SciFi and Fantasy Book Club discussion

Brenda wrote: "...a camel (an animal once reviewed as a horse assembled by a committee)."

LOL. It echoes what Miles Vorkosigan might've said. Did people actually think sometime in the past that a camel is a sort of horse? Where did you get it?

Experiment BL626 wrote: "I'm with you on the spoiler tags. It's so annoying to click each of them to read the review in its entirety. On the Goodreads app, all it takes is one click and you can see the spoilers in the review AND in the comments. "

I'll offer a dissenting opinion. There are too many books, far too many for me to ever get to them in a normal human lifetime even were I gifted with superhuman reading speeds.

So sometimes I rely on reviews to augment my reading sample of the book to base my "go/no-go" decision on. If you have major spoilers, then say so at the outset. Don't just freakin' slip in there that you were stunned when Vader was Luke father's and that changes everything. That ruins the story.

Similarly, I also hate reviews that are plot outlines. Stop that. All of you. Right this instant. You aren't in school, you don't have to prove to me you read the book by writing a report on it. Tell me why the damn thing sucked and should be burned or explain why you loved the book so much you've petitioned Congress to allow you to marry it, but don't spoil the experience for me.

Trike wrote: "Similarly, I also hate reviews that are plot outlines. Stop that. All of you. Right this instant. You aren't in school, you don't have to prove to me you read the book by writing a report on it. Tell me why the damn thing sucked and should be burned or explain why you loved the book so much you've petitioned Congress to allow you to marry it, but don't spoil the experience for me. "


LOL! I think I just died laughing!

I agree...but admit that I am guilty of this sometimes. Especially when I first started reviewing instead of jotting things down. It worked a lot better when it was in a notebook in a big pile instead of on a page with the blurb right above...

Trike wrote: "Similarly, I also hate reviews that are plot outlines. Stop that. All of you. Right this instant. You aren't in school, you don't have to prove to me you read the book by writing a report on it. Tell me why the damn thing sucked and should be burned or explain why you loved the book so much you've petitioned Congress to allow you to marry it, but don't spoil the experience for me. "

I was also against giving a summary of the book at the top of a review when I first started using Goodreads and I still don't do it myself. However, I now find it can be rather useful when reading reviews on the updates feed. It helps me know if I have any interest in the book being reviewed without having to look them all up for the Goodreads summary. So I'm not so anti it any more although it still bugs me a bit when I'm looking at reviews for a book in particular.

I generally won't give more than a few sentences of a summary if I'm posting it on Goodreads, LibraryThing, or Amazon. For one thing, there's a perfectly good summary at the top of the page. For another thing, if *that* summary wasn't enough, then there's a bazillion other reviewers posting book reports.

I may go to far in not having my reviews be long enough or explain why I liked/didn't like the book, but I do feel that going into too much detail gets too spoilery.

Trike wrote: "Similarly, I also hate reviews that are plot outlines. Stop that. All of you. Right this instant. You aren't in school, you don't have to prove to me you read the book by writing a report on it. Tell me why the damn thing sucked and should be burned or explain why you loved the book so much you've petitioned Congress to allow you to marry it, but don't spoil the experience for me."

Amen.

HA! I just received a review for the fourth and final book in my series on Amazon. The reviewer basically gives away the endings of multiple storylines and the grand conclusion. I will say that he/she states they are about to talk spoilers before they begin to reveal them.(For those who wish to know, 3 star review and unhappy with a "rushed ending")

For the record, this reviewer has written about my previous books and I admire their honesty and candor. However, any reader who has invested their time in 3 books doesn't deserve to have their experience ruined by stumbling into this review. All complaints/praise that a reviewer wants to discuss can easily be worded without plot reveals. Just my opinion.

Daniel wrote: "HA! I just received a review for the fourth and final book in my series on Amazon. The reviewer basically gives away the endings of multiple storylines and the grand conclusion. I will say that he/..."

Hmmm, I'm not a big fan of major spoilers.

I try to mark spoilers at all times. If I miss them i have no problem about correcting that.*


* With the exception of triggers. I mark triggers (rape, incest, etc) in my reviews if I run across them. If this is the plot of the book I usually haven't read the book. If it is a major spoiler as to the actions of (a/some/the/all) characters, I still state the trigger in the review. In those instances it is purely a "for me and people like me" thing.

I'm horrified when I hit a book that has those triggers and always wish that someone had told me in advance.

Olga, I cannot recall. It is proverbial, I think. If you had to describe a camel to people who had never seen one before, you might well make a horse analogy, since you ride on it, and there's a saddle and a bridle and so on. Somewhere there is a famous engraving of a rhinoceros by Albrecht Durer. He had never seen one, but he was working from a description. It's a great image, but you can tell he was not working from a model.

I don't like to read summary reviews before I read a book, but I do tend to like to read them after I do. To see someone else's opinion on it.
I've read reviews that talk me into reading a book, but I don't believe it's ever worked the opposite way. If I want to read it, I will.
And sometimes a negative review will actually talk me into it.
You just never know.

I just realized that my most recent review is really negative AND that the authors are all here on Goodreads. No idea if they saw my review (or would care if they did), but when I re-read what I wrote, I *really* sound pissed.

Which is good, because I was.

Tell me how bad this review is:
http://www.goodreads.com/review/show/...

Trike wrote: "Similarly, I also hate reviews that are plot outlines. Stop that. All of you. Right this instant. You aren't in school, you don't have to prove to me you read the book by writing a report on it. Tell me why the damn thing sucked and should be burned or explain why you loved the book so much you've petitioned Congress to allow you to marry it, but don't spoil the experience for me. "

This is where I have to strongly disagree. I want to read reviews that are like that. I accept the fact that some readers hate spoilers, but I refuse to accept that there is a correct and proper way to review. Who gets to decide that?

Whoever that person is, I want to usurp the throne and ordain that reviews must have animated GIFs to be legitimate. Yeah, that will annoyed some readers, but I would be the king and I would not give a shit.

Like with books, not every review is for everyone. This is why it's so important find the right reviewers for you.

Trike wrote: "I just realized that my most recent review is really negative AND that the authors are all here on Goodreads. No idea if they saw my review (or would care if they did), but when I re-read what I wr..."

It wasn't that bad honestly. You might've even talked fans of Criminal Minds to read it. Lol.

Just chiming in to say that this whole discussion thread is one reason why I like Goodreads even more than FaceBook. (although I do like FB).

So many people are willing to offer up deep, well-informed perspectives on the literary process including writing, reading and reviewing. I really wish I could randomly select a half dozen people from this thread and just hang out with you/ them for a few hours over coffee and chat about books.

Unfortunately my busy life (2 and 1/2 jobs + two small children) precludes this, but Goodreads is a close second.

Thanks all for adding breadth and perspective to this discussion. (I may be misusing the term breadth)

Experiment BL626 wrote: "This is where I have to strongly disagree. I want to read reviews that are like that. I accept the fact that some readers hate spoilers, but I refuse to accept that there is a correct and proper way to review. Who gets to decide that?..."

Perfectly understandable point of view. I like spoilers in reviews too - they let me know what the book is about and its most prominent features. Often, spoilers help me decide whether I want to read the book or not.

Olga wrote: "Perfectly understandable point of view. I like spoilers in reviews too - they let me know what the book is about and its most prominent features. Often, spoilers help me decide whether I want to read the book or not. "

I like them sometimes, too. Sometimes I will read every review I can find to locate a spoiler, lol.

Trike wrote: "I just realized that my most recent review is really negative AND that the authors are all here on Goodreads. No idea if they saw my review (or would care if they did), but when I re-read what I wrote, I *really* sound pissed.

Which is good, because I was.

Tell me how bad this review is:

http://www.goodreads.com/review/show/..."

I actually think it's a great review. A review doesn't have to be favorable in order to make it legit. In fact, reviewers don't have to have a Bachelors in English to write a good review. The best ones tend to come from the gut, whichever side of the rating scale they fall down on.

I've got a few blistering 1-star Scathers from readers as well and they are among my favorite reviews. Keep the professorial-styled reviews, I want to read the ones where the readers have passion!

This was a fascinating thread from well before my time on Goodreads. COVID-19 has given me thread mining time. It's a topic that I often discuss with my friends and family. I like to think I'm candid and blunt, but that can easily be misconstrued as "a jerk." I sometimes find myself rephrasing so my comments come off as honest. I'm not trying to be the anonymous tough guy on the internet, nor do I want to draw the ire of trolls to get revenge. That being said, here are my answers (over seven years too late).

1. What if you want to give a negative review but also want to encourage the author (because- say- they are your Goodreads friend)?

My reviews for indie authors always have four sections: a general review (like my popular book reviews) with no spoilers, The Good, The Bad, and The Technical (things that some readers may or may not dislike e.g. first person, present tense,etc). Obviously The Good is a bunch of warm feelings wrapped in a puppy bow because I thought it was awesome. Even one star reviews have some good points.

2. Do you leave really long reviews for the books you hate, or really short ones.

All my reviews of indie work are really long. Although some don't write for authors, when I review books with few reviews, I keep them in mind. So The Bad section may be longer than The Good (I can get on a soap box and declare myself emperor), it will still be written as a reason I disliked it. Often I point out how my tastes vary from the majority on a specific topic (I despise plot armor, but many readers like the coziness it offers).

3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?

I think that's just human nature. I find this more of a problem with movies and TV, but of course it happens with books too. Ultimately, I'm fine with my decisions, and I'm happy others have their own minds.

4. Do you ever have the urge to bash a book only because it's popular? (I get that urge sometimes, usually I resist, but I feel it)

Nope. Not in a review. That kind of Haterade is only for speaking with close friends and families. We get each other enough for it to be fun. If I don't know you, I'm not going to bash your differences in a public (and forever) forum.

5. have you ever written a negative review and then immediately felt bad about it and gone back and changed it? And- as related question- have you ever given a book a break (and an extra star) because you feel bad for the author?

I've changed star ratings a time or two, but mostly stay firm. As others said, it was my honest opinion in the moment. As I age (perhaps only a few days) my perspective may change, but I feel the emotion of that candid first impression is something I'd appreciate from a reader.

3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?

That would be my review of the Man Booker Prize winner a few years ago...

Thanks a lot for excavating this thread. While going through reviews for books I realised that I don't like to read 'rants', those kind of reviews where you get the feeling it was only written because the reviewer wanted to show off or get some laughs. So I try not to rant in my own reviews of books I don't like, but try to explain in a (hopefully) factual way why they weren't for me. The rants are reserved for the more private space of my updates.

1. What if you want to give a negative review but also want to encourage the author (because- say- they are your Goodreads friend)?

I try to find something positive and be as polite as possible with my 'problematic issues' (which certainly varies in its success), always keeping in mind that other readers have different views and tastes.


2. Do you leave really long reviews for the books you hate, or really short ones.

No. If I can't find anything polite to say I write no review for a book I didn't like. If I feel the need to tell folks why I didn't like it (mostly with books that are otherwise raved about), I stay rather short with some facts why it didn't work for me.
The energy/time to write in length about something I didn't like is wonderfully spent in more useful undertakings (i.e. start reading the next book from my pile)

3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?

Certainly! There are books where I'm just not the target audience. Those are easy, cause I can tick them off. But whenever I stumble across a book that should be along my line, that is loved by many other readers I'm friends with here on GR then I definitely get this feeling of having missed some vital point.

4. Do you ever have the urge to bash a book only because it's popular? (I get that urge sometimes, usually I resist, but I feel it)

No, if it looks like a popular book that I feel I won't like, I just don't read it.

5. have you ever written a negative review and then immediately felt bad about it and gone back and changed it? And- as related question- have you ever given a book a break (and an extra star) because you feel bad for the author?

I feel bad about negative reviews all the time - but I try to resist the urge to change my rating because of that. I give an extra star in cases where I didn't like the book but am well aware that it is an influential classic and my not liking it most probably is because of the datedness.

ETA: Just have to add: The way Allison writes her reviews with the pros and cons are a perfect way imho. I always appreciate them, even if I don't coincide.

Aw, thanks, Gabi! Phil's reviews are also quite helpful, I find, if you like this format :D

I don't tend to write negative reviews for folks I like as friends. I do say where I think it was good or needed some work, but frankly most of the people I am friends with write genres I don't enjoy, so it seems like bad form to pick up a book I know I probably won't like and then pan it. I generally include my relationship to the author so that any bias there is clear.

2. I write as much as I want to talk about. I have a format, and I largely stick to it, with exceptions for oddities and books I love.

3. I often feel I'm missing something, which is why I like book clubs!

4. JUST because it's popular? No. I don't bash books for being successful lol but I do often wonder how some books become so successful when I know there are authors who've done similar works with more nuance, technical finesse or fewer personal scandals.

5. Yeah, I try to make sure that nothing I say is something I wouldn't say to the person who wrote it. I mean, obviously I'd likely clam up if, say, Terry Goodkind was around, but if he asked me about my review, I want to be able to feel that I was honest, that the emotion I evoked is honest, and that I wasn't pandering for laughs. So, sometimes I tweak things later, but not my star ratings, and not my overall thoughts, just their wording. I have one review out there right now that I sort of regret because I think the author is awesome but this book did not work for me, and it's prominent in top reviews for this book, so if the author were to scan the page they'd see my thoughts. I could have been kinder in that one.

When I write my reviews, I try hard to be respectful and find something to acknowledge that worked, even when a book frustrated me or pissed me off. There’s one exception, though, and I went whole hog into writing a screed of how much I thought the book I read was a terrible blight on the world. It happens to be a book that’s super popular and pretty highly praised, so in that case I decided to just let my review be; it was written in the heat of the moment of hatred for the book I had just finished. But that author is doing just fine for himself in terms of sales and acclaim, so ultimately I thought no real harm done. Perhaps I was a bit too harsh in my review, but man it was the worst book I’ve ever read. Folks seemed to get a kick out of reading my review, too, since I never get that harsh, generally. But I truly don’t imagine I will ever go that route again.

There’s one author who blocked me on Twitter, and I’m not sure why, but maybe it’s because I didn’t love her book? Although I gave it 3 stars in my review, and said some quite positive things in my review.

Overall, I strive to be honest, with regard for the hard work that goes into writing, but also with some degree of expectation that the time I’ve spent reading it should be rewarded with a rich experience.

@Anthony Yes, the blocking was a weird choice by her, it's so aggressive and leaves you no room for explanation or discussion :(

I did end up in a situation a couple of years ago where I was reading a friend’s book, and it was just awfully written. I didn’t realize you didn’t have to actually rate by stars when you finished reading a book, otherwise I’d have just done that. As it were I gave it 1 star, didn’t write a review, and hoped to god she didn’t see my rating. I saw no reason to be negative to her about her book, it would only hurt her. I just told her it wasn’t really my type of book and left it there. She hasn’t blanked me, so I don’t think she knows about my one star!

I usually write reviews based on what I feel, so if I definitely disliked something, and feel my opinion is valid, I will probably express that quite clearly. It’s no different from how I will express my utter love for something. I have opinions because I’m passionate about literature, and would like to share that passion.

However, there are definitely situations where I’ll refrain from a negative review, like if it’s by a friend, or if it’s a matter of personal taste, or if it’s an indie writer, or I want to be supportive for whatever other reason. Sometimes a book is just not for me and I leave it at that with no further comment. Sometimes a book is so meh I have nothing to say either way. I tend to just go by my gut feeling, what to do or say in a review situation.

I've never bashed a book because it's popular, that sounds like an odd thing to do, but I have definitely had opinions contrary to the popular opinion on something, and have no problems expressing that.

I've definitely felt bad about not liking something, but then it's usually if I liked the author and really wanted to like something of theirs. I don't feel bad giving critique when the book deserves it. If I knew that an author cried themselves to sleep because of something I said that would probably change, but luckily I don't! :D

I'm bored so I'm going to do this instead of writing actual reviews;

1. What if you want to give a negative review but also want to encourage the author (because- say- they are your Goodreads friend)?
I usually have something good to say about any book, and so far I've wonky followed authors whose books I know I like? They are all popular enough that I don't feel like I'm writing directly at them when I review their books.

2. Do you leave really long reviews for the books you hate, or really short ones.
Either. Lots of love makes me verbose, as does lot of irritation. I have a soft spot for the negative reviews because they are easier to write though.

3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?
Oh yes. And sometimes (more rarely) vice versa, where I see a book rated abysmally but which I personally thought was compelling.

4. Do you ever have the urge to bash a book only because it's popular?
Nah. I do tend to get more vocal in my disappointment if I read said popular book and don't like it, though.

5. have you ever written a negative review and then immediately felt bad about it and gone back and changed it? And- as related question- have you ever given a book a break (and an extra star) because you feel bad for the author?
Yes to both, especially the rating one. I've started to ban myself from giving anything less than three stars to books because I feel guilty about doing it. Which makes for some interesting mental gymnastics let me tell you.

Thanks for digging this one up, Phillip! It's a topic near and dear to my cold coal heart, so I'm surprised I've never seen it. :P

I am definitely a negative review writer when warranted, and self-described Ranty McRanterson. I subscribe to the Scott Lynch philosophy of reviewing: "If you want to write a negative review, don't tickle me gently with your aesthetic displeasure about my work. Unleash the goddamn Kraken."

And while I do admit to a certain level of snark and attempted wittiness in my reviews in general to hopefully be somewhat funny/entertaining for others to read (because this IS a social media site after all), in the end, my reviews are for myself and are my honest and in-the-moment opinions and feelings about the book. I'm not PURPOSEFULLY upping the rage-rant factor to get likes or comments. In fact, I'd say that a good amount of the time, the comments I get on my negative reviews are from people who dislike them for some reason or other and feel the need to tell me so. (I get a lot of those - especially when I've disliked a book enough to DNF it AND dare to review it.)

Basically, a book is a product, not an extension of the author, not the author's "baby", not some special criticism-proof thing. If it fails to be what I expected or hoped for, I will say so, and why, and maybe not in a "constructive" format that others will always like or appreciate, but it's MY honest opinion.

1. What if you want to give a negative review but also want to encourage the author (because- say- they are your Goodreads friend)?
I don't friend many authors, unless I already know that they are active READERS and not just looking to spam their books at me. And I can't think of any books that I've read that have been written by someone I interact with regularly enough to call them a friend. Theoretically, if I value the friend, I would likely try to be a bit more constructive and careful in any criticism I would have, and maybe try to sandwich it with things I did like (if possible), but I would NOT avoid the criticism or pretend that I liked the book more than I did. I use this same method for books that I'm asked to read for review. (Which is almost never these days.) But... if I buy a book, or otherwise use my time and/or resources to acquire and read it, on my own, then it's fair game.

2. Do you leave really long reviews for the books you hate, or really short ones.
Almost always long. (This comment is an example of that. I have things to say!) But it depends on how I really felt about it. If a book was just... unimpressive and had little to no impact on me, and 5 minutes after finishing it I've already forgotten it, I might just say something along those lines and leave it at that. But I always try to say WHY I felt a certain way about a book, or talk about things relevant to it, etc, and often during that process I find that I actually felt more strongly about certain things and end up ranting about them. LOL. I don't find much value in "Loved it!" or "Hated it!" style reviews because I want to know WHY someone feels the way they do. Even ratings without reviews mean little to me. Tell me what what you liked or didn't!

3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?
ALL. THE. TIME. Stephen King's last several books have been that for me. I've stopped even trying to read them because I know I'm gonna be disappointed. But you'd think that the man shits gold by the high ratings he gets on this site. I've read him since I was 9 years old, and I think I've earned the right to say it... his last several books have just been hot garbage.

4. Do you ever have the urge to bash a book only because it's popular? (I get that urge sometimes, usually I resist, but I feel it)
Nope. I didn't even bash Twilight. I think I rated them a middle of the road 3 stars? They weren't GREAT, and definitely problematic, but they were entertaining enough.
There have been books that I have bashed that are immensely popular, like The Night Circus, but I didn't bash it BECAUSE it was popular. I bashed it because I hated literally everything about it. EVERY. THING.

5. have you ever written a negative review and then immediately felt bad about it and gone back and changed it? And- as related question- have you ever given a book a break (and an extra star) because you feel bad for the author?
NOPE. Write a better product, get better reviews. I don't care that an author is independent or self-published. It's all fair game. You put it out there, for sale, and I'm gonna review it as it is.
That being said, I generally avoid indy or self-pub work these days because I find most of it to be... not good. And I'm not LOOKING for books to shit on. I read books that I think I will like (or sometimes for obligation), and if I don't, I'm not shy about saying why.

1. What if you want to give a negative review but also want to encourage the author (because- say- they are your Goodreads friend)?
I've not been in this position but would probably try harder to pick out things I did like, and phrase my criticism more in terms of "I would prefer" than "I didn't like" The latter tends to be what I do anyway, for anything short of 1-star reads.

2. Do you leave really long reviews for the books you hate, or really short ones.
In a sense, a longer review is an indication that I actively disliked a book (as opposed to feeling meh about it, I'll definitely leave long reviews for books I liked as well), because I'm able to clearly articulate all the reasons it was Not Good. Whereas if I felt it was fine but just not for me I'll say so and move on.

3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?
I definitely have those moments at times where I wonder if we read the same book, but generally I feel like it's just a difference in taste, or in some cases that they're not as nuanced in their ratings as I've tended to be since I've been more active here.
That's also why I've avoided rating anything that I'm particularly nostalgic about, because I doubt I could give an honest rating.

4. Do you ever have the urge to bash a book only because it's popular?
Not exactly, although I might feel more comfortable doing so. That said, it does feed my rebellious streak a bit, especially if it's not really popular enough to have a sizable hatedom.

5. have you ever written a negative review and then immediately felt bad about it and gone back and changed it? And- as related question- have you ever given a book a break (and an extra star) because you feel bad for the author?
I haven't gone back to change a review for anything other than typos or forgetting to include something. If I disliked it enough to explicitly say why, then I'm fine with putting those reasons out into the world, and if someone's bothered by me saying something just isn't to my taste, then they should probably avoid reading reviews.
I have gone back and forth on star ratings at times though, when I feel I was being overly generous in the moment. In other words, I know how I feel at the end of a 3 or 4 star read, and I'll later acknowledge that that didn't really cut it.

Becky, thank you, re' Night Circus. We're not alone in our dislike, but sometimes it seems so.

Cheryl wrote: "Becky, thank you, re' Night Circus. We're not alone in our dislike, but sometimes it seems so."

VERY MUCH feels like it, right?? Ooh man, I hated that one so much.

Holy cow this thread came back to life after 7 years! (Started 2012)

Phillip has powers!

1. What if you want to give a negative review but also want to encourage the author (because- say- they are your Goodreads friend)?

I’ve been approached by authors who friended me in the past to read/review their book. I usually try to say both what I liked and what didn’t work for me. If a book was not for me I usually try to state which audience I think the book is for. I think if the author was someone I really cared about (as in, I cared about them outside of GoodReads) I’d ask them first if they wanted/needed the review or if they preferred that I not post anything at all. I know some of the algorithms on Amazon require a book to have 50 reviews or something before Amazon will push it to people who might enjoy it, so in some cases even a negative review is better than no review.


2. Do you leave really long reviews for the books you hate, or really short ones.

Reviews for books I didn’t like almost always end up longer than reviews for books I loved. I don’t know why- I guess I’m not very good at articulating why I liked something.

3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?
Well if I have no interest in it, the truth is I’m not going to read it no matter how popular it gets. (I have still not read Harry Potter. I keep meaning to, but really, I have no interest in it outside an academic understanding of why people love it so much.)

I do often feel like I missed something when everyone else is giving a book 4/5 stars and I thought it was okay or just plain bad. It happened with a book last year that gathered very positive feedback and I was sitting there pointing out technical errors that no one else seemed to want to acknowledge. Characters popping into scenes they shouldn’t have been, calling characters by the wrong name. I was scratching my head wondering if anyone had bothered to edit the book and others were head over heels in love. I’m still scratching my head on that one.

4. Do you ever have the urge to bash a book only because it's popular?

Sure I’ll cop to this one- when I feel like a book is popular and doesn’t deserve to be. I did bother to read it first though. I would not bash a book I hadn’t read.

5. have you ever written a negative review and then immediately felt bad about it and gone back and changed it? And- as related question- have you ever given a book a break (and an extra star) because you feel bad for the author?

I have changed negative reviews in the past, but never immediately after writing the review or because I felt bad about it. There are some books that I look back on with more fondness than I had for them while reading- for example if a book stuck with me for a long time, or if I find myself recommending it. Happens most often with books I rated three stars.

In regards to feeling bad for the author, I’m usually more generous with self-pubbed/indie authors to begin with, especially if they asked for a review. It’s a pretty brave thing to do- to ask for criticism, and They don’t have all the tools at their disposal a large publishing house would. I feel like independent authors are a lot more likely to see my review somehow so I try to be kind and give honest critiques and not engage in ranting or bashing.

I have had authors comment on my negative reviews and not with kindness at which point I didn’t feel bad and left both my review and their comments on display for everyone to see.

Weirdly, my most liked review ever is a negative one, that might be a little ranty, of a very popular author. I reviewed it early and the review is front and center on the GoodReads page I think. I do feel bad about that one, because I think it still has things to respect (not like, respect) but I haven’t changed the rating because as a book it just doesn’t work. It was something that probably should have stayed locked in the authors desk and never seen the light of day.

Oh, I like this topic! I do sometimes like to write snarky reviews, especially when I'm feeling upset about the amount of time I spent on a book I didn't like. And I will go back and edit if reflection with a cooler head seems to indicate that I was too harsh. I've also changed ratings if the lasting impression from a book was different than my initial response.

Personally, I find reading negative reviews to be more helpful in deciding to read a book, so I think I do tend to spend longer/more space on those. I think my most liked reviews may also be negative, and when I get random likes on old reviews from people I don't know, it does tend to be on negative reviews.

In general, I try to focus my reviews on aspects of the book that I don't see in other reviews - either problems I had that I don't see in the first page of reviews, or to highlight the things I liked about books that aren't as well known. I probably won't spend much time reviewing a popular book I enjoyed unless I really loved it. I don't go out of my way to bash popular books, but I may be more likely to review to explain why my rating is so different, especially as I said if there are aspects that I think have not been covered by other reviewers.

I do try to be a bit kinder to indie/self-pubbed and other less known books, especially on things that more editing/copy-editing could have helped with. I'll still be honest about my issues with it, but depending on the circumstance I may refrain from rating, especially if I like the ideas/characters much more than the writing. If it's a requested review, I try to be especially comprehensive in describing what did and didn't work, on the assumption that the author may be more likely to actually read my review in those cases. If there's really nothing I find redeeming about a work, I'm probably not going to feel much like encouraging the author, so I won't feel bad about a purely negative review. And if I struggled with a book but think the author has potential, I will highlight everything I liked, as well as often specifically stating that I'd like to read more from the author.

You make an extremely good point, Elowen, and I think I forgot to stress that as well. Reviews are definitely meant for my peers, for other readers, my opinions arw for friends I want to recommend things to, or the opposite I suppose. They aren’t directed at the author at all, nor do I have any interest in making them feel bad about something I disliked.

On Twitter I’d tag an author (or actor, or writer, or any artist) if I have enjoyed their work, to let them know I liked their work and to promoted it to followers. But the reverse isn’t true, I would never tag them if I didn’t like their work, I’d just ignore it. There would have to be something decidedly problematic about their work which required a larger public scrutiny, for me to start tagging them with a critical pov. That hasn’t happened a lot and when it did it was under different circumstances than reviewing a book.

I definitely support being fully honest when a book is a bad investment in time and/or money. If it has a cool premise, and doesn't live up to it, or a lot of hype, from ppl who just skimmed it, or whatever. And yes, then I *try* to be very specific about what's wrong with it.

But indeed sometimes I do think it's more about what is wrong with me. I have no clear idea of why I don't like The Three-Body Problem. I wish I could find someone else who rated it low and said stuff that resonated with me, to help me understand what I'm missing or whatever.

I originally write my reviews for myself, so I can remember what I read and what I thought of it.
At the beginning of this whole global pandemic thing, I thought 1. Oh no, no libraries, what will I read? 2. Oh! I can read books I've owned for a long time and not gotten around to.

So I read-- or rather started to read Telegraph Avenue by Michael Chabon. I know Chabon isn't popular around here, but I love his genre novels. Unfortunately, this is contemporary fiction, and I was bored out of my mind. Then I saw this was the third time I was trying to read it. I read more than I had previously. That's another thing, I don't usually HATE books, because I give myself 50 or pages to get into a book, if it doesn't catch me by then, I start reading another.

I've found that my appreciation of Chabon varies from book to book, too. Thanks for the heads up on Telegraph Ave.; good to know it's not universally beloved... :)

And btw, just because this is the SFF book club doesn't mean "Chabon isn't popular around here." Lots of us read other stuff, too. :)

Oh but (some?) readers here, long ago, despised The Yiddish Policemen's Union, or at least, that's how I remember it.

I have several types of negative reviews.

The "Not My Thing"
The "Missed the Mark"
The "What kind of Turd is this"

these are a few

LOL Don!

Overtly derivative works for me in a lot of cases.

Just yesterday I had the case that I was pissed off by a book everybody else I'm connecting to here on GR loves. So I just left it by short 2 sentences, cause why should I rain on something others love?
As mentioned somewhere above, meanwhile I'm kind of allergic towards rants. When I see a negative one that starts like a hate review I close it and go to the next.

Gabi wrote: "Just yesterday I had the case that I was pissed off by a book everybody else I'm connecting to here on GR loves. So I just left it by short 2 sentences, cause why should I rain on something others ..."

I'm like that with positive ones - I always go for the 3 star ones. I tend not to review a book unless there's something wrong with it and a lot of my reviews on Amazon are "product reviews" where there's something wrong with the product (scads of typos, poor formatting, jagged right edge, etc)

CB, you negatively review a book because of deckled edges? Or do you mean something else?

Gabi wrote: "Just yesterday I had the case that I was pissed off by a book everybody else I'm connecting to here on GR loves. So I just left it by short 2 sentences, cause why should I rain on something others ..."

Gabi, I couldn't disagree more about raining on the party. I want to see people's honest opinion on what they thought of the book, including why it wasn't for them. Obviously you don't have to go full rant, but I often seek out the negative reviews of popular books, because NO book is perfect or universally loved, and if the negative aspects you hated would also dealbreak it for me, I would love to see that. Rain on! ;)

Gabi, you are so sweet.

Chessie, interesting that it's the production part that you add to! Do you just feel that the pros and cons of the content are covered elsewhere or are you sensitive to the fact that opinions are always subjective, or?

lol Becky! I'm with you, I like honest reviews of all stripes, but I also appreciate the sensitive souls who don't want to "yuck" someone's "yum." I figure personally I'll skip it if I think it will upset me in some way, but I will always value kindness, too. Thank goodness it's a free for all, my favorite kind of all!

@Becky: I do read both negative and positive reviews for books, but if the negative one starts as rant I skip it and go on to the next. I know lot of people love reading those, but not me, because they tell a lot more about the reviewers than about the book. And the latter one is what I'm interested in. Fortunately there are also negative reviewers to my liking out there. ;)

I know... I don't want people to go against their nature or review style, but I also don't think that people should NOT review a book just because they felt differently about it than everyone else. Those are specifically the reviews I look for! :D

Gabi wrote: "@Becky: I do read both negative and positive reviews for books, but if the negative one starts as rant I skip it and go on to the next. I know lot of people love reading those, but not me, because they tell a lot more about the reviewers than about the book."

Interesting... I kinda feel like that about ALL detailed reviews on this site, ranty or no. The only ones that tell me nothing about the reviewer is the short "liked/loved it" or "wasn't for me/hated it" ones.

Random aside -

when I see this thread I start thinking of the music for "when you wish upon a star". That's how I read this thread name...

So, to the actual topic...

1. What if you want to give a negative review but also want to encourage the author (because- say- they are your Goodreads friend)?

I don't pay much attention to whether my goodreads friends are authors or not, tbh, and I don't tend to read books just because a goodreads friend of mine wrote it or whatever. I'm just not here for that kind of relationship.

I think most of my negative reviews are more just "this is what I didn't like about it". I only get ranty when I really hated something, or when it's really popular and I'm just like, "but, why, this is terrible"... but I think my ranty reviews are in the minority.


2. Do you leave really long reviews for the books you hate, or really short ones.

Hate? Probably longer ones, because those are the ones I tend to get ranty about. Sometimes a book is just so terrible it leaves me speechless, though, and it's more like, "wtf was this book" - and that's my review...


3. Do you ever feel like you missed something when everyone else gives a book 4 or 5 stars and you just have no interest in it?

Sometimes. Usually I think most people are just easier to please than I am.

I've been called overly critical... more than once. I think other people might, perhaps, be a bit... underly critical sometimes?


4. Do you ever have the urge to bash a book only because it's popular? (I get that urge sometimes, usually I resist, but I feel it)

I like to think no, in that it's not only because it's popular. My favorite series ever is still Harry Potter, and you can't really get more popular than that...

But if I read a book that's just RAVED about and I'm like, "why", then I do have a hard time not writing a bit of a scathing review...

I have been accused of not liking things just because they're popular, though. But that guy was also an asshole, so there's that.


5. have you ever written a negative review and then immediately felt bad about it and gone back and changed it? And- as related question- have you ever given a book a break (and an extra star) because you feel bad for the author?

No.

I've actually done the opposite, though.

So, I can totally get peer pressured by group reads, especially the ones where everyone else in the group seems to love it and I'm either tepid or just blah about it.

I have given books 3-stars probably out of a sense of not wanting to bash the book too much, but then later realized I over-rated it, and bump it down a star.

Becky wrote: "CB, you negatively review a book because of deckled edges? Or do you mean something else?"

Digital books that are left justified only. I have a hard time telling when paragraphs end and the next one begins on my Kindles. And following conversations is really difficult. Kindles have the ability to have the "jagged right edge' for those who prefer it as their are choices for justification, but those choices do not work to change a book from left justified to fully justified.

I'll often preface my review with a bit about the book/story and then segue into the formatting like the two short reviews here:

Loved the book and the story. It was a bit slow but it held my interest which was good considering that the publisher made the unfortunate mistake of, unlike the other three book, using a jagged right margin in the Kindle version. As reviews on Amazon are product reviews, I feel that the story met and exceeded expectations, but the formatting kept bothering me the whole time I was reading it.

Thoroughly enjoyed the story, but the replacement of every "you're" with "your" was a real distraction. I am presuming that it was a global spell check correction since it continued throughout the book. I would recommend reading this book and plan on buying the next one when it comes out.