Underground Knowledge — A discussion group discussion

Excerpt from INTERNATIONAL BANKSTER$: The Global Banking Elite Exposed and the Case for Restructuring Capitalism:

Capitalism and socialism are traditionally thought of as being contradictory and conflicting economic ideologies that cannot operate in tandem. However, that assumption has been challenged in recent years with some radical thinkers claiming to be equal parts socialist and capitalist – and, in some cases at least, presenting sound arguments for combining the two contrasting ideologies.

According to traditional definitions in economic theory, such statements are paradoxical. However, perhaps two systems that were formerly thought to be mutually exclusive, or diametrically opposed, may actually share some common ground.

British journalist, author and economics editor Paul Mason may well be one of the aforementioned radical thinkers. In an article published in The Guardian on July 17, 2015, Mason writes about “new ways of working and the sharing economy”.

An excerpt from the article follows:

“The old ways will take a long while to disappear, but it’s time to be utopian.

“Technology has created a new route out, which the remnants of the old left – and all other forces influenced by it – have either to embrace or die. Capitalism, it turns out, will not be abolished by forced-march techniques. It will be abolished by creating something more dynamic that exists, at first, almost unseen within the old system, but which will break through, reshaping the economy around new values and behaviours. I call this postcapitalism”.

Private citizens are starting to think along these lines also – as these excerpts show from a September 2015 letter addressed to the editor of Californian-based daily newspaper the Chico Enterprise-Record from local resident Linda Furr:

“Capitalism, socialism can co-exist peacefully.

“There’s socialism in Norway, yet there’s capitalism, too. Norway’s forms of capitalism and socialism check each other. People in Norway decided long ago they want to have a good, working economy as well as good investments in their country’s future, i.e. education, health care, affordable transportation, freedom from want as much as possible, innovations in arts, science and engineering”.

Ms Furr concludes, “Whatever the reason, Norway’s forms of capitalism and socialism seem to be working well — certainly far better than the casino-styled, vulture capitalism of our country — in place still, in spite of the havoc it wreaked on the world in 2008”.

We note other countries, like Japan for example, also seem to be successfully supporting big business as well as looking after their population by incorporating the best of capitalism and socialism.

“We put our faith in a system that awards do-nothing CEOs with millions as their companies collapse and provoke a global crisis. We judge corporate success on the number of sackings, fund the privatisation of essential services with public money and favour cheap goods discounted by the loss of our jobs. We sign up for wars in which capitalism makes a killing.” –Bob Ellis, The Capitalism Delusion

This topic relates to a group poll we ran last year which asked members: Do you believe Capitalism should be restructured, replaced by another economic system or left exactly as is?

Here are the results of that poll:

55.4% voted Restructured/reformed
26.2% voted Replaced by another economic system
10.8% voted UNSURE
7.7% voted Left exactly as is

Check out the comments that occurred during the voting period: https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1...

We mentioned this poll result in INTERNATIONAL BANKSTER$: The Global Banking Elite Exposed and the Case for Restructuring Capitalism as per the following excerpt:

So, more than half the members believe capitalism should be restructured/reformed.

We believe this poll result is reasonably reflective of the public at large. People are sick of being screwed by banksters and by corrupt politicians who do nothing to stop them. However, most people seem to want to keep the best aspects of our current (capitalistic) society.

The poll result is also reflective of our own opinion in that we think restructuring or reforming the current version of capitalism is what’s most needed.

It’s time for change. Let’s face it, a resentful public are perhaps only one or two major financial injustices away from demanding a new, fairer economic system that supports ‘the people’ ahead of the global elite.

Beyond Capitalism and Socialism

Capitalism, Socialism and Democracy

Mixed Economic System http://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/m...

"A mixed economic system is an economic system that features characteristics of both capitalism and socialism. A mixed economic system protects private property and allows a level of economic freedom in the use of capital, but also allows for governments to interfere in economic activities in order to achieve social aims. According to neoclassical theory, mixed economies are less efficient than pure free markets, but proponents of government interventions argue that the base conditions such as equal information and rational market participants cannot be achieved in practical application."

People-First Economics: Making a Clean Start for Jobs, Justice and Climate

STOPPNow: (Stop the Organized Pill Pushers) Now There is going to be a story on 60 Minutes this Sunday 2/24/19 regarding the Opiate Epidemic. This is not capitalism at it's best. This is not what our forefathers had in mind.Below is a link to the 60 Minute show that will air this Sunday: It will reveal/expose what we have known for a long time - the opiate should never have been approved by the FDA for long term use. My friend Emily, that lost her son was also interviewed. I hope and pray that this brings about the needed change to opiate prescribing and puts and end to the opiate epidemic.https://www.cbsnews.com/news/former-f...

www.utopiancapitalist.com


READ "WEALTH OF THE WORLD" by Ewan Lillicii

http://a.co/ioCZ7xD

Here's an idea out of LEFT field (literally!)

Fully Automated Luxury Communism https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PugN3...
A different kind of politics for a new kind of society—beyond work, scarcity and capitalism. In Fully Automated Luxury Communism, Aaron Bastani conjures a vision of extraordinary hope, showing how we move to energy abundance, feed a world of 9 billion, overcome work, transcend the limits of biology, and establish meaningful freedom for everyone. Rather than a final destination, such a society merely heralds the real beginning of history.

Fully Automated Luxury Communism: A Manifesto

Has the Social Credit Party 'won' its argument after all this time?https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/1218...

Just because the banks are printing money furiously to help the rich get richer does not mean the Social Credit policy is working.

I can't fathom how the policy of NZ's minor political party can work. If they are encouraging printing huge amounts of money and giving it to everyone, then how does that work with inflation? How can their policies be practical, do you know Ian?

I am not sure what you mean, James, by the "minor party". If it is Social Credit, it has not stood in an election for quite a long time. The Reserve Bank, here, is independent, and the quantitative easing has not been ordered by the government or any political party, although, of course, the government is having to borrow a lot of money from somewhere to fund its COVID response. As for giving it to everyone, that is not happening. I haven't received anything unusual. (By that, I mean I still receive my pension payments, but they have been paid for quite some time.)

Ian wrote: "I am not sure what you mean, James, by the "minor party". If it is Social Credit, it has not stood in an election for quite a long time. The Reserve Bank, here, is independent, and the quantitative..."

As per the article I posted above, the Social Credit Party is a long-time minor or fringe NZ party. I think from memory my father (Lance) did some journalistic or PR work for them back in the 80s maybe. It says in one NZ election in the 80s this party received 21% of the vote, so I assumed you would know them.

James, they disappeared from view, which is partly odd once MMP came along - they stood when a minor party would have huge problems. As an aside, in the 1960s Social Credit formed the state government in Alberta and were very successful. Of course, it was hard not to be with the oil money, but they had excellent roads, a good houising by and large, and a good health system. Since the US is now an oil exporter, Trump could do worse than take lessons.

James wrote: "Ian wrote: "I am not sure what you mean, James, by the "minor party". If it is Social Credit, it has not stood in an election for quite a long time. The Reserve Bank, here, is independent, and the ..."

Yep good memory James. I was actually employed by the NZ Social Credit Party, handling their PR, briefly early in 1972 (during the disastrous John O'Brien era). That was at party HQ in Wellington. Got the job a week after I was fired on the spot from NZBC News for protesting NZ's sporting contact with apartheid South Africa... and that setback happened a month after I married your Mom! Tumultuous days...

P.S. I didn't understand the party's convoluted social credit financial philosophy back in 71. and I still don't understand it now.

Unless the Social Credit Party rob Peter to pay Paul?

I think Muldoon's interpretation (if you could call it that) was they wanted a three dollar bill :-)

James wrote: "Unless the Social Credit Party rob Peter to pay Paul?"

Yes! and that was the very slogan opponents used to disparage and ridicule the party. Back in the day media labelled Social Credit the "Rob Peter to Pay Paul Party". As PR Officer it was my job to deflect the criticism. The results are history now. (Enuff said...).

Sounds like there could be a great comedy movie about this party. And if they really were as dumb as they seem, then it's embarrassing that 21% of kiwis voted for them in the 1981 election like the article says.

But then again... What if they are right and ahead of their time?! They just needed a mega crisis like now to make their point!!

They did well in Alberta, but with all that oil money the janitor could have done well too :-)

James wrote: "Sounds like there could be a great comedy movie about this party. And if they really were as dumb as they seem, then it's embarrassing that 21% of kiwis voted for them in the 1981 election like the..."

Yes it would be a great sequel to Fawlty Towers for sure.