Underground Knowledge — A discussion group discussion

Do you know a lot about veterinary medicine, Catherine?

Sorry I meant to say Catherine not Catie
My mistake

Maybe your real name is Catherine so I assume you won't mind my mistake
Most Caties are called Catherine after all...

I've friends who have pets with cancer...going through chemo...both dogs and cats...one of them recently went into remission after months of repeated bloodwork and chemotherapy drugs..both iv and oral. she will need to be rechecked in six months, I believe...but she seems to be happy.

James Morcan wrote: "Maybe your real name is Catherine so I assume you won't mind my mistake
Most Caties are called Catherine after all..."

not a problem..a lot of people assume my name is spelt with a K too

Wesley wrote: "Lance wrote: "Interesting (All things Big Pharma and the Medical Industrial Complex don't want us to know I suspect)."

Indeed. Another interesting natural remedy for many conditions is Olive Leaf ..."

wow! have you ever gotten lyme again? I'm only asking because a friend of mine has had it 4 times...and not from being re-infected by a new tick bite...she's been treated repeatedly for it...and each time at the end of the treatment...been sent on her merry way under a clean bill of health...only to (month later) get it again...

As a side...James....you can call me whatever you wish, spell my name any way you like...as long as you don't call me late for supper..or..er..tea perhaps...lol just ahd to say it.. couldn't resist

James Morcan wrote: "Laureen wrote: "I just think it is a little bit insulting not to recognize the great accomplishments that our educated science researchers have given to our societies. Yes, science outcomes can be ..."

You have hit on one of my pet subjects with this piece by Denis Toovey. I have been searching for a medical doctor who is open to and understands holistic medicine. In Australia, these doctors (ahead of their time) are extremely hard to find. I have found one in Brisbane. There are a couple of others in the Southern states but they are rare.

You are right to suggest that Medical doctors have not been amendable to working with holistically knowledgeable people and, in my mind, it would improve the success outcomes of medical practitioners considerably if only our doctors were not so scathingly against alternative medicine. What are they afraid of?

Laureen wrote: "James Morcan wrote: "Laureen wrote: "I just think it is a little bit insulting not to recognize the great accomplishments that our educated science researchers have given to our societies. Yes, sci..."

I think...mostly..loss of income....but there may be much more to it.

I don't know if they're hiding a verified cure/"magic bullet" for cancer.

They certainly go out of there way to discredit/refute any alternate, simple, inexpensive, or natural treatments in favor of their patented, exclusive, expensive ones.

I think if they had something that could make them a profit, it would be out there. If it was as simple as the cure for scurvy 9get your vitamin C), then they would bury it. But every alternative claim I've seen for such simple cures tends to rely on anecdotal evidence, rather than verifiable, repeatable data.

Besides, for everything an effective treatment is found for, the pharma industry finds a new condition you need to ask your doctor about and a medicine to take for it.

Inadequate or not enough lashes? Ask about Latisse.

Non-24-hour sleep-wake disorder? Hetlioz.

Or just about any other drug advertised on US TV.

And don't get me started on the various drugs in development for diabetes. Yes, as a diabetic, I know there are improvements to make to treatment, but I think a large drive for it has to do with the prevalence and efficacy of inexpensive generics.

Lance Morcan wrote: ""What would be the benefit in curing cancer anyway?"

Put that question to any one of the millions of cancer sufferers worldwide, or to the families of departed cancer victims, and I think we all k..."

Considering cancer is a common way to die, I know that people suffer from it. I've lost many family members from it, and I still have this question. Lol, I don't think my heart bleeds as much about death as many people's do. Death is only suffering to the living. We all die. Suffering is living.

I want to add, as a medical researcher, that cancer is not as simple of a disease as the argument poses when it comes to "hiding" cures. Cancer (as in malignant tumors in a tissue or organ) is a symptom of a problem that we can hardly detect until cancer arises. We still aren't clear on why we get certain types of cancer and the causes and clinical manifestations vary widely across the board. Now, what I would call a scam, is the treatment of many types of cancers that might regress on their own. There was actually a podcast I was listening to (Frekonomics) a few weeks ago that was talking about the problem with the healthcare system, which I thought was interesting in and of itself. A man interviewed said that many of the cancers that are treated may regress on their own, and treatment might be what kills the patients. Seeing as chemo kills the immune system and god knows what else (no seriously, we don't know everything that chemo does), treatment of cancer kills people under the pretense of saving them. I wish I did more research before I came back here and responded, but I'm sure you all will give it a look.

Robert wrote: "I don't know if they're hiding a verified cure/"magic bullet" for cancer.

They certainly go out of there way to discredit/refute any alternate, simple, inexpensive, or natural treatments in favor ..."
I was just talking to a family member about the made up disease: restless leg syndrome, whatever that is.

Some more excerpts from MEDICAL INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX: The $ickness Industry, Big Pharma and Suppressed Cures regarding this subject:

The medical establishment has identified and branded as ineffective numerous alternative therapies to treat and prevent cancer. These include: homeopathy, naturopathy, herbalism, holistic medicine and aromatherapy.

Similarly, many other treatments have been put down by the establishment. To name but a few, these include light therapy and other energy-based treatments, fasting and other diet-based treatments, cannabis and other plant-based treatments, colon cleansing and other physical procedures, and faith healing and other such spiritual measures.

There’s no disputing that the alternative (cancer treatment) route is littered with examples of pseudo-science, snake oil salesmen, bogus cures and failures; nor is there any disputing that in recent decades medical science has made major inroads into treating and removing cancers. You only need to look at the advances made in chemotherapy and radiation therapy, and the refinement of surgical techniques, to understand that.

However, officially at least, a cure for cancer still eludes Mankind and cancer sufferers continue to die by the millions every year.

For that reason alone, mainstream medicine should not be so quick to dismiss claims of alternative treatments and cures. After all, there are many case studies that support the theory that there has already been a cure, or many cures, discovered for cancer.

...

Our own investigation into the merits of using olive leaf extract to combat cancer proved productive. Among the many papers published on the subject, a report by health writer Danica Collins on the UndergroundHealthReporter.com site claims that “The phytochemical known as oleuropein found in olive leaf extract has been shown to eliminate cancer tumors in 9 to 12 days”.

Collins says, “It’s no wonder that people who live in the Mediterranean area — who consume 20 times more olive oil than Americans — have half the incidences of cancer than the U.S. Both the olive leaf and olive fruit have active polyphenol properties, but in the processing of the fruit and oil, many are removed.

“Even so, olive oil contains enough polyphenols that deliver many healthful benefits. It is the olive leaf, however, that is prized for its anti-tumor, anti-microbial and anti-viral properties. And it’s not just cancer that olive leaf extract has been shown to treat successfully”.

She concludes, “Clinical tests conducted by the New York University School of Medicine showed that olive leaf extract is able to change the pathways of HIV-type infections as well, and may even reverse these conditions”.

Collins also refers to a book titled Olive Leaf Extract, by Dr. Morton Walker who, she says, recommends using olive leaf extract for its miraculous effects on more than 125 infectious and chronic diseases. (We couldn’t obtain a copy of this book before our own book went to press, but it sounds interesting).

The health benefits of olive leaf extract are also extoled in an article published by Fox News on January 23, 2013. It confirms that “Olive leaf is an especially good source of the anti-cancer compounds apigenin and luteolin, and is a source of the anti-malarial agent cinchonine. And oleuropein has also shown protective capabilities against breast cancer”.

The article continues, “Olive leaf extract also acts as an anti-inflammatory. Like oxidation, inflammation is a key factor in chronic and degenerative diseases. Animal studies additionally suggest that olive leaf extract may protect against nerve damage, and may be of value in cases of stroke”.

The popular science-based natural health advocacy organization Natural News, led by activist-turned-scientist Mike Adams, lists on its website “The top seven natural cures for cancer that got buried by the FDA, AMA, CDC.” Detailed case studies supporting each “cure” are included in an article dated October 24, 2013 on the organization’s NaturalNews.com site.

...

The list of other supposed cancer cures said to have been suppressed is long enough to fill a whole book. These range from Cannabidiol, the little-known medical compound found in Marijuana, to a treatment that involves ingesting nothing other than regular household baking soda.

In 2009 Hollywood celebrity and cancer survivor Suzanne Somers wrote about natural cancer cures in her book Knockout: Interviews with Doctors Who Are Curing Cancer and How To Prevent Getting it in the First Place.

The synopsis for the book mentions that “Somers interviews doctors who are successfully using the most innovative cancer treatments—treatments that build up the body rather than tear it down.”

Knockout also outlines an array of effective, alternative treatment options from doctors across the United States. Treatments that do not involve chemotherapy or radiation and which primarily focus on building up the immune system.

The book’s synopsis also mentions the “stunning testimonials from inspirational survivors using alternative treatments”.

In a 2010 interview she gave on News Max TV, Somers spoke about her personal experience beating cancer and the wider research she conducted on alternative cures while writing Knockout.

“I would talk to these (alternative) doctors, interview them, and I would say to each of them ‘it’s all well and good for you to tell me this, but I need to talk to your patients’. They opened up their patients to me. I talked to Stage Four lung cancer, liver cancer, ovarian cancer, cervical cancer, breast cancer, prostate cancer, brain tumors – all these people living these normal, healthy lives having not been degraded by harsh chemicals. And I realized that there is another way that none of us know about.”

The other way, of course, includes alternative, natural healing methods which do not involve the Medical Industrial Complex’s patented (and highly profitable) chemo and radiation therapies.

To quote the natural health website Mercola.com once more, “There is so much you can do to lower your risk for cancer”.

The site lists its “12 top cancer prevention strategies”. These include:
• Food preparation – “Eat at least one-third of your food raw.”
• Carbohydrates and sugar – “Reduce or eliminate processed foods, sugar/fructose and grain-based foods.”
• Protein and fat – “Consider reducing your protein levels to one gram per kilogram of lean body weight.”
• GMOs – “Avoid genetically engineered foods.”
• Animal-based Omega-3 fats – “Normalize your ratio of Omega-3 to Omega-6 fats by taking a high-quality krill oil.”
• Natural probiotics – “Optimize your gut flora…add naturally fermented food to your diet.”
• Exercise – “Make regular exercise a priority…lowers insulin levels.”
• Vitamin D – “Decrease your risk of cancer by more than half simply by optimizing your vitamin D levels with appropriate sun exposure.”
• Sleep – “Make sure you are getting enough restorative sleep.”
• Exposure to toxins – “Reduce your exposure to environmental toxins.”
• Exposure to radiation – “Limit your exposure and protect yourself from radiation produced by cell phones, towers, base stations, and Wi-Fi stations.”
• Stress management – “Stress from all causes is a major contributor to disease.”

If you have cancer or know anyone who has been diagnosed with the disease, Massimo Mazzucco’s 2010 documentary film Cancer: The Forbidden Cures is a good starting place for those searching for natural cures.

To be fair, the natural health sector has attracted its share of quacks, too, so all claims of cures should be treated with a degree of skepticism until proven. However, automatically riding roughshod over claims of natural cures, especially where those claims are supported by glowing and apparently bona-fide testimonials, is no more the answer than gullibly believing them all.

Very interesting James. My Medical Doctor told me some time ago that there would never be one cure for cancer because the causes targeting specific cancers are different. Prostrate Cancer treatment will be different to skin cancer just as an example.

So what do I surmise from this discussion? I think we need to live as naturally as possible and comfortably, including enforced exercise for those in sedentary jobs or lifestyles. The body houses our soul so it should be treated with respect. A healthy body creates a healthy mind and shouldn't present as a host for cancer. But remember, cancer is not a new disease. It was prevalent way back in history when there was no modern treatments like chemotherapy available. I can't help feeling that cancer is a lifestyle issue, but is it? According to history, it was around long before modern science. Maybe it is a food or hygiene issue? Let's just do the best we can but, in the process, get informed.

Interesting ideas, Laureen.
I definitely agree many of these different types of cancers are probably due to modern lifestyles...At least that's my guess.

As an adjunct, I believe I've read somewhere that there is no word for cancer in Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) and they recognize such illnesses as something entirely different - possibly as energy imbalances, from memory.
I'm not sure whether the Indian Ayurvedic medicine recognizes cancer.

And what's interesting is certain types of cancers are much more prevalent in some parts of the world and almost non-existent in others. Again, I have no idea why, but would be interested to find out whether it's diet or different genetics in the various races or what.

Exactly. It all gets back to research I think. Here we are trying to put the pieces together but we are subject to the findings of science which is then subject to the whims of big pharma. Now we have the natural medicine fraternity trying to get their fingers in the pie of success by wealth.

I have a great belief that many of our earthly citizens have their hearts in the health of mind, body and earth, so I hope that this purity of mind prevails. There is nothing wrong with developing material wealth so long as it doesn't abuse any other part of global society. In fact wealth is more than welcome. How could we do good things without it in our world of today or could have done in any era.

Harry wrote: "And one scene in that vid reminded me of this brilliant bit from the film They Live:
http://youtu.be/G-sn9FgY_gs
..."

Hey Harry, did you hear the star of They Live (Roddy Piper) died the other day? Heart attack in his sleep even though he'd been a very healthy 61 year old by all reports...

Hmmm, I can feel a conspiracy theory coming on regarding that death...Not coming from me, but he did star in probably one of the biggest conspiracy theory movies of all time, so surely someone will start connecting dots here...

Angeliqblue wrote: "There is good news in the "war on cancer". Optimal nutrition coupled with appropriate medical treatment can dramatically improve the quality and quantity of life and chances for a complete remissio..."

Thanks Angeliqblue,
Those books by the Chinese doctors sound amazing.
I tend to agree that holistic medicine is the way to go and that (Western) science will one day prove that a lot of these illnesses like Cancer are the result of emotional or mental disturbances within patients.
Thanks again for sharing the medical knowledge that you know!
James

Liver Cancer Was No Match For This 63-Year-Old and His Illegal Medicine -- http://www.realfarmacy.com/63-year-ol...

Back in 2008 Mike Cutler a 63 year old grandfather-of-nine was diagnosed with liver cancer and given three months to live. However, his doctor had him put on a transplant list and within the year he successfully underwent liver transplant surgery. His doctor pronounced him cancer free and Mike was out of the woods, or so he thought.

“Do I become a good citizen and die or a criminal and live?” – Mike Cutler

Unfortunately, by late 2012 Mike was feeling really bad and soon learned that the liver cancer had returned with a vengeance and was attacking his new liver. His doctors gave him little hope and sent him home to die with a bag of morphine to manage his excruciating pain. His health deteriorated until he was bedridden.

He tried many things to reverse his cancer but nothing worked. Bottom line: Mike wasn’t ready to die. So he began researching with his laptop online for a viable alternative liver cancer cure. Eventually he found a very instructive YouTube video that explained how cannabis oil could be used to cure cancer.

Cutler stated: ‘All I had in those dark days was my laptop, and that’s when I began searching for something else that could help me – I couldn’t accept I was going to die.” [1]

Mike found a reliable connection that gifted him some cannabis oil. Within three days of taking the cannabis oil, his pain had disappeared and he stopped taking the morphine. That’s when Cutler decided to grow his own cannabis to ensure he had a steady and high quality supply of cannabis oil medicine.

After a few months on the cannabis oil, Mike began coughing up blood, but he believes he was actually coughing up more than blood. With the help of a microscope and the internet, Mike was convinced that he was coughing up dead cancer cells. In May of 2012, Mike went for a liver biopsy at the Royal Free Hospital in London. He was delighted to learn that the cancer cells in his new liver were no longer there – completely gone. A spokesperson from the hospital confirmed that Cutler had not received any cancer treatment since his transplant in 2012.

Dr. Kat Arney, Cancer Research UK’s science communications manager, stated: “This could potentially lead to more effective treatments for cancer in the future, but there’s still no good data from clinical trials to show that cannabis or cannabinoids can safely and effectively treat cancer in patients at the moment.” [1] Apparently, Dr. Arney doesn’t know about the many medical studies that confirm cannabis is an effective agent against many types of cancer.

Currently, Mr. Cutler is involved as a medical marijuana activist with a group called United Patients Alliance (UPA), a UK group pushing for the legalization of medicinal cannabis oil and other forms of cannabis that could be used medicinally to treat cancer and many other illnesses.

HOW and WHY does Cannabis Cure Cancer – Scientific Explanation

The Emerging Science Behind Cannabis and Cancer

For starters here’s a list of 25 scientific studies that show cannabis can effectively target and eliminate a wide range of cancers. The list was compiled by Michael Taillard, an economist, author and board member of NORML (National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws) in Nebraska . [2] Note: A consistent theme amongst the studies is that cannabis selectively and effectively targets tumors and cancer cells while leaving health cells undisturbed.

Cures Brain Cancer
http://www.nature.com/bjc/journal/v95...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11...
http://www.jneurosci.org/content/21/1...
http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content...
http://mct.aacrjournals.org/content/1...

Cures Mouth and Throat Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20...

Cures Breast Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21...
http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content...
http://www.molecular-cancer.com/conte...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22...
http://www.pnas.org/content/95/14/837...

Cures Lung Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21...
http://www.nature.com/onc/journal/v27...

Cures Uterine, Testicular, and Pancreatic Cancers
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pd...
http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/con...

Cures Prostate Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12...
http://www.nature.com/bjc/journal/v10...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/artic...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22...

Cures Colorectal Cancer
http://gut.bmj.com/content/54/12/1741...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22...

Cures Ovarian Cancer
http://www.aacrmeetingabstracts.org/c...

Curse Blood Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16...
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10...
http://molpharm.aspetjournals.org/con...

Cures Skin Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12...

Cures Liver Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21...

Cures Biliary Tract Cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19...

Cures Bladder Cancer
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/8...

Cures Cancer in General
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15...

NOTE: Beyond mainstream, allopathic, medicine there is a plethora of cannabis oil, cancer cure testimonials on the internet and the success stories keep pouring in each and every day.


Paul Fassa is a contributing staff writer for REALfarmacy.com. His pet peeves are the Medical Mafia’s control over health and the food industry and government regulatory agencies’ corruption. Paul’s valiant contributions to the health movement and global paradigm shift are world renowned.

See FULL ARTICLE HERE: http://www.realfarmacy.com/63-year-ol...

Ila wrote: "From today's NY Times:
http://tinyurl.com/pep88e7

Why Preventing Cancer Is Not the Priority in Drug Development

This makes me sick - hell we do preventive maintenance on machines - why would we ..."

You are exactly right when you say preventing cancer isn’t the priority in drug development. Whilst a cancer cure or preventive drug would be worth many millions of dollars to Big Pharma in the short-term, on going treatments (chemo etc.) are worth many, many billions in the long-term. So...financially it's a no-brainer.

Ila wrote: "TY Lance. What I found interesting is that its finally being published. I've seen 2 articles in as many days with this headline.

Its all to do with politics. I'm so sick of politics - and the way..."

Nope I can't make sense of that, but I think more people are questioning the mainstream approach and that's encouraging.

I do agree "It's all to do with politics." We devote a chapter to this pressing issue in 'Medical Industrial Complex,' pointing out that politicians by nature are only ever interested in short-term solutions that will guarantee or at least enhance their re-election chances at the end of their current term in office. Such a survivalist mentality precludes adopting or supporting long-term strategies for such vital industry sectors as medical/health. That's criminal because lives and people's wellbeing are at stake.

Ila wrote: "Lance, do you think that society will ever agree that it is criminal and mete out punishment for what the pols are doing?

And while we're on the subject what would you feel would be an appropriate..."

Thanks lla and I hope you enjoy those books. Most of your queries are answered (to my satisfaction at least) in the medical book in that series...except perhaps the one about how to punish the politicians. (Death penalty maybe?).

Linus Pauling wrote this in a letter to Dr. Ralph Moss in 1979:

"I have read with great interest your book The Cancer Rebellion: Hope and Betrayal. I wish that I had had it a few months ago, when Dr. Ewan Cameron and I were writing our book. Much of the information in your book would have been helpful to us.

The revelations in this book about the ways in which the American people have betrayed by the cancer establishment, the medical profession, and the government is shocking. Everyone should know that the "war on cancer" is largely a fraud, and that the National Cancer Institute and American Cancer Society are derelict in their duties to the people who support them."

(Source: http://www.secondopinionfilm.com/wp-c... )

What's concerning about the cancer treatments/medications that are out right now is what has been mentioned in this thread, and in the book Medical Industrial Complex, is the money factor...

There is just so much money at stake... and careers.

I've come to realize by working in the health sector and from reading books and articles how easy it is to falsify data. I have worked with such people, so I know they are there, and I can only imagine how tempting it is to manipulate not just data, but also the population groups in the studies when millions or billions of dollars are at stake... including your reputation as a scientist.

Whatever the researchers say happened is taken as gospel and if it is on paper, then this must be exactly what was observed.

These people are not just "business partners", they socialize together as well, including intimately. They have each other's backs. You don't want to step on any toes when you need their good word in order to get funded for your next project!

The researcher has the ability to manipulate any part of the study to please the money source.... populations have been tampered with..... as an example, a researcher orders 500 mice.....250 for each group. When the mice arrive in the laboratory, he notices that 100 of them are not well and will not perform appropriately for the study. What does he do with them? He puts them in the group where he knows will favor his results. There have also been cases where mice have been taken out of the study during trial without being reported, but rather the report records the mice present and in the desirable shape.


There was an AIDS trial once... where they were testing AZT...I won't go into detail, but in the beginning, the study did not go well and all hell broke lose, including on Wall Street, because the drug company's stock dropped 10% the very next day after the results came out.

FDA decided to rewrite VAs findings:

VA: Whether an early or late AZT treatment, there is no benefit towards survival.
FDA: Effects may vary among different patient groups.

VA: Early treatment may show transitory benefits in whites. In Hispanics it shows neutral or harmful effects. When minorities were treated early, it appeared to have a higher death rate (14%) than the ones who were treated later (2%)
FDA: African-Americans and Hispanics who received the AZT late did better than those treated earlier.

VA: It is mandatory to perform more studies in minority populations.
FDA: African-American and Hispanic patient results are not conclusive.

So the FDA approved it..

http://www.duesberg.com/articles/jlse...

My point is.... regarding cancer treatments, I'm sure healthy lifestyle is a great way to keep the body clean, it is my impression that the real dilemma is more towards the fact that we are falsifying data to produce treatments that don't work, rather than focus on an actual cure/treatment.
You'd think that the latter will bring about just as much money, if not more than a useless treatment would. My guess is that one of the issues are the fact that it is estimated that it takes almost a decade for drug to go from Phase I testing to become marketable.... if it then even becomes marketable.

Lisa wrote: "What's concerning about the cancer treatments/medications that are out right now is what has been mentioned in this thread, and in the book Medical Industrial Complex, is the money factor...

Ther..."

It really is a pity money and medicine, or money and health, can't be separated. But unfortunately, the reality is money is needed to finance cures, new drugs etc. Perhaps a better hope would be that profit and health/medicine be separated or outlawed even...It feels obscene to me that companies and corporations can profit (and profit HUGELY) from citizens' health and wellbeing. The whole situ is so open to corruption. (Try Googling "pharmaceutical company frauds" and you'll see many billions of dollars are up for grabs).

the fact that it is cost effective for them to invest that much money in a drug is concerning in itself.
it becomes quite obvious that the care for our fellow humans is merely a distraction....and false advertisement....
in human history, when have people in power ever cared for their fellow men over money...generally speaking?

Lisa wrote: "in human history, when have people in power ever cared for their fellow men over money...generally speaking? ..."

It happens all the time, Lisa...Every Blue Moon :)

A study was done on "How Wealth Reduces Compassion" and it included various factors, including having people wear heart rate monitors and watch two videos: How to make a patio and the other one about children with cancer.

The researcher answered this question: Why would wealth and status decrease our feelings of compassion for others?
Their answer was: that it may have something to do with how wealth and abundance gives us a sense of freedom and independence from others. The less we have to rely on others, the less we may care about their feelings. This leads us towards being more self-focused. Another reason has to do with our attitudes towards greed. Like Gordon Gekko, upperclass people may be more likely to endorse the idea that "greed is good."
They also found that wealthier people are more likely to agree with statements that greed is justified, beneficial, and more defensible. These attitudes ended up predicting participants' likelihood of ENGAGING IN UNETHICAL BEHAVIOR.

The article continues:

Given the growing income inequality in the United States, the relationship between wealth and compassion has important implications. Those who hold most of the power in this country, political and otherwise, then to come from privileged backgrounds....Although greed is a universal human emotion, it may have the strongest pull over those who already have the most.

Given the fact that, generally speaking, this is the motivation of people higher up on the food chain (would they even be there otherwise?) I have to say, James, that I disagree that it happens all the time. I think that often they solicit humility and compassion over money, but I bet that there is an ulterior motive behind such "humanitarian actions".

One problem with cancer is there are at least 250 different variations, so there is no "one treatment suits all". It is a slow death, which means it gives the desperate plenty of time to use up all there savings of the family, and how can you turn to a loved one and say, "Hold on. This isn't going to solve anything." There is a so-called "melanoma drug" running round that will take hundreds of thousands of dollars, and buy a few extra weeks of life. My personal view is it is virtually criminal to let that on the market at such a price, knowing it will not cure, and merely delay the inevitable a little.

Ian wrote: "One problem with cancer is there are at least 250 different variations, so there is no "one treatment suits all". It is a slow death, which means it gives the desperate plenty of time to use up all..."

You know....although The Big Devil has a big hold on how things are run in this world, we can still make our own choices (circumstantial, I guess)....but let's say you have cancer and treatments aren't doing you any good, you're just getting worse.

It is quite possible for you, as an individual with your own mind, to choose how you want to fight the cancer.

There are Gerson clinics all over...and I'm guessing similar programs all over the place....probably have to go outside US to find them.....alternative treatments, herbs, vitamins, nutrients in general (diet), meditation, yoga...whatever it is that big pharma doesn't want you to do, you can do.

You're right, it all costs money...but what good is your money when you're dead anyway, so might as well spend it on one of the most valuable things you can possibly spend it on....your life.

I'd rather give my money to a Gerson clinic than a doctor working at a hospital with big pharma agreements...although...who knows....

If cancer treatment is too expensive, then focusing on your diet and health in general should be a reasonable way to fight it...what are the odds that you'd be any worse than if you were paying heaps of money for a treatment?

The problem is, when you have a retro-virus that has become a part of your DNA, I'm not sure how many of these healing methods will actually reverse our DNA back to before it became cancerous.

A thought just popped in my head: Imagine if that's the new eugenics? Inject all humans with retrovirus via vaccines, aerosol, or whatever. And they have a cure for this man-made cancer, but will only give the cure to those who "qualify" (of course, we wouldn't be aware of this)......Paying to stay alive may become a whole new level of reality.

The money is no use to you when you are dead but it is of use to those left behind - that is the curse of it. I have unfortunately had some experience of this situation. My wife ended up with cancer and while treatments bought her an extra 7 years of life, when it returned it was unbeatable. Claire had an interesting viewpoint at the end; one that I would hope to have adopted, but very difficult for those watching and who love. Her attitude was, life no longer had any positive inputs, there was no pleasure, so if anything, she prayed that it would end quickly. When all your life contains is visits to hospitals to have things done, and then lie in bed until the next lot, is there a point? Why pay huge amounts of money for something that at best all it does is prolong the suffering?

Ian wrote: "The money is no use to you when you are dead but it is of use to those left behind - that is the curse of it. I have unfortunately had some experience of this situation. My wife ended up with cance..."

I'm sorry you had to go through that. Unfortunately, cancer has become all too common.... not a random occurrence any longer.

I've worked at a couple of convalescent homes with people of all ages and were there for various reasons. It is heartbreaking to see them wake up in the morning and watch how painful the thought of living one more day was for them. I could hear some of them pray at night to be taken away.

The problem with the way the powers of this world work, is that they will do anything for personal gain. I don't think they consider the victims as humans who are in need of help, but rather as an opportunity to earn some cash.

From what I have read...I haven't read enough to verify that it's all correct, but it appears that not only are they thriving on our illnesses, but they are also at times bringing about the means that causes the illnesses in the first place.

While we are just another penny in an overloaded bank account, we are left to fend for ourselves in a war that doesn't seem like we can possibly win.

I can't imagine.... not even sure I want to imagine.... what it would be like to live a life of constant visits to the hospital and then just to lie in bed at home. I can't even stay in bed when I don't feel well.... drives me crazy, so I can imagine the depression that can kick in.

Is there a point, you ask... suffering until death has no point, in my opinion..... but we can make anything we want to have a point.... it's all a mind game. I think the only thing that makes sense to me is what I see some families do when they lose loved ones: fight to prevent more deaths in similar manner.

In this case, I think the Morcan duo did a great job introducing the medical field in their book. It is a great start for a deeper dig into the murky world of the health sector.

Why pay huge amounts of money? That's the messed up medical system in the US.... nobody should have to sell their soul to stay alive.

So what's the point? Expand the work the Morcan's have done... and so many others..... make people aware of the corruption..... maybe one day we will get more independent "politicians" with the enough backing to fight for a less corrupt health care system.... maybe even legalize alternative cures for cancer!

You are right about the health sector being murky, although in my case (or more specifically, my wife's) I found the doctors were very thoughtful and caring, and I suppose they did their best. And I do get angry when I see the ridiculous prices the big pharmaceutical companies charge. I suppose if they were really magic bullets and cured the otherwise impossible I could understand, but when it is only a step up from snake oil . . .

I know the US has extremely high health costs, and I suppose that shows something, but I am not sure what. I come from New Zealand, and the health costs here, while still high for obvious reasons, are nowhere near like the US, so there is room for them to come down.

Ian wrote: "You are right about the health sector being murky, although in my case (or more specifically, my wife's) I found the doctors were very thoughtful and caring, and I suppose they did their best. And ..."

I believe that if we feel there is a problem or an issue, we should follow it up by suggesting solutions.... It is important not to lose sight of the fact that we have the ability to strategic thoughts and we need to utilize this ability by coming up with solutions to the issues at hand. Negativity or pessimism never healed anyone.... easy for me to say when I've never been diagnosed with a death sentence...

So, here's my little thought process: What we have been told about viruses that cause cancer, is that they are retro viruses (retroviruses include: Influenza viruses, HIV, hMPV, Mumps, Measles, Rubella, West Nile, Hepatitis C...), which means that they synthesize single stranded RNA into double stranded RNA/DNA hybrid and makes copies..... and by its ribonuclease h function, it is able to degrade RNA from the RNA/DNA strand.

So, this can be done in the lab by performing RT-PCR (Reverse Transcriptase-Polymerase Chain Reaction)... I'll spare the details.... why, then, can't we take a healthy cell from a person with cancer, and by genetic engineering (performing PCR like activity, for instance) and create a pseudo-virus that carries our healthy code which we know to be missing in the cancerous cells, and then inject this concoction into our cancer cells and replace the cancerous part of the DNA coding with the genetically engineered healthy code?

I guess if this was a possibility, big Pharma wouldn't make any money off people having cancer.

Another thought that I have is for some reason, unknown to me, our thoughts seem to have the ability to affect us on a cellular level.... like how people tell themselves they are sick so much, that their body actually becomes sick. It would be very awesome to learn how to use this against disease.... like being able to perform apoptosis on cancerous cells by using our thoughts.... you hear about these monks who meditate all their lives and never get sick and live to a very old age.... maybe they know something about this that we don't.

I don't mean to sound insane or ridiculous, but I think that looking at possibilities in various aspects, not just in form of modern medicine is crucial to ones health.

Go Lisa!
Awesome ideas.

Lisa wrote: "Ian wrote: "You are right about the health sector being murky, although in my case (or more specifically, my wife's) I found the doctors were very thoughtful and caring, and I suppose they did thei..."

True, negativity never cured much. On the other hand, we have to know more or less what we are doing to propose action, because it has to be realistic. So, Lisa, take a pat on the back. It is not quite like what you suggest, but work is underway, as I understand it, to do something similar. The idea is you take a sample of the tumour, or cancerous cells, grow them somewhere else (and the patient has to obviously have little time left for this to work) then they train the immune system to recognise and destroy the tumours, and when they get this right, the enhanced T cells, etc, are re-introduced to the patient's body. No correspondence will be entered into pointing out differences in how I have described it to the details of the real program :-) But, the idea is to genetically modify the immune system to deal with the cancer. The problem with cancer at the moment is the body's immune system does not recognise it as a disease, so it leaves it alone.

It will take a while for this to get sorted (it is still in the research stage) and, as you an see, it is not a pill so big Pharma [presumably will not be very interested. The process will essentially be labour intensive, so there would need to be a number of qualified operators to make this work.

Ian wrote: "Lisa wrote: "Ian wrote: "You are right about the health sector being murky, although in my case (or more specifically, my wife's) I found the doctors were very thoughtful and caring, and I suppose ..."

Yes, the cancer cells are quite evasive... they are able to do this in so many different ways, such as for instance, Tumor Suppressor genes. Our DNA produces these genes and they function to suppress tumors. But in a cancer cell, they are expressed as antigens on the MHC I.... as are so many other proteins that the body produces, but due to mutations, are now being expressed as antigens on the surface of a tumor cell.

Exciting study you mention.... it will be interesting to see what comes out of it.... It would be nice if a cure could be found that would not be monopolized by the money makers in the health sector.

Also, they are starting to focus on nanomedicine....and curing cancer that way as well...

A tumor cell produces biomarkers which is what the doctor uses to detect cancer.... the problem is, during early phases, their concentration is too low to be recognized...... but I guess nanoparticles can be injected into the tumor cell and cause it to produce more biomarkers, which will make it possible to detect cancer at an earlier stage.

One of the many problems with cancer is that it metastasizes... if it does this after the patient has started taking drugs, one can assume the cancer is resistant to that particular drug... which is why cancer patients are often on multiple drugs (as far as I understand)....I can only imagine that determining proper dosage can be very difficult.
This is kind of what some scientists are working on concerning nanotechnology... trying to figure out the best possible treatment.


As of present, the drug therapy is decided based on genetic information. This new technology will not be doing that, so when the cancer mutates, the therapy is not useless against the new and modified cancer cells. So, instead, they are able to recognize these new mutations and modify the treatment accordingly.

Another technique is using nanodiamonds....it causes the drug to stick to the surface of the cancer cells and make it difficult to get rid of.... this way, the drug has a longer time to administer toxin into cancer cell.

I think the technology you mentioned is excellent, but in reality, I think the technology that will make big Parma the most amount of money in the end will win.... that's why I'm thinking nanotechnology might be in the forefront.

Suppression of Natural Remedies (Against Cancer) http://www.thrivemovement.com/suppres...

Cancer is cured safely, in spite of widespread suppression by the "cancer industry" http://www.naturalnews.com/040585_cur...

Alternative Cancer Therapy - For Stage 3 and Stage 4 cancer patients (Talk by Dr. Frank A. Shallenberger, MD) https://www.goodreads.com/videos/1235...

Overall the above video I posted is still too mainstream (toxic) treatment for my liking as this doctor is still recommending chemo at times for stage 3/4 cancer patients (albeit a different sort of chemo and in conjunction with alternative health treatments).

I'm interested however in this doctor's usage of ozone for lesser diseases http://aaot.us/

If anyone knows anything about ozone therapy or has used it, I'd love to hear your opinions.


What Is Ozone Therapy?
Ozonotherapy is the use of medical grade ozone, a highly reactive form of pure oxygen, to create a curative response in the body. The body has the potential to renew and regenerate itself. When it becomes sick it is because this potential has been blocked. The reactive properties of ozone stimulate the body to remove many of these impediments thus allowing the body to do what it does best – heal itself.

Ozonotherapy has been and continues to be used in European clinics and hospitals for over fifty years. It was even used here in the United States in a limited capacity in the early part of the 20th century. There are professional medical ozonotherapy societies in over ten countries worldwide. Recently, the International Scientific Committee on Ozonotherapy (ISCO3) was formed to help establish standardized scientific principles for ozonotherapy. The president of the AAO, Frank Shallenberger, MD is a founding member of the ISCO3.

Ozonotherapy was introduced into the United States in the early 80’s, and has been increasingly used in recent decades. It has been found useful in various diseases:

It activates the immune system in infectious diseases.
It improves the cellular utilization of oxygen that reduces ischemia in cardiovascular diseases, and in many of the infirmities of aging.
It causes the release of growth factors that stimulate damaged joints and degenerative discs to regenerate.
It can dramatically reduce or even eliminate many cases of chronic pain through its action on pain receptors.

Published papers have demonstrated its healing effects on interstitial cystitis, chronic hepatitis, herpes infections, dental infections, diabetes, and macular degeneration.

Cancer is big business. I had to go to the cancer clinic here and the first thing I saw was a large sign on the wall that said DO NOT EXERCISE FALSE HOPE. Can you imagine? I have read articles where doctors, two in particular had found a cure and they mysteriously died. If cancer is to be defeated I believe first it either has to be by private discovery or defeating the Medical Industrial Complex.

DO NOT EXERCISE FALSE HOPE

Wow?

How about we replace that sign those dimwits wrote with something like this:

NEVER GIVE UP HOPE ;)

Laurette wrote: "I had to go to the cancer clinic here..."

Best of luck in beating cancer, if you haven't already.
Prove them wrong and don't listen to small minds!

James wrote: "Laurette wrote: "I had to go to the cancer clinic here..."

Best of luck in beating cancer, if you haven't already.
Prove them wrong and don't listen to small minds!"

Oh thanks so much. You would not believe it but my doctor said to me after she almost killed me truly, not making it up, but at any rate on my first visit from an operation because of her ineptness she said you know you have cancer. Just about floored me, I said first in my head, The Lord rebukes you satan, I reject those words, then I said out loud I think I will sit down. So a long story short off to the cancer clinic and they wanted to harvest a couple of organs and continued to use twenty five dollar words on me, I kept asking is it cancer, do I have cancer? After an hour of round about discussions and trying to talk over my head, I finally got the specialist in a three thousand dollar suit with a Rolex to admit that I did not have it, but that the cells that were there at some point in time could change. Well that is my laymens terms. It was really an amazing experience. I said, no thanks I will keep what I have. I know it sounds unrealistic but I can only shake my head and say that is what happened. I thank God that He gave me wisdom to cut through all the red tape.

Doesn't sound unrealistic to me as I think there are grey areas where unnecessary surgeries are occurring all the time.

James wrote: "DO NOT EXERCISE FALSE HOPE

Wow?

How about we replace that sign those dimwits wrote with something like this:

NEVER GIVE UP HOPE ;)"

AMEN I 100% agree. When I looked at all the faces sitting in the waiting room under that sign well I was actually horrified to see it. As long as there is breath there is life and as long as there is life there is hope.

I can't believe anyone was allowed to put that negative sign up! Someone should rip it down!
There's always hope. And we need positive messages to enjoy every minute of our lives.

Trish wrote: "I can't believe anyone was allowed to put that negative sign up! Someone should rip it down!
There's always hope. And we need positive messages to enjoy every minute of our lives." It was not the kind you could rip down and even in my state I was able to discuss it but the industry in my opinion brainwashes and uses treatments they know most likely will do more harm than good. But I believe many people are waking up and a cure will be forced. They will then find another cash cow. The Bible says that money is the root of all evil, that's probably the best way to explain it.

There are many cures that work for some cancers, but the trouble is, cancer is not one thing, but rather a very large number of different cell malfunctions. I think the general rule is, if you find it early, you have a good chance. If you have something like pancreatic cancer, like my father did, you don't even have the first clue it is there until you are in really deep trouble. But there are emerging gene technology treatments starting to emerge where the body can be persuaded to identify the cancer as something to be got rid of, and so the advice is - keep fighting and hope. There is hope around the corner - the problem is, how far?