Support for Indie Authors discussion

Sorry in advance, folks, for this frustrated rant.

Honestly, I don't get it. I mean, in all marketing advice you read you always see 'start with your friends and family, let them read and recommend your book to others'. That's fine - if you had people among your friends and family who actually were interested in reading what you're writing. It would be okay if they weren't interested in reading it, though, because hey, horror isn't up everyone's alley, right. But... this really, really awkward silence every single time I so much as mention something about my book is... astonishing... I have no idea why this is. An example here that I think everyone can more or less recognize: Facebook. I put up a photo of my children and immediately get 40 likes and comments. I write about my Thanksgiving dinner. Same there. Lots of likes. I say that my book is finally in print. ... ... ... Nada. Nothing. Zilch. What the hell!? At this point it's gone so far that I start to feel bullied. People can obviously like the not threatening things I put up. The harmless things. The things that apparently don't shake your ground. But to put even a like on the fact that a friend or a relative has published a book? That's apparently something that is so extremely uncomfortable that you don't know what to do. This is not only going on on FB, but when I talk with people too. They look awkward and say something like: "Well... that's nice... Um... I really enjoyed the last game night we had together."

Does any of you get the same kind of silencing and if you do, how do you cope with it?

I've been 50/50 with that so far. I have some very strong supporters from my friends, but the rest of them pretend it didn't happen. It's eye opening when you get to see what people really think of your capabilities. I just stop, and move on. I haven only one family member that has read it, but I didn't expect much from them anyway. It is discouraging when someone that enjoys reading won't even pick up the free copy you gave them and read the first three chapters or so.

The consolation being if(when) you do break out, those people will be the first to flock to you with praise and hands out.

A.E. wrote: "Does any of you get the same kind of silencing and if you do, how do you cope with it? "

I learned many years ago that most people do not know how to react when you say you're a writer. If you're not writing the exact kind of books they like, they won't even feign interest. So, these days I don't even bother. I discuss my writing with my wife and a handful of people I have met through this group. I will post an occasional post on Facebook about my writing and I have a small, small number of friends there that will buy my books once in a while. My family has never mentioned my published works and won't even pretend to be interested.

And I'm okay with that.

I look at it this way - My parents both worked at a golf course after they retired. I didn't take up golfing just because they have an interest in it and are making a living with it. I used to have an uncle that managed a Hardee's for a while. I don't care for Hardee's and didn't eat there.

And so on.

I do my thing, they do theirs. We talk about other stuff at holidays and get along fine.

Bottom line, I really only write for myself. If others enjoy what they read, great. If not, that's fine, too.

I recommend you create a separate FB Author Page. Then people that Like it do so to get updates about your writing. Here is a link to mine as an example:

https://www.facebook.com/MartinWilsey...

Keep the content fresh. I also do a monthly promotion, post freebies, and just have fun.

I also have a blog, Twitter, Goodreads, and LinkedIn.

It's work, but worth it!

Charles wrote: "The consolation being if(when) you do break out, those people will be the first to flock to you with praise and hands out. "

Ha ha! May we all see that day. And soon!

I agree with Martin.

Separate (but equal) FB pages is the way to go!

I kind of get it. People are excited when they hear my book has been published and then they ask what it's about. When I tell them, I kind of get the blank stare and the slow head nod, followed by an "uh huh, gee that sounds...interesting." LOL I try not to let it bother me. I know that not everyone is into UF and in fact none of my friends are readers (which is why I need all you folks here) and they think my reading obsession is crazy too. Like someone else suggested, I have a separate FB page for my book related stuff and any of my friends and family that are truly interested have liked the author page so they get the updates and I keep the book related stuff on my personal profile to a minimum. That doesn't mean I don't give myself shoutouts on my personal page though because my writing is personal and something to be proud of as far as I am concerned.

We all seek validation to some degree. However, expecting your family to understand your writing is asking them to understand something beyond their experience. Some people are able to do that, some are not.

I'm reminded of a story I read about Anne Tyler (Accidental Tourist, etc.). Her books were bestsellers and made into movies. Still, her neighbor of many years asked her, 'Have you found a job yet, or are you still doing that writing thing?'

One of the greatest insights that an individual can discover in life is that you can be a whole person without the validation of others.

I hope this helps.

When you post pics of your food just make sure that your book is in the background! BACON!

I've experienced this too to a certain degree. I started writing later in my life and I kept it to myself until after I'd finished my first MS. I took sneaky to a whole new level while I was writing...lol Now mind you, I have the best husband in the world but when I told him that I'd written a book he didn't have a whole lot to say about it...something in the area of...you've always been good with words and that was that. I didn't get into it any farther and neither did he. He supports me completely now and is proud of me. He's told all his co-workers to look for my books soon. I wonder if it was just that I'd shocked the beans out of him. Who knows, and maybe those that don't support me are shocked too, at least that's how I choose to look at it. I do have loyal friends who love my books though so maybe I'm lucky. I'm proud of myself these days and will be even if nobody reads my books. I've done something that I didn't think I could do and that's something that a person should be proud of.

I get the similar reaction where they "can't wait to read my book," then spend the next 3.5 years telling me they're "too busy" while they tell me everything that's happened on every reality TV show that exists.

I'm right there with you. Half of why I canceled my personal facebook account was because in addition to completely ignoring anything I posted regarding my books, there were a few friends who would go out of their way to point out typos and autocorrect mistakes that showed up in my posts because as an author, I should know better. God forbid I forget an apostrophe when posting about bad weather.

Fortunately, that was just a handful of folks and I do have a handful of folks (even if it is a smaller handful) who are very supportive.

I agree with that. Keep your personal FB all about friends and family. Not customers.

Martin wrote: "I agree with that. Keep your personal FB all about friends and family. Not customers."

Absolutely.

Jay wrote: "We all seek validation to some degree. However, expecting your family to understand your writing is asking them to understand something beyond their experience. Some people are able to do that, som..."

Hehehe, well, I guess that's one way to do it... ;-)

But yes, I do have a separate FB-group for my books, and some of my friends has liked it, which feels good, even though there aren't a lot of people who comment, which is fine. I don't post customer things to my private FB-page. Those things don't belong there. I post updates about my books there from time to time because I'm proud of what I've accomplished, and as everyone else I want to get recognized for something good I've done. ;-)

I'm happy to hear that I'm not alone experiencing it, even though I feel sad that so many of you are actually experiencing the same thing, but it makes it easier to bear. It's not that I expect a full out support from friends and family, but an encouraging pet on the shoulder and a 'Wow, that's great!' would be nice every once in a while. :-)

And Christina, honestly, that is just awful, having people point out grammar mistakes in your private status updates! :-O

And the Anne Tyler story is just... hilariously tragic and mind-blowing. :-D

I keep most of my writing stuff for a separate twitter account. Half my family doesn't even know I have a book published. I told a few friends about it but without giving too many details. I try to keep it all separate. It gets awkward otherwise.

I've put my book on my personal FB page. Some friends are really supportive and others don't respond. I can understand those that remain silent and it's no problem, while I'm thankful for those that share - not that I have sold many!

I'll just wait for it to be dramatised into a movie!

Yes, I am a comedian too... ;)

Man, I thought people's reactions were a bit odd, but I guess it's normal. I think most of the people I know are outwardly supportive, though. My siblings are willing to mention their sister wrote a book, though my roommates haven't bought it yet.
Part of me knows some of it is due to people not being into the fantasy genre. I imagine horror would be even more difficult to sell.

I get a mix of reactions from family. Most of them are not into the genre (sci-fi) so that's not surprising.

What's really surprised me, though, is the positive response from work colleagues. People regularly approach me in the office asking for paperbacks. Maybe they're just the right thickness to prop up wonky desks :)

I've noticed if I mention my books to friends or relatives who don't write, they smile and nod and that's the end of it, while those that do write will at least pay a little more attention (but not always have time to read what I wrote.)

I was actually surprised by the response I had from co-workers as well. Of course I work in an office where there are 200 people in the same building so there would have to be some UF/PNR readers in the bunch. I also just recently offered up a chance to name a minor (very minor) character in my next book as a prize for a charity auction (United Way for you Canucks, not sure if that charity exists outside of Canada) so the whole company is aware of my writing now.

Lisa wrote: "I was actually surprised by the response I had from co-workers as well. Of course I work in an office where there are 200 people in the same building so there would have to be some UF/PNR readers i..."

That's a great way of doing it, Lisa. I have a friend who got to create a character that will have a huge impact on my current main character's life. She is very excited about this and so am I. It's fascinating to work with getting to know a character that you haven't created yourself.

My friends have been fantastic; then again, it helps that a lot of them are also writers. My family, on the other hand, has been pretty "meh" about it -- though my grandmother did say she wanted to read it.

That scared the crap out of me; my small-town, conservative grandmother wanting to read a murder mystery sci-fi book featuring several out LGBT characters. But she read it and loved it.

Problem is, there aren't many people for her to brag about it to.

A.E. wrote: "I'm happy to hear that I'm not alone experiencing it, even though I feel sad that so many of you are actually experiencing the same thing, but it makes it easier to bear"

Thanks A.E. for venting for me too.

Axe Facebook - that worked for me on any number of annoyances :D

Ellison wrote: "A.E. wrote: "I'm happy to hear that I'm not alone experiencing it, even though I feel sad that so many of you are actually experiencing the same thing, but it makes it easier to bear"

Thanks A.E. ..."

You're most welcome, Ellison. I have to admit that I'm surprised over how many of us that have experienced this.

Sometimes people do surprise you though. I'm happy to hear that your grandmother loved your book J.D. That's awesome. :-)

My family didn't take me seriously until I registered a VAT number as a small publisher in order to get exempt from US taxes that Amazon takes off my (future) royalties, as I pay taxes on them at home.

Suddenly my Dad wants me to publish his poems, and now likes to say "Excuse me, I need to talk to my publisher," when he goes to see me.

The majority of my friends doesn't read, and sees "writing a book" as a huge thing that only select people can accomplish - certainly not me. They either ignore me or even belittle my efforts.

The only friend who supports me is someone I met while gaming, and I borrowed the name of her gaming toons for one of my minor characters, which she is very excited about.

My most unlikely support comes from my mother's boyfriend, a retired managing executive who is an avid reader, and as it turns out, a great SFF fan. He thinks my writing is exciting. The second unlikely supporter - a friend of my Dad's - is a renowned physicist (so, as a scientist, unlikely to be into magic and monsters), who was very impressed that I write in English, despite this not being my mother tongue. He has published scientific papers in English and found the language a challenge, so he now regularly asks about my progress.

So yeah, people surprise you.

Keep at it, A.E. - also, you have all of us to cheer you on!

I got the little support biz in spades. -_- fam and friends give me thats nice speil and where i live most stop reading after high school and usually have a bible tv guide and at least one special intrest magazine. i used to mention my works online through the usual soc net channels but to no avail. hell i spent almost 3k on marketint...

Martin wrote: "I agree with that. Keep your personal FB all about friends and family. Not customers."

I agree with that. People are friends with you because of who you are, not what just what you do. If you have a separate author FB page, then the people who will like it will be those who are genuinely interested in your work (although don't take that as a given).

That doesn't mean you can't occasionally throw things up on your personal FB page, but don't expect many responses.

I used to find the same thing in conversations. When I used to try talking about my writing, people would close down and rapidly change the subject. Nowadays, I just briefly mention I'm a writer or I wait for someone else to bring it up (which will happen eventually). At that point, I play it down a lot, not in a bored sense but in a 'I'd rather talk about you' way.

By doing this, you will find the people who are genuinely interested because they will keep asking questions about your work - those are the people you want to target as the start point for your fan base - the ones who show a genuine interest and actively ask you about your work.

It takes time, but if you play the patient game, you will work out who you really want to focus your attention on. From there you at least have a chance of getting the word spread...

Hope that helps

I just assume that most of my relatives are illiterate, and just don't want to say so. So they're deathly afraid that I'll ask them to read my books.

To comment on everyone saying 'keep your private and public profiles separate': Yes, most of us here do. However, take a look at your facebook feed. How many people post about their promotion? How many complain about a bad day at work? How many post pictures from their company baseball team? Do they get radio silence? Of course not. That's the problem.

Even when you aren't trying to sell to someone (like AE's original comment about her physical books) friends and family get defensivd. Why? Most likely guilt. They know they aren't goimg to buy and even if they do buy to support, they aren't going to read.

I find I struggle to talk to anyone about my writing. Apart from my partner. I find it impossible to talk to both my friends and family about my work as my first book is an erotica, paranormal, romance novel.

They don't want to hear how their family member could write something like that and almost all of my friends are male and don't care for such work.

A.E. wrote: "Ellison wrote: "A.E. wrote: "I'm happy to hear that I'm not alone experiencing it, even though I feel sad that so many of you are actually experiencing the same thing, but it makes it easier to bea..."

Thanks! It was definitely a shock. I was so worried when she asked to read it. But now she's bugging me for the sequel, so I guess I did okay lol.

You may even find that some people may be jealous. It's odd how people react sometimes.

You may also be surprised at how few people read ANY books anymore.

Keep in mind that being a writer is a lonely endeavor. Also, I think it's fair to say that most writers have a deep-seated need for validation. We need others to confirm that we are indeed writers.

Don't expect your family and friends to necessarily meet the need for validation. Validation is more likely to come from fellow writers who you befriend in social media or in a local writers' group, and from readers who like your work.

I've experienced the same thing you've described, but to a slightly lesser extent. My sister is my BFF/manager/cheerleader/coach. My parents pat me on the head and say "Good girl; we knew you could do it." Most everyone else ignores my writing. My friends at work are patient and supportive (and many of them have read my book).

Just remember, writing is a solitary, at-times lonely, activity. Try to validate yourself and not look for external validation from family and friends.

Also, genre does make a difference. I write romance - people generally aren't afraid of romance, while some people may feel uncomfortable about horror stories.

April wrote: "We need others to confirm that we are indeed writers."

Personally? No, I don't require anyone to validate any aspect of my life. I do, however, expect that most people were taught to be polite and can't understand why they tend to forget this on social media.

The more I read in this group, the more I see that we authors share a lot of the same experiences that I myself thought I was alone in.

I agree,it is interest to see what people think of your capabilities. I have experienced it as well on FB amd with friends and family, and I have to admit, it was pretty hurtful. Although I have one or two enthusiastic supporters, one in particular, I supported everyone in everything they did and always the first to say you can do it and can't wait for you too, by couldn't get the same from the same people.

So what I decided to do, like others in this feed, is focus energy and marketing on venues where people who are interested can read it if they like. Discussing with people who will rather than wont. That is how I found this group, and I have to admit, it has been the best resource and arena I've found since I started.

Christina wrote: "April wrote: "We need others to confirm that we are indeed writers."

Personally? No, I don't require anyone to validate any aspect of my life. I do, however, expect that most people were taught to..."

I'm with you Christina. I have noticed that some people will jump on a particular bandwagon because others have stated one thing or another. Gotta love a social bandwagon - a couple of negatives causes a list of negatives, and a few positive responses will result in more positives.
I come from a time when we each valued our own personal opinion, and did not speak just because it was popular to be in the agreement business.

B.B. wrote: "And just because I love this gif so much

"

Well stated.

April wrote: "Keep in mind that being a writer is a lonely endeavor. Also, I think it's fair to say that most writers have a deep-seated need for validation. We need others to confirm that we are indeed writers. "

Perhaps for some, but certainly not for me. I love being alone. I think that was part of what lead me to become interested in writing. It's a great way to entertain myself. There probably are writers who seek validation, but it's not a concern of mine. Yes, if someone enjoys a story I wrote, it does please me, but it's not why I write. For many years I wrote just for myself and maybe the very few others in my life that showed any real interest.

I really like Dwaynes response. Its blunt but it's also reality, nothing says someone who knows you is going to be beaming and jumping for you just because you write.

I've found that when I make posts about my works or news on them they generally go unnoticed although I will get occasional likes and comments. Sometimes some will inquire and ask about them saying they will buy a copy but never do so that's a bit disheartening but I don't make much fuss over it.

Dorsey wrote: "The more I read in this group, the more I see that we authors share a lot of the same experiences that I myself thought I was alone in."

Yay! This is a lot of why this group exists, Dorsey.

Thing is, most people don't really care about creative work. Period.

I started out as a visual artist. I got support from my parents for my schooling and my attempts at making a career out of it, but not really any understanding or encouragement. Because they just didn't really understand art. To them a painting was judged on whether it was pretty and if it would look pleasant on the living room wall. Art was a pleasant luxury and being an artist wasn't really a viable career. They wanted me to be happy, so they didn't complain about it, but they wanted me financially secure so gentle pressure was put on me to find more gainful work.

When I switched over into music, it was pretty much the same thing. My close friends were always supportive, but family only reacted when the music was pretty. They didn't really understand what I was doing, but by then I had become accustomed to not expecting them to.

So when I started publishing a few years back, I just never really made a fuss about it. I put stuff on my FB page (which is not an author's page) and my closest friends share it, buy it, post about it...but most of my casual friends and/or family ignore it. I don't even talk about my writing with other than my closest sibling (even though he's never read my stuff, 'cause he just doesn't read).

I think you have to know your family and friends and set your expectations accordingly. You can't expect people to get it, or support your work because, as I've said, most people don't care about creative work. To most people, writing is something (a chore) that you had to do in school which, when you grow up you, can be safely ignored. There are far more important things to attend to like events their kids are involved in, watching sports and reality TV shows, movies & video to watch, games to play. You know, important fun stuff.

But someone sitting down and creating something? Well...that's a hobby, yeah? An idle pastime.

Justin wrote: "I really like Dwaynes response. Its blunt but it's also reality, nothing says someone who knows you is going to be beaming and jumping for you just because you write."

I hope not too blunt? I intended it to be helpful. Hope it doesn't seem snarky.

Tony wrote: "I come from a time when we each valued our own personal opinion, and did not speak just because it was popular to be in the agreement business.

Sufferin' succotash! I almost thought I was the only one left who remembered that time!

Back then, I also remember that it was permissible to think before opening one's mouth. Of course, that didn't always work well, but it was certainly better than beating Christina up over an apostrophe or turning social media into a new edition of "The Joy of Snarky".

I totally get that! I am just gearing up for my official book release (tomorrow). So I asked on my own fb for friends to like/share my author post. I had ONE like!! :-( One out of hundreds!

But like you, I put pictures up of my latest dress on dinner and at least 50 will like it.

This book is mega important as I'm trying to raise CSA awareness. I was hoping my friends would understand and (heaven forbid) they support.

I got so fed up that I actually put on a rant on my fb. I've been a shoulder to cry on for them (gladly) many times, yet a click of a like and/or share is too much for them?? I had a few apologies, and some shock as I don't usually rant at my friends. Apparently the post was "beneath you"!

But they've been a bit better since!
I think sometimes people just don't understand what's important to us. And tbf they may not be interested in reading, and I respect that.

I'm glad that I have groups like this, on Twitter and my fan page where lots of authors feel the same. We're like a club of misunderstood souls. ;-P

Don't sweat it; just build up your fan base.
And when you're rolling in cash just don't give your friends any unless they supported you! :-) :-) :-)

When I released my book, I asked all of my friends on Facebook to share it with their friends, because between all of my friends, they had about 12,000 friends-of-friends. I figured I'd at least hit a couple hundred people that might be interested in checking out my book.

Well, after much prodding, almost everyone finally shared it, but all but 2 of them simply hit the "Share" button. There was no context, no "this is my brother/cousin/friend's first published book" to go with it to possibly further interest readers. So it really ended up being a waste of time for the most part.

The other thing that gets me is the whole, "I don't want to read it in case I don't like it, because I don't want to hurt your feelings." Right, because refusing to read my work does so much for my feelings.

People are weird. Now that I've accepted that, it bothers me a little less.

April wrote: "Keep in mind that being a writer is a lonely endeavor. Also, I think it's fair to say that most writers have a deep-seated need for validation. We need others to confirm that we are indeed writers...."
Agreed, but the best validation is when you go back over your manuscript the tenth time, looking for textual errors, and get lost in the storyline. That tells me I've written something good.

Hi, my name is Holly, and I'm an Indie Author...
I had to weigh in on this conversation. I don't feel so alone anymore! I'm not the type who needs validation or praise. I've lived without praise most of my life; I'm used to it. I've been writing for over thirty years, since I was pre-teen. My immediate family was actually happy to hear about my first "self-published" book. I didn't expect a big deal or a parade thrown in my honor, but my two best friends (from when I first started writing as a child) basically accepted the free paperback copies I gave them, said "that's nice", and continued to tell me about what was going on in their lives. If either actually reads it, I'll probably fall over dead. Although I consider my family supportive, not a single one asks me about my writing--EVER! I usually don't talk about my writing unless someone asks. If I do become famous, I suppose they'll have to find out about it in the gossip rags. What DOES upset me and I CANNOT forgive are those who believe my writing is a "pipedream" and "stroking my ego" all without EVER having read a single word I've written.