The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910 discussion

We will have to agree to disagree Malcolm.

Deborah wrote: I think Collins was ground breaking.

He was in terms of 'inventing' the genre which came to be known as the detective novel and Hide and Seek was a portrayal of the first deaf character in English lit. His 'cliffhanging' method of serial writing for Dicken's magazine All the Year Round was considered by Dickens and others to be an excellent example of that genre too. However, his addiction to laudanum blighted his later writing, although it aided his brilliant description of the effects of addiction to it in The Moonstone, which T S Eliot described as 'the first, the longest, and the best of modern English detective novels...in a genre invented by Collins and not by Poe.' Collins' social commentary became rather strident and in this I think he was surpassed by both Dickens and Gaskell. He was called 'a sensationalist' but Victorians loved sensation and melodrama, hence his enormous success. He was one of the best loved and best paid of Victorian writers but his reputation declined after his death.

This is a good description of him: 'He lived an unconventional, Bohemian lifestyle, loved good food and wine to excess, wore flamboyant clothes, travelled abroad frequently, formed long-term relationships with two women but married neither, and took vast quantities of opium over many years to relieve the symptoms of ill health...Collins's unorthodox lifestyle reveals a cynical regard for the Victorian establishment. This view is reflected in his books together with a sense of humour and a profound understanding for many of the then prevailing social injustices.'

He lived until he was 65 which is quite good going for such a bon viveur!

Not to denigrate the Collins discussion in any way, because I personally find it very interesting, but I feel as though it might be better served and more appropriate in a separate thread. It's obviously worthy of one!

I may be completely wrong on this point, but I bring it up merely as someone who might want to revisit it in the future and wouldn't immediately think to look for it here.

Perhaps Christopher will move it when he gets back Alan. I see you are an MA EngLit student - are you going to join us in the Jude the Obscure discussion - we start Part Fourth tomorrow? Your insights would be very welcome.

MadgeUK wrote: "I see you are an MA EngLit student - are you going to join us in the Jude the Obscure discussion - we start Part Fourth tomorrow? Your insights..."

I truly wish I could. I have a pile of novels to get through this semester that's a bit too large, however, to permit any outside reading without getting behind! Jude is absolutely near the top of my summer reading list, though.

Interestingly enough, one of the books I'm reading for class right now is Hardy's The Mayor of Casterbridge...

A great novel Alan and on our list of TBRs:). So many great novels and so little time eh? I am a retiree so have more time than most for reading, especially when the weather is as lovely as it is in the UK at the moment and I can read in the garden all day.

I'm new to the group and thought I'd jump straight in and join in with this. I've read several Dickens but excited to tackle some of those I haven't.
Will grab a copy of The Pickwickpapers tomorrow

Well, folks, I've jumped into this challenge. Took "Bleak House" out of the library yesterday, and as it turns out this is a very interesting edition. It's the Crowell Critical Library version, edited by Duane DeVries from New York University, copyright 1971. DeVries says in his introduction that he's chosen to select the earliest edition of the book - the collected nineteen monthly sections that were published in Dicken's magazine, "Household Words", from March 1852 through September 1853. He feels it's important for the reader to experience the novel as did its first readers, in the serialized releases. This way the modern reader can get the feel of the novel as Dickens intended it to be experienced. There are a great many footnotes included as well as a large bibliography for those Dickens lovers who wish to read more about him and his writing. I have only read the introduction and up to page 4, so I have a long way to go! But so far I'm enjoying it, surprisingly, as when I'd read it a very long time ago I didn't really like it much at all.

That's my Dickens Project update for today, folks! Thanks!

What a good idea Ellen! I wonder if they will start doing that with all of his books. It might give them a new lease of life.

Yes, I think you're right, Madge. But the only issue I have with this edition is that all the footnotes are very distracting! However, on the plus side, the editor has reinserted all the text that had been deleted either by Dickens himself (to fit the limit on the number of words that could be printed in each issue of the magazine) and by other editors. I'm really enjoying the feeling that I'm actually reading ALL of the text written by Dickens here. Thanks!

A Dickens challenge! I'll gladly participate. Little Dorrit is on my 'TBR soon' pile, but I wouldn't mind going in a chronological order.

I'm not sure I'll be able to join in all the books but I've only read Great Expectations and had already set myself the personal challenge of reading more Dickens. I'm new to critical reading though so not sure how good I'll be in the early stages. Will get a copy of the Pickwick papers next week!

MadgeUK wrote: "What a good idea Ellen! I wonder if they will start doing that with all of his books. It might give them a new lease of life."

It would be great to have this type of info while you read.

Y. wrote: "A Dickens challenge! I'll gladly participate. Little Dorrit is on my 'TBR soon' pile, but I wouldn't mind going in a chronological order."

Little Dorrit is in my pile too Chris. I would like to go in order too. If it doesn't work out like that and you want a buddy read, I'm in for Little Dorrit.

Browsing a second-hand bookstore today, I came across a complete set of Dickens...a New York edition with green covers and gilt-edged pagetops, c.1900.Very tempting...but when they're all available free online, and my house is already crowded with too many books, I couldn't really justify spending $550 dollars, now could I....could I?

Jan wrote: "but when they're all available free online, and my house is already crowded with too many books, I couldn't really justify spending $550 dollars, now could I....could I?
"

Too many books is a phrase I can't get my head around -- it's like saying you have too much love. :)

I suppose it depends on what you would otherwise spend the $550 on. If you need it for food, I suppose it wouldn't be responsible to spend it on books. But if it's only going to go for things like insurance, clothes, shoes, optional stuff like that, it seems better to spend it on books, especially beautiful and wonderful books that will last you a lifetime.

Figure it this way. If you have 1,000 days of reading there, which you certainly do reading all of Dickens at a leisurely pace, that's only 50 cents a day, or one cappuccino a week. Which is more important -- a single cappuccino or a week's reading of Dickens in a book that's not only a pleasure to read but a joy to hold in your lap and caress?

Go ahead. Splurge! What else is money for? You would only leave it to your kids when you did, and they are better off with good books than money -- money will probably only get them in trouble, but books will be good for their souls!

Jan wrote: "Browsing a second-hand bookstore today, I came across a complete set of Dickens...a New York edition with green covers and gilt-edged pagetops, c.1900.Very tempting...but when they're all available..."

Wow, Jan! What a find!! Don't you just love the second-hand bookstores and all the wonderful books you can find there? I was in one the other day, looking for "The Pickwick Papers", and there was a set of about six Dickens novels there, not in the best of shape though. There was a "Pickwick" but I passed on it, first because it wasn't in such great shape, and second because I don't like to break up sets. I did find another book that I liked so I bought that instead. The hunt continues for a used copy of "Pickwick" for the Dickens Project. C'est la vie, c'est la guerre... ;o)

Deborah wrote: "MadgeUK wrote: "What a good idea Ellen! I wonder if they will start doing that with all of his books. It might give them a new lease of life."

It would be great to have this type of info while you..."

Yes, it is really interesting to have all the information in there, Deborah. And after the novel finishes there are about 100 pages of critical discussion, Dickens' layouts of the chapters, and some letters he'd written regarding "Bleak House". I tell you, I'm really enjoying reading BH much, much more than I'd anticipated. It's a fun read so far. Thanks!

Everyman wrote: "Jan wrote: "but when they're all available free online, and my house is already crowded with too many books, I couldn't really justify spending $550 dollars, now could I....could I?
"

Too many boo..."
Everyman, I'm glad you think like that, but I'm not sure that my husband would agree. He frequently makes comments like "There are too many books in this house." and "You'll have to stop spending so much on books." But then, how much did he spend on the cycling tour that he's currently away on? Perhaps I could smuggle them in before he gets back.What would the money otherwise go on? Saving up for the travels we plan to do in a couple of years when my husband retires (and our income reduces) including visiting Madge in the UK, hopefully Chris and Everyman in the US. I imagine touring Everyman's library and sitting and reading something to him if his eyes are not good that day...it's important to save up for this, right?

Jan wrote: "I imagine touring Everyman's library and sitting and reading something to him if his eyes are not good that day...it's important to save up for this, right? "

Absolutely. I feel honored that you even consider a visit to me worth passing on a complete set of Dickens.

Perhaps I can achieve both. I'm thinking about going back for a second look....

And world travel from Australia is very expensive, at the end of the day $550 dollars probably wouldn't make all that much difference...

Honestly, the enjoyment of discussing books and poetry here with others who share a love of literature is worth more to me than anything money could buy.

Jan wrote: "Honestly, the enjoyment of discussing books and poetry here with others who share a love of literature is worth more to me than anything money could buy."

"Amen to that, Jan, Amen to that!"

Yeah, I'd have probably purchased the series too. I have all of Dickens in paperback (various publishers, Penguin, Wordsworth, Modern Library, etc.); and I would love to have a set that is consistent and compatible.

Do you think the price is reasonable? I think there were about 22 volumes.$550 ...gilt edging. I didn't check the condition in detail, so obviously I'll have to go back,(and place myself in front of temptation again), but looked OK at first glance.

Jan wrote: "Do you think the price is reasonable? I think there were about 22 volumes.$550 ...gilt edging. I didn't check the condition in detail, so obviously I'll have to go back,(and place myself in front o..."

YOu could go on Alibris or ABE and check whether the set is available through them and if so what their prices are. If higher, you've got a good deal. If lower, you might take that in to the store and negotiate. I've found that the higher priced pre-owned book prices are often negotiable , especially if a book has been around for awhile -- many store owners would take the opportunity to move the book at a lower price and get the money now rather than wait around for someone to come in and pay full price.

Jan,

If you come to see Everyman in Washington, why not come see me too? I'm just north of Seattle in a lovely green setting.

Everyman, I couldn't agree with you more. What does "too many books" mean? That just doesn't translate into anything that makes sense to me at all!! To me, one cannot have too many books! LOL!!

Jeanne, thankyou so much for the invitation! I think when you go to a country, if you just see the tourist places, you only skim the surface. To me, meeting the people, even just a few families gives the experience a whole extra dimension. Back in 2001 (our one and only world trip) we were fortunate to have dinner in a mountain village with a Swiss family. It was summer and we ate a superb meal on the balcony with our friends, with the sun highlighting the mountains, overlooking the medieval town as the church bells rang.
Now I wonder when that bookshop will be open again...

Ah, dinner with friends, overlooking the medieval town with the setting sun lighting the mountains... what could be better? I agree with you wholeheartedly, Jan. Beautiful scenes are glorious, yet we most appreciate and remember the people we meet.

Regarding the set of Dickens books, how were the print size and darkness? Even though I see well (with reading glasses), I have become more particular about eye comfort.

Ellen wrote: "Sigh. I wish I were able to sign up for this project, but with my fibromyalgia there's no way I could read all of the Dickens books chosen."

Is it the effort of holding the books causing pain, or is it lacking the energy to maintain concentration throughout that is preventing you? Or something different? If you are feeling left out because of your fibro, Librivox.org has almost all of these as free audio-books, so you could listen while resting.

Just a suggestion because I don't want you to be sad. :-)

S. Rosemary wrote: "Ellen wrote: "Sigh. I wish I were able to sign up for this project, but with my fibromyalgia there's no way I could read all of the Dickens books chosen."

Is it the effort of holding the books cau..."

Thank you so much for the Librivox link, Rosemary! I greatly appreciate it. Actually, I've figured out how to prevent my hands from tiring holding a book; I just place a pillow on my lap, place the book on the pillow and rest it there, and then all I've to do to read is place my fingers on the book and turn pages as required. Works wonderfully! But actually, it's lacking the concentration and the memory to read long books that's become problematic for me of late, because of the fibromyalgia. But I decided that if I have to go back and reread the previous chapter to remember what was going on I'll do it. I'm actually making my way slowly through "Bleak House" now, one chapter an evening, and I'm really enjoying this book. I'd read it when I was much younger and just couldn't make my way through it. Shows me what a bit of maturity can do for a reader, right? Thanks again so very much!

I went back to the shop and had a second look at the Complete Works of Charles Dickens Authentic Edition 1905. 21 volumes. They look nice on the outside, but the handcut page edges show some silverfish nibbling and there was quite a bit of foxing in the margins. They wouldn't budge on the price, which to my mind is too high. I have books older than that, in much better condition. I think they're asking the price that you would expect for a set in very good condition. Every book and just about every page has some foxing. That reduces the value. So I didn't buy them.

Jan wrote: "Browsing a second-hand bookstore today, I came across a complete set of Dickens...a New York edition with green covers and gilt-edged pagetops, c.1900.Very tempting...but when they're all available..."

If it was me, and if I could afford it.....I would definitely go for it!

Everyman wrote: "Jan wrote: "but when they're all available free online, and my house is already crowded with too many books, I couldn't really justify spending $550 dollars, now could I....could I?
"

Too many boo..."

Everyman - We finally agree!!!!

Jan wrote: "Everyman wrote: "Jan wrote: "but when they're all available free online, and my house is already crowded with too many books, I couldn't really justify spending $550 dollars, now could I....could I..."

Jan - We are married to the same man. My husband says the same thing. He is also a cyclist. A friend of mine who has been a serious cyclist always says to me - that's less than one tire replacement on his bike. He is now really struggling with the fact that we will be moving literally thousands of books from one coast to another.

Jan wrote: "I went back to the shop and had a second look at the Complete Works of Charles Dickens Authentic Edition 1905. 21 volumes. They look nice on the outside, but the handcut page edges show some silver..."

Makes sense. I love pre-owned books, but only those in very good condition. There's nothing desirable about silverfish nibbles or foxed pages, certainly not at $25 per volume.

Deborah wrote: "He is now really struggling with the fact that we will be moving literally thousands of books from one coast to another. "

When I moved the other way, east coast to west coast, I found that the cheapest way to ship my books was by the post office, using media mail, which is available for printed material. I bought a large quantity of boxes of a size that would nicely hold books but wouldn't be too heavy to handle, and for weeks before the actual move, every day on the way to work I took about a half-dozen boxes in to the post office to mail. They got to know me well there, and while they may have been groaning internally, they were also happy to have the business.

Jan wrote: "Honestly, the enjoyment of discussing books and poetry here with others who share a love of literature is worth more to me than anything money could buy."

That's exactly why I joined GoodReads and this bool club :)

Although it would seem that every student was required to read Charles Dickens, I can't honestly say I've read any (was it a movie or a book syndrome).

My recent experience with trying to "get into" the Edwin Drood mystery, by reading two separate books, Drood and The D. Case or The Truth About The Mystery Of Edwin Drood, that were to give their interpretation of the solution, has left me thinking that it may be Charles Dickens that I don't like and not the authors of these "completion" books.

Heresy!!! So not to show my prejudice, I told myself that I will actually have to read Dickens (and Wilkie Collins).

So I'll take this challenge!

Heya, we're buying a house (!!!) and will have insurance on our personal property for the first time.

Those of you who have insurance out on your books, how did that work? Did you need to inventory every single book (!!!) as my husband is supposed to do for his carpentry tools, or make an estimate, or hire an appraiser, or what?

Most of my collection is trade paperbacks, so they're not individually valuable, but I have so many of them that replacing them would be prohibitively expensive.

Photos can be pretty useful for showing what you have..especially with tools or jewellery. Different companies have different policies on how much detail is required. We've always gone with one which allowed for estimates of house contents, rather than detailed lists.

S. Rosemary wrote: "Heya, we're buying a house (!!!) and will have insurance on our personal property for the first time.

Those of you who have insurance out on your books, how did that work? Did you need to inven..."

We just have a set amount for content insurance. I just took a video camera through the house to document not only the books but everything in the house, and put the SanDisk card in our insurance agent's folder -- it can be read by almost any computer with a card reader if need be. Photos are by far the best evidence of what you actually have, and with the ability to store them digitally these days, it's easy to document every thing without having to print a single photograph.

I periodically do the same thing--i.e., go through the house with my camera and tripod. It is probably the very best way of ensuring that you have an accurate record of your belongings. I actually get close enough to my bookshelves that you can read titles and publishers. Also, your Goodreads account is likely to be accepted too, especially in concert with your photos.

I'm up for the challenge! Bring it on! lol

My 12 yo & I spent all last summer pottering around the house with our laptop entering all our books into the Librarything.com site. At $25 per lifetime membership and no limit to the books one can enter I am finding it a great resource/safety tool. That's what I plan on using in the dreadful "in case" scenario. I know you can have an "extra" content proviso on your insurance as well--which I believe we do. Renters would do well to look into that as well, we always had the extra protection for our books when we were renters.

My husband is off working on helping people in the Midwest after the tornado (he's Mr. Incredible, the insurance adjuster)--his life would be easier if more people had content lists! He LOVES it when they do.

Anyway, back to librarything...you can enter just about any data about your books you can think of including photos (I didn't have time to do that), where and when you got it, condition--really, everything. You can also create classifications (sort of like goodread's "shelves") so you can search your books easier.

Now, whenever I buy books, I stack them by my computer until I can enter them in so I'm always caught up.

I know that won't work for everyone--Everyman's library would be daunting--but it works for me!

Thanks, folks. I have Librarything but haven't used it in a while; I didn't want to pay the $25 when Goodreads will catalogue my books for free. Librarything has much better sorting algorithms, though.

K. wrote: "I know that won't work for everyone--Everyman's library would be daunting--but it works for me! "

Indeed it would. I shudder even to think of it. I started putting a few in Goodreads as I brought them off the shelves to read or reference, but I couldn't see what benefit there was in that (since there's no way I would get even a fraction of them entered), so I quit.

I can see how one might feel overwhelmed...I only had to enter 3000 or so :) Are your grandkids old enough for summer hire? Just a thought!

The thing that was most fun for me was that the kids would say things like "wow--that looks cool--I didn't know we had that book!" and then taking stacks to their rooms. We made a vow to try to eschew the library this year and read as many books in our house as we could. We haven't been very successful on either count.