Goodreads Librarians Group discussion

I was looking at this book today and noticed it is listed as a part of the Avalon series: http://www.goodreads.com/series/56532...

As far as I can remember (I've read it) it is not a part of the series. Also, I checked out the MZB Literary Trust: http://www.mzbworks.com/works.htm#other and it is listed as "Other."

I wanted to get some other opinions/feedback before changing since I know how much work goes into series creation.

As far as I know, The Fall of Atlantis is not part of the Avalon series at all. In the series list, though it is at the #1 spot, with Mists of Avalon (even though the title says it is #1) at #8.

Definitely needs to be fixed.

Wikipedia (I haven't had a chance to look at other sources yet) states that Fall of Atlantis was in fact part of the Avalon series. (Small note: there are two Avalon series I think. One chronological one, which is referenced in this topic, and one that has the publication order.)

Oh and if anyone wants that wikipedia link here it is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avalon_S...

I haven't read it, but a friend once told me that it's a prequel book.

Wikipedia indicates that it wasn't in the same universe orginally but Paxton refrenced the events in Ancestors of Avalon, which IMO makes it part of the series.

I guess my problem is that there is no real stated link to the two series anywhere. The book - as written by the author - was not intended to be linked to the Avalon series from what I can tell.

The MZB Trust http://www.mzbworks.com/works.htm#other
shows that it is not a part of the Avalon series: http://www.mzbworks.com/works.htm#avalon

The same wikipedia article doesn't have it listed with the rest of the books under the "novels" heading at the top, though it does have it in the series order section. That's a little confusing.

I also tried looking at WorldCat (no mention of the series, that I saw) and the LoC (couldn't find the title, actually - found "Fall of Neskaya / Marion Zimmer Bradley and Deborah J. Ross." which is part of a different series).

But, when I pulled up "Lady of Avalon" by Marion Zimmer Bradley, it didn't give me a series listing at all, even when looking at the full record, or the MARC tags.

Which leaves me with - I am confused.

Okay, just went to Marion Zimmer Bradley's wikipedia page, and it says:


Atlantean series
Web of Light (1983)
Web of Darkness (1983)
The Fall of Atlantis (1987) (omnibus edition of Web of Light and Web of Darkness)


Which is separate from the Avalon series.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_Z...

Based on comments I've read from fans of the series, it would seem that Fall of Atlantis is a stand-alone work (as in, not part of the series proper) set in the same universe as the Avalon series.

My suggestion would be to add an entry for the Atlantean series and then link the Avalon series to it.

MZB had quite a few books that were never officially considered parts of a series even though they shared events and characters. (Her occult/”Light” books, for example.)

According to Paxton's website, she considers Ancestors of Avalon to be a "direct sequel" to Fall of Atlantis, but says Ancestors is the first book chronologically. That doesn't make much sense to me. One book is a sequel to another but isn't part of the same series? - Link: http://www.diana-paxson.com/writing/a...

The official Avalon series webpage (run by Paxton) doesn't include Fall of Atlantis either but says that the characters in Fall of Atlantis were reincarnated in the Avalon books. And she says the idea was MZB's, not hers. I've only read Mists, so the explanation doesn't make much sense to me.
http://www.avalonbooks.net/books/ - book list
http://www.avalonbooks.net/faq.html - 2nd paragraph talks about reincarnation
http://www.avalonbooks.net/reincarnat... - list of who's who.

I guess the argument could go either way. Neither author claims that Fall of Atlantis is part of the series, but they both seem to agree that the book is somewhat related. The book is widely thought of as being part of the series though, so if you remove it, eventually someone’s probably going to add it back.

Speaking as someone who loves to eat up every bit of lore I can for a series - the relationship between the books is definitely something I would like to know if I were looking in to that series.

But I can see how the argument could go either way. My thought is to leave it on the series listing but remove it as a primary work and make a note in the series description that it's related to the series though not officially part of the series.

If there is a way, as Vicky suggested, to list it as related but not part of the actual series, that would be good.

This reminds me of the Sookie Stackhouse/Southern Vampire series. There are obviously direct books in that series, and even novellas related to the series starring Sookie that end up being noted as say #7.5 in the series. However, she also has what are called Sookieverse stories. There are other works that take place in the same world Sookie lives in but Sookie doesn't show up directly in that story. These are never listed in the series list of actual Sookie stories. (Although the author does have a list of Sookieverse stories on her website for those interested.)

Using that as an example, I wouldn't list it as an actual book in the series although it's related. Perhaps another series could be created for all the related books that in themselves are related to each other but are only say cousins to the original works but not an actual part of it.

Ok. I kept the book in the series list but changed the numbering. I also noted that the book is related but not officially part of the series.

I also created a series for the book itself as The Fall of Atlantis is an omnibus.

Now here's my next question: I called the series "The Fall of Atlantis" but in seems the series has been called both "Shadow's Gate" and "Atlantean."

Now I'm not sure which is more appropriate.

Shadow's Gate: http://www.ibdof.com/series_books.php...

Atlantean: http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?M...

If you look at the second link (the isfdb one) it states that Shadow's Gate is already a series, with completely different books.

lafon حمزة wrote: "If you look at the second link (the isfdb one) it states that Shadow's Gate is already a series, with completely different books."

*face palm*

I guess that's what I get for not scrutinizing the entire page.

I'll leave it as the Fall of Atlantis for right now. The MZB Literary Trust lists that book in this way:

FALL OF ATLANTIS, Pocket, 1987 (aka WEB OF LIGHT/WEB OF DARKNESS - written in the early 1950s) e-books: multiple formats, including Kindle
DARK SATANIC, Tor 1988

Not "Shadow's Gate". That's the name of the estate in the "Light" books -- Ghostlight, Gravelight, etc.