping for a bit more plot-wise.
What did you think of Flavia's reaction to finding the dead man?

I thinking about it, one of the issues I had with the first person narration of Flavia is that the things she said didn't really sound like the organic thoughts of a child who had little interaction or social exposure-rather they seemed overdetermined and designed to make an impression.
Of course children who spend a lot of time alone reading DO sometimes sound unnatural and bookish but this is a mark of their childish inexperience, not sophistication or maturity that the tranparently older voice here suggest.

Oh, I am pretty sure if I knew her in real life I would think she was an annoying little sh!t.

There's a fundamental problem with a child first-person narrator in a book written for adults because some of the information that needs to be conveyed is not necessarily something a kid that age would be privy to or understand. So there are times when the voice doesn't ring entirely true, especially with the tense this book is written in. I just started Swamplandia! which also has an 11-year-old narrator, but she's speaking from some point in the future so she's able to say stuff like "Little did we know, that was just the beginning of our troubles." You really can't do that with mysteries, though.

Yes I suppose that is an inherent problem of this type of narrative. But I think it is really apparent here because the author kind of went overboard in making the kid seem so brilliant and precocious (and reference-filled). It draws so much attention to the issue of whether this could really sound like an eleven year old.
At the same time, her actual detecting skills seemed a little unclear to me. I didn't really feel she was ahead of me. I never felt surprised by either a turn of plot or by her perceptions or deductions.
Come to think of it, it might be interesting if the book were really written as a child would perceive and understand events, and it were left to the reader to figure out what was really happening. And now I remember that in the author interview, he mentioned liking the fact that a child would be an "unreliable narrator" but I don't think that really came across at all in the book.

I totally agree. She sort of the most reliable narrator ever.

I think you're right about the construction of the mystery--I didn't feel like she outsmarted me and wasn't surprised by any turns of the plot.

On another note, a few years ago I went to an evening at the theater that was comprised of many short plays (5-10 minutes each) written by children (11 year olds, I think!) but aided by working playwrights, actors, and directors. In addition to being possibly one of the most enjoyable evenings I have had at the theater, the authenticity of the children's voices was so striking-so different from the children we are used to, that are written by adults.
Back to The Sweetness, the revelation of the criminal wasn't surprising. There had to be a reason for that character to be in the book, though of course it didn't necessarily have to be that role.
I tend to be disappointed in mystery novels' resolutions, yet I love mysteries so much anyway.

I have been struggling with time to read this week, but tax season is over for me and my time is my own again. But I also have been struggling with desire to read this book, and I think you two have given me the reason, her voice is not ringing true to me. I have actually been annoyed with her in many ways. I have just a few more chapters to read, I WILL get it done this weekend.

Whatsherface, I will be interested in your thoughts.

I pretty much agree with all thats been said so far. I loved the town and big old house and liked Flavia. I thought she sounded a bit old at times and a bit too much but I let a lot go in books. I didn't see this as a great mystery at all, just more like an adventure for her.

oh, what about the title? and the quote they used in the book that no one would explain to her, sorry I don't have the book handy so I can't copy it here.

Okay, so here are my thoughts.
I enjoyed the story, not as a mystery, but as a glimpse at another time & place. Upon reflection, it wasn't so much that I was annoyed with Flavia, more so that I was annoyed with how the "clues" just fell into her lap at every turn. As I was reading I had to concentrate on the fact that she was a child. I could see that she had no parental figure in her life to speak of and that she had an independence that few 11 year olds have, but it seemed that too many adults treated her as a peer. There were a few times that her age helped her get around obstacles, but most times it fell flat for me.
I did appreciate her intelligence and I had no problems believing in her while she was captured.
As to the title, I am still trying to process an answer to how it related to the story.

I think the title might be referencing all those human ties that were kind of surprising to Flavia--her affection for her sister and her fathers, the little nugget about how the housekeeper knows they don't like the custard pie but Harriet told her to bake one every so often. Flavia's whole is the pie and those little interactions are the sweetness? Maybe?

Frankly, I think the primary function of the title is to make people in bookshops go "Oh, what a quaint turn of phrase!" and pick up the book.

I tried to read this a while ago, but gave up.

I think I'm going to try again now that I have more reading time. I see the Flavia series is up to 4 books now with 2 more planned, if anyone really enjoyed this book.

The Sweetness at the Bottom of the Pie
The Weed that Strings the Hangman's Bag
A Red Herring Without Mustard
I Am Half-Sick of Shadows