Around the World in 80 Books discussion

Start discussion here for The Remains of the Day by Kazuo Ishiguro.

I'm about 2/3 through this. My third by Ishiguro.

From Litlovers.com


Summary
Winner, 1989 Man Booker Prize

The novel The Remains of the Day tells the story of Stevens, an English butler who dedicates his life to the loyal service of Lord Darlington (mentioned in increasing detail in flashbacks). The novel begins with Stevens receiving a letter from an ex co-worker called Miss Kenton, describing her married life, which he believes hints at her unhappy marriage. Stevens' new employer, Mr. Farraday, who Stevens fails to hold in high esteem, then grants permission for Stevens to borrow the car to take a break.

As he sets out on the motoring trip and meets the long since retired housekeeper, Miss Kenton, he ponders (via numerous flashbacks) his previous actions and his feelings of love for Miss Kenton, which she silently reciprocated. Both characters failed to ever fully admit their true feelings for one another. Arguably this is due to the lack of communication between the pair; throughout the flashbacks, the majority of their interactions are through conflict and confrontation.

Many of Stevens' memories are biased, leaving the reader with the impression that he is an unreliable narrator. Yet throughout the novel, he prides himself on his attention to detail, which leads the reader to believe that Stevens deliberately mis-remembers or alters his recollections so that they cast him in a better light. These purposefully altered memories support what he wants to believe, that there is still a chance for him and Miss Kenton. (From Wikipedia.)

Discussion Questions
1. What does Stevens care most deeply about? Can you articulate a world view for him?

2. Consider the decisions Stevens makes during time of his father's death, as well as the dismissal of the two Jewish servants. Where do Stevens's ethical responsibilities lie — given his time in history and place in society?

3. Talk about the social hierarchy to which Stevens is completely loyal—yet which exploits him thoroughly.

4. And, of course, poor Miss Kenton. Would she ever have been happy with Stevens? Or could she have humanized him had she persisted and won him over? Oh...and what about the fact that she never left when she was forced to dismiss the two Jewish maids? Is she as culpable as Stevens in this matter? What would most of us do in her place?

5. This novel is famous for its "unreliable narrator," meaning that Stevens who tells the story colors a great deal in his telling. He seems blind to much that goes on around him, events that we, the readers, see and judge differently than Stevens seems to. Give some examples of Steves's inability to see things as readers see them. What blinds Steven, or gets in his way of understanding, especially when it comes to Lord Darlington.

6. You might also tackle the ending. What happens to Stevens after he leaves Miss Kenton? What does he come to understand, what insights has he gained? Will he change—indeed, is he capable of change?

(Questions by LitLovers)

I have to say that thus far I am enjoying this book more then I would have thought. I had really been on the fence about this one. I like Ishiguro's writing, and I thought on the one hand the concept of this book sounded like it could be interesting, but it also sounded like it had the potential to be kind of boring.

But seeing it being read with this group, and seeing as it is not a very long big I figured I would give it a chance and it really is quite an enjoyable read. I particularly appreciate the dry humor of the book.

I will consider the questions more once I have actually finished the novel but I will give a few of my thoughts now regarding Stevens as the unreliable narrator.

One event that immediately comes to my mind in the way in which Stevens does not see things the way in which the reader does is the incident in which he is listening at the door to the conservation of Mr. Lewis and M. Dupont

In his mind he is doing a noble service to listen first before knocking in order to avoid knocking at an importune time. He sees this as being part of his duty, and he also sees the fact that he does this as conforming what a great butler he is.

But I think to the mind of the reader it is eavesdropping and most people would view the action much less honorably and much less favorably. He overhears two people talking and he finds a way to convince himself that he is in fact doing his duty by staying to listen even though the conversation is a private one.

Also in regards to his being an unreliable narrator their are moments in which he cannot even recall or remember events properly. When telling the story about his father, he first tells us that Miss Kenton beings to complain to him about all of his father's little mistakes and that she suggests to him that perhaps he should be relieved of some of his duties.

But than he says, that he didn't think it was Miss Kenton who told him that but that it was Lord Darlington whom must have had that conversation with him.

This does throw into question much of what he says, because you cannot trust that he is recounting the story correctly and you can never really know now if indeed it was Miss Kenton or Lord Darlington.

And what else has he misremembered and mistold?

I'm looking forward to starting this as soon as I finish what I'm currently reading.

I hope I can get to this next month

I hope to start on this tomorrow.

I'm 90 pages in and it's a very slow read, but get's more interesting with time. It took me some time to get used to the tone (I'm reading this in English, but I'm not a native speaker).

The more I read the more I get the impression that Stevens' world view is built on sand: The way he speaks about his father in contrast of what we learn about the old man, for example. And also his opinion of "Miss Kenton" seems to be unreliable.
I wonder where this all is going.

I finished this the day before yesterday. The second half was very enjoyable, I couldn't say exactly why, though. In the end it got me in tears (I think I cracked up at just the right sentence - if you've read it, I think you'll know which one). At the same time, I wanted to hit Stevens on the head.

He glanced at the truth for a short time, but went back to his ignorance in the end. This is so frustrating, but also realistic. A real life tragedy, so to say.

If you're interested, there's a map of Stevens' journey; quite an interesting route.

I've been listening to the audio version for a couple days now and really enjoy it. Simon Prebble's narration is the perfect voice of a butler. Stevens' character is everything I would expect it to be; dedicated to the life he has chosen, set in his ways, unable to fully comprehend and fit into the world beyond the one below stairs.

In consideration of the way in which Stevens sees the world differently than the reader/others, or the way in which he might perhaps miss certain things I think during his journey and the things of which he never would have seen, and passed right over, if someone else hadn't pointed it out to him.

Steven's is so focused upon his task/his duty, and perhaps so certain of his own understanding of his country that he really doesn't take in the sights around him. He is moving with a narrow minded focus.

First the spectacular view that he would have missed was brought to his attention by the old man. And then latter after his car broke down there was the lake that the Chauffeur recommended to him.

I was a little baffled about why, twice in the novel, Ishiguro included the scenes about the views he almost missed. Your comment, Silver, made me think anout the significance of those scenes. I was wondering if it symbolized the opportunity Stevens has been given to see himself and his life on this journey.

To Iseline, I'd like to say that I, too, was often bored to death while reading this book! Only after finishing did I see its brilliance. I think it's one where repeated readings would always reveal something different.

I also loved the dry humor. Like when Stevens was asked by Lord Darlington to explain the birds and bees to the Lord's nephew. Whatever would make anyone think Stevens could do that!!! Yet again, though, when I think about this episode perhaps this also had a purpose. Lord Darlington proved himself a dupe to the Germans and perhaps this request of Stevens symbolized how blind Lord D was to what was happening in Europe.

Mmars wrote: "I also loved the dry humor. Like when Stevens was asked by Lord Darlington to explain the birds and bees to the Lord's nephew. Whatever would make anyone think Stevens could do that!!! Yet again, t..."

I loved the story about the tiger in the dining room. It describes so perfectly the image of the unflappable British butler.

Mmars wrote: "I was a little baffled about why, twice in the novel, Ishiguro included the scenes about the views he almost missed. Your comment, Silver, made me think anout the significance of those scenes. I wa..."

Yes I think it does represent the idea of opportunities, perhaps both new opportunities being presented to him as well as maybe passed opportunities he had in fact missed along the way while he does reflect upon the past while recounting this journey.

It makes me think of when his father was dying and his father was attempting to have a real personal discussion with Stevens about their relationship, but Stevens didn't want to consider the possibility so whenever his father tried to open up to him Stevens just kept repeating that the house was in good order or something similar to that.

In experiencing these views which ha may otherwise have missed he is perhaps in a way having his eyes opened up and maybe gain new understanding both about himself as well as his country.

I finished it this morning.

All those hours watching Downton Abbey have finally paid off. I don't really think I could have appreciated this magnificent novel nearly as much as I did had I not understood the idea that being a butler was a life, not just a career. In Stevens quest to be the perfect butler, he denied himself any kind of a personal life. Ishiguro's portrayal of the emotional turmoil within a man who denies emotions even in his own thoughts is both magnificent and tragic.

Mmars wrote: "I was a little baffled about why, twice in the novel, Ishiguro included the scenes about the views he almost missed. Your comment, Silver, made me think anout the significance of those scenes. I wa..."

I think part of it is that Stevens had never done anything for himself. He had spent his life serving others and doing what he was told. Now, even though he is on his own, he doesn't think to do something for himself unless directed to by others.

I think you've nailed it, Tom. Couldn't think "for" himself. I have watched every Downton season -but not this year. My TV is off. Odd, now that I think of it, but I sort of have a fascination for butlers. Don't think I'd have liked the Addams family without Lurch or Itt. And one of my favorite movie scenes? Peter Sellers in "Being There" and his quote. "I like to watch." I'm pretty much a free thinker and butlers are quite opposite!

One thing that struck me as out of character was that Stevens actually lied when asked about his employment history. If he didn't feel that he could answer honestly, why didn't he give one of his standard, "I'm sorry but I can't assist you." answers?

Interesting, I forgot that. I think he wanted so badly to be a butler in a proper house. It certainly adds to my feelings of Stevens being one of the most perplexing characters I have ever run across. Does he remember things as they really happened or as he wants to remember them? Is it possible that he confused a lot of occurrences? Certainly one day often was much like another and the flurry of guests sometimes was overwhelming, both which may lead to incorrect memory.

Mmars wrote: "Does he remember things as they really happened or as he wants to remember them?."

That's another good point that I'd forgotten. Trustworthy as Stevens comes across, he really is an unreliable narrator. Early in the book he recalls something Miss Kenton said to him and then almost immediately said that maybe it was Lord Darlington who had said it. That really throws a lot of what he said into a new light.

Yes, confusing what one of those two said is really a stretch!

I think this is the first time I've posted in the group. I wanted to read the discussion and maybe comment about this book because it is one of my favorites.

For me, Stevens is the epitome of the old British Empire mindset (as mentioned, Downton Abbey also deals with this), with its repressed emotions and blind worship of protocol. Poor Stevens, so completely unable to face his own broken heart, as when his father dies, or when Miss Kenton finally leaves, because doing so -- exhibiting any kind of grief or emotion -- would undermine his position in the household (so he believes), or distort his picture of himself and (as Wikipedia points out) his dignity.

Stevens lies because he must uphold the stories he has to tell himself in order to survive such a repressive system. I think the story ends much the same way as the outdated England draws to a close... stoically, and blindly.

Janice George (JG) wrote: "I think this is the first time I've posted in the group. I wanted to read the discussion and maybe comment about this book because it is one of my favorites.

For me, Stevens is the epitome of th..."

That's an interesting parallel, Janice. I hadn't thought about it, but it makes sense. I think I mentioned somewhere in this thread I was torn between pity and anger towards Stevens.

Silver wrote: "I have to say that thus far I am enjoying this book more then I would have thought. I had really been on the fence about this one. I like Ishiguro's writing, and I thought on the one hand the conce..."

Ooh. I love dry humor. Can't wait to get to this book...soon.

Started the book today. Slow start, for sure. But, enjoying it as I go along.

I don't quite get what I was supposed to feel at the end of the book. Was it a sad ending? It should be, but I didn't think Stevens was in despair. If anything, it felt like he was being positive even, trying to better himself for what tomorrow may bring.

Hi all -- this is my first time posting in the group. I recently joined. I just finished the book. I thought it was a moving portrayal of the life of an English butler. Mr. Stevens' narration provided such great insight into not only his inner life, but also the cultural life of the era. It made me wonder if the slow pace of Mr. Stevens' words weren't meant to reflect the pace of the era.

Iselin wrote: "I finished this the day before yesterday. The second half was very enjoyable, I couldn't say exactly why, though. In the end it got me in tears (I think I cracked up at just the right sentence - if..."

I felt the same way about Stevens -- went back and forth between feeling bad for him and wanting to slap him. He seemed almost like a child, like he had never grown up emotionally.

Tom wrote: "I finished it this morning.

All those hours watching Downton Abbey have finally paid off. I don't really think I could have appreciated this magnificent novel nearly as much as I did had I not und..."

I agree about Downton Abbey. I couldn't stop thinking about Mr. Carson and his complete devotion to his Lordship and to the house itself. It was the same with Stevens - even in the face of difficult decisions (e.g. the dismissal of the two Jewish servants).

I enjoyed this book. As it has been said before, Mr. Stevens reminds me of Mr. Carson from Downton Abbey. I somewhat admired his strictness in the structure that he led his life. He had a sense of what loyalty is that is foreign in today's culture. Although that "loyalty" got him into a moral dilemma at times (the jewish maids, etc.) Slow read, but a good one!

Here are my favorite quotes:
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

I really hope to get to this soon. So many books... so little time.

I really loved this book; it's a favorite. Stevens kept surprising me right up to the end, when we learn that he doesn't even enjoy this work that he is so single-mindedly devoted to. Not that you would expect a butler to do it for the sheer joy of dusting and serving soup, but you might imagine a man that dedicated to his job would take at least some pleasure in it; I don't think Stevens did.

But I never pitied him, and I left with a sense of the dignity involved in his service, whatever his limitations as a person may have been.

Maybe I'll read this again, so I can participate in this discussion in a more meaningful way.

Tom wrote: "I finished it this morning.

All those hours watching Downton Abbey have finally paid off. I don't really think I could have appreciated this magnificent novel nearly as much as I did had I not und..."

I felt the same way! I listened to this one on audio and I felt like it was Carson talking to me the whole time, it had that exact feel to it :)

Aaarrggh. I still need to get to this one. I just have so many unfinished books right now.

Too many books, not enough time :)

What a gem I found on this forum discussion regarding the symbolization of the landscape. I agree that Mr. Stevens is a very passive type of person, who prefers to serve and being told what to do, instead of critically thinking and identifying it himself. Thus, if he hadn’t met the people, whom he stumbled upon along the way, he would have not known about beautiful landscapes that surrounded him.

However, I do ask myself, what did Miss Kenton see in Mr. Stevens???? Why the heck was she attracted to such a rigid and narrow-minded workaholic? Did she think that his devotion to his work as a butler would translate into a good and devoted husband?

I really don’t know if Miss Kenton could have found happiness with Mr. Stevens (regarding Question No. 4). On the one hand, she did state that every now and then, she imagines how life would have turned out if she had gotten together with Mr. Stevens instead. But he is such a passive guy… I doubt she could have found “more” happiness with him.